[Rework] Ash Feedback

[Ddublu]

So after playing this game for countless hours of this game; I am kind of sad that my favorite warframe, namely Ash, has kind of fallen off the useful list (at least in my eyes). He use to be my go-to for stealthing around; but lately Loki has well taken over that 'role'.

 

Which made me think of some ideas to give him his place back on my roster. I'll go ahead and state these are mostly based on what I think his role should be in the game as I like to feel each warframe should have their own area of expertise basically; like Loki with Stealth-melee, or Frost with his globe. (admittedly a lot of frames still overlap on what their role is but ah well xP)

 

Getting right to it, I see Ash as the Ninja of Space Ninjas. Meaning he's meant to be the epitome of the ninja aspects of Warframe. He's the only warframe that seems to act in the most ninja-like way; throwing shurikens, using smoke bombs, etc.

 

Ability #1: Shuriken

     Opinion: I actually think this ability fits Ash's 'character' the most currently. What would a ninja be without throwing stars? I guess just a sneaky backstabber? Anyway, I believe this ability to be very sound and balanced for what it's intended purpose is; which by the way I see as a semi-long range silent assassinate move. So pretty much a pocket thrown secondary.

 

     Change: If I were to change anything about this ability; it would be allowing the ability to hit more than two targets. Perhaps at max rank it should maybe throw 3-4 shurikens instead. If this were to be changed; then there would also need to be a slight reduction in each shuriken's damage. Either by causing multiple shuriken to do less damage when hitting the same target; or just having the shuriken's do less damage. Still, I don't believe this ability is in dire need of reworking in any case.

 

(After thought comment: One thing that could make Shuriken better may be to have it work like a 'paper bomb' in that it'll throw something on enemies that will detonate after a short duration; causing a good bit of AoE damage on top of the initial 'getting stabbed' damage.)

 

Ability #2: Smoke Screen

    Opinion: It is true that Ninja's at least to some extent use methods of disappearing from sight and the like; generally in a poof of smoke. I like the concept of this; however I feel the execution is rather lacking (mostly thanks to Loki trumping the F*ing hell out of stealth melee). I do like that this ability has a staggering effect; albeit short, but it is still there.

 

     Change: What I would do to make the ability better is have it act as, dare I suggest, the smoke bomb used in World of Warcraft. For those that may not know, the Rogue class in World of Warcraft has an ability called Smoke Bomb (I think, it has been some months since I played last). Pretty much it acts as an AoE damage reduction for a duration. I think this would be a pretty neat thing for Ash to do; which would also bring him into more use for teamplay I feel. I don't know the details really on how this mechanic could work; as in how much reduction and the like. An alternative could be that the smoke bomb would instead make enemies caught in it fire pseudo-randomly and potentially hitting other enemies. I believe the first change would be more beneficial than a Nyx Hysteria field type of thing.

 

Ability #3: Teleport

     Opinion: This has to be one of the most awkward ability in Ash's kit. I've seen little to NO use from various Ash players, as well as myself. I suppose it's use would be to quickly swoop from one side of a large room to another or something to that effect, but in all honesty you may as well just run or slide or something. It really just feels like a hap-hazardly thought out ability and could really use either a replacement or a big big rework.

 

     Change: I actually lean more towards a full replacement of this ability than just a rework. I simply don't see the real use of this due to when you want to backstab an enemy you CAN'T touch them, or they will just sound the alarm pretty much. Not that I think this will bring much use for the skill still; but I cool mechanic would be that Ash instead of needing a target will simply teleport a set distance forward, the animation of which could be him sinking into a pool of shadows and then reappearing from another pool some distance away. More specific details on it's mechanics could be etched out later on as I think more over it.

 

Ability #4: Bladestorm

    Opinion: Again Bladestorm is one of those well sorta weird but also sorta okay abilities. it gives him immortality during the whole thing; which in some cases can be very very necessary to escape death. However it also takes the longest out of any warframe's abilities to go through. And in that it doesn't really do to well for the higher level mobs, say 50+ and the like (not that you'd really want to take an Ash for that stuff anyway).It can do some pretty good damage, and possibly take out key enemies however. One of the drawbacks is that it only will target things in the room and in the range at the activation time. So if more dudes come in, they will not be targeted; not even to fulfill hitting the max number of targets.

 

 

     Change: As far as changes could go. I'd first thing a 'quality of life' change would be to allow the ability to re-target if there was not enough to hit the maximum number of targets. Also another possible change would be to allow it to hit targets more than once. This could seem a little OP for bosses since with a max hit of I believe 15, thats 15 times he'd hit a single target; unless of course the max number of hops to the same target was maybe 2-3. A more visually pleasing change could be that instead of teleporting around a room (as much fun as that can be) he instead enters a state where he does like cool hand signs with tenno symbols popping out. With this his targets would be highlighted and also have shadowy figures of Ash appear behind them; ending with all of the 'shadow clones' backstabbing the intended targets.

 

Again these are mostly based on my own thoughts on how I think Ash's style should be and his role in general. I also thought about his 3rd ability being replaced with like a disguise type of move where he takes the looks of a random same-type enemy for the mission. So like he'd take on the looks of a Grineer on Grineer maps, or Corpus on Corpus maps. But that seemed a little too silly; though possibly viable. In the end I feel Ash should generally be seen as a warframe to use for taking out key enemies in a fight. Rather than trying to compete with Loki for master of subterfuge and stealth.

[cloudyDev]

Ash rework needed.

 

+1'd!

 

:D

[baron1357]

This rework would make me play Ash more I haven't touched him ever since I got him to 30 

[(PSN)LordSnoz007]

Ddublu,

I love your ideas for Blade storm and Teleport they are by far some of the coolest renditions of the moves I've seen and I would love for something along the lines of what you have portrayed to appear in the game.

[(PSN)ELIT3_EXP3RT-01]

I second this rework before trinitys nerd is done. +1'd !

[shut]

As an Ash player, I absolutely refuse to support any thread that says that Teleport should be replaced.

 

I use Teleport. I love teleport. Believe it or not, I am effective with Teleport. Do not touch my Teleport.

[holyicon]

I've always supported the idea of adding Ash's equipped Melee bonuses (Crit, Elemental, etcc) to his ability attacks.

[Ddublu]

thanks for the support :)

[LastingLongbow]

Personally, I've level Ash to 30 and Shuriken is the skill I use least. I've even gone to the extent of un-equipping it and using the slot for more mods. I prefer a melee-in-your-face playstyle, so Shuriken just doesn't feel right. Why poke them with my low damage shuriken(s) when I can just teleport to them and kill them in melee? I've found that it's horrible against Corpus and armored Grineer, while Infested will be swarming you while you try to Shuriken them down.

 

Smoke Bomb feels awkward since you have to stand still to use it. I love that it stuns enemies, but I don't like having to stand still for about a second to use it. I like the damage reduction idea you have, but I want to be able to use my stealth while moving.

 

Teleport is awesome. Don't want to jump across a ravine? Teleport across the room to an enemy that happens to be standing there, kill him, and move on. Allies getting ahead of you? Teleport to them to catch up. Boss ahead? Teleport --> Smoke Bomb --> melee killing with damage bonus.

 

I love Blade Storm, but I don't like that it can't re-target when more enemies come in range. I envision a change where the camera takes on a ceiling view while Ash jumps around like crazy, hitting all 15 targets within 2-3 seconds. (still invulnerable) The camera does not move until the skill has ended.

[Ddublu]

Bumping this to get more looks and thoughts.