Dalzedur
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Posts posted by Dalzedur
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Yep, two slots would be great. Warframe modslots are getting increasingly crowded due to syndicate augments. I'm thinking that those are probably the number one thing to take a look at.
Other limitations are fine as well. Either acquisition of the blueprints for these should be something to work towards. Maybe limited by chance (not necessarily a low drop%, but maybe only appearing in alert-types or rare containers) and challenge (maybe the alert has to be a nightmare alert or a tactical one.) Gathering the resources for crafting them is probably not going to be a significant limiting factor, since the people who are at the point in the game where they can actually benefit from these superchargers already have existing stockpiles of resources.
I am taking the safe route of assuming that the Warframe development team has some kind of a 'big picture' vision going on. Calling these suggested items 'superchargers' was just something to give me a term with which I can refer to these items, there is probably a better term to use, but this one was the one that came to my mind. Hell, if a feature such as this gets implemented with only a lore-compatibility overhaul, or even partially / in some entirely other way than described in my starting post, I would still be more than glad. Because... if it gives me a new goal to strive towards, then that's going to keep me playing. Me - and quite likely other people as well.
After all, with so many mods around and so few slots to fill there are going to be a lot of 'useless' (even if they are good) mods around. Since some of the mods I put in 98% of the time. And my suggested approach will also give me something to do with all the forma I have. :)
My part here is to suggest an idea, which might or might not reach someone in the development team. How that someone or the development team in general proceeds regarding this idea is up to them, I acknowledge that they do have things on their todo-list already. But basically it comes down to brainstorming what ramifications these would have for the game, and how to best implement them if they are shown green light. After that the coding will probably not even take as long as creating art for them and writing the necessary texts (lore, documentation etc)
-D
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I'm using the term 'Supercharger', but there is probably some better term for these. I have not excessively skimmed through the various suggestions on the forums to see if someone else has already suggested something along these lines, but:
A supercharger is a consumable item, much like Orokin reactors and Orokin catalysts. It is used through the 'action' button in the modding screen, just like reactors and catalysts.
When used, the supercharger is consumed. Its effect on the supercharged item is as follows: It adds a corresponding 'modslot' to the item, with restrictions depending on the supercharger used. There are more than one kind of superchargers, and more than one of them can be used once on the same item, provided that they are not the same type of supercharger. A modslot added by a supercharger can be formatted with a forma to alter its polarity type from the initial 'empty' slot to any of the existing polarities available.
--- List of some suggested superchargers, no need for all of them to be added ---
Primed supercharger: The modslot provided by the Primed supercharger can only be equipped with Primed-level mods, such as Primed reach (for a melee weapon.)
Corrupt supercharger: The modslot provided by the Corrupt supercharger can only be equipped with Corrupt mods.
Stalker supercharger: The modslot provided by the Stalker supercharger can only be equipped with Nightmare mods.
Orokin supercharger: The modslot provided by the Orokin supercharger can only be equipped with rare/uncommon/common mods that are not primed or corrupt.
Syndicate supercharger: The modslot provided by the Syndicates can only be equipped with syndicate mods.
Lotus/Tenno supercharger: The modslot provided by the Lotus supercharger can only be equipped with uncommon/common mods.
Corpus supercharger: The inferior mass-produced Corpus supercharger gives the equipment a modslot that can only be equipped with common mods. Corpus supercharger is the most common supercharger out there, possibly the only one being sold on the market.
Not sure if a Conclave supercharger would have a place in the world, though.
--- End of list ---
Now, having additional modslots does not mean that the weapon/frame in question has enough modpoints to make use of them. After all, 60 points is the usual maximum, but aura or melee stance can further increase it. This means that in order to make use of the added modslots to their full potential, you would have to bring the individual modcosts down through matching polarity slots, which usually means using a Forma. Another way of handling this hard limitation is to have the supercharger give additional modpoints to the item when used, but personally I would have mixed feelings about this.
If the players have to craft superchargers from consumed blueprints, the crafting cost could be made steep, involving rare components, maybe Forma, and a a credit cost that would be anywhere from 10k to 1M, depending on the supercharger type in question.
Even though I have suggested several types of superchargers here, I leave the methods of acquisition open. As well as how many superchargers can be used on a single item.
While this will introduce potentially more power creep to the game, it will provide precious replayability to the endgame players out there who have already exhausted their interest in the regular content. I also think that initially the effects of having superchargers would mean that players would specialize in a single, favourite, frame. This, of course, comes down to how easy or difficult it would be to acquire superchargers, and normal missions could still very well be played with non-supercharged frames. The possibility of players making use of superchargers would also give the development team a safe way of making more challenging/difficult content in the form of trials, bosses, special missions/quests/encounters, higher level starmap regions, or even V-tier Orokin missions.
I know that players are already struggling to optimize their 8 modslots and that there will be mixed feelings towards increasing that hard cap of 8 modslots, since some players will also want the game content to not be boringly easy.
-D
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Yes. Now, please take the rare 5 cores OUT of the void. I really would rather get prime parts for my keys.
This I have to agree with. Not sure how much it would affect the economy though.
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So, is there now that intended double reward for void sabotages with all three caches searched? Finding 1x uncommon cores in all of them made them a waste of time.
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You know that one Orokin treasure room/vault that has you drop down a vertical shaft with lots of laser hazards? Yeah, that one.
After you avoid the lasers and go up the wind tunnel, you can get stuck inside the sphere-like compartment near where the ceiling meets the back end of the room (the sphere's lid closes, it has orokin containers on a 90-degrees tilted platform that defies gravity).
I suppose you are meant to shoot the containers after you get launched from the wind tunnel, but if you have enough horizontal movement (by hitting melee button during the flight, for example) the horizontal air current sucks you inside the still-open lid and you get imprisoned inside the sphere. You don't seem to have enough time to get out, as it takes just that long to get there that the lid closes right after you enter it.
This does not seem like an intended trap by deliberate design. There is a small gap between the lid and the rim, through which you might theoretically be able to teleport out with loki/ash if you can get someone to target with the abilities, but for frames other than those - you are pretty much royally screwed. For bonus points, you can be carrying the mobile defence briefcase that will then make the mission impossible to complete for the entire group.
So far I have been unable to glitch back into the map by attempting wall runs and other devious maneuvers - maybe the lid is childproof since it can open/close, and there really isn't any good edges inside the hemisphere. The sucking air current makes it difficult to try it properly, too.
By the time I am writing this, I have fallen prey to this dastardly device twice now. Previously while... carrying the mobile defence briefcase... >_>'
And since it is a void mission, the mission ends for everyone if the host leaves. Or seemed to, so it was not possible to alt+f4 out the game and use the reconnection popup feature after relaunching the game. And of course, being there in the first place means that a key has been consumed.
There should be some kind of unstuck-me button for situations where you get glitched inside walls/outside the level...
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Hey, where's the TL;DR? Just kidding.
You raised a good point, I kid you not. Added a TL;DR. A picture is worth thousands words, they say. Alas, MSpaint is clumsy, and so was I.
Overall, ideas are and remain ideas until someone with the power to implement them takes a look at them and filters them through his/her own thought process. As such, it is a good idea to remember that these are merely suggestions, not ultimatums - I won't throw a tantrum and kick a puppy if I don't get my way, but I will feel warm and fuzzy inside if my post makes a positive difference.
If a developer chooses to add foils, then he/she adds them his/her way. Those might make use of the suggestions players have made, or not. As such, all feedback is welcome, both relating to personal gaming experience (e.g. "I don't want these to be implemented and this is why: <your reasoning>"), and your interpretation of how it would affect the game in a bigger picture (for example: "Your suggestion would make Foil-level mods too powerful and it would severely disrupt the game balance in ways X, Y and/or Z, such as would be the case when you have a Dread + foil thunderbolt + foil split chamber.)
I understand that the game developers have their own todo-lists and making purely cosmetic changes without any effects on actual gameplay mechanics is something that is likely to get buried under more important features, tunes, additions etc.
As for foil-mods having an additional gameplay benefit of being slightly more powerful than regular cards, this feature - if implemented - would probably make foil cards appear to the game sooner than if they were to remain purely cosmetic. Maybe - I don't know.
As is, a foil-mods without an added benefit would be a vanity item. A bragging right. But how would you go about showing off having one? Anyone could claim that they have a foil-mod, as there would not be a way to reliably show it around, right? I don't know, maybe you know something I don't - which is probably true.
As for people who already have a maxed out mod, and should foil-mods have an added benefit and make it to the game: Personally I would feel joyous. Yes, that maxed out mod would no longer be 'the best available', but it would not be any worse in absolute sense. In relative sense, yes, admittedly, but in terms of gameplay, it would still have its effect of +n% in stat X. But the option, the possibility of there being a foil-version of the mod would give me a new goal. Something more to reach. Something to achieve. It might keep the game fresh. People playing, who otherwise might become bored, having achieved all there is to achieve (until next content update).
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TL;DR: http://postimg.org/image/qk1tzgn29/
Anyone who has ever dabbled with collectible card games &c, probably knows what a 'foil' is. (to be honest, I'm not 100% certain myself, but that's another story and a story we shan't let get in the way)
In a nut shell, a foil card is otherwise a normal card, except that it has special eye candy on it, possibly gloss, or a layer of colouring that changes in appearance when you look at it from different angles. They are an additional 'rarity' level, so to speak, and are something to be proud of, should one have any. In layman terms, a "same-sex-attraction-orientation pride" version of a card. (<-- Ha! Found a way to avoid automatic post text censorship!)
Now back to Warframe:
From what I've understood, Warframe mods are much like collectible cards. They have rarity levels: common, uncommon, rare etc, and you can buy them, collect them, and nowadays - even trade them. How are they different from collectibles?
So my suggestion is to incorporate this foil-gimmick to Warframe mods. Make a special probability check whenever a player acquires a mod - any mod (except maybe fusion cores), in any way (except through trading from another player) - be they event reward, a drop, a mod from any source. This check might be as rare as 1:1000, or something along those lines. When the check passes, that one-in-a-thousand returns true, the acquired mod is a foil-version. With this high playerbase, several are bound to enter the game each day, even if they are weighted to be very rare occurances.
The point is to make them so rare, that it would not be humanly possible to grind for a foil-version of particular mod. No 100 missions a day to get Foil-level Hornet Strike. If it happens, it happens. No point lamenting over 'wasting a boon from the RNG God' when one acquires a foil-version of a useless mod. Well, we can all point fingers and laugh at the misfortune, which brings us closer as a community, so even then it can be called a win-situation, overall!
The foil-chance could be further modified by: mission level, if it is a nightmare mission, number of players participating, some buff item from the market (like there is already affinity booster and credits booster), slightly higher chance if a mission reward mod, slightly higher chance in alerts, slightly higher chance in Orokin void, slightly boosted chance during operations, or something upcoming that we don't even know about yet (very long 6-man missions?) etc.
The benefit: Make a foil-version of a mod act as if it were one mod level higher. So a freshly dropped foil split chamber would be 30% multishot with cost of 10. A maxed out foil-level split chamber would be 105% multishot with cost of 15, as opposed to 90% from a normal maxed out split chamber mod. While this poses a situation of a slight power creep, I personally do not think of it as an issue, if foils stay rare enough to make it unlikely for a player to be able to mod out their uberweapon with 3+ foiled mods.
Variant: Make a foil-version of a mod cost one mod slot less, so a freshly dropped foil-level fast hands would cost 1 mod slot to equip (instead of normal 2), and a maxed out fast hands would cost 6 instead of 7. A lot of max-level mods seem to have an odd-numbered modcost, so this would help even with polarity slots involved. (15/2 = 7.5, which rounds up to 8.0, but (15-1)/2=7)
Combine the two above to form an even rarer version that combines the two effects: 1 level higher, 1 point cheaper. Maybe make the two foil checks and if both pass (1:1000 & 1:1000 -> 1:1000000), you get this I don't know what to call it, ultra foil? (or just give it some in-game lore name, Vandal version, Orokin version, Prototype version, Heaven version, Earth version etc)
Secondary benefit: People would probably trade them around.
Disadvantages:
-People already complain that the game is grindy. (No one is forcing them to grind for foils, huoh...)
-Power creep: Some mods already do not have that many levels in them, so a +1 to a 4th level mod is a considerable boost already: Thunderbolt, nightmare dual mods. (But again, rare is rare, and rare is way of balancing)
-People get mad when they finally get a foil, and it is a crappy mod. (Which they can trade to other players who appreciate that mod and get platinum that way, huoh...)
Personally, I would <3 it a lot, if this were to make it to the game.
Discuss.
EDIT: Added TL;DR.
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Right, so I've had my own personal experiences with Capture missions that suffer from buggy behaviour.
My warframe was Mag, the missions in question were Grineer captures, E prime on Earth, and Phoebe on Saturn.
What I've seen so far, is that the capture target can die and its body can vanish in blue decay matter like they normally do, and it does not cause the mission to auto-fail (I mean, it should, since the missions becomes uncompletable at that point, right?)
I had one instance where I used pull on the target to keep him from running away, and he ragdolled, bent and twisted out of normal shape and boundaries (e.g. graphical glitch), died as a result (the same way ancients died when you threw Kestrel at their feet). I was unable to capture him at that point.
Another time, was when I, again, used Mag's pull to try and draw a target closer to me. Turns out, he flew off a ledge and down to a place where my Warframe cannot enter, since I get teleported back to safety when I try. I suspect the target died at that time, too.
Also, the target seems to boast large amounts of hitpoints compared to normal enemies of those missions. It takes a lot of firepower to gun down to capturable amounts, although I do admit that my weapons are fresh and have only a couple of levels in them - but still, they seem noticeably hardier than regular grineer forces in those missions.
I hope this post will be even a bit helpful, and not just a retelling of issues that have happened to other players.
(As a person who has dabbled somewhat little in programming, I cannot help but wonder... how were these new capture missions were tested if they made to the game with such issues? Not blaming anyone or pointing fingers, but as a curiosity. :D )
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I see your points. The take on these would have been that you might want to include these in addition to the already existing mods, not simply to replace them with these, since you can already stack dual mods with the standard mods that both give the same thing, thereby gaining a little bit more extra on whatever it is that you already have, which your particular build might concentrate on.
For example, there would be a threshold difference between the warframe uber being able to kill something with one use along with heightened power cost, instead of two uses at standard cost. Focus only gives +30%, after all.
But yeah, the 8 modslot limitation per weapon (or 9 if you count the aura) and frame would not probably work well with these, since there are better choices out there.
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We have some nightmare dual mods already in the game that are very good. Yet, I've been thinking of a different kind of branch of dual mods. I'd like to think of them as 'Boon/Bane' dual mods (but shan't, because of confusion with the bane part of the name, because of bane mods), or 'Give-and-take' mods, or even more simply put: +/- mods.
What they would do, is improve one aspect at the cost of some other aspect. These abilities could be even closely tied together, such as +damage and -fire rate, which would keep the dps from going through the roof, but making the weapon less wasteful in ammo consumption through more damage per shot, and more time between shots for the recoil to reset. One other example would be a kind of 'finesse' mod for melee weapons: +crit chance, but -crit damage, which would again be a mod that might not give a huge dps boost by itself.
Since they would not be a tremendous upgrade over the existing mods, mostly because of their usefulness being lower than that of a standard mod (which do not have a negative aspect in them), their modcost value would start fairly low, around the 2-3 cost. To keep them from upsetting the precarious balance of the game, their max levels could also be kept fairly low along with how much they influence per level, so they would not provide insanely high bonuses when paired with existing mods that influence the same aspects.
The lore might explain them as faulty mass-produced mods by inadequately trained manufacturers.
What they would offer in terms of gameplay: More builds and customization options for us players. They might allow for more narrower niche-builds, such as trying to maximize one aspect of a weapon/warframe, which might get out of hand if some forethought is not given to what kind of +/- mods would be implemented - but that should not be an issue, since that same forethought is already used when it comes to the already existing nightmare mods. :)
Food for thought, some suggested +/- pairings:
Increased power damage, lowered power efficiency
(Increased power efficiency, lowered power damage, problematic since it could make non-damage powers very cheap)
Increased shield recovery, lowered max shields
Increased damage, lowered fire speed/attack speed
Increased crit chance, lowered crit damage
Increased crit damage, lowered crit chance
Increased multishot, lowered damage
Edit on Dec 6th 2013: These features seem to have made it to the game as Corrupt Mods. Thank you!
Superchargers - Adding Modslots To Weapons/warframes/sentinels/kubrow/archwings
in Fan Concepts
Posted · Edited by Dalzedur
Yes, I know.
Adding anything new to the game usually involves some degree of power creep. Yet, power creep cannot and should not be this terrifying boogie man whose existence means that no new things should ever be added to the game, right?
There are several aspects to consider to make it right: To what degree it involves power creep is just one of them. Unlimited power is a bad thing - Limits are love. Basically it comes down to breaking the game into pieces and making adjustments, then combining those pieces back into an even better game. The developers can indeed minimize the power creep caused by a new feature if they choose to. I think it is a shame and very likely a placeholder that when it comes to improving our weapons there are only two choices available outside of mods: Forma and catalysts. Players who become bored is a dangerous thing for a game's future, but these 'superchargers' would alleviate that boredom.
-D