Mods And The Primary Choice Dillemma

[Panzermeido]

I like the new mod system. To tell you the truth, after I got the basic mods to keep me afloat, the mods and their combinations are one of the funnest things to achieve in the game right now.

 

Nevertheless, the system has a specific flaw that the devs have addressed, but not in the full and required aspect.

 

Let's call this problem "The Primary Choice Dilemma".

 

The problem lies in one of the most basic things in the game - it's difficulty curve, an equation consisting of three points. 

1) How much damage is dealt to the player

2) How much damage can the player withstand

3) How much damage must the player deal to stop receiving damage.

 

The best wording for the "Dilemma" that I personally can provide is this: given a choice, most of the players will always cater to their direct survival and direct damage output.
This means that, to keep himself capable of taking the challenge, any player will always choose mods that increase his or her survivability and damage before any others.

 

It seems like a logical and simple enough thing, but it's actually a game design mistake - to a certain degree. Why?

Because The Prime Choice is a forced choice. You'll make it whenever you want to make it or not, because it's the only way to keep afloat in the world of 40+ lvl men with laser rifles.

And mind you - it was addressed. Warframe level ups now provide them with basic survivability upgrades on the fly, without mods, allowing for some degree of true to god customization.

 

The problem still lingers in the gun mods.

 

There isn't a build for any weapon, any at all, which doesn't have a damage mod in it.

 

Every weapon build will have elemental damage mods included.

 

Most of the builds will have multishot mods in them.

 

And only after those are set, you actually get to customize your weapon.

 

See what I mean?

 

How can this be addressed? The easiest way is simply increasing gun damage with level, the same way it was done with the frames. Does it really solve the problem? No. Not really. Even with the increased damage, players will still move towards the Primary Choice - to increase the increased damage even more.

 

So, again, how can this really be addressed?

In my opinion. the gun progression and mods should be re-hauled in a specific way.

Pure damage can't be increased at all. Period.

What can be customized, however, is the damage type.

 

Let's say, an armour-piercing damage mod for a rifle. Instead of returning a percentage of the physical damage of the gun as armour-piercing damage, simply changes the damage type of the gun to armour-piercing. That's not all, though.

To keep leveling elemental damage mods viable, as one of the possibilities, they can be turned into a distant cousin of the skill mods, along the lines of this:

1) Level 1 AP-mod turns the damage type of the weapon into AP.

2) Level 2 AP-mod makes the gun Puncture at 0.2 meter.

3) Level 3 AP-mod allows the gun to inflict a "Shredded Armour" condition, which reduces a damaged enemy's armour.

 

A limiter disallows putting more than one or two elemental mods into the weapon; after this is done, the weapon is open for any mods - the Primary Choice is gone, and you can customize the gun in any way you like.

 

Mind you, this is just my vision. I do hope it actually helps.

Thanks for reading the post.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 17, 2013 by Panzermeido

[Satori_Mind]

You're literally asking to be able to do everything with every weapon.  You're taking out all the meaningful choices, making most weapons redundant or just plain inferior.  There's nothing forcing the stacking of damage mods.  There's just a point where you have to use a little fire control.

[Tsoe]

it seem that hey have a similar idea but reversed

 

a passive upgrade (1 more polarity or something like that) will be aplyed once your weapon reach lvl 30   if yu accept the weapon is rezeted to lvl0 after but granted with a new plarity

Edited April 17, 2013 by Tsoe

[Panzermeido]

You're literally asking to be able to do everything with every weapon.  You're taking out all the meaningful choices, making most weapons redundant or just plain inferior.  There's nothing forcing the stacking of damage mods.  There's just a point where you have to use a little fire control.

Oh lol. No. Weapons aren't just damage per shot and damage per second. I'm not asking for them to be the same in terms of damage. I'm asking to actually give me choice when customizing those weapons. The thing that's forcing me to stack up damage mods is the amount of health the enemy has with higher levels: want it or not, if I wish to keep playing on those high levels, I'm forced to updamage my guns - to make the Primary Choice and then make the secondary choices, which should be just plain "choices" to begin with.

Edited April 17, 2013 by Panzermeido

[Satori_Mind]

If for some reason you're not doing enough damage, a single mid-level elemental mod will do all the work for you.  This has been working for me with a fair range of weapons until at least 64.  Aim.  Hit weak points.  Quick bursts.  That's all it takes.

[Panzermeido]

If for some reason you're not doing enough damage, a single mid-level elemental mod will do all the work for you.  This has been working for me with a fair range of weapons until at least 64.  Aim.  Hit weak points.  Quick bursts.  That's all it takes.

Strawman. This isn't my point.  Elemental mods are percentage-based mods that aren't really doing anything unless you've got the main damage mod installed. Even with an elemental mod, you're still quite likely to install a multishot to increase fire rate without increasing the ammo-per-DPS of the gun. If those mods are a "must have", and they are, then those mods are a choice that isn't a choice and actually disrupts the process of making real choices. That's the point.

[Satori_Mind]

Not a strawman.  Just a fact and fine example.  You either need to learn to aim or stop bringing woefully ill-suited weapons to missions.

[Panzermeido]

Not a strawman.  Just a fact and fine example.  You either need to learn to aim or stop bringing woefully ill-suited weapons to missions.

Hek seems a good enough weapon to me. And it is a strawman. I didn't arise the question of "weapons don't deal enough damage in high level missions". I raised the question of "you're forced to take damage mods to play in high-level missions". Play it straight. 

[TestSubject06]

Not a strawman.  Just a fact and fine example.  You either need to learn to aim or stop bringing woefully ill-suited weapons to missions.

I believe that right there is the entire point.