PoopManZ
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Posts posted by PoopManZ
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2 hours ago, ChuckMaverick said:
Then they could... oh, I don't know... maybe provide some real engaging content for clans?
Ridiculously high resource costs when compared to previous projects is not 'encouragement' or interesting content, it's a grind, pure and simple.
If clans do it at all, they will do it grudgingly, it's certainly not setting a good tone for cooperative working.
I know no one else was suggesting raising the costs on all projects, but surely if higher resource costs are a 'good thing' that 'encourages clan participation' then we should do even more of it, right?
It makes no sense at all to have one project be such an outlier, for what reason? I realise logic and space magic don't mix well, but what is the in-game justification for this weapon being so much harder to research than previous infested weapons?
Suddenly demanding warlords to downsize or enforce participation quotas without even putting back in dark sectors, or any other incentives to run a large active clan is a disaster. Clans are just going to bleed out even harder, clan leaders arent going to magically have awesome clans if the activity/incentive isnt there lol. One single weapon BP or a potential trend in them is the worst possible incentive, and would only drive angered clannies away. Making this whole problem worse. You dont just go and decide to 10x the entire clan research resource pool combined and think that would somehow drive clans to be more active.
A mediocre lifesteal gimmick does not justify 10xing the combined research pool. Especially when you have the dang Tonkor existing as an easy to craft low MR weapon, theres no actual excuse here for this. Its a pretty obvious cashgrab that DE foolishly can not backup. And a mediocre lifesteal gimmick is definitely not even an encouragment to sustain active clans (or would that could even significantly keep a clan going).
This could be justified, if I dont know there was actual content that helped warlords have their clans be competitve with other games out there to retain clannies.
If this was the golden age of clans where inter-clan competition existed and inticed and made clans feel like families and making it super easy to have a flourishing clan, this whole thing wouldnt be problem. Its DEs fault for taking this long in not replacing dark sector and having barebones clans becoming the norm.
But its hilarious to demand clans to go back to the old way without even fixing the problem of why theres so many barebones clans. And also in the world of gaming, once you lose a specific population like the hardcore clan population, it is an incredibly uphill battle to regain that and once you do, you need to shift design philosophy with your system in how it ended up. Or you will cause even worse damage.
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43 minutes ago, disco_inferno6 said:
129 mutagen samples in 25 waves of ODD ?
I call BS. Where's your screeshot proof ?
Reddit thread discussing the same exact result with screenshot:
https://m.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/5jx17g/mutagen_samples_from_20_waves_of_odd_with/
Mind you this group of 4 did it in the most ideal setup to farm resource drops.
Forcing a 100% perfect raid like setup with no diversity for 6 hours, just for one meh weapon isnt really my idea of engaging gameplay. Its different than just paying play to avoid time, "grinding" should be somewhat interesting in itself. But you really cant defend going this crazy barring peoples frame choices just to unlock the BP of one weapon, that's insane.
The current state of clan health in Warframe is in no position for DE to demand this. One weapon isnt going to suddenly fix all the problems of why theres awful member retention in the first place. Thats the one reason people are so pissed off about this. Getting enough players to actively play to even get to the position of doing this to not be "the not healthy" kind of grind is a seperate game in itself. It goes beyond the barrier of PayToSaveTime.
The game is not helping clans to be inticing enough to have WoW levels of thousands of active healthy guilds/clans that DE wants with this. Actually stuff like this actually actively works against helping clans keep players active. No one likes being forced into cookie cutter setups for hours just for some weapon they dont even care about.
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5 minutes ago, rockscl said:
thats because not everyone spent their warframe time in the void
Again, players online is a direct reflection of how the game captures players, If status quo existed still, that means the update did not change anything it did to help keep players. (That is gameplay changes having a real actual statistical effect) Player retention is a nice statistic cause it wraps diverse player opinion in one bubble without any major concerns.
Statistically it would be tantamount to just changing the color of the Liset on a gameplay level. Looks different but no real chew.
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2 minutes ago, Omega-Shadowblade said:
I have to agree. Looking at some wider data plots of the steam, it is pretty much the same before and after for the most part.
Even with that conclusion the attempt to help void fatigue did not help if before and after retention has not changed. Although more time is needed to be more accurate, I wouldnt give 4 weeks enough time.
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10 minutes ago, KJRenz said:
I never assumed that the non steam version didn't see a drop, we have zero info on the nonsteam playerbase. If there was a info on it, then yes, but there isn't.
Saying that half the population stopped playing because they didn't like it is dumb. How do they know that they didn't like it? How do they know it's half the population? Or is it just better to just jump to conclusions and twist things here and there to fit the point?
Again you are not realizing what statistical significance or the basics of statistics is for, your logic would make scientific sampling impossible. Steam chart is 100% acurate data pulling and has very significant numbers to extrapolate. Regardless if you use steam or not you are playing the same game so you are the same population. Much like people being polled and people of the same population not being polled. And in this case the bias against non-Steam users would not be any major cause for a difference in opinion of SOTR or gameplay stagnation
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3 minutes ago, Omega-Shadowblade said:
Not really sure what you are trying to say to me. What I meant was this, A group of attendance numbers does not accurately display the opinions of the people. (I.e. school attendence does not mean people like school).
That logic would invalidate any trend tracking statistical analysis out there. Again another misnomer, people actually playing your update is reflection of reception. And it covers all sorts of opinions of the update too. And this is why you use the concurrent player base curve to eliminate player schedules.
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2 minutes ago, Omega-Shadowblade said:
People wanted to see the new systems. They did. Whether they liked them or not is not at all shown by your graph. You are twisting the meaning of the data.
Actually you can say that by calculating the retention curve (or this case looking at the slope) by measuring the slope from time of updates playerbase to what ever point in time you choose. The amount of concurrent players from present to the past IS the % of people who stayed. I mean people being online is as direct a data point for people liking a game as possible.
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14 minutes ago, KJRenz said:
If you're going to keep the Steam Chart up there, then your post has no credibility. Sorry
It's not a valid source, also sizable enough portion? How do you know that? You don't. What's the other non steam playerbase population? How big are those numbers compared to Steams? How far apart are the numbers? Do you know? No?
Again, all the update really did was rework old systems to new systems. There have been a few new features, but players/vets already blew through it.
This does not mean it failed expectations, where did you pull that out of?
Arguing the validity of Steam to poll player activity is a misnomer since if there is a significant number of players it can be a representative trend. The only selection bias here would be not selecting those who do not prefer DRM or Steam to only the Warframe client. That would have no coorelation at all with this trend. We cant even analyze console players as they are not in the loop regardless. Steam pulls a signifigant portion of the PC playerbase that chooses their library to be on Steam. So it does have a significant chunk of the curve, especially offering packs and advertisement on steam on updates and during sales.
Although I think this trend is not simply due to SOTR but moreover the larger problem of Warframes of not being able to capture large amounts of people for standard MMO periods of time and poor new player retention, also with the increasing demand on DE to provide content at the cost of quality at release. The lack of locking in actually rewarding veterans over 3 years now is taking effect, as I discussed this in a feedback thread with the void missions.
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1 hour ago, Redthirst said:
It can be interpreted both ways, but time travel makes it impossible for Corrupted to spawn, since Corrupted we have in the game are modern enemies.
Not to mention if it was timerifts, you would have you know Orokin Empire soldiers and units (and other warframes...) instead of the Corrupted Corpus, Grineer and Infested.
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54 minutes ago, pauli133 said:
No.
Name Type Damage 
Slide Jump Wall Radius AS CritC CritD Proc Target Polarities Sheev Dagger 45 2.25 2.25 40.5 96 90 135 - 0.7 5% 2.0x 25% - 
Karyst Dagger 50 
0 0 0 107
100
150
- 0.75 10% 2.0x 15% 1
Heat Dagger Dagger 45 2.3 36 6.7 96 90 
135 5 0.8 5% 1.5x 5% 1
Dark Dagger Dagger 35 
- - - 75
70
105
- 0.9 5% 1.5x 10% 1 None Ceramic Dagger Dagger 35 3.5 31.5 - 75 70 105 1 1.0 5% 1.5x 10% 1 
Dont know why we are doing this considering syndicate variances get huge stat bonuses. You wouldnt think the Rakta Cernos would be cool if you guys were predicting this way.
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The tenno are actually the passing napdream of a random man in Chicago who is currently being overworked and underpaid for his time in a consulting firm, Warframe is his plane of existence to exert his existisitential crises on. Warframes are actually microwave ramen cups and the Grinner happen to be his nagging coworkers. The transference link is his analogy for his never ending shift and his stressful eating. The artififacts happen to be images for his paychecks and the fissures a metaphor for his struggle in the office enviornment.
You cant prove me wrong because this is how I envision my personal Warframe as and I suggest DE to add a third reality as Office daydreaming Tenno. We can do this cause the dream world can be manipulated with and the Second Dream exists so we can totally do this.
P.S The Corpus is actually that stupid kid Jimmy from accounting who keeps demanding you send your invoice report to him already.
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When DE put in Bursas they took a step forward to actually make alarm results interesting and having diverse enemy options. Removing them would be an awful idea.
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19 hours ago, Venom-Snake said:
No, I believe this one is a step forward from what it was before: We can continue to do our missions without taking a detour and standing in 1 place, then going back to the mission, it has progression.
I will admit, this update had upsides and downsides.
The upside is that we can just run the mission as normal do and get rewarded in the process.
The downside is that it doesnt add to the gameplay, only gimmicks and stronger enemies. Not the type that makes you wary of getting hit like a Level 100 Napalm, but its up there. I just did a Neo Fissure MD in the Void and for the first time in months, I had the whole team downed.
With I guess now Prime Part Mission 3.0, the problem isn't void fatigue, it's in general veteran fatigue with actual game-play to reward diversity (not just different flavors of mass murder) and DE's expectations of how enemies and the tile-set should interact with the player. The only incentives for older players are prime parts, and thats not good. Incentives have to be a lot more diverse/rewarding if a more diverse and engaging mission spread is to be feasible. Otherwise you'd still have advanced players only playing where the prime parts are offered, and the missions still involving just killing as many enemies as you can. Its one thing to burn out on a game in playing it for an extreme amount of hours, but Warframe burns out on its gameplay way too fast for typical MMO standards.
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One of the few interesting enemies and something that makes the alarm system slightly not just filler noise and you want to get rid of them. Okay then
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33 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:
I respectfully disagree.
Not with the points you make themselves. This does not add anything new. It does not change the actual game play. And in the longer run yes, this will become a problem.
On the other hand, I still enjoy Warframe gameplay from moment to moment. Mission type does not matter, for the most part. So long as its not Spy or Rescue I enjoy the game. Therefore, I just see this new system as gaining additional rewards for the enjoyment I already derived from playing in general.
If however you were burned out on the game and hoping this would bring actual new game play...yeah, I could more than understand your position and boredom.
If this were a single player game, a moment to moment basis is ideal like Shadow of Mordor (another super hack and slash play like Warframe) but when you have an MMO, you have a live dev team that can potentially be overstretched to keep producing to stay afloat. Now Warframe is no where near a dying state of course, I am just merely talking about long-term health.
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34 minutes ago, (PS4)mr_chainsaw555 said:
looks like us three are the only ones who are actually reasonable here
well, looks like i got another circle jerk on my hands,
to those of you who want some kind of ultra-deep gameplay and hyper-intelligent AI, sorry but this isn't the game for that kind of stuff (mostly looking at you poopmanz), similar to something like the arkham games, shadow of mordor, COD zombies or dynasty warriors, the fun part of the game comes from just going on full-on murder sprees against legions of enemies, the more enemies that are thrown in, the better.
in the case of this, would having intelligent AI enemies be awesome? of course it will, but it's not an absolute necessity in my eyes, as long as they're shooting at me and not humping a wall somewhere, i'll live
The problem is enemy assortment, not enemy AI. Its impossible to ask for some deep Skynet AI that can adapt to how you play, but you can change how the pieces are cast in a way to make things fresh as you progress. The problems that are hurting Warframe does not include enemy AI, its the scale of reward to freshness of gameplay. For an MMO, Warframe should not look to keep people in short bursts of attention but on a long community basis otherwise it puts an exaggerated stress on the developers to provide constantly.
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Just now, grinerslayer said:
battle royale =*) add friend kill !!!!!! haha
That already exists in the Radiation proc and offers 0 in engagement but 100 in frustration in the way its used in missions now.
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40 minutes ago, BPNPC said:
This. The staleness of new Void is a symptom of Warframe's larger problem: the complete lack of difficulty.
I honestly don't know why I expected more from this rework when DE stated beforehand exactly how poor it was going to be on devstream.
I would say the major problem is the blueprint of how a mission plays out is really stale. Imagine a D&D GM who is really really really un-creative, thats the overall enemy&hazard layout we get in regular missions throughout the whole game. Sorties are just Regular Missions: Random Condition and Buffed Armor Edition. Again another potential for having a different mode have completely different ways of the mission playing out being wasted. In terms of how enemy progression to player level should work out, what we have now should be what newbies get at Earth and Mars, it shouldn't be the same the entire star chart. Otherwise the planets are nothing more than huge signs that say LEVEL ##-## ENEMIES SPAWN HERE and a resource drop list. The whole idea of Uranus's qualities playing into the uniqueness of the Unit types, missions and unique encounters should be expanded upon to a deeper level and to the entire star chart.
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Just now, thalx said:
Only prime parts, actually.
Endless missions are everywhere, it just depends on how much time you want to spend on them to become 'endgame'
Prime parts were the carrot on the other end of the stick, which are useful for the other endgame, which is trade chat.
T4 Survival offered the fastest way and an ego check anyways. And if we should treat trading as some sort of endgame, EVE is much more enjoyable and actually physically engages trade in gameplay.
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I think the main problem is that between combat, visual reward and progression and challenge, Warframe gets really stale in a much shorter period of time than other MMOs with the way they interact in this current state. Once you are at the experienced player flash-point, all of the awe and flashy mechanics of the game becomes trivial, its really hollow and you are just running a treadmill for either MR (and by default gear grind, which leads to another core issue with MR) or looks. If the only thing that offers game-play longevity to people is infinite challenges with messed up stat sloping, thats a huge red flag in the game. Void has lost its point, and we are still stuck with the problem with Veterans being disengaged from fun with the game other than running either of the two hamster wheels. The only point of the Void being endgame (and the Void being the ONLY non-raiding endgame) was that it had prime parts and it offered high scale endless mode, thats pretty terrible in a design&balance perspective. SOTR did try to address making the regular starchart engaging again with Ceph frags and other things, but there is a long long way to go to put more "game" in the veteran period of player lifespan. Ceph frags dont provide longevity and the Junctions are a complete joke to people who are geared to the teeth already. The alarm system is a complete joke outside of being a time sink if its a lockdown alarm and other vanilla mechanics that have been forgotten. Despite all of DE's renewals and reinnovation, I can say only a little bit has moved forward on the actual end of content-mass:reward:fun ratio for experienced players.
The Focus System was supposed to be one of the answers to that, but the fact its tied to one ability with a huge cooldown ruins most of the progression reward feedback for the player and there is no mission whose challenge truly justifies the insane boons two of the Focus paths offers (its too delayed and unreliable for you to feel great you spent time on it, and 2 tree passives overshadow the entire system). This is a huge issue for a game centering itself on being an MMO to continue to be sustainable overall, it puts a huge demand on the developers to keep throwing out updates (ooo shiny) to bring burnt out people back in (and in turn having to go back and reinnovate what ever they threw out at a later date) instead of constructively building up expansions. This did not work out for Firefall at all (but to be fair, they remade the ENTIRE game multiple times). The fact the War Within Update Package release timing got bungled is indicative of this really growing unrealistic demand on the devs to keep pumping out updates for the sole purpose of updating to be flashy to draw older players back in (and to keep paying for plat and PAs). Over the long term, you burn out your design team, your art team, and your dev team, you end up with a shallow product and thats really really bad. You can get to the point where it may be inefficient to hunker down and go Bob the Builder on core aspects of gameplay as the shift in team focus may effect immediate quarterly earnings (See Evolve and Turtle Rock Studios, where it took to the point of their player base decaying so bad they literally had to drop out of the radar to completely fix their game). I can't believe it took DE having to rush out a completely broken update to adjust to an update focus that is better for long term health (although temporary), and that is to address the problems of what ever you reworked immediately instead of shifting to another different subject again (and potentially (I would say always at this point) having to readdress that at a later date too, which is the theme of every 2.0/3.0/whatever.0 update we had) and have the players stuck with a hollow unfinished idea for months.
Considerable resources have been spent in making really imaginative enemy types that can actually make all mission types challenging if they were intelligently grouped together in fireteams. But instead we get huge zombie swarms of no-brainer units, get spammed with units that are just very annoying in huge swathes for the guise of challenge instead of sprinkled intelligently (Nullifiers and Bombards), or be so irrelevant in spawn that they might as well not exist to engage the player in the first place (Manics, Combas, Bursas, etc.). Not to mention the Dynasty Warrior-esque gameplay does not offer long-term replay-ability, but is only good in short-term bursts since you are overwhelming/oversaturating the player in the combat gameplay. Some of the tactical alert combos were interesting, and can be incoporated into the alarm system. For example, if one of the alarm results was to make the Grineer ship darken in lighting and start spewing out only Manics, that would be an awesome OH @$@$ moment that can provide excitement in normal missions. Also it would fit with the idea that the enemy is actively trying to stop you with what they have if you are detected in a logical sense. The blandness of the majority of the tilesets also plays into the stale factor, none of the maps truly synergize with unit types and take advantage of them. We have units like Grineer Ballistas idiotically charging around as if they are main infantry instead of taking a distant vertical advantage and grouping up (you know like how actual sniper teams work), almost every single map is completely planar in a combat perspective and just have decor to look nice so this approach would be impossible anyway (the close quarter planar maps by the way ruin the entire sniper weapon type). All of the above improvements would add in a different kind of scale that can be adjusted as the player progresses where you can start throwing in more complicated hazards/tilesets, enemy formations and alarms when the player is expected to be more developed in equipment and skill, and validate the entire point of Mastery Rank Tests. The Rank Tests by the way, being the most creative use of mission creation and unit use, but are relegated to one-off missions. With the game's emphasis on parkouring and ninjaing, I find it ridiculous it has been years and we still don't have all parkour-dedicated/dominating missions and tile-sets(like being the operative that recovers the goodies for the Survival mission Tenno) instead of just murderbash. Again being relegated to extremely minor one-off experiences (spy missions are barely parkour, and more like avoiding the most boring placed laser walls, turn on cloak power and hack, other parkour cells in tilesets are pointless unless you still need the Moon Exilus Mods) in missions. Only Moon Spy missions offer a more Mirror's Edge experience but are still stuck to single vaults of a mission instead of being a whole fluid mission progression. Everyone would have so much fun and break from tedium if we had a whole-spread of missions which from start to extraction had the ingenuity and fluidity of a moon vault, and if it had proper rewards you would have people become Parkour mission junkies instead (this would also promote different ways of mod builds) The only unique-ish boss fights are Lephantis, Tyl Regor, Vay Hek (the three being multi-stage fights) and De Thayn, all of which end up somehow being excessively repetitive and lack reward (Lephantis is hilariously unrewarding, youd find Regor boring after farming him 3000 Quintillion times for Equinox, Vay Hek is just a gigantic bullet sponge head for most of his fight, and De Thayn requires you to spam one mode type again and again to even get to fight her once, and then makes you burnt out on the ONLY MODE THAT USES UNITS INTELLIGENTLY). Imagine if a boss was an intelligent multi stage that centered on parkour mobility to expose weakpoints and progress the fight instead of just unloading your ammo into it (or one shot it as a vet) and have the reward scaling not ruin the uniqueness of it, or instead have a boss chase mode where you need to parkour to not lose track of him, sorta like capture but not have it be so brain dead (also capture needs to be turned into a parkour mission as well, the current speedrush and extract is stupid). There are plenty of things in the base game that can be utilized to have a more diverse experience that can tie in rewards. Theres a reason I am a founder but I am only MR 12 because I really don't want to burn myself out on Warframe with the lack of rewarding longevity and the lack of reward for doing different things in the game instead of running meatlockers.
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5 hours ago, Zoretor said:
I don't understand how this pointless thread has 6 pages, yet much more relevant, interesting, intelligent, and current issues posted die at about 2 pages...
Arguing with Mak is essentially banging your head against a wall and people keep wanting to do it.
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6 minutes ago, (PS4)Lowk721 said:
Isn't Dark Sector still partially owned by the publishers? Can DE even do anything outright/blatant with that IP without them?
Basically, the only thing they can manage is make obscurely detailed throwback skins which they already did, regardless DE chose to cut actual lore ties to Dark Sector. With how they have their narration in full disclosure mode now with Second Dream and SOTR, and soon War Within, they finally made a decision on how they wanted to drive the narrative. The whole ambiguity in the beginning of the game's life was probably due to them being unsure/not having the resources at the start to pull off what they wanted to at first.
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41 minutes ago, NikodemosTheMan said:
Hhhoooo boy.
Here we go again.
Why do we even keep doing this, hes just going to keep ignoring reality and any point that acknowledges the fact that DE has chosen its course and has moved on. Every single thread of his just pushes his headcannon agenda with no logic other than "do this cause I want it" or "This is how the story is because I want it to be, Nah nah nah can't hear you". Not to mention using time travel to retcon any plot point is the worst, unimaginative cop out you can pull in storytelling.
Also they are crafting the story how they choose to not you, just cause they have resources doesn't mean they are going to create awful plot holes and illogical devices to cater to people who make up different realities of Syndicates and characters. I think I said this before but Warframe and any singular narrative isn't a choose your adventure book. Quite honestly, the way they revealed Tennos make the mystery of what the Warframes are more complex than being a suit of armor you just slap on or slide your brain in. Considering certain Cephalon spoilers, it can end up being 3000 times more horrifying.
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8 minutes ago, Knight_Ex said:
I wonder if people realize its not only to get the items but to support the developers in this F2P game, ah well.
Support what? They have made loads off of their cash shop already. This isnt a kickstarter, they have been pushing their product for years now.
My thoughts on Helmint Charger.
in General Discussion
Posted · Edited by PoopManZ
The more disturbing (and really dumb part) is we are to believe somehow a technocyte infestation suddenly means biologically you can sprout manufactured armor on top of another species head. On top of all the UI bugs, this was obviously a placeholder for the unfinished pet.
Shouldnt the Warframes then suddenly sprout out Grineer heads too, with Grineer armor coming out? Or Grinner growing out of Nidus's openable spaces?
Obviously the charger model was straight up copy pasted and shoved into being "kubrow infested".
The early days of copypasta bosses were understandable but this was a little bit unacceptable to me for release standards (on top of everything else). The rest of the industry would be chewed out for just throwing any thing willy nilly into their commercial build if they had the resources DE has at this point .
I mean we have Charger spectres, whats exactly the point of having carbon copy chargers? Let alone have them be based on Kubrows?