Operative_Shift
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Posts posted by Operative_Shift
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16 minutes ago, ..atom.. said:
can you honestly say that with a straight face? *badumtss* .. the community have ALWAYS pressed DE for more transparency and more information about how the game works.
LMAO! That was good one, XD I admittedly giggled
Yeah but as I had stated, both the community and DE used him as their crutch. We would've pushed them harder if we had no other outlet whatsoever, and they would've been in a rough spot because we'd be right about not having any kind of resource available to us.
18 minutes ago, ..atom.. said:this happened organically out of necessity, saving time and money for DE.
Yes, but DE needs to put the time and money into transparency. It's that same crutch mentality that let this go for as long as it did.
21 minutes ago, ..atom.. said:also we kinda need 3rd party verification since DE has a bad track record regarding accuracy in certain cases.
Not if it's pulling the information directly from the game, kind of like the way it does with the relic system now. It would just be transmitting what exists.
22 minutes ago, ..atom.. said:don't get me wrong the game is amazing but how it's presented to the player is severely lacking in the UI. also i'm not convinced the wealth of information wiki has can ever fit comfortably in the game's UI and i don't mind going outside the game for it.
Yeah I think that's why they're begining with an external site. I personally am going to encourage them to find a way to get it into the game. It may not be today, it may not be tomorrow, it may not be after another two reworks, but in my heart that's what I'd really want to see.
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55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:
All of this is nonsense, and you know it. These forums are a place where respect matters, and you're not showing any.
Actually I think getting information from actual experts and sharing it with interested parties is extremely respectful.
55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:Your claimed credentials are not relevant here, I'm afraid.
My credentials aren't in question here. The video has a professional computer engineer speaking on the proper definition of datamining, and how information was acquired from the game, so it's actually incredibly relevant. Feel free to dismiss me, but you can't dismiss him.
55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:You have just finished claiming computer engineering credentials.
I'm not sure if you actually watched the video whatsoever.. because I NEVER claimed MY computer engineering credentials LOL. You may want to actually view the material, before you start speaking on things that you haven't even looked into.
55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:Unless you wish to reopen the question of the nature of the activities in question, we're only discussing the legality of those activities
Well the fact is, using the inappropriate terminology to play google search lawyer will result in the wrong results. Using the appropriate terminology changes the factors ;)
55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:To which expert might you be referring, I wonder? If you wish to assert that you are a computer engineering expert, you have provided no proof of that.
Sounds like you didn't watch the video whatsoever.. I mean you'd think that if you were going to attempt to put together a cohesive response, I'd actually expect you to review the material, rather than just push it aside in pure ignorance.
55 minutes ago, notlamprey said:I'm disappointed that this is the sort of behavior we're getting from a Warframe Partner.
I'm disappointed in this sort of behavior from someone in our general community. I mean you're insulting me, yet you haven't even studied the material I provided. You're disappointed in me, but you haven't actually taken the time to hear out someone with experience with actual computer engineering.
But hey, that's what this thread has turned into now right? LOL blind ignorance. No one wants to listen to someone unless they're pandering to the crowd. THAT is what's truly disappointing.
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2 hours ago, ..atom.. said:
whatever you want to call it, the actions of Void_Glitch and other "data miners" of providing information, without which we wouldn't have such a comprehensive wiki, vital to the game, also act as a "fact checker" for DE's Warframe.
don't be like a certain prez slandering ppl for showing the truth.
yes there are aspects that i agree should not be leaked but i think cooperation could be a better path of achieving both transparency and data security.
I actually think about it this way.. If Void hadn't been around, the community would've been in an uproar for information straight out of the gate, and pressed DE for a resource like this A LOT sooner. Had this resource NOT been available to us, for the sake of transparency (and also Canadian guilt lol) they would've had no choice but to create the site for us themselves several years ago.
Let's face it, both DE and the community used Void as a crutch. We should've been pressing the entire time the "datamines" were going on for an IN GAME resource, rather than having to seek things outside of game.
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3 hours ago, (PS4)VoiD_Glitch said:
What this person does not understand though is that there are different contexts in which different vocabulary makes statements work. For example, to a general audience, datamining is "the practice of examining large databases in order to generate new information".
Lol but we're not speaking about the GENERAL audience are we? We're not even speaking about lawyers. We're talking about a computer engineer that has first hand knowledge of what datamining is vs. what hacking is.
3 hours ago, (PS4)VoiD_Glitch said:In fact, the majority of the files that were on the GitHub repository were not encrypted. They were parsed out of a file known as Packages.bin, a, while obfuscated file, was not entirely secure.
A... majority? So not the entirety.. which means that SOME of it was encrypted. and you admit that the files were obfuscated which by definition means "to render obscure, unclear, or unintelligible". So basically it was hidden, and you went digging for it. Because when you say things like "not entirely secure" that could mean a lot.. a persons house who's windows aren't barred could be considered "not entirely secure".
3 hours ago, (PS4)VoiD_Glitch said:They were extracted from the application sent to all of our computers (meaning that you could access it too, AGayGuyPlays)
Lol, well with the right tools I could also break into a house with no bars on the windows couldn't I?
3 hours ago, (PS4)VoiD_Glitch said:Apologies, Rob from AGayGuyPlays, but this individual is not a lawyer.
You're right, he's not. Hes a computer engineer LOL, far more qualified to speak on the subject than a laywer is.
3 hours ago, (PS4)VoiD_Glitch said:one of your (now) main lines of "proof that I am the guilty party" just seems so invalid, at least to me...
Lol, I think I'll stick to the expert who's not a part of the violating party (who's admitted to having ties to the hacker/s in question) to determine what's right and wrong. Regardless, it seems to me that you determined you were guilty ages ago.
So.. I mean if you feel like continuing to mislead the public by trying to advertise what you did as something it isnt.. feel free. But at the end of the day..
you never fought Activision for taking down your stuff.. so I guess we now know why lol
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The Definition of Datamining from an ACTUAL Computer Engineer
I'll just leave this here for ya'll to stew on.
And here's a shorter version, not from a Computer Engineer, but still covers the information about the ACTUAL definition of datamining.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IB6XMEFPxA8
Kthnxbai!! <3 <3
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5 hours ago, Church002 said:
Spooky_shuck was clear of whom he was responding to exactly, which was sinisteran, and NOT you. He referenced you and your opinions on the datamining several times, but never referred to sinisteran as "Rob". In his response, he called sinisteran arrogant (see separation of quotes)
ROFLMAO, you may want to read it again. He attributed me to speaking on DE's intellectual property & copyright, things about Canadian Fair use, and quoting one of SINISTERAN's quotes and saying "What the hell Rob?" Note, that in my video I did not speak on copyright or Canada's laws. He was not quoting any of my work.. so he sure as hell was NOT making reference to anything that I've posted.
Now.. I don't know what YOUR issue is, but clearly he DID think it was me, and my response was not one driven by arrogance but one asking if he knew that he was attributing that post to the wrong person. I mean.. feel free to hate me all you like, but make sure you're hating me for the right reasons. -
17 minutes ago, Church002 said:
"you know who you're talking to" ?
i believe he's talking to someone who plays warframe and makes youtube/twitch content. much like everyone else here.
don't let that "fame" swell your head. you'll end up saying things you regret, regardless of "who you are."
LOL I don't think you quite grasp exactly what happened.. This poster started talking to ANOTHER poster assuming that it was ME. It wasn't. So when I say "you know who you're talking to" I'm literally asking him, because he was referring to someone as ROB.. when that person wasn't me.
Please, get your facts straight before you start sending that kind of attitude my way.
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17 hours ago, Spooky_Shuck said:
To put this as politely as I can, however; I am unsure how you can carry yourself in this discussion so arrogantly, as if you are dropping truth bombs, or whatever 'spilling tea' means, when you've really not demonstrated the comprehensive knowledge you'd need to back up such a self-assured tone.
I'm not exactly SURE that you realize that you know who you're talking to. If you're referencing Rob, as in from agayguyplays, thats ME bud. And, personally I'm a bit too busy creating content and streaming to be dealing with this here. Check your facts! Kthnxbai!! <3 <3 XO XO
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9 hours ago, Evanescent said:
Thanks for having a meaningful discussion, I've learnt some things and got to see some other points of view. I may not agree with them, but that's alright.
Also, Guys, we need to separate people from opinions, alright? You mught disagree with an opinion but that doesn't make a person your enemy or something. Let's have a polite conversation here, and stray away from personal attacks (most of the thread is doing that anyway).
Aww danke! Agreeing to dissagree is sometimes the best option, plus.. and I hope everyone remembers (and is most probably glad about this) at the end of the day DE is going to do their best to make the right decision for their game and their community. Beyond my own opinions & anyone elses.. (from my own private conversations) I know that they are always seeking to make the best product possible.. and when you do that for tens of thousands of people its hard to keep everyone pleased. So while you may or may not agree with some of their decisions, while you may or may not like certain mechanics, understand that this game is made to cater to more than you, more than your circle friends, more than those here on this forum.. but an entire community's worth of Tenno.
We all want the best for this game, however the best has drastically different meanings for each of us.
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3 hours ago, Evanescent said:
Ahha! I found out how to separate the quote.
Hahaha!! I know exactly how you felt!! It feels like each forum or forum type of place has different set ups, so it always feels nice once you manage it!! XD
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:I was talking about the relevance of fast paced gameplay in high level play. It feels much better to be bouncing between walls and picking of enemies while dodging their shots rather than stunning them with CC and then watching them each mag after mag. I'd much rather prefer DE kept our fast paced gameplay alive in high level stuff and make it 'kill or be killed' rather than be bulletsponge fests.
Wait a second though.. doesn't "fast paced gameplay" contradict your approach of "tactically tough encounters"? I'll be honest with you, endgame in almost any game isn't meant to be fast paced, but more deliberate and thought out.. As we saw with the weekend stream, and in your reference to tactics being priority, it's all about playing as perfectly as possible, not necessarily zipping through missions by bobbing and weaving. For more advanced things, you're going to need CC and ways to address enemy advantages, like armor.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:I realize that, but seeing it being acknowledged makes me breathe a little easier It may not be soon but at least it's on their minds.
Yeah but, I'm just being extremely realistic here.. on their minds, and on their plates are not at all the same thing. So I'd almost suggest wiping its possible existence from your brain, unless they begin talking about their progress on it.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:Infested focus on getting you stunned/slowed/knocked down before hitting you with waves of persistent attacks. The ancients just mindlessly apply buffs to whatever they happen to be around, and certainly the infested don't attack in formation!
The Aura stacking thing may be attributed to them, but that I feel is like saying CC should be the domain of just one warframe.
Technically they do have a formation.. its called swarming. Regardless thematically the infested win by overwhelming numbers, whist the Grineer is all about self fortification, with their hardest targets being difficult to kill without the right set up. Highly armored individual units vs. a swarm that stacks buffs. And while, you're right, certain tactics shouldn't be 100% exclusive to just one faction (shown by the grineers adoption of quick moving targets like the manics, and the jesters set to release in TWW)..each faction however has their defining characteristic, you can't just take that away from them because you don't like it.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:But I think you'll agree that the challenge came from what the enemies could do to you and not what you couldn't do to them?
Innacurate.. what you did to them was use the right team comp and the right loadouts to control them so that there were less issues you had to combat. All the preparation and planning ahead of time, and the way you set your team up was what you did, and minimizing that fact takes away from a BIG part of the game.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:that's mainly what I want DE to do: to make enemies dangerous so that they don't need bulletsponginess to be a challenge.
Lol kind of like nullifiers? Not bulletsponges by any means.. easily killed, yet one of the most detested by players.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:I think we can both agree that a Trinity makes energy cost irrelevant in a group, and the weapons of choice taken have enough ammo efficiency that unless it's an auto weapon you're likely to never run out of ammo unless the enemy levels are in the thousands
Just because Trinity exists, doesn't mean she's always going to be used in every group. You can't balance an entire game on the existence of one Warframe. In addition they began to run out of ammo on level 100 enemies and not all of them were using full auto weapons, in fact there were bows, and orb launchers. Again, hyperbolizing the situation just makes your argument seem less relevant, as having to rely on that kind of statement to validate what you're saying just means that what you're saying doesn't carry enough weight on its own.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:I'll never really get that kind of personality, I guess. I liked going for an hour or two (well over an hour and half my game would crash without fail) but never that extreme.
I'm right there with you.. I've done it a couple times and while those times were fun, it's not something I'd want to do regularly.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:Yep, that's what I was saying. Keep the mindless slaughter, but punctuate it with high intensity encounters to jolt players. You don't need stupid high armor to pose a challenge.
You don't NEED high armor, but it definitely raises the steaks. I'll take the high intensity encounters WITH armor plz!! I want an actual challenge, something that forces me to pre-plan as well as engage in skill based combat. See the fact is, there are different factions for a reason.. you don't want to deal with armor on your extended runs, pick one of the factions that doesn't specialize in it. However, let the rest of us revel in the challenge if we choose to accept it!
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2 minutes ago, Evanescent said:
If you think about the frenetic pace of Warframe, I feel it doesn't suit the 'hey there, take this mag and really work on emptying it so you can kill this one guy'
Exactly, but that only ever occurs when you've planted yourself for a long duration into an endless mission.. which isn't the sole mission type in game. OR if you happen to be using a sub par weapon, which honestly I'm assuming isn't a part of the argument. You can't crystallize this as something that occurs all the time everywhere due to armor. It only occurs when players challenge themselves to participate in an extended run, at that point they should expect some form of difficulty.
11 minutes ago, Evanescent said:It's a hole we've dug ourselves into, as I've said, and one I hope DE can address with their damage rework
Between you and me.. and this is just my perspective on it.. with all the work they're doing with TWW as well as the two other frames that are incoming.. I wouldn't count on this being a thing for a looooong while if ever. Remember, just because it was discussed on a devstream, doesn't mean its a 100% guarantee.. its pretty much just live brainstorming.
13 minutes ago, Evanescent said:An energy leech charger is easily 1 shot even at high levels, but the same is not true for a heavy gunner with the same effect.
You do realize that you're comparing a light unit with a heavy unit right? Lets compare apples to infested apples lol.. While infested heavy units may still be easier to kill than a grineer heavy unit their real threat is their ability to buff surrounding units, making it kind of difficult to take them on along side their buddies.. but making it difficult to kill their buddies. Grineer heavy units on the other hand are heavily fortified and just difficult to kill plain and simple, but pose no buffs to their allies. You gotta remember that each faction has distinctive fighting tactics so its not as simple as doing a one to one comparison.
23 minutes ago, Evanescent said:See, enemies stacking auras to make them tough to kill to me, is amazing for difficulty. You actually have juggle avoiding the attacks of the protected enemies while you find the enemy that's protecting them and kill it. It kind of makes a dent in your gameplay by forcing you to change your approach and prioritise and spot the threat.
Exactly! And that's the approach of the infested 100%! Each faction is going to have their unique approach, which is what makes the game interesting.. if all of them adopted the same play, it wouldn't be nearly as thematic.. and wouldn't be nearly as butt clenching when they get together and combine their tactics in the void!
26 minutes ago, Evanescent said:Now you take that, and you have 4 groups like that approach your frost bubble in your wave 100 defense. If you had waves of lvl 200 units in there, they wouldn't be much of a challenge because you would have 4 CP, an Ash bladestorming, a CC frame keeping them brain dead, and a frost protecting with a globe. You would have your multi-polarised guns that would be shredding through them with your viral and slash procs, and they would be gone within minutes. That's not really something that would challenge the normal experienced player, because they couldn't apply their damage to you in the first place, and the armor that was supposed to stop your progression is now gone.
Literally just watched the world record run live on twitch yesterday where they spent 7hours going up to wave 136.. while the armor didn't stop their progression the 1 hit kills definitely made for some intense moments. Trust me, that snowglobe didn't save them.
30 minutes ago, Evanescent said:The problem seems to be the meta endless missions promote: bypassing the challenge instead of meeting it head on.
I think the verbage on that is inaccurate.. It's more like modding to negate specific challenges in order to focus on progressing. The progression itself is difficult.. the enemies increased damage ouptut, the increased health pools, and the fact that your weapons will only continue to do the same amount of damage regardless of how far you decide to go. Not to mention the resource management you need, IE ammo, health, shield and energy restores.
35 minutes ago, Evanescent said:DE has stayed that the endless missions are designed to push you out at a certain point, and the armor and damage are a means to that end. Yet CP allows you to just bypass that difficulty and CC keeps you from getting damaged, letting you go on for as long as you want. Isn't it contradictory then, so claim armor as a challenge and yet have something that lets you not tackle it, but skip it, unchanged?
I feel strongly that this has been addressed in the above answers.. but if you haven't watched it, I do believe that wGrates, DanieltheDemon, ShulGaming, and animatedbreak should have this in their twitch vods. If you watch the last half hour, you'll see that you've definitely minimized the threat of these enemies. CP doesn't necessarily make these enemies easy to kill, and CC doesn't keep you from getting damaged 100% of the time.. when facing level 2000+ enemies that 1% is enough to cause the mission to fail. At that point it's all about playing perfectly.. and as we're all human beings that's not always going to be the case.
39 minutes ago, Evanescent said:And if you don't want players going on after a certain point, why not make them finite, long missions?
Sometimes, and while I'm not the kind of person who really wants it.. its all just for the glory. Just to be able to say that you did it! If you watch the twitch vods you'll see what I mean.
39 minutes ago, Evanescent said:To me it seems it would be more productive to have planned, tough encounters in a well organised mission rather than have an endless slew of mindless slaughter. Do we go for quality, or quantity?
OMG, YAAAAAASSS!! This I 100% agree with!! Not necessarily to kill off endless, but to have this be an option too!! The thing is there are A LOT of people that like mindless slaughter (I definitely do occasionally).. so let them have their missions, but also in turn, even if just occasionally give us these tactically tough encounters for those that enjoy a different type of challenge.
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8 hours ago, notlamprey said:
I think we may need to examine the larger question of who is representing our community to DE.
Lol just because I don't represent you, doesn't mean I don't represent a good amount of the community. The part of the community that finds the forums to be too toxic to be a part of. The kind that don't like the vocal minority assuming that they're the only ones that exist.
8 hours ago, notlamprey said:I think we should be represented by folks who know better than to respond to a single negative comment in the manner I've quoted below.
XD oh, you mean the poster who said I was wrong, then posed a very weak argument as to why I was? Then moved on to call me a yes-man? And accused me of not being able to see their flaws which I was easily able to argue against? Funny how one-sided your viewpoint is.. thanks for not even addressing that whatsoever! Totally fair and impartial <3
8 hours ago, notlamprey said:We don't need you telling us how to feel about these people and their ideas. We will decide for ourselves, because we're capable of doing that.
Funnily enough.. wasn't that exactly what the poster was doing to me? Let me pull some quotes.. "DE, please don't listen to that.. He's a yes-man and he's only ever contrarian to anything that questions your design choices.. stop putting him in every episode just to agree with you.."
Now of course, anyone who's paid attention to my content knows that I've definitely stood in opposition of things they've put out before. I've even put in suggestions that have been put in place in game. So.. where's your post on his inaccuracy? Or have you just decided that I'm the villain in the argument?
8 hours ago, notlamprey said:Here we see another direct attack on the credibility of the other party, playing toward ideas which are meant to evoke an emotional response.
"Ugh, the other guy is doomsaying! We're so tired of that around here!"
Maybe you haven't caught it, but there's a big part of the community that can't stand the doom saying. That doesn't like people who don't know what they're talking about attempting to push their psuedo-issues onto the devs, when they could be working on something that would be more enriching to the community.
8 hours ago, notlamprey said:You really seem keen to attack others, here. In lieu of explaining why anyone should be persuaded by your arguments, you're focusing exclusively on trashing someone else's.
LOL again, I find it funny how you take that ONE quote, but you dont include the paragraph above that where I discuss the principals of modding for the biggest threat:
"a lone bursa's armor can be dispatched by a single kavat. Sooo is a lone bursa the bigger threat? or are the packs of nullifiers that may require you to have high efficiency and energy regeneration in order to recast your abilities more of the priority? As for the infested, burning them down quickly, rather than letting them use their pack buffs on you is far more important than stripping armor, in fact if you kill fast enough you won't have to worry about it."
Sounds kind of like someones knitpicking quotes claiming that I'm "focusing on exclusively trashing someone else's".. when in all reality I'm posing counter argument that actually sticks. ;) I don't know.. maybe you don't like what I have to say, or feel like it threatens your ideals, but it sounds like "a direct attack on the credibility of the other party"8 hours ago, notlamprey said:What do you gain from that? What does the other party gain? What does the community gain?
Simply put, stronger discussions based on fact, and not emotion. As I've stated previously, its very hard to stand up to a solid argument, and frankly a lot of whats been posted up is either pure miss information or complete hyperbolization of the situation. It's great to have well thought out meaningful discussion, but so often what we get is doomsaying, bandwagoning, and other ridiculous forms of copy and pasta.
While you may not like me, and even possibly my view points, I will challenge other players to do their research, to think BEFORE they speak, and most importantly to have the guts NOT to be intimidated by the echo chamber of the forum hounds. There are many people out there that the vocal minority silences, and they need a voice.8 hours ago, notlamprey said:You have claimed a diverse following, and you have claimed to be acting in service of the community.
I don't think you are, honestly.
Feel free to disagree all you like, but lets face it, seems like you've got a clear bias ;P
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On 11/5/2016 at 0:32 AM, Evanescent said:
I don't dislike armor scaling by itself, I just think the time to kill becomes too high after a certain point to be fun. It's one thing going toe to toe with a boss, but seeing primed bullets bounce off of a mere grunt never feels good.
That's the thing though isn't it? When difficulty increases that's what you're going to get.. whether its increased health, shields, multiple nullifier bubbles, enemys who stack auras to make it difficult to kill them. Every faction is going to have some barrier to your progress, and that's the real issue.. you're not MEANT to stay in a mission forever. It's supposed to get difficult. It's supposed to pose a challenge.
And, while I'll take any buff we can get, realistically we don't have skill based shield breaking.. nor do we have skill based aura removal.. why is there no discussion about that? Personally it just kinda feel's like we're knitpicking.. then when this problem is "solved" what will we move on to trivialize next?
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3 hours ago, Evanescent said:
Addressing the last point, and from what I know, the slash proc is determined by 35% of your base damage
I think you need to do more research.. its 35% or your weapons base damage per tick for 7 ticks giving you a total of 235% of the weapons base damage over a total of 6 seconds.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:you can counter shields without an aura, using a damage type that can be applied to any weapon.
Yeah you certainly can with a 90% toxin mod and a 60% toxin mod.. which adds up to what? 150% of your weapons base damage? ;) So while yes you can add it to ANY weapon, it still doesn't add up to the 235% slash damage that a slash status weapon can put out.. of course a weapons status chance and damage spread does keep things balanced in that case.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:This is not the case in a 4 man group or in solo, where there are only 4 slots which must be taken by CP or gone without it. Even if you do CC enemies, you are still going to need to kill the boss: the damage boost from removing armor is unparalleled. So you don't need to worry about CP, chances are there will already be 4 of them there.
LOL I 4 man Jordas and Law with no issues when we lack CP.. soooo, again I think you're being melodramatic. Bring an Amesha and toggle on the slow for Jordas, which brings him to a crawl, and Vay Hek.. well he's just cake. Not sure if the rest of the team was packing Tigris Primes or something, but he's always been dead in a matter of seconds.
3 hours ago, Evanescent said:I speak on energy siphon from personal experience. When I use a caster frame, which should benefit the most from ES (outside Loki, his invis easily lets me regenerate energy and have spare for disarm) most of the time, ES only proved useful in the downtimes where I had an active power going or wasn't using them. I was burning through energy too fast for ES to really give me much of a benefit.
Lol well I speak on energy siphon from personal experience.. what it looks like you're having an issue with is power strength stacking. I play with high efficiency so every tick from ES means a whole lot more than when running a less efficient build. I mean feel free to build any way you like, but I've run lots of solo extended duration missions and not had to pop a single energy pad due to ES.
So while YOU may attribute the dash polarity in the aura slot, it doesn't mean that THAT is the specific case for all users who chose to do so. (PS: Loot radar is also fun for treasure hunting!! XD)
Now as for the whole end bit.. (because I don't know how to do that neat thing you did to like hide the long comment. Someone teaaaaaach meeee!!) That can all be fixed by just biting the bullet and using CP. There's a solution to the problem, its no one else's fault but your own if you choose not to use it. And that's not meant to be adversarial or combative in any way shape or form, but is a simple statement of common sense. Just because you may have some emotional tie as to why you don't choose to use it, it doesn't mean that the solution doesn't exist. -
25 minutes ago, Evanescent said:
While that's true, the actual high level stuff you'll want to do are raids and sorties with the elimination of void survivals.
As someone who quite enjoys raids, the groups we run don't prioritize CP since a majority of what we do is CC.
26 minutes ago, Evanescent said:Grineer sorties frequently feature enhanced armor, and given most of the sortie missions are split between Grineer and Corpus, you have a large chunk of sorties demanding armor mitigation.
Technically not a LARGE chunk, but more precisely stated.. half. Again, I stick to the non-hyperbolic stuff here ;P
33 minutes ago, Evanescent said:Yep, but it becomes an issue when you face corpus proxy bosses, especially in sorties, again. If future event continue to have groups like the Index, we are going to see armored corpus, and it will become a problem, Better to nip it in the bud.
So, one mission out of the possible three may require you to use CP IF the sortie of the day happens to pull up a Corpus boss? Doesn't seem all that big a deal.
OR during a special event run.. that, lets face it will not experience high traffic after players get the mods that drop from there. Honestly busting out CP occasionally to deal with this kind of stuff isn't as harrowing as people make it out to be LOL. I highly doubt that people people are chomping at the bit to turn the index into their new end game experience.
There isn't an issue unless you really want to inflate the situation into something that it's not.
39 minutes ago, Evanescent said:it seems it provides a bonus to 2 types of armor and cloned flesh, machinery, fossilized flesh, and suffers -50% aginst corpus flesh. Correct me if I am wrong, but if it provides a bonus to 3 of the four current factions, does it not prove how prevalent armor (and machinery being exclusive to grineer, i believe) is in the 3 factions?
I'm not sure what you're looking at, but the link that you specifically sent is to corrosive damage.. which only deals bonuses to Ferrite armor and Fossilized units. I'm not sure if you read it before you actually linked it. Now technically the armor redux from the procs would help with alloy armor as well, but alloy has no innate weakness to it, meaning that corrosive damage will be mitigated like the rest of damage types when coming up against alloy.
As for bonuses to 3 of the 4 current factions, this is not tied to armor prevalence as one of the factions is Fossilized infested flesh, which does not count as armor. I think you may need to spend more time researching to make any kind of statement.43 minutes ago, Evanescent said:Not the sole perhaps, but advanced builders I think recognize that energy siphon is pretty lackluster and insufficient in the later stages of the game, especially once you have zenurik. If an experienced players does use a dash polarity, it is for CP.
Lol this is also quite inaccurate.. I think there may be a bit of confirmation bias going on. An advanced builder would know that energy siphon is excellent for warframes that don't use toggled abilities and have skillsets that work well with the Naramon focus. This actually tends to be a big go to for solo extended survivalists, especially those that combo it with slash based status weapons.. not a large need for CP if your build is able to bypass the armor on its own.
Again, hyperbolizing the issue by insisting that something is the only choice, without realistically looking at all the other options is one of the big problems amongst players, and one of the big reasons why I feel it necessary to speak up.48 minutes ago, Evanescent said:I agree that each faction has its niche, but those niche's have to be adjusted to be manageable. And if that niche is removed just by putting on a mod, that isn't really a niche at all!
You mean like stacking Shield Disruption (with 2 coaction drifts) to completely negate Corpus Shielding? Or combining 4 EMP aura's to reduce Corpus accuracy by 40%? Or using Infested Impedance to slow infested by 75%? We can easily negate these niches to make each faction far more managable, but the real issue here is that people are over dramatizing armor scaling because "it's too hard", or possibly because its has once again become the "hot topic of the week".
55 minutes ago, Evanescent said:That's a good balance-you can choose to just take of shields, but if you want to use a different aura you can just shift your builds to include poison. The Grineer, I feel, should follow suit.
Kinda like you can shift your builds to include slash procs to bypass armor? Again, people are too blinded by their emotional ties over "the issue of armor" to see that the solutions already exist.
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21 minutes ago, Evanescent said:
o combat high priority threats like us I believe we can accommodate them developing adjustments to their units to counter us! So having mobile units for anti-tenno action, especially in wave attacks where we assume they send their forces in a premeditated manner, this would be lore-friendly indeed.
Lol they tried, but we stopped them.. Tube Men of Regor, manics & manic bombards remember? So unless we LET THEM develop more of those we're just gonna have to stick to the standard armored units. XD
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Now, before I begin, I just need to give you a heads up. I'm not here to down anybody, but what I am here to do is provide a realistic, non-hyperbolized perspective on a highly stigmatized topic. A lot of players get very emotional when approaching the subject of armor scaling, which seems to be the reason why facts tend to be thrown out of the window. But please, do not begrudge me if I do not yield to feelings, as logic (at least for me) is paramount.
4 hours ago, Evanescent said:I agree that you should be prepared when going into higher level content, but really, that preparing is awfully limited.
First off, lets be 100% transparent about this.. with only 8 30+ nodes that feature escalating mission types with predominantly armored enemies across the ENTIRE starchart, the amount of exposure a player is going to to have with these are extremely limited, UNLESS they decide they specifically want to pursue them, and even then the challenge only begins to ramp up beyond 20mins/waves.. so while the prep is extremely limited the forced exposure is also quite limited.
4 hours ago, Evanescent said:"the lazy way will always be the smartest way" and truly, nothing can compete with just slapping on a mod that removes 100% armor from everything without doing anything other than spawning into the mission.
Exactly.. stacking CP isn't a difficult thing to do, so the exposure a player has isn't just limited, but its easy to circumvent
4 hours ago, Evanescent said:Nevertheless, it remains true that beside very select powers with very select augments, there are no other efficient ways to counter armor scaling.
While the forced exposure is limited, this is also true. So maybe the real issue isn't that armor scaling itself is the problem, but the lack of options to combat it. Each faction has their own unique challenges, with their own unique solutions.. so aside from CP, corrosive & slash procs, and the current batch of armor stripping augments, maybe we should have more.
4 hours ago, Evanescent said:Another issue is the prevalence of armor. Compared with shields, nearly everything other than the corpus have armor, and even they have armored robotics inside.
This statement is actually highly inaccurate. The infested do not feature armor ASIDE from swarm multalist moas who can grant an armor buff, but is limited solely to infested light units. You eliminate the moa before they spread their swarm, and there is no armor to speak of. Specific ancients provide damage reduction auras, but these do not count as armor and are not reduced by corrosive projection. Again, the infested tactical advantage is their ability to swarm and buff the swarm.
As for the Corpus the only armored robotic units they feature are Oxium Ospreys (which literally suicide themselves) and the Bursa which only appear in limited numbers.4 hours ago, Evanescent said:Is it not odd why magnetic is shunned while corrosive and radiation are so loved and lauded?
Technically the reason why corrosive is held in such high regard is the fact that it features a 75% damage bonus that effects three of the four current factions. While yes it does have armor stripping capabilities, it is also the most useful in general meaning that players don't have to swap their builds as often ("the lazy way is always the smartest way"). Magnetic on the other hand is far less popular due to the fact that it is focused solely on corpus units, and excels at taking down shields... which can be bypassed by both slash procs and toxin. This has less to do with armor than it does the elements overall effectiveness as a damage type.
5 hours ago, Evanescent said:Add to that in nearly build video you will find, the polarity is always changed to dash "for corrosive projection". It certainly does not represent the entire playerbase and state of the game, but it does speak to the power of corrosive projection.
This is also partially inaccurate as energy siphon, another VERY popular aura, shares the same polarity. Whist corrosive projection is quite powerful, admittedly energy siphon factors into a lot of self sustaining buff builds. So CP is not the SOLE reason to swap polarities to a dash.
5 hours ago, Evanescent said:Going into higher levels, you could then simply make them more mobile to increase the difficulty and not have to shoot their health and armor through the roof!
While this is a great thought, other factions already have this capability, with infested jumpers and moas, and the Drover bursa.. even to a lesser extend flying drones with their small hit boxes (I hate them sooo much!).
The thing about this is, as players, we can't just pick and choose challenges because we feel like one is too hard (which as we covered earlier isn't actually very hard as all it takes to counter is slotting in CP), that's not the way life works. Each enemy faction has their own niche, and removing a niche simply because we don't feel like it's fun, or we just don't feel like swapping around our auras, or we feel the need to make some sort of principalic statement to DE about our feelings on armor, is a complete cop-out. Thematically the Grineer are a highly armored military force that has taken over the system.. attempting to turn them into ninjas simply because we don't like the challenge they pose, just doesn't fit in game-wise.5 hours ago, Evanescent said:Ty for reading!
Ty for listening!! ;D
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2 minutes ago, homiedudemanguy said:
the matter of the fact is that have a representative of a total of 335 votes over the millions of players that play warframe isn't really a great pool and suffers from a low sample to represent a population that could likely not even know that there is even a poll to begin with.
So basically you're saying that both of our judgments on this poll aren't really representative of the game as a whole, and thus neither statments are an accurate quantification of what happens in game. I can definitely agree with that!
However if we are simply basing appearances on this specific sample group, it still does stand that only 22% think its a must have, while the rest of those polled are more flexible with their choices to a varying degree. -
3 hours ago, homiedudemanguy said:
Seeing Corrosive Projection at top with "almost always on" is a problem for it hinders diversity
That might be slightly miss-representative of the actual numbers (at the point of this posting).. if you combine the top three options, (almost always/always, frequently, often) you get a total of 335 votes. If you add the bottom three (sometimes, rarely, never/almost never) you get a total of 300 votes.
The split is actually approximately 53% for more often used, and a little over 47% for less than sometimes used.. If you look at the almost always crowd, they only represent 22% of the entire graph, meaning that 88% don't consider it a mandatory mod.. so clearly there are a few very vocal people in the community that make the issue seem more dire than it actually is. -
2 minutes ago, Chipputer said:
I appreciate that you leveled with me and stood your ground.
But of course! A solid argument always floats ;D I appreciate the feedback, and you take care of yourself as well! Hopefully you'll continue to enjoy future episodes of the podcast!
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2 minutes ago, Chipputer said:
Funnily enough, that's why I simply adore your youtube content. Yes, I said adore.
I can tell trust me ;D (no sarcasm)
3 minutes ago, Chipputer said:I just think it's a bit imbalanced and one person ends up being the clear lead in the discussion and it just feels... stagnant.
Clear lead? Definitely not how I feel when sitting on the panel, especially when the positions I present tend to be a odds with the other two guests.. however it is slightly flattering.
5 minutes ago, Chipputer said:It was unintentional, but I left it when I realized how it sounded. Figured you'd appreciate it. :P
Lol how can one not? Honestly though, that's how most of mine tend to come out, then its all just about changing the inflection for accentuation (which apparently is a real word!! kinda shocked)
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23 minutes ago, Chipputer said:
When someone is publicly putting their opinions out there, particularly in a small group discussion, and you feel that they may or may not be disruptive to the proceedings, the quickest way to get that across is to tell them, directly.
See while you think it may be disrupting to the proceedings, I view it as challenging someones viewpoint. Like I had stated, if someone makes a less than informed statement I feel that it is completely fair to tell them, directly. Lots of people in the community tend to latch on to falsehoods, so without someone with the experience, exposure, or enough common sense to show them the possible faults in their thought processes, that falsehood is accepted without question.
23 minutes ago, Chipputer said:Rob can be a little overbearing, but that's who he is. He comes in hard, he comes in fast, and he gets what he wants to say out whether you like it or not.
Lol did you slip in an innuendo in there? ;P
However yes, admittedly when I spot weak arguments I do tend to become impassioned, because frankly I believe our community deserves to be better informed and act more logically than they have in the most recent months. And frankly if that's an issue then I'd beg to ask why? As I had previously put it.. if an argument is strong, its very hard to poke holes into.. so either people aren't fond of me common sensing out, issues that they're emotionally tied to (which should lead them to ask, WHY they are so attached to it, when it can easily be sorted out), or they just don't like me personally.. which is totally fine ;)
I'm not the kind of person who cops out, and follows mob mentality or someone who plays sesame street with peoples feelings. It may not make me many friends, but what you don't need is someone who will cave to the will of the doom and gloom echo chamber that can be the forums. -
1 minute ago, TGDM said:
As I re-listened to the segment, almost every response you gave was along the lines of "we should wait to talk about this" culminated by a final "... and that's why I think it's a little bit dangerous to have a conversation about this right now in this state." I appreciate your enthusiasm and point of view, but surely you can see the value in discussing these things before they're added to the game.
I highly dissagree, the fact is without having it in game for a large number of players to playtest we don't discover all of the exploits, all of extremely niche mechanics that can be combined with any one specific thing. So while talking is nice, actually having something solid to base a conversation on is more effective.
6 minutes ago, TGDM said:as Rebecca mentioned on the latest episode it's rarely ever done completely right the first time. Imagine what "The Vacuum Within" would have been like if they stuck to the original plan of splitting it into 3 mods.
Lol lets face it, with all of the 2.0's and even a few 3.0's its proof positive that we NEED to have it in game to be able to truly gauge how something is going to work. Cutting it down 6m and making it passive may have freed up a slot (which in discussion sounds nice), but as we saw its implementation IN GAME fell quite short, just furthering the fact that we need to HAVE something before we can provide feedback for it.
10 minutes ago, TGDM said:You've been around long enough to see stuff added to the game that was just flawed at the conceptual level by now. You've been around long enough to know that even though something can still be fun, it's not necessarily good design.
You're right, I have been around, and I've been around long enough to know that players aren't good at providing solutions as they do not know what tools or mechanics are available to the development team, BUT.. they are instead MUCH BETTER at telling people what's wrong, and we can't know whats wrong without it being in peoples hands.
13 minutes ago, TGDM said:I'm just saying that there have been a few times where you've stifled the conversation a little bit when it comes to brainstorming or offering criticism.
I think that's more of an issue of clashing ideals. As we both make it very apparent, we tend to not stand on the same side on many issues. The fact is it's always going to be hard to offer criticism when you have someone there that can challenge the faults in your argumentation. Let's face it, the stronger a statement is, the harder it is to poke holes into. As you've stated, I've been around for quite awhile, I have a good amount of experience, and I have a very wide audience that takes many different stances (and makes sure that I hear every word of it lol). So, when a point of view is presented that doesn't quite float, it's a part of my job in the community to point out the issues in it.
24 minutes ago, TGDM said:I've enjoyed our discussions and I hope we continue them in the future. I think our discussion about Armor in particular was a healthy display of conflicting opinions, for example.
The funniest part of it all is, as argumentative as we were on the stream, we stayed for.. what? LOL like 2 almost 3 more hours afterwards continuing the discussion.. too bad no one can see the laughs we had there, instead I'm just gonna be painted as some hardass villain XD
Drop Rates, Datamines, and Digital Extremes (DDD).
in Developer Workshops
Posted
Yeah.. thats kind of the whole point isn't it? It was never in the game because a group of dataminers were already providing it for the community. DE simply used it as a reason to work on other things, like new weapons, new frames, reworks, cinematic quests, etc etc. I'm not saying that they were in the right for doing that in any way shape or form, HOWEVER if that resource DIDN'T exist for us AT ALL you damn well know that the community would've pushed for it a ton harder and DE would've been forced to respond to THAT instead of this.
The parts of the UI that pull DIRECTLY from the game itself didn't show screwed up stats. Manually imputed ones most likely did, however it seems that with this site, DE is making sure that it comes directly from the source that way you get the most accurate and up to date information, rather than waiting for someone to "datamine" the info.