FeRixia
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Posts posted by FeRixia
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7 minutes ago, C11H22O1 said:
You're not having fun with Warframe you're enjoying something else while the game just plays itself in the background, essentially cookie clicker.
Saying that you're playing the game because you walk to get life support once in a while is laughable
I don’t think you have the authority to tell me what I find fun or not. You can have your opinion but you can’t tell me I don’t have fun getting some progress in while doing something else.
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6 minutes ago, C11H22O1 said:
That's not chill it's just not even playing the game at all
Players can play the game in different ways, and chill to me means low apm/relaxed gameplay. If it’s not fun to you, cool, but it’s fun to me on occasion. And it is playing the game as you are controlling the character still and doing the mission objective.
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5 minutes ago, UnstarPrime said:
I wholeheartedly agree that not everything has to be 100% focus. Most of the time when I'm playing Warframe, I've also got a YouTube video on. The YouTube video alone isn't enough to give me all the engagement that I need, nor is Warframe...but together, I get something enjoyable to do with my hands and simple problems to solve, while also being able to learn about philosophy or whatever. Like peanut butter and jelly, they pair great together and get me where I'm going.
However, when I read what you wrote about your strategy, it doesn't really seem like you're engaged with the game. The game is running, and you're only "checking back in" periodically to handle the aspects of maintenance that you haven't been able to automate away. I don't have any ethical criticism of what you're doing, but the way you wrote your original post makes it sound more like you're "automating chores" than "playing a game".
DE has made it pretty well-known that they are against any kind of automation of gameplay. While they certainly ban players that use 3rd party tools to automate, I have no idea whether they'd enact any punishments on players who are automating using purely in-game means. Personally, I wouldn't risk it, but maybe I'm being overly cautious.
Wukong has been nerfed in the past for his ability to automate play, so at the very least I wouldn't be at all surprised if DE saw strategies such as this as grounds for another round of nerfs.
If you want to actually play the game while getting relics at a faster rate than the strategy you mentioned, doing solo runs of the Void Capture missions is fast, relaxing, and has 0% risk of inciting bans or nerfs.
Levels of engagement differ from player to player, and the beauty of it is you can choose how much you want to engage with against the reward (fun or loot). Yes the game is a chore sometimes so it is up to you to decide how to handle them. There is no definition of what “actually playing” is and there is no wrong way to play (as long as you aren’t disrupting others etc).
The devs can play whackamole with this concept as much as they want but there has to be some point which it’s not worth the effort compared to making new content or improvements elsewhere. Again I highly doubt they would start banning players for playing how they don’t want you to play (whole other can of worms about them dictating how you get to have fun), but yes they could nerf the strategy, but in such a game there are many ways to lower engagement with such a variety of items. In the end you can play how you want and if you want to do this or not won’t affect me end of the day.
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1 minute ago, johnno23 said:
Because if I choose to play a game I am playing and if I want to watch a movie I don't want a game distracting me. your solution is Game is boring if farming so i want to watch a movie. In my brain that simply does not compute as I would never play something i get bored by. that's just my opinion though.
Fair enough, I know what you mean. A lot of grinds I like to distract myself because WF is insanely repetitive sometimes and I would go crazy if I was only on the game and nothing else on the side. Actually bought a second monitor partly because of it. That’s just the nature of MMOs, not the developer’s fault. Other times I like to get something done while watching videos.
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Just now, Venus-Venera said:
I'm not talking about performance either. I know enough people who have been banned for something like that or simply long runs.
If it works for you, then that's good.Well back in the infinite ammo days it was widely popular and while disliked, not bannable as it is simply using the tools provided to you. This strat also does not get you a ton of resources or let you stay for multiple hours so it is well within normal parameters anyway. Many players also use Octavia to farm SE in much the same way. Maybe some people don’t like the gameplay but it’s all done solo and you don’t have to if you don’t want, just providing an option.
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1 minute ago, johnno23 said:
AFK play is not a good idea plus it pretty much defeats the aspect of actually playing which is done for fun.
Why isn’t it a good idea? You can have fun relaxing watching a video and grinding like this the whole time. Not everything has to be 100% focus.
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3 minutes ago, Venus-Venera said:
You can get a ban for this. careful with it.
I would rather speedrun the two void captures for lith-meso-neo keys under 1 minute. you get more out of it.I did mention it was not efficient, but more about the chill aspect of it. I have done this and never gotten banned, and there are zero macros or exploits involved. You are still controlling everything yourself, so this should be perfectly fine.
The intention is that it will help someone out who is too busy to completely focus on playing but still needs to farm some relics. Of course there are much faster ways as you pointed out for more effort.
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This may not be the most efficient, far from it, but if you wanted to sit back and farm some relics while doing something else, here is a strat that works well enough.
Go into solo normal starchart with Wukong, and Kuva Tonkor. Ani Void is good, and try to get the wide open room. Hide under the place beneath the stairs and let the clone kill everything. Every rotation will drop Aya or a Relic, and you need to check back every minute or so to collect life support. I recommend healer specter for protection and for subsume, can use Roar with Augment for more range. This will work up until 40+ minutes but could be pushed farther with a coordinated team. Happy farming!
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9 hours ago, MechNexus said:
Just listen to the dialogue. You don't need to blitz through everything as fast as possible and have the new shiny before everyone else. Slow down, pay attention to what's going on around you, and chew your damn food.
This comment (and others like it) don't help solve the problem of the player not enjoying or wanting it in the first place. Many quest cutscenes are skippable in the first place so why is NPC dialogue not skippable also? Players can play for actual missions, not to sit there listening to some dude we don't care about to monologue over a story we don't care about. If you enjoy that type of thing, cool. But don't assume everyone also wants to. Adding options to skip (and making it not easy to accidentally trip) fits both parties and is something already in the game for other cutscenes.
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There's no harm in putting a skip button in. Until then, I suggest just tabbing out to not waste your time. For the quest, you can also use Nightwave menu to skip dialogue though this is unrelated to the annoying forced cutscenes.
Players enjoy the content in different ways and can still respect it without being forced to listen to boring lore they don't want to hear. Giving options for players to do this is not a bad thing. The lore is not needed at all to enjoy the gameplay or progress the account. Such a small qol is definitely not amiss.
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Well think of it this way. There are certain grinds or missions you don't like. So you do a low effort setup to clear them without thinking or "work" so you can get the rewards you want to enjoy other missions. As long as it's not purposeful leeching and you contribute reasonably, it's fine imo.
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4 hours ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:
"I rarely bother switching to other weapons for lone enemies or barely glance up from staring at the minimap"
Your problem and no one elses.
Let me rephrase that I would rather just keep running past the eximus rather than engage if I don't have to or it happened to not die in the aoe (why switch and keep aiming if I can just keep going).
And "not glancing up from the minimap" is more like keeping everything else in peripherals because minimap is important for targeting and movement to find out where to go next and I can generally aoe the enemies down barely looking at them. It's not a problem. It's a valid playstyle choice I've chosen and found to be more efficient for my time. And afaik, it's not just me that's doing it. You need good map reading skills to clear fast missions with Titania and such. I almost always get top damage/kills every time so clearly it works.
This is a thread about how to do that sort of run and boom playstyle effectively post changes again and I am hoping others will take some advice and enjoy it again. Of course you can be "careful aiming and swap weapons if necessary" like how it is "intended" or you can have more fun (depending on the player) doing it this way and possibly outkill everyone easier.
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Thanks for the responses thus far, though I don't agree with some of them. I just think one of the aspects of the nerf should be toned down, be it firestorm, ammo pickup, or ammo max (such as merciless bonus). Right now we have a few options: spam with no conditionals with Tonkor/Envoy, use EM and spam with Zarr/Ogris/Bramma, or use mutation/scavenger/carrier instead and be a little more careful. I rarely bother switching to other weapons for lone enemies or barely glance up from staring at the minimap so these ways are the most comfortable. I've also found Primary Tombfinger to have big aoe with unlimited ammo and fast recharge though the damage is more lacking and it has an annoying fire mode.
I really don't like the implication that the devs want you to switch weapons per enemy and would rather keep spamming the same weapon. Another suggestion is make ammo drops consistent in all size squads. I have no issues maintaining Bramma ammo in a solo SP survival but all full team exterminate has problems.
For AFKing I can use tonkor Wukong or Octavia and that's fine.
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13 minutes ago, MechNexus said:
Yes, that's still setup. It's not like the old days where you'd just have a Banshee (or even mag) spamming 4 all day and doing nothing else, you always at minimum need some means of stripping defenses, and advanced units with overguard or guardian eximus providing additional shields, and even nullifiers make that a little trickier than in the old days. That little extra step is why the nuke abilities dodged the nerf hammer, and AoE weaponry (which I remind you, people were going AFK with) did not.
The "forced playstyle change" was totally justified and won't be undone for reasons outlied in one of my previous posts: It was proving disruptive to other players and trivialising content that's supposed to be challenging and (as a result) engaging. It's kinda hard to make anything that challenges someone if they're allowed to just go AFK nuking everything with no resistance. Yes, you can bypass the nerfs with your build, but that's also intended and expected because imo short of ammo mutation, everything else has some kind of opportunity cost. Taking Carrier means no Smeeta Kavat for random buffs, Energized munitions means you don't get any other helminth skill (e.g Roar, Pillage, or Gloom) that may be more powerful, and Scavenger Aura means no corrosive projection, steel charge, growing power, etc. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, that's why the change is good because you now need to sacrifice something else to spam AoE weapons again, which can keep the power in check.
To get off a way-too-long tangent: No, the nerf isn't getting undone and no, it wasn't a valid way to play. There's an old bit of game design wisdom that says if given opportunity, a player will optimise the fun out of the game - and I don't know about you, but brainoff borderline AFK strats aren't what most people would consider fun. If I wanted that i'd go play cookie clicker.
Maybe also consider why players would rather go afk. Boring enemy and mission design like Mirror Defense. Objectives boiling down to nuke enemies and go to extract or camp a corner and kill things. Sure they "fixed" the aoe problem and you can still afk to an extent, but the problem is most missions simply aren't engaging or remotely interesting to veterans regardless of what gets nerfed or not. It's a valid way to play if that's what you care about, getting rewards without having to get insanely bored of repetitive content which is at the core of the game anyway. Heck I'd rather sit on an Ivara wire and hold mouse button on a Shedu rather than engage in what seems to be purposefully soul sucking mission types like survival or mobile defense.
Also, aoe of any sort is apparently "disruptive" because that is what you sign up for when going public. WF has been for ages a race to nuke everything first and run to extract. And with all the powercreep, that won't be changing. No matter your viewpoint, players (me included) will find the best way to nuke content for the best rewards if we want to (which was what Whispers turned into even because of the simplistic missions yet again). Is efficiently clearing hordes in a public match with endgame gear disruptive? Is throwing Mallet once a minute and standing there an invalid way to play a survival? Well that's up for debate. I'm saying the nerfs were too harsh and not to completely reverse but tone them down a little.
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9 minutes ago, MechNexus said:
"Not all nukes require setup"
"Gyre can walk to the end unless it's heavy armour"Read that again and think about it for a moment.
(aside: the "these weapons are useless now" was a sentiment expressed at the time the nerf went out - and unless i'm misinterpreting Kaiga's post, this very thread too)
The setup is just in the build just like AoE weapons. Mirage? Press 4 and run along with your personal turret. Xoris? Spam it into the ground for up to ~28m effective aoe with influence. Gyre only falls off beyond base SP without strip (also not every faction even has armor). And the sentiment, again, is that the devs tried to force a playstyle change and you can counteract that with the same weapons by using different builds I suggested. Also check the edit for more examples. At least, that particular user's sentiment is that AoE spamming is dead which the original post is trying to "disprove" and I do not agree with. But not running these things forces a more annoying playstyle drawback which is a bit too harsh especially in teams (did you know ammo drop rates are nerfed the more players are in a squad?).
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6 minutes ago, MechNexus said:
This is honestly just wrong.
The reason the nerfs happened in the first place, and why the playstyle was deemed unacceptable, was because it was too effective for the effort put in and sucking all the air out of the room for any other playstyle, and was deemed disruptive because it was capable of dealing with high end content intended for full groups while being just barely active enough to not trip the AFK timer. It was getting so bad that people were allegedly treating warframe more like a gacha game because the required input was so minimal.
Now, as for why nuke abilities and incarnons still exist/happen? Simple: They require user input. Incarnons require you to get headshots to charge the altfire, where all the AoE stuff is, and modern warframe ability design locks the really big nukes behind a lot of setup first - e.g, Saryn requiring spores to be spread and maintained, or Qorvex requiring rad procs to get stacked.
The suggestion that AoE weapons as a whole are useless and a non-viable playstyle full stop? Utter hyperbolic nonsense on par with the "Blessing doesn't make you invincible anymore, Trinity is useless now" discourse back in the day. AoE weapons are still incredibly strong, you just have to be careful with your shots and actually manage your ammo rather than just exploding every individual enemy you see, or flailing wildly with no precision or strategy.
I think you misunderstood the point of the post. Nowhere did I say the weapons are useless. I am suggesting builds to make wild spam possible again. Please read it carefully. Also no one's stopping you from still taking good ammo aoe weapons like Tonkor and afking with Wukong or Equinox but that's besides the point. Also not all nukes require setup. For example, Gyre can legit just walk to the end unless it's heavy armor. Torid can spam wildly into a crowd and get charge while Ocucor is just a hold mouse button simulator (albeit fun and does fall off on armor without help). Fact is there are many strats that room clear the same and not a complete reversion but just a little acknowledgement the nerfs were too hard and to pull it back a little would not be amiss.
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12 minutes ago, Kaiga said:
Building frames or weapons that are now useless due to nerfs, and nerfs in general, doesn't automatically make you guilty of this now nonexistent playstyle.
The whole post is about how this playstyle still exists and now to make it happen besides just "being more careful how to aim" but expecting players to nerf themselves like that is entitled when the point of the game is get stronger and play how you want.
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4 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:
Whilst I think this is framed peculiarly, and I wanted to be a little bit sarcastic (as in these aren't really solutions to a problem, like already mentioned, this is using in game tools, to enhance a particular play style, or maximise the strengths of certain weapons/minimise the weaknesses etc), I can always appreciate someone trying to lend tips, advice and assistance to fellow players. So thats legit.
Not my fav play style, but to throw another tip, or more of a video recommendation, but Garuda has some good synergies with certain AOE weapons like Zarr. AznvasionsPlays on Youtube has a pretty good video going in depth on this. Requires some set up, but on the plus side, that amount of set up, means we won't see it everywhere, whilst those that enjoy that kind of thing, can get it,
Thanks for your response! I agree Garuda is an amazing platform as well esp for Zarr and Envoy! I also enjoy sunder spam and breach surge. Blood Forge is really underrated and you can use Gloom for heals or EM/buff and hp regen shard and be on top of shieldgate in that case.
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Thank you to those who responded that acknowledged the validity of these strategies.
And to those that laughed the idea of reverting nerfs, I agree it is unlikely but there are those like me who would enjoy the game more if that happened especially because they proceeded to add more powercreep in the form of influence and aoe incarnons.
And to those who tried being demeaning to those who want to do this playstyle, it's insulting because it is also a valid way to play. AoE is not "problematic" when you look at the meta as a whole filled with nuke abils and incarnons.
I am not "late to the party" or uninformed about these builds. I just wanted to share some things I've found helpful to counteract the decisions the devs have made to still do the same efficient playstyle as before. You can choose to use or not but please don't insult it when the game's about farming and many tend towards strats that make it efficient or brainoff.
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While we all wait for some reversion of the Bramma Zarr etc nerfs (hopefully), here are some ways to "bypass" the impact of them. Tired of needing to land a headshot (or bodyshot) and swapping between incarnon forms or using non aoe guns that wont run out of ammo? Want to spam at your feet and keep your eyes on the minimap? Read on.
To be clear, they could do with a base ammo max and ammo per pickup increase. PFS was already nerfed and merciless lost its ammo bonus so it really doesn't make sense that they also nerfed pickups like this. But anyway on to the actual advice:
1. Energized Munitions shall be the helminth slot. This gives 75% ammo efficiency which means every 4 shots consumes only one ammo. Indirectly increases dps with fewer reloads. Downside is taking your helminth and needing to be casted frequently with a base duration of 5s.
2. Scavenger Aura (Bramma excluded...where Bow Scavenger?), increases pickups by 150%. If you get someone else too, it will stack to 300% and so forth.
3. Carrier + Ammo Drum. Outsource your mutation! Downside is not having consistent Reinforced Bond for firerate if spamming Bramma. I would go EM + Wyrm Prime or Panzer Vulp with Reinforced Bond instead for this.
These can be used on any frame but Saryn, Mirage, and Gauss are great for this! Have fun blowing up the map Tenno!
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I'm all for adding another range or eff mod, whether an upgrade to an existing with an Umbral or something else. It has been so long since any range improvements were added, and archon shards have ignored those 2 stats. I don't see anything wrong with giving it some love especially since we have so many shard buffs and incarnons already.
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If you want an easy fight, use Styanax with Nourish subsumed. All you need to do is press 4 and aim in the general direction. You have infinite energy and you'll keep gaining overguard so you can facetank quite a bit. When overguard breaks, roll away until you aren't nullified then resume. I'm curious to see if anyone's found a faster or easier way!
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Is there a good reason Ember/Glaive have not come around in resurgence? Even the upcoming event don't have them. Glaive prices have gone through the roof and it's pretty ridiculous by now how long they haven't come back while others have come multiple times. What's the use in keeping it out when resurgence was supposed to ensure the opposite?
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This is utter nonsense such that I'm even surprised this thread is still going/you posted the latest anecdote. The devs had plenty of time to evaluate after the nerf and the fact that it wasn't touched this update shows they're fine with it and it's time to move on. Your arguments up to this point have been exaggerated. You even said 47 of their kills were melee and say he did "nearly nothing but spam..." in the same sentence.
Back to the anecdote though, this is weak correlation at best. Gauss is a strong nuke frame and requires energy and battery management. It is highly unlikely that he spammed sunder the whole time because that would run out of energy, and battery mechanics make it weaker (though I doubt this was on SP). It also needs multiple casts to kill anyway. You also mentioned his damage. Damage is not indicative of anything needing a nerf in any capacity. Maybe the Mesa was afk, maybe they had a bad build. It doesn't account for build or playstyle. But pure damage stats can be heavily biased anyway. I have encountered exactly zero TS users in all the public bounties I did, aside from myself when I felt like it. Plenty of nuke builds go past the 28-30m TS does (Gara, Volt, Mirage to name a few).
Also, incarnon lex? Incarnons are notoriously hard to charge up in public non sp missions. That doesn't mean anything. 54% dmg isn't anything to write home about either considering most pubs don't have optimized builds or aoe. Heck even a prism Mirage standing there and pressing it every 10 seconds would've cleared easier with less button pushing.
Chill Solo Relic Grind
in General Discussion
Posted
Well, there are still more steps involved like actually starting the mission, collecting things every minute (both so clone doesn't kneel and collect life support) so I would say there is STILL interaction with the game. It's not like you sit there for an hour not touching anything, so it's not "true" AFK. I'd say setting up these strategies to accomplish some goals is well within playing the game, as part of it is coming up with your own builds for what you want to do. As long as this sort of strat isn't the dominant way of getting things (it isn't) and isn't more rewarding than more active methods (it isn't) then there is no issue imo. I'd say the devs nerfed him enough for those things and what you still can do is a fair tradeoff these days. In addition, Octavia exists and scales way better into higher levels anyway. I support players experimenting with strategies to get what they want out of a mission.