On The Topic Of Offensive Vs. Defensive Buffs [A Question]

[Celestics]

I have been reading a few topics on the forums regarding specific suggestions towards buffing weapons and warframes but have not really seen a consensus on a thread that covers a general suggestion to offensive and defensive balancing.

 

My Main Question: Would buffing and prioritizing Offense on all entities and keeping Defense the same be a positive change for Warframe?

 

I hope that this question will spark some interesting debate. Hopefully I am not missing anything that would make this a stupid question (and if so, then sorry!), but I would rather get this out now and see what the community thinks about such a change. Of course, there are issues somewhat unrelated to this idea that may be very important as well, but I want to know if this idea would be a good one to follow.

 

An analysis of the change will follow. Keep in mind that I am referring to buffing all warframes but also making enemies stronger as a result – to the point where enemies can easily take down a single target in a few direct shots or more. Defense will be only slightly changed if necessary. Note that I do not want extreme offensive buffs that allow players to one-shot smaller enemies; such a change would be unwanted and problematic. Enemy density in certain rooms should be large enough to prevent teams from simply steamrolling past enemies because of low defenses.

 

If you do not really want to read what I think will be changed below… Here is a short summary:

 

TL;DR – Team play is encouraged more, while Solo play is discouraged. Rushing and stealth become harder to do, and certain Warframes become “priority” assets in certain missions. However, many warframes will be able to fit their specific niches more, and thus their play-styles become more unique. Item drops are harder to get. In my opinion, this may be a good change, but a few balancing issues would be present if such a change were to occur. I feel that this could also open the door to more late game possibilities, especially if the offensive capabilities of teammates and enemies are greatly increased while keeping all of them prone to death very easily.

 

What if Offense was increased and Defense stayed the same? A few ideas below:

 

·         Level Rushing

o   Invisibility by Ash and Loki now is the main source of rushing levels.

o   Buffing player and enemy offense and keeping defense the same would encourage more team play.

o   Solo play takes a hit, as it becomes much harder. Stealth play mechanic will need to be reconsidered.

o   Levels take longer, so item drops and quantities need to be adjusted. It is already hard as it is now to get certain items due to RNG (different topic, but still relevant).

·         Weapons Effectiveness

o   Primary Weapons are buffed in general.

o   Secondary Weapons are buffed in general.

o   Melee Weapons are extremely nerfed in utility. Trying to get close to an enemy may result in death. Enemy awareness should be focused on those in front of them, while teammates can sneak to the back to melee specific targets to death. Soloing missions will make melee combat near useless, except when being swarmed by Infested (or with stealth). 

§  On the other hand, BLOCKING may actually become really helpful now!

·         Warframe Strengths and Weaknesses

o   Warframes with AOE attacks will be extremely strong. Such abilities may be kept the same.

o   Warframe abilities with crowd control will become extremely helpful, if not required, for all team compositions. Examples include Loki’s Radial Disarm, Excalibur’s Radial Blind, Nyx’s Chaos, etc.

o   Ash

§  Smoke Screen becomes even more of an amazing invasion and stealth tool.

o   Banshee

§  Sonar effectiveness is lessened, except in cases with high-leveled enemies.

o   Ember – Should stay at similar effectiveness.

o   Excalibur

§  Slash Dash effectiveness is weakened, as dashing into enemy lines exposes Excalibur to counterattacks. This is remedied by Radial Blind.

§  Radial Blind effectiveness in open areas is weakened, due to cast time.

o   Frost

§  Snow Globe basically becomes a ridiculous asset to any team and may cause Frost to be a priority warframe. If this occurs, Snow Globe can be modified to absorb a certain number of attacks (or damage), if necessary.

o   Loki

§  Decoy will die too fast. This should be buffed.

§  Invisibility becomes an amazing stealth tool.

§  Switch Teleport is variable in effectiveness due to its uniqueness, so it will not really be impacted here.

§  Radial Disarm may become a priority ability to get for any team. This may be modified by reducing enemy damage effectiveness within a larger range, and by directly disarming enemies that are closer (i.e. stronger disarm near Loki).

o   Mag

§  Pull disable may become more helpful, but cast time makes this ability subpar.

§  Shield Polarize is only single target, so it is not helpful here, especially with its cast time. This may be buffed to restore and drain shields within a radius.

§  Bullet Attractor will be mainly reserved for bosses, and will thus be extremely buffed for this specific use. However, it will not be as useful against multiple targets.

o   Nyx – Becomes a powerhouse crowd control warframe with god-tier abilities.

§  Mind Control becomes more effective.

§  Chaos becomes a priority asset to most, if not all, teams. This may need to be changed if it becomes overused.

§  Absorb becomes extremely powerful. Unless the range is not as large, the damage absorbed may have to be lessened.

o   Rhino

§  Defensive abilities (i.e. Iron Skin) will need to be buffed.

§  Innate armor should be added to help Rhino fit his role.

o   Saryn

§  Molt effectiveness is lessened. This should be buffed.

§  Melee weapons in general might be made hard to use, so Contagion might need a buff to cope with the changes.

o   Trinity – Becomes a greater asset.

§  Well of Life is increased in effectiveness.

§  Link becomes a godly ability. This may need to be changed.

o   Vauban

§  Bastille and Vortex both increase in effectiveness.

o   Volt

§  Energy Shield effectiveness is increased.

§  Overload range makes the ability strong due to buffed damage.

·         Mod Strengths and Weaknesses

o   Armor effectiveness may be increased.

o   Elemental damage resistance mods become more useful, but only if enemies actually deal such damage. This is on another topic, but enemies should be given special elemental attributes in certain missions, such as Void missions (i.e. a Tower’s beings are electrically supercharged).

o   Redirection and Vitality mods become more effective.

o   Mods relating to utility increase in effectiveness (i.e. Stretch, Continuity, etc.).

o   Mods relating to raw strength are decreased in effectiveness overall (i.e. Focus).

o   Rage effectiveness is increased (except if you die quickly, of course!).

·         Artifact Strengths and Weaknesses

o   In general, all “AMP” artifacts are reduced in effectiveness, because they may not be needed. Damage balancing here may be required.

o   Scavenger artifacts may be increased or decreased in effectiveness based on how ammunition is used during the course of a mission. On one hand, running out of ammo may spell disaster for a team, while killing enemies faster would make these artifacts near useless.

o   Energy Siphon becomes a priority artifact.

o   Enemy Radar, in my opinion, becomes more effective. Knowing enemy locations would be more helpful towards positioning correctly before a fight.

o   Infested Impedance becomes more effective.

o   Steel Charge, Corrosive Projection, and Shield Disruption may lose effectiveness.

o   Rejuvenation and Physique become more effective.

·         Bosses

o   Team play against bosses is now more heavily focused upon. There will normally be no instance where a single person can solo a boss (this may be a good or bad thing – boss strength can change with the number of people and rewards adjusted accordingly). Of course, this does not really change if you fight Vor (he is the first boss, so not much should change. Boss tactics can now be more easily seen because their style of attacks shine through with their combinations and damage output.

·         Other Crazy Things – Just Because!

o   Stalker… becomes ridiculously powerful.

o   Tier III Exterminate missions will be a challenge.

Edited July 1, 2013 by Celestics

[RealityMachina]

Congrats, you just turned Warframe into a cover shooter.

 

IE killing probably one of the biggest reasons people like Warframe.

[Celestics]

Congrats, you just turned Warframe into a cover shooter.

 

IE killing probably one of the biggest reasons people like Warframe.

 

I didn't quite see that coming, but now that I think about it, the Parkour type of style would fit Warframe better. I can definitely see why this would be a problem. The other problem I thought about was rushing and how it impacted the community, but that does seem a bit minor... Still, you're probably right. The question I want to ask now is how Offense and Defense should relate with one another in this game. Obviously, if Defense is emphasized over Offense, games would just take too long and rushing would just be the prime alternative. The goal is just to emphasize team play more, but I guess I missed the mark here. But is this issue really that minor in comparison to other problems, or is it on par?

 

Other issues exist... especially with the "farming" aspect, but I think that the newer additions to the Clan Dojo and how the Devs are working on it right now should help with the problem. The stealth problems are also apparent, but that has other solutions in other threads.

[RealityMachina]

I didn't quite see that coming, but now that I think about it, the Parkour type of style would fit Warframe better. I can definitely see why this would be a problem. The other problem I thought about was rushing and how it impacted the community, but that does seem a bit minor... Still, you're probably right. The question I want to ask now is how Offense and Defense should relate with one another in this game. Obviously, if Defense is emphasized over Offense, games would just take too long and rushing would just be the prime alternative. The goal is just to emphasize team play more, but I guess I missed the mark here. But is this issue really that minor in comparison to other problems, or is it on par?

 

Other issues exist... especially with the "farming" aspect, but I think that the newer additions to the Clan Dojo and how the Devs are working on it right now should help with the problem. The stealth problems are also apparent, but that has other solutions in other threads.

Hrm. Personally if I wanted to try encourage teamplay on squads, I would try to start taking pages from games like Ghost Recon Future Soldier (or more specifically, its multiplayer component) and try to incentvise teamwork oriented actions as much as possible for squads...but I'm not sure how you would do that in a game like Warframe, especially since I know there's a good chunk of the warframe population that likes soloing/private play and thus one should try not @(*()$ them over...

 

Maybe DE will surprise me with a good solution in Update 9.

[TheHeraldXII]

Upping the damage isn't as good a plan as assessing why teamwork doesn't exist. It's because we have instant room clears on every suit, they might not all be damaging abilities, but there is always an ability that overcomes any challenge in a room with one button push.

That and hitting solo play is just unnecessary, although it feels like the game is better balanced for solo play, especially as far as boss design goes.