[[PC] Update 23: General Feedback Megathread]

That was it?

Spoiler

 

I hoped on a new deep and revolutionary game mechanic on Umbra, not just a silly AI bot on your warframe when you go in useless mode.

The quest was good apart from Ballas himself: why does ballas even feel pain? Wasnt he supposed to be one of the immortals and just laugh off his wounds like Ordan Karris said the Orokin did when he attacked them?

I know he's not dead, but i expected him to be something alien and incomprehensibly powerful, not just an arrogant magic man in a dress that just dies as soon as you slap him

Also, wasnt this a good chance to free us of the Lotus announcer and give us something else until the next quest? Now we are stuck with fake lotus for another year at best

 

 

[Improving the New Player Experience]

My girfriend is really skeptical about warframe being a good game and just yesterday tried getting back on after a very long pause. She did not remember anything significant about the game's mechanics. She just remembered the old ugly assets. I tried accompanying her on this and this is my experience of her playthrough.

Now bear with me for a story on where this adventure disappointed even me, the one who brought her in:

She logged on her old account only to find Vor's Prize to be inaccessible and apparently bugged. She proceeded to make a new account because starting a game with a support ticket is not a good start.

Initial cutscene was pretty good, but soon after ending things became confusional. She started moving around and the first instructions disappeared immediately. I was lucky to catch a glimpse about casting first ability or it would have been frustrating for both. This was not the first case of this happening, leaving her confused. Do not put instructions that close so easily and remember to put them really in view.

Various glitches about AI happened all around the tutorial levels. Most of them were about the AI not reacting to fire and just relaxingly watching over a wall while being shot multiple times.

There was NO glimpse of a challenge. There are very few and sparse enemies. They have the right HP but they deal NO damage and pose NO challenge. Ramp up enemy spawns.

She noted animations, visuals and graphics are not on par with Destiny, but this is not a complain you should really care about because i think destiny is a dumpster fire on every other aspect.

Vor is a really bland character until he talks about his dreams of dying a grandfather. That's one of his few redeemable lines.

The story is explained the old way, just by having Lotus, Vor, Darvo and Ordis just speaking to eachother while you play. What they say is mostly flavour text about their character and Ascaris drama, mixed with serious informations about what to do and what is happening. My girlfriend is used to WoW standards, where all text is flavour text and mission progression is tied to a marker. She is not a good listener and she would like to know when to listen for the important stuff and when she let herself be distracted by the fight. Just be sure to repeat the important stuff happening, because people like her tend to lose the important bits together with the not important ones.

Espionage and Rescue levels are not really explained in depth. It is ok for their difficulty to be non-existant but this way she did not understand its rules or potential or if she will see this kind of level again in the future.

Ship segments unlocked had no explanations on what they do:

• Market does NOT explain that most of your early weapons will be bought there FOR CREDITS. NOT PLAT. NO. THIS IS NOT PAY TO WIN. TELL THEM.
• Loadout does NOT explain how mods actually work. She also does not want to read every mod she finds, so have her understand what is important and guide her through increasing the damage output instead of having Ordis spam an irritating line about him waiting for you to "mod" stuff before proceeding.
• Foundry has clutter from Air Support Capsules and Eidolon archwing launchers that make you wonder what is it you are trying to build and is generally bad polish.

The fire after the sabotage SCALES with level. By accompanying her she had a fire that basically one shotted her.

The boss fight of the tutorial STILL SCALES WITH LEVEL. She had to fight a lvl 25 VOR that basically one shotted her while I could one shot him

If you don't get sucked in the narrative you can clearly see the tutorial is just a series of basic mission with NO challenge and tedious scripted exercises on unexplained mechanics.

Once this tutorial ends, you get two ways.

One to venus, where lays one of the oldest bosses of the game. I can't imagine her disgust when she is gonna see it AGAIN. It is not a good way to show how much warframe has evolved.

The other is through Cetus, where she can do NOTHING and through some basic Earth missions with little to no challenge.

 

I am pretty disappointed about this, and i think she will not pick this up again.

I may write more tomorrow

 

 

 

 

[Devstream 87 Overview]

Just now, SpaceSheepie said:

Devs lie and we're expected to have undying trust? Ok.

Devs lie and it does not matter until they try to steal your money with their lies

[Devstream 87 Overview]

1 minute ago, DoctorBagPhD said:

Aye because there was as big a backlash with [other examples where resource costs were high] and DE went out of their way to state the costs wouldn't change in order to acknowledge the 'hard work' of players who had already done it in those cases.

Aww wait, naw, it didn't play out like that at all for any of the 'high' cost examples you could throw out, did it? This is the first time DE have said "know all that feedback we're getting over this? Awa tae pot wi' it. Unfun grinding is they way forward because we're DE and the people in charge of these decisions don't even play the game, 'cause oh look here's Steve actually playing the game for the first time in ages/ever and is noticing a ton of stuff that's been in for a good long time'.

They don't play their own game from the perspective of a player and make moronic decisions because of it. They then decide to throw out well thought out, reasonable criticism because some idiots went ahead and paid platinum (one way or the other, boosters count) in order to get a really sub-par mastery fodder junk weapon. Really looking forward to Steve getting to the derelict and seeing how much it 'rains' mutagen samples there. 

They actually LIVE out of unfun grinding, so you should expect to see it somewhere.

At first it was the catalysts

Then the orokin cells

Then the primes

Clans

Argon

Syndicates

Kubrows, Zephyr, Kavats

How many of these are an issue right now? They grew old and now you have 10 orokin cells per mission. 100 oxium per mission. Argon by the dozens, and costs stayed the same

So the bulk of the unfun grind just moved to the Hema now. They live thanks to this

They just moved the goalpost and they will move it again, you just have to be patient and not get your blood pressure threaten your health over this

Yes, the Hema is their hostage right now

 

[Devstream 87 Overview]

18 minutes ago, DoctorBagPhD said:

I had that exact line of thinking when I saw the numbers for the Hema. Worked out well for everyone in that situation didn't it? =D

That is a matter of time, like the Zephyr.

But if you want it NOW and FREE, no. Business does not work like that

 

15 minutes ago, Jarcu said:

Also, wasn't the basis of this games success being the joy of killing vary many things rather quickly in an interesting theme and setting?

 

I don't get why some people think this is just a visual background for OSU where space men die brutally while i wave the mouse around

I mean, we can't say it does not need challenge, it is a game, not a procedural wallpaper

 

[Devstream 87 Overview]

3 minutes ago, --Q--Kyl0Ren said:

^^ I think people are annoyed with the current line of thinking rather than how it is going to be implemented. Yes while i do agree with you that it wasnt voiced in a proper manner by some, I do understand where they come from.

Having an 'invulnerable state' for eximus is a wrong path to take no matter the method in which it is implemented in game. Of the top of my head : eximus strong hold missions with exterminating 200+ enemies, or even any endurance run for  leaderboard  with defense or survival missions or even a Kuva flood where the guardians are already invulnerable (For instance, I'm pretty sure people will get damn annoyed if we had 50 kuva guardians storming one spot ).This will be especially bad at high levels if the % spawns scale with enemy levels. Rather than focus on new methods of implementing invulnerable state, balance enemy scaling first perhaps? A mini-boss in a mission is fine so long as its just 1 or 2 bosses. The current line of thought with eximus units means so many such mini bosses which seems a bit excessive.  The outcome if this is implemented is going to be a shift in usage to more CC frames and AOE damage weapons if they at all affect the enemy that way. This will more than restrict the loadout  people would prefer for such missions going against the entire idea of having so many frames/weapons in the game. Like @tnccs215 correctly pointed out the current state of the AI is the issue rather than anything else and this is the precise reason implementing such an idea would be wrong at the current moment 

 

Lots of tweaks and solutions have been proposed, and they know they will have to make something about it.

They already know invulnerability phases and some of the stuff you mentioned are the wrong way to make things, and are here as a placeholder until they have the courage to balance the damage numbers to reasonable amounts

Do you think they are just gonna spread it to normal enemies to the point it will be unbearable?

They can just slap a tweak and it can be bearable. Not make them invulnerable? Have a cap on how many can spawn together? Have the points give them only specific resistances? All of these together?

It is just about changing a few numbers. Vomiting bile and rage over the actual numbers makes no sense, because you know they will change

[Devstream 87 Overview]

3 minutes ago, SpaceSheepie said:

Ditto. Don't care enough any more to moan. This is what you did to your fans. GG.

My god, what's you guys' problem?

It is OBVIOUSLY not final and it is not supposed to be. It's like a concept art.

Everytime they show a shiny tool you people bleed hatred like you got stabbed in the heart by it

They don't want to stab you with it, they want to give it to you to use

If it's not fun they'll change it. You saw that. It was not fun. They will change it. Stop bleeding now.

I don't wanna defend their stuff but GOD it was just a concept

[Press 4 to win in PvE ..wait wut?]

This is why we need damage 3.0 fast.

I find myself rolling my eyes as i equip my sortie loadout every time there's a challenging mission. I cannot stand how trivial yet long and boring "challenging" missions become with it.

P4TW is part of general inbalance that needs reworking to let the challenging content stand out from the trivial grind we have now.

Please DE do it fast, my addiction for this game is bound to turn to hatred

[DE is Testing What We Players Will Let Them Get Away With [18.0 spoilers]]

I hate defending them and i don't like the recent patches, but it is evident that the problems with the new weapons are either recent resources or MASSIVE sinks for old resources. Both these things make sense when these resources are as inflated as they are right now and our pockets are filled with centuries of missions.

You should notice that the old weapons are very easy to get instead.

You want this new shiny bauble, quick and painless? Pay for it. This is the simple strategy of any Free to Play.

Give it some time and they'll get old and ugly, and mutagen samples will drop dozens or its cost will get to reasonable levels.

[[Spoiler] Dev Workshop: New Mods Part 1!]

IF but only IF they are going to adapt really well to how much the weapon is already useful THEN i may think this was a good idea

Sadly, tweaking the algorithm to adapt to 400 quirky strange weapons perfectly requires a massive amount of work

WHY don't you just rework and rebalance the useless weapons instead? Why should i need a painfully farmed mod to use a weapon that should be usable since the beginning?

This looks like a nice addition but you should look at the mess you're deploying it in.

Balance the weapons first, then you can use these riven mods to smoothen the edges.

 

Like this, it's like you're applying a bandaid on the cracks and keeping it glued by throwing more glue based on the size of the crack

BUT THERE SHOULD BE NO CRACKS FROM THE BEGINNING

[[TWW] General Feedback]

I usually just lurk the forums, but you guys need some advice here to set things straight

Quest is good. Does not expand much on the lore but expands on out operator very nicely. Cutscenes are great.

The gimmick it offers is useless and needs some work, but is pretty promising.
PLEASE expand on the part where you used transference on the Golden Maw. It was so amazing that for a moment i thought the new mechanic allowed us to possess any enemy.
THIS would have made it the best update ever, but now i know it needs a lot of work and it won't happen till 2050. Still, you can still improve it alot.

The tileset is amazing. The music is awesome and there is so much stuff going on once you trip the alarm! Sadly, it is not immune to cheese.

About the cheese: What were you guys thinking with Riven mods? Cheese and powercreep is so bad now that it ruins any form of gameplay, and you allow for MORE powercreep behind THREE different layers of RNG? These mods are not even interesting like the sindacate ones, it's just powercreep!
I would understand if this applied only to useless weapons, but i saw a guy get +200% damage & 100% multishot on TONKOR. Is he god now? Did he win the game? Do I need to farm kuva and sorties for ages to hope to get on par with people with these abominations?
This is all levels of bad, and worst thing above all: you won't be able to remove them without causing mass riots from the ones that farm them.

What were you thinking? This was totally unexpected and it is broken enough to sink the whole boat if you don't fix it quickly.

Please fix it somehow and quickly. The more you keep it, the more it will hurt the game
 

 

[We need more music. Again]

I know it's been requested multiple times but it's been so long since we've seen new soundtracks (besides Second Dream which you can now hear only on the back of your ship)

This game has great music artists, and yet we get the same musics on the same levels over and over again. Grineer musics sound pretty much all the same to me and we have only 1 Corpus track, 1 void track, 1 derelict track, 1 infested track and 1 stalker track for rare occasions

I really loved the Corpus music the first time i heard it. So much it got stuck in my head and made me want to play more
So much time has passed though, and it is getting old and overused. Does not tie me to the game anymore

I want to remind DE of how much a good soundtrack is important in these games of fighting and exploring, and i will make the comparison with the past masterpieces DE has worked on:
Unreal and Unreal Tournament

Unreal was a great adventure on great worlds with great gameplay and great level design
The soundtrack was so fitting and so long and so great that many times i had to replay the fight or delay it just to listen at how cool that fight was.
I played Unreal like 6 times and i still find the soundtrack utterly amazing. If it wasn't for the soundtrack i would not have loved the game so much.

In Unreal Tournament, every map accompanied your actions with a great soundtrack and it was so good you could replay the same map over and over for ages before getting bored of it.

This game needs this kind of feature to prevent maps from getting boring too fast.
I know you can't hire those great artists of the past, but i see you have talented composers who can make great music. I can't understand why they make it so slowly.
Hire more of them maybe? Go wild  and show us many, many musical pieces to accompany our carnage.

TL;DR:
I want to see the old days. Don't go cheap on composing the soundtracks and bring us much, much more. And possibly faster.

 

[Sap Comba Gets His Ai Stuck When You Stagger Him Mid-Melee]

I melee'd the Sap Comba having a whip while he was about to attack me and after getting staggered he had his whip stuck mid-animation and he stopped attacking and just followed me around hovering

[Gift Of The Lotus Defense Bugs]

In today's gift of the lotus mission, while alone, cryogenic core lost collision and the AI mostly stopped working, forcing me to go and find it myself. This made it difficult for me to find them.
Then it stopped spawning at 2 remaining waves

Unfinishable mission.

 

I think it has to do with the guardian osprey  that somehow didnt let the cryocore spawn when it moved

 

 

 

 

What is this?