Kothophed
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Posts posted by Kothophed
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9 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:
If you look back at the comments on this thread you will see that there are some that humble brag about having thousands of hours of game time as experience.
As I stated, condemning anecdote rings facetious when you have no better pool of evidence to counter.
9 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:Some changes will make aspects of it easier for us. Others will make them less so. Many of the people here admit willingly to having gained so much loot that they're probably never going to be able to use it all. That could suggest that parts of the game were too easy at some point.
If I'm reading this correctly, you are saying loot acquisition missions are too easy, and should be corrected. Resources should take longer and be harder to get. Glad to know where your coming from.
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3 hours ago, peterc3 said:
Previously overlooked synergy in the game is brought to the forefront when new content is designed and added to the game. Anything from bugs to unintended usage of abilities is ultimately a flaw in their design of the game that would be fixed when it becomes important to fix.
This is how it's gone numerous times before and it will happen again. If they wanted to drive boosters, they'd just completely cut loot rates across the board. This is Vex Armor 2: Electric Boogaloo and the feigned shock and pain from those who should know better by now is quite something to watch.
2 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:We dont know how many actually used it, we do however know that people love to be vocal and critical for the sake of being vocal and critical towards things.
3 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:Shhhhh. Stop making sense. If you talk like that they're going to demand that you start using more salt when you mix your Kool-Aid.
Just do what the rest of us do and take notes of the names. You'll be seeing some of them, a LOT.
Y'all've done much criticism of our motives, but explained your own little. Allow me to clarify my own, hopefully to y'alls satisfaction. Perhaps then do me the courtesy in kind of revealing yours. My fellow players and I are more individuals than a faction, and ought be addressed in their individual concerns, not some perceived group identity. I do not think Warframe is "rU1n3d FoReVah!", I like DE, haven't seen any Youtube videos on the subject (mostly because I find the youtubers' meta-commentary dull if not condescending) and seldom join these complaint threads. I am here, because I like DE in large part. I like how they respond to player concerns, and are willing to revisit their mistakes. I like how they keep Warframe truly free to play, and not freemium misery. So, when I noticed a change that incrementally worsened the game, by increasing disliked grind and reducing variety of play in a popular mission, I wanted to contribute my feelings as a player. Not necessarily so that I myself would be heard, but to be part of the contingent advocating revision of this change.
As I stated before, I've been playing long enough that quantity of loot extracted matters little to me personally, especially as it may be a small difference; However, this shift will detriment variety of play, with Nekros already returning to consensus best-in-slot. Ere this change, you could bring Atlas, Hydroid, Ivara if you were good, Khora, and they all brought something different and played differently. That diversity and lack of a hard meta continued to permit innovation and variation for those that wanted to explore. With a clear optimum, however, players become far more rigid and myopic. We have seen this many times before. You may counter that this is a playerbase issue, and not a dev one, but if the devs are able to remedy it, it would be best for them to do so, for the benefit of all. It may be minor, but everything is. Things are improved not by sweeping revision, but individual augment, and when long-running games like this fall, it is often an accumulation of minor misteps that fells them.
Now that I have explained where I'm coming from, permit me to ask as to y'all's motivations. What do you gain from this update? Does this benefit some strategy you'd hoped to see played more? Does it increase the value of some tradeables you have? Does it stop or mitigate an aspect you found annoying or unfun in your play? Is there some other reason why you stand to win from this fix remaining in the game as is? I'm asking sincerely, because I'll admit my own picture is imperfect, and their may be some facet I have missed.
Perhaps you do not stand to gain, and your motives are more altruistic. Have you come to bring evidence to an admittedly anecdotal pool of experience? If so, present it. Y'all've done a lot of criticism of anecdote, but have little evidential counter beyond that; anecdotal evidence is better than no evidence. If you mean to defend DE, defend the parts of them that make them so great, their receptiveness to critique and creative solutions; allow those to flourish. Defend their motives, but allow those negatively impacted by the fix to explain their case. This does not harm DE, this is not an insult against them but an invitation to improve. If that is hostile, then so too are those who post new warframe, weapon and whatever concepts in the hopes that their ideas might advance the game.
If you are just a popcorn-eater, detachedly watching the circus unfold, why do you interject? If you mean to goad us frenzied sheeple into a more amusing fervor, get better bait. This is weak. Seriously.
If you stand to gain nothing, but simply act to your own detriment in the hopes of harming another, you are the worst kind of petty. By making those who have been set back by this change out to be a small, ignorable cohort of troublemakers, you reduce the odds of us being heard and making the game better. I doubt if you are such you will have the vertebra to admit it, but please do, if nothing else as another act of pointless spite, to show me how wasted this wall was on your screen.
If [Other] please explain: _____________________________________________
Sorry for the textwall, wanted to be precise and cover all my points.
TLDR: I'm critiquing this "fix" because I want Warframe to be the best game it can be. What're your motivations for arguing against me?-
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Welcome back to getting harangued by your squad if you bring anything but Nekros to a loot mission. Because that was fun. Inter-frame synergy, variable squad comp, multiple playstyles in a mission type, who wants those?
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Estos aqui são os fóruns na língua inglesa. Habla ingles por favor.
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The hello friends of Warframe beauty firm? so friends, most of the games the producer sends or has in the game, example> sends us suggestions to always improvement <in my opinion the paid skins that we buy for steam? should of having different effects on skills, why do I say that? I bought a skin of mirage I paid 14 dollars, then came the primo mirage of Grace? and much more top than the skin PAY, this is bullS#&$, the paid skin always has to have thing much than the normal clothes of the frame, at least that is my opinion
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INB4 DeMonkey reveals some Joseph Joestar setup to delay the update.
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The ult ought to be changed, it has all of the same problems as Revenant's ult, and will either be ignored, or wholly overshadow her kit. Fix it now, so you don't have to deal with the nerfsalt again.
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This be the English forums.
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libmo was a mistake
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I agree with all of the changes, save decreasing the energy cost on Danse and making Thralls invulnerable. I like Danse where it is, as a payoff for Enthrall rather than the centerpiece of Rev's kit. For Thralls, I'd say they should refund half the cost of Enthrall when killed with more than half of their duration. It would give more incentive to run duration builds with him, and make Thrall death feel less bad in general. Lastly, the duration of the columns needs to be increased; I run with Primed Continuity and Constitution, and the columns still disappear before doing any damage most of the time.
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I agree with the main point, however Thralls do not give you nearly enough value for their deaths. Saryn's Contagion Cloud does better damage and is still overlooked. They need to drop overshields/energy/something else useful when they die to make them worth caring about.
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11 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:
It still requires you to actually wanna pop out of Dance or stop firing/meleeing to use it. The skill just isnt worth the energy as it works now, because the thralls are dead within seconds and provide nothing useful in return.
I am wholly with you, currently his Danse is the only way to get adequate value from Thralls, and now it has been nerfed. I would say that Thralls, regardless of who killed them, should drop a 25 overshield orb (Half of a Danse orb) instead of the nigh-worthless tornados. In addition, if a thrall has >50% Duration left when it dies, it should refund 50% of Enthrall's cost, to offset the feelbad/sunk cost of them dying in seconds.
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1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
You’re kinda busy spinning right round baby right round to be casting other abilities.
That's my issue, his 4, rather than rewarding use of his other abilities, demands that you focus solely on it.
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6 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:
Enthrall feels a bit lackluster, but it is a #1 skill. Adding in more Thralls would have the posibility to turn his #4 into an overpowered skill due to the synergy between thralls and dance. Overshield orbs all over the place. However, having a lackluster #1 skill isnt uncommon. ky, cu
My issue here is that he was hyped as a general, commanding his Thralls. Look at the devstreams, or any of the promotions for this update. They all focus on the Thralls. It's also, IMO, a more interesting centerpiece power than his 4.
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I agree on all instances save Revenant; he does "control to kill". Look at his other powers, his 3 gets extra health/shields from draining them, his 4 makes them drop overshield orbs. The purpose of Thralls is to die. The issue with them lies in the fact that their deaths do not give you enough. I would say that instead of, or in addition to, the weak damage-nados, Thralls should drop smaller versions of the overshield orbs given by his ult, and refund energy if killed with more than half of their duration remaining. Maybe Reave thralls to increase their damage output as well, to make his 3 more useful.
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Danse Macabre: What should be the payoff for his other abilities is instead best used in isolation.It almost synergizes beautifully with Mesmer Skin, with Mesmer Skin providing much needed defense for Danse's offensive power. However, you cannot Enthrall stunned enemies while in Danse. It is all the more aggravating as Danse uses up Thralls. This feels frustrating and broken, as well as counter to Revenant's theme of synergy. Enthrall should be castable on stunned enemies while Dansing. If the Devs feel the need to nerf Danse Macable, please nerf range as opposed to Strength or Efficiency. He needs Strength to be able to function as a CC, and his energy economy is somewhat tenuous as is. I am not advocating a nerf, however his 4 is among the strongest room-clears where it is now.
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1 hour ago, Julian_Skies said:
Man, after reading the millionth thread, did anyone ever consider that Reave is, like Molt, an evasive ability?
Many, myself included, did. It is a bad evasive ability. It is too slow to cast, and costs too much energy. Molt, by comparison, is instant, and costs 25 less energy.
1 hour ago, peterc3 said:What should the limit be, then, assuming you could have an entire squad of Revenants? More AI has quite the effect on game performance.
7. If Nekros can have 7 (or more) Shadows, Revenant should be able to have at least that many without impacting performance. He was sold to us as a general, commanding a legion of Thralls.
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Why I like Revenant
Unlike many here, I like inbuilt synergies. I liked Saryn 2.0 for that reason, and was sad to see that go. For that reason, I have liked Revenant since he was first revealed. For those who dislike such synergies, there are plenty of 'frames that lack them. Revenant is currently the only 'frame where every ability synergizes with every other. Not every 'frame has to be for everyone.
My Issues with Revenant.
- Passive: Actually fine where it's at for me. Lack of shield gating hurts though.
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Enthrall: This was hyped as key to his identity and playstyle, but is his weakest ability.
- While many compare this ability to Nyx's Mind Control, I see it as more analogous to Nekros's Shadows. Revenant was advertised as an army-maker, and every one of his other abilities points to it. Look at the update ad, it shows Revenant commanding his thralls, not T-posing. While I know I am comparing a 1 to an ult, Nekros's Shadows are also stronger, and benefit from Shield of Shadows. If Nekros is not causing lag issues with 7 minions, neither should Revenant.
- Another key difference is both Nyx and Nekros can scale in a way Enthrall cannot. If a stronger enemy spawns, Nyx can abandon her current minion and Control it, likewise Shadows replaces killed minions with the strongest enemies available. However, when Revenant tries to cast Enthrall on a new enemy while at his max, the game prevents him.
- Lastly, the DPS effect created by dead thralls is seldom useful. Thralls often die to friendly fire within seconds, and Revenant needs better return on investment when they do.
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Mesmer Skin: As Mogamu said, it's almost good. Almost.
- Cannot be recast when active. This what everyone wants, for every castable buff, because it makes play smoother and less tedious.
- Secondly, Enthrall should either automatically cast on stunned enemies. If not, they should at least give a clear indicator, both so the Revenant player can see them more clearly in crowded halls and so courteous squadmates can avoid killing them.
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Reave: Kinda sucks.
- The visuals can best be decried as janky.
- It costs too much and casts too slowly to function as a "panic button" or evasive ability.
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Danse Macabre: What should be the payoff for his other abilities is instead best used in isolation.
- It almost synergizes beautifully with Mesmer Skin, with Mesmer Skin providing much needed defense for Danse's offensive power. However, you cannot Enthrall stunned enemies while in Danse. It is all the more aggravating as Danse uses up Thralls. This feels frustrating and broken, as well as counter to Revenant's theme of synergy.
My Proposed Fixes
- Passive: Add Shield Gating
- Enthrall-25 Energy: Casting on an enemy will turn that enemy into a thrall for the duration, recasting will reset duration on all thralls. Revenant can have 7 thralls active at a time, recasting when at 7 will release the weakest enemy (lowest level/weakest type). On death, a Thrall will drop an orb that gives 25 overshields to Revenant and his allies instead of the DPS column thingy. If it has more than 50% of its duration left, it will refund 50% of Enthrall's energy cost.
- Mesmer Skin-50 Energy: Can be recast when active for 25 energy. Each stack has a .5 second grace period after use. Stunned enemies will be automatically Enthralled if Revenant is below his Thrall cap, or marked with an indicator if he is at it.
- Reave-50 Energy: Cast time is halved, looks like a Vomvalyst charge wreathed in smoke. Passing through Thralls increases their damage output instead of damaging them. Both drain and buff are affected by Strength.
- Danse Macabre-25 Energy: Enthrall can be cast on stunned enemies while Dansing. If the Devs feel the need to nerf this, please nerf range as opposed to Strength or Efficiency. He needs Strength to be able to function as a CC, and his energy economy is somewhat tenuous as is. I am not advocating a nerf, however his 4 is among the strongest room-clears where it is now.
TL;DR-Revenant's abilities don't suck because of synergy, they suck because they suck. Keep/improve the synergy, remove the suck.
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While channeling Revenant's 4th, Danse Macabre, with Mesmer Skin active, one is unable to cast Enthrall on stunned enemies. This breaks the synergy of his kit, as Danse Macabre has no defensive aspect, meaning that it must be used in conjunction with Mesmer Skin to be most effective. In addition, during Danse, Revenant gets shields by killing thralls, incentivizing the player to use them up; this makes the inability to smoothly create more all the more irksome. While it is possible to leave Danse, cast Enthrall while the enemy is still Mesmer-stunned, and return, due to long cast animations for both Enthrall and both entering and leaving Danse, it is seldom feasible, and what more, never worth while due to DPS lost. Mesmer Skin is also unable to be recast while in Danse, however I understand this decision as it imposes a natural timer on his Danse, and creates moments of tension when the player must leave Danse to recast it.
My suggestions, ranked in order of preference (not trying to armchair dev, just making my own predilections as a Revenant fan clear)
- Make the Enthrall automatically cast on stunned enemies in range (or those in range and LOS). This has been requested by many in the community, perhaps even a majority of Revenant fans. While I know this would largely obsolete his 1, any usage it would lose would be mere rote button-pressing, not actual gameplay. This change would be in-line with the streamlining of Nekros's Desecrate, reducing fiddliness while keeping the playstyle largely the same.
- Allow Enthrall to be cast on Mesmer-stunned enemies while channeling Danse. Whether intended or not, Danse is the centerpiece of Revenant's skill-set. Reducing other abilities' compatibility with it will simply lead players to ignore those abilities in favor of a more one-note playstyle.
- Alter Reave so that Reaving Mesmer-stunned enemies while in Danse Enthralls them and Reave costs less while in Danse. This idea harkens back to an earlier version of Revenant, and would make Reave more useful. However, it is somewhat cumbersome and energy intensive.
TL;DR: I can't cast Enthrall while using Danse. This feels bugged and annoying. DE plz fix.
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1. I do not know how to post it directly 2. yes i do not do it good to photoshop 3. a bit late meme but at least not dead
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2 hours ago, Harestation said:
Eris/Viver
RIP Viver.
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Welp, AperoBelta, guess you've won. I guess I'll have to go back to having fun playing a game I like, while you get to argue with strangers for days about something you don't enjoy anymore. Great are the spoils of your victory /s.
Nerfing Loot-frame synergy in a loot oriented game is a terrible idea
in General Discussion
Posted
Farming shouldn't take 4ever. Some clan still don have Hemo, and now it's harder. DE say reduce grind, but then go increase it. smh.