Ash/banshee Reworks

[Zero.No.Hikari]

I've been kicking around a few ideas for these two frame that I have been enjoying the most and having to working them around

Disclaimer: I'm not saying Ash is useless I'm saying that he is a Solo-play type frame with preference in keeping himself alive over helping others with his skills and as such i want to improve that viability for him while make Banshee a team-play friendly frame

 

Ash:

Stats:

HP 150 (450)

Shields: 100 (300)

Armor: 70

Sprint: 1.2

Energy: 100 (150)

Stamina: 120

Just giving him a Slight boost to his armor,sprint and Stamina would help with his skill set given that Ash is a melee oriented frame with pretty lower stamina at base.

Thinking of him as a solo frame but a few people want him with a few group skills.

When I first started with him I never saw him as a Group Frame and more as a Solo survivor who can keep the team alive when he needs to. As such he should stay the same Loki is more the Stealth frame for Grouping while Ash is Stealth Combat.  Now with that a few skill reworking I have in mind.

 

Shuriken; 15EN

It works out for what it is but it should become a single hand skill with at least maybe a increase of shuriken thrown so at max rank we could have 4 homing blades of death that each have a slight buff and maybe a quick stun to be used as a melee opener.

 

Smoke Screen: 50EN

Some want this as a team buff overs don't well I rather keep it just for him and you'll see why with Banshee.

Now for the skill itself is comments as lower tier than Loki's invisible, well Maybe how about they both become 15sec with Ash's keeping his slight stun for a second or two along with if they are caught in the smoke screen they will be stunned and blinded momentiraly as if the smoke is in their eyes, Along with that have both his and Loki's cost the same of 50EN so to have them on par with Loki's having no stun due to him being a Stealth Support not a Stealth Combat like Ash is.

 

Teleport:40EN

For this we could have a combo for both a free aim and a Targeted skill.  With the range being locked like Hydroid's Undertow.  With Free-aim being half of the targeted ranged so when going into melee you can either aim into the group get a bit of a stun and then unleash melee hell on them with that if possible even be the open with Ash using his gauntlet blade when using the targeted variant to initiate melee combat.

 

Blade Storm: 100EN

This I know won't get changed given the animations it was given but how about maybe give her a double style skill with if he using Smokescreen he will keep his melee and boost his attack speed along with maybe given a free range.

When still visible if activated he will go like Valkyr with his gauntlet swords with maybe using dual sword stances or heck give a special stance that works just for him.  Maybe have it work either/or  Want to use the gauntlets but be invisible?  Well activate Blade Storm then Smoke Screen.

 

As he stands Ash is a solo viable frame that should become a even better solo frame not Rhino viable but good enough that he can keep up with others in Survival.   Ash is a Stealth Combatant and as such he should be able to rise up as that

 

Banshee:

Stats

HP: 100 (300)

Shields: 100 (300)

Energy: 200 (375)

Stamina: 80

Armor: 65

Sprint:1.1

With a slight energy increase Banshee will be able to keep her New skill costs for her Infra-sound up along with Sound Quake and Sonar given that the new way they will work will have a slight energy increase as to fit in with their usage.

Sonic Boom: 25EN

While this is a great CC cone for a Sniper Frame I feel the after-cast should either be removed or shortened as it sometimes gets cast then someone comes from behind and knocks her down. maybe a half second after-cast so it's not spam-able

 

Sonar: 75EN

This is her bread and butter, it makes her a very powerful contender for end game....if it doesn't spawn on the feet.  maybe fix it so that she mostly focuses on vital organs like the heart brain or yah know.  Along with finally give it a timer for both the Radar and Weak Spot maybe even a target-able skill setting up a location of Sonar so that she doesn't end up getting caught by a large pack or Grineer or Corpus. For the most part this will stay the same but for ancients and bosses that have weak spots those will be targeted so no more foot sonar spots!

 

Silence: 75EN

(Renamed Infra-Cloak) Oh Silence, Silence silence, This here is what I feel must be reworked with the idea of Infrasound

  Now how would it work?

 

Instead of covering the enemies, Banshee cloaks her allies in Infrasonic waves allowing for a team cloak that means: Team Invisibility!! Of course this would be either at a higher energy cost or lower duration for the skill  maybe a short range so they have to be near her when she casts it. Energy cost increased due to now being a very powerful team buff that can last upwards of 12secs base as to have any one invisibility be better than the others

 

Sound Quake: 125EN

With this Banshee is locked down for 6 seconds, kinda falls off when they can shoot you out of its range.   Well I propose maybe changing it to a aim style skill like Hydroids Kraken.  It could be changed to a deploy-able mine for a certain duration that decreases the more Sound Mines are set up with a maximum of 3 mines. with 10/8/5 depending on the amount of mines before they disappear with weakened damage so you can have on large and powerful sound mine or three small but equally strong mines that add up the damage of the single mine.  It gives he not only CC but a way to be able to effectively snipe the heavies without relaiation

 

Banshee is labeled as a Stealth Frame with only one measly Stealth Skill, She truly is a Sniper Frame with skills to keep her alive in a pinch with this she not only becomes a Stealth Frame but improves upon her Sniper skill set to be able to trap and lock down as well as cloak to sneak away truly being a support that if played right can become a Deadly team player

With this rework not only with she be finally a true stealth ranged fighter but with Ash they will now fit their roles ever so easily

 

These are a few ways we could improve these two frames one remaining extremely solo viable with the other becoming a very welcome team-player keeping at range and dispatching without being seen.

Ways to change this is always welcome

Links:

 

Edits and additions: Added new stat values and energy costs along with a few tweaks to some skill descriptions.

Additions: Fixed energy values along with a better description of the new skill

Edited May 5, 2014 by Zero.No.Hikari

[BlurrE_Tempo]

I play as Ash and he is very good in a group. You clearly do not know how to use ash. He was my 2nd warframe and I have no problem with him. Ash is mean't for Stealth as DE clearly states. The only thing I would Suggest is that they increase the speed of Blade Storm. Ash does not need to be reworked, all of his skills work just fine you just need to know when to use them. Don't change something you don't understand.

[VentiGlondi]

I think what shuriken needs is a guaranteed slash proc.

And a few more shurikens per throw.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

I play as Ash and he is very good in a group. You clearly do not know how to use ash. He was my 2nd warframe and I have no problem with him. Ash is mean't for Stealth as DE clearly states. The only thing I would Suggest is that they increase the speed of Blade Storm. Ash does not need to be reworked, all of his skills work just fine you just need to know when to use them. Don't change something you don't understand.

 

 

Ash was my Second Frame is still currently my Most used so it's neither of those.  Ash never really gave me the Team oriented vibe more of the guy who is the one keeping the team alive once it hits the fan, not saying he's bad for team play but his skill set gives him an edge for solo-play.  Blade Storm is decent but given that Valkyr has the same style of Ult but hers flows even better than Ash's hence why I said maybe giving him a buff style skill like hers so that he can still keep moving and prioritize on heavies for the team instead of it randomly picking a target as many have asked for in other threads about Ash.  Yes I have also used Ash effective in Team-play and quite well too.

[BlurrE_Tempo]

Ash was my Second Frame is still currently my Most used so it's neither of those.  Ash never really gave me the Team oriented vibe more of the guy who is the one keeping the team alive once it hits the fan, not saying he's bad for team play but his skill set gives him an edge for solo-play.  Blade Storm is decent but given that Valkyr has the same style of Ult but hers flows even better than Ash's hence why I said maybe giving him a buff style skill like hers so that he can still keep moving and prioritize on heavies for the team instead of it randomly picking a target as many have asked for in other threads about Ash.  Yes I have also used Ash effective in Team-play and quite well too.

You might not have mean't it but you sorta made Ash sound like all powers his powers were useless but I understand now :P

[Zero.No.Hikari]

You might not have mean't it but you sorta made Ash sound like all powers his powers were useless but I understand now :P

 

Huh really as I wrote it I had in mind meaning that he's a solo frame with no need for team play skills.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

Updated main post and added stat changes that could work for the frames

[Zero.No.Hikari]

Bump? Please Notice me Sempai....

[Eirshy]

Well mister Zero's Light, first I must point out that your spoiler tags are borked a tad on Banshee

 

 

Why the increase to Sonar's cost? You're removing fun from the ability (trick shots over headshots) and making it more expensive.... not really giving it anything new.

 

The idea behind Sonar is that it finds microfractures in the armors/bodies of targets from where things didn't quite get repaired/healed right, and pointing them out. I'd much rather see an armor-bypassing effect granted to it over it turning into a boring "headshot things moar!" :(

 

 

 

Team stealth I'm afraid might work out to be like Trinity's Blessing if made too long, or be the bane of defense missions in general. It's an interesting idea, but there's a reason League of Legends's Lux's Prismatic Barrier is a shield rather than the team stealth it originally was conceptualized as. It'd kinda be massively OP.

 

 

 

Sonic Boom as a tossable, thing is nice, but increasing the cost is just being a jerk. It wouldn't be doing anything Sound Quake doesn't already do except not lock Banshee down while she uses it, and considering Rhino Stomp is basically what Sound Quake's current form wishes it could be, I'd say that's unfair as hell.

 

 

 

As for the energy increase, only makes Magnetism's STILL 100% MANA OMNOM more annoying, and doesn't actually help with the mana gain problem. It'd only be "needed" with all the random-&#! mana cost increases you're throwing out there.

[Recovery8]

While I like your idea's for bladestorm I'm going to have to politely disagree on your suggestion for smokebomb. Sure he can be a solo-frame but the game is meant for coop. I'm all for some solo-play but at the core the frames need to have powers that synergize well with teams and with each of the other powers they have. The teleport idea you have is something I see being tossed around a lot and I have to say that i like it, it does make him a bit deadlier to fit the Assassin we love.

 

Now, onto Banshee. I don't really think invisibility works for her, she is more of a sniper from all of the advertisements and due to her ability of sonar. I don't think your idea's for her are bad per-say but they are in my opinion not what she needs.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

TheBluejelly its not completly removing limb shots its more fixing the borked part where it'll target the undagameable parts on bosses and ancients while remaining relatively the same cept now its targetable. Same with sound Quake instead of being sttionary she now places a landmine of sound that'll detonate when stepped on so pretty much set it on a spot where you know you need the CC and get back. The cost increase was for the fact that not only do they still keep the main features but now aren't stationary keeping her moving. Also Sonic Boom just gets a shorter recast while soundquake gets the slightly higher EN cost to compensate for not only remaining for a now extendable CC but being set up wherever you want. Silence is a finky skills and the 30sec duration is the maximized duration build cap so base will be close to 11 secs. Is a sense its an attempt to make her mobile like a agile sniper. The bigger EN pool is to compensate for the now more power hungry skills if I had kept the original costs they'd feel like a easy win maybe keeping original pool would make them feel like when they should be launched.

Recovery8: Ash is already a decent team frame the problem lies his skill kit is self survival with two skills lacking teleport and bladestorm. Smokescreen is already a good stunner to keep heavies at bay if anything that may be the only team part he has. Its not making him solo exclusive its making Ash a more survive frame that can jump into the fray while his team needs to rest or relocate. Think of his skill reworkas making him a more offense heavy assassin than stealth/CC that Loki is.

I will look over the reworks and tweak them thank you for the input.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

Updated based on newest comments