Frost Rework ideas

[(PSN)Revak29]

Just some ideas for possible reworks for frost's abilities. Anyone who has played frost can agree that his 1 and 2 are worthless without any augment. His 3 and 4 are pretty much fine, but personally, I would like a tweak on his 3 & 4 and a new augment for his 3. I feel these ability changes would help frost to scale better, make use of all his abilities, and to make a greater variety of mission types tolerable. 

Freeze Rework:

Freeze is a throwaway ability no matter how you look at it. The only use is for collapsing his 3 which is awkward as a damage dealing method. I think the duration of his 1 needs to be closer to 20 secs (scales with duration) and the range of the ice patch needs to be a patch coning outward about 7m with a 90 degree angle (scales with range) It should still be shot off as a projectile, but when it lands it should be a cone. The size should not be smaller with distance. My reasoning for these changes is that a circular patch would be a bit awkward for cc around a snow globe. A cone would be a bit further reaching on the sides. The duration feels like it ends way too quickly to be any kind of viable CC. If your CC ends before you can aim your gun properly, I doubt it is very good CC. A caster frame should not have to jump all over the place to get a decent sized cc and waste precious time.  

Ice Wave/Avalanche Rework:

Make synergy between Frost's 2 and 4 by making an armor strip from his 4 permanent when a frozen enemy is hit by his 2. In this case, after making it permanent, the remaining armor can be stripped as a proportion of maximum armor, not current armor.  

Ice Wave Rework (Alternate):

Literally, just throw out the Ice Wave Impedance augment and integrate that into the ability. Without that augment, the ability has no real use for enemies over like level 20. I shouldn't have to say it but I know y'all on here like to whine about anything you can like idk augments being too OP if you don't have to sacrifice a slot for them. Warframe abilities should not be worthless without an augment. Simple as that. Also if you went this route, a radial shape instead of a cone shape would be much better for keeping frost in the action. Moving to and from the side of the map to use the ability is just a big waste of time.  

Snow Globe Rework:

Make it so Frost can cast his 3 on the ground instead of as a radial ability. This would make it much less awkward to put snowglobes at chokepoints to collapse when full of enemies. 

Snow Globe Augment:

Make it so that frost can pick up snow globes and carry them around for damage mitigation. Casting his 3 on an ally would attach a snowglobe around them too. One of Frost's big faults is that his 3 is probably his best ability, and it makes him extremely immobile. Lots of Frosts can hardly survive outside it. This makes frost really bad for any mission where you don't have to defend something

 

A little disclaimer: Some of this amounts to personal playstyle and what mission you play in. Do not whine about how you think Frost doesn't deserve a rework bc your fav deserves it more. Do not whine about this making frost OP without explaining exactly how you believe this will give frost an advantage over frames with a similar ability. Do not whine about how it's okay that frost is extremely immobile. Do not whine about this 2's augment being good bc we all know that is just a bandaid fix for a worthless ability. NO VANILLA ABILITY SHOULD BE USELESS. Collapsing Frost's 3 may deal lots of damage, but to what end? It's pretty awkward to run out the bubble to break it, and so few enemies end up inside most of the time that it isn't even worth busting it. Leaving it at choke points to break it is also awkward to recast, because it is placed around frost, not at the aiming reticle. These are all my opinions on how frost could be better and more fun to play based on my own playstyle.

[AmadeusProject]

I agree with some points. Frost is a really strong frame and have a fun kit and the augments really complement, but when nyou try to build towards the kit's proposal, you you struggle like hell trying tomod him and make a real build of it.

I was dreaming about an Umbral Icy Avalanche Full Armor Strip Frost, but When I tryied to reach the 250% strenght and get the augment, I found out that was impossible... =/
So an Awekening System or build in some augments featuers is his kit could be really helpful, Like the Ice Wave one.

 

Before I elaborate a bit more in your sugstion and make mine as well, I have to get a point here about one thing...

 

Frost has a problem, he annoys everyone!
No matter where you put your globe, is allways in "stupid places" as people like to say, so, you cannot put your globe anywhereother than a defense targe, and your globe should be small, cause everyone has to shine and snipe people all across the map, but they can't if your globe is in the way.
And the Avalanche? if you build him for high duration and max rangue, guess what happens? frozen enemies can't be affected by status, so your team is now crying and screaming at you, 'cause they can't proc status, Or you just stop using your 4.

Frost is a solid frame that could be endgame viable, but de doen'ts have scaling damage, his CC gets in the way of everyone and his survivability is just from the invencibility frames of the snow globe...
 

• [Freeze Rework]
  Agreed, Its a really great CC, but its too small low durantion, Nobody really uses out of some special ocasions like to slow some assassins, but if got more range, spread and durations, would be a solid option, I don't know about the cone, I rather to be a big circle, But I guess we can take Gara's route, tap 1 would be a projectile and hold 1 could make an "Ice wave-like" cone.
  
  I would also add a possibility: If casted as a projectile Inside the Ice globe, freezes the ground the double or triple ammount of time, Like we already do with assassins, or instead of slowing the enemies a bit more, could grant a buff for alies, like extra armor, cold damage while inside the globe, extra status chance from shots fired while stanting in the Icy ground...
• [Ice Wave/Avalanche Rework]
  Kinda gimmicky, I don't know if I understood your Idead, but I think that reducing the strenght for full armor strip could be an alternative easy to implement, 175% or 200% for 100% armor striping, nobody builds for armor striping, its too hard to get 250%, and you get no range, efficiency or survivability. Its the 4rth ability, so its expenssive to spam and the animation is too long, I don't think that really too expenssive to cast or the long animation being a problem, but for its initial range,
  
  I'm tired of being the frost or seen some frost having to suck up really toxic comments because of his avalanche, I want to help my team, to help them kill things faster, not stopping them for doing So, there are two alternatives we could take to make this change
  • Make so frozen enemies can be affected by status
  • Make so if you Hold 4 while casting it freezes enemies, if you just tap it, they will not become frozen or just get a low duration frozen proc to make them slow form a bit. The tap/hold feature that some frames got could really be great in Frost's kit.
    
    The CC era is over, we have to tweak a bit towards support, make his 4 a bit of both, if players want CC, they can do it with their 1.2 and 3, make his 3 a CC just while casting and a sorce of damage based on enemies armor and armor striping, but for being effective for getting rid of armor, the avalanche will need to be casted frequently and affect a lot of enemies so it can be really relevant, os it really neeeds more innate range and reduce the required strenght, at 200 strenght, will make the build more versetile, but 175% sounds even more versatile, I don't know if really would break the game 175%, but would make avalanche frost an easy and viable support build as blessing Trinity,
• Ice Wave Rework (Alternate)
  Nothing to add here, I agree with every word.
• Snow Globe Rework and Snow Globe Augment
  Not sure about that.... I would like to protect a mobile target like a hostage or an allie like gara's 2 or pick up like vol'ts shield or so many abilities, but I don't know if the Snow Globe is the ability to mess with... I guess it would be nice to have a mobile protection, but I don't know if we really need it... or a at leats, a mobile globe doesn't seem like a good idea to me...
  BUT your brought up a point here, being immobile sucks for everyone, no one wants to stay inside the globe, being inside the globe could give you something!
  • Status/aura Immunity/cleanse while inside the globe, could be a good call, I would say its mandatory, People would say that is too OP, but no one would complain if forst already had, "oh, a lot of eximus and ancients, better run to the globe and chill for a bit ", this would make Frost so great that would actually be OP, and that is okay! We need some safe options and motivation to make the players to protect the globe againsts the nullies and step inside from time to time, would be really OP and we would have a lot of players chosing to play him more often, is that a bad thing?
    
    Yes, the globe is a bullet sponge and can protect the tem, but guess why the players don't want to stay in the globe? less enemies, less aggro and being mobile is a better option and givesmore survivability than camping inside a buble that can be oneshoted in the levels that you really want to be inside a fortress not taking damage
  • Or some killing efficiency while inside the globe. If we get the"1" casted inside the globe to add your status chance while inside the bubble or something to benefit casters innerent or as an augment for the globe and make the chilling globe innate + the status cleanse, frost would make a great steam support/protector

 

If we got his kit revisited, we would have Frosts modifying how the players behave when he is in the match and we would have new play styles comming up and being an options for some mission. He is already great and have nice features, no doubt that he is a frame really fun to play with, but people rathe rplay other frames when they have an option, we don't need to nerf the other option,we just need to make him a strong option, not THE option or the BEST option, but a STRONG option,

"Oh, we have some crowd here, lets give a coat to everybody and make them easier and faster to kill! oh, we are droping like flies and the red dots in the map are just getting bigger, lets hop into the bubble for a while, get some air and energy, another ice coat and we are good to go!" 
I Want frost to be the guy that the the situation is getting a hard, he can just do his magic and put everyone in safety for a bit, hold the trouble for a bit until someone else is ready to solve it, he is strong, he is good, but Frost could be better. Isn't the right time, with Vauban, Ember and Wukong needing more attetion, but looking at other frames could bring up some points in commom.

Vauban's Shred+Vortex combo suffers the same problem of frost, its too hard to build for it and restricts the build too much, and in the end of the day, lacks range, lacks efficiency, lacks suvivability, you waste a lot of time, energy and effor to deal with a small crown when you could simply delete half of the map in the same time with other frames or weapons that are way more versatile.

Sorry for my poor Engrish and even more for typing so much when so many people don't think its necessary, but the same people use frost just once or twice a mont to have some fun, but when they are serious about a long endurance, most of them would never ick a frost and being annoyed to ress a frost or being slowed by him... guess what, a revisit to frost would just be better for everyone, he may not need so much as some other frames, but would be really great if he had, do you disagree with that, make him more powerful, useful and steam synergetic would be a bad thing? I don't see how could be....

Edited April 11, 2019 by __suko