Saryn Talk

[GeekyGamerGirlx3]

I have been playing Warframe for quite some time now (since update 8, i believe?) and its been a blast. Sadly, I have noticed that all missions I run has just become so saturated with the "high tier" frames, such as Rhinos, Novas, and Trinities. Now don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with that, but it seems a lot of popular Warframes have been just getting all the love recently. However, the warframes that are less used has, in my opinion, been left to pick up dust in peoples' inventories, Saryn being one.

 

Before damage 2.0, she used to be a VERY popular frame. I saw one for almost every run I've gone through. But after damage 2.0, she went from the queen of death and destruction to a frame that just isn't wanted in any of the late game content. Just the other day, I wanted to join a T4 survival and went on recruiting. The person asked which frame I was bringing along. I wrote Saryn, and the person SPECIFICALLY said Saryn is garbage, bring a rhino. She just isn't wanted at all anymore. I know there are other frames that undergo the same treatment, but with everyone just thinking Saryn is now sub-par, in comparison with other frames. I just think it's about time she gets a rework/buff. Something that will make her stand out again, like some of the more recent buffs for Oberon and Valkyr.

 

Oberon recently got all of his abilities buffed and now hes actually wanted because his abilities are just that much more powerful,  easily taking him into late game whereas before, he wasn't even wanted by many. Valkyr got her armor tripled from 200 to 600 and her hysteria now grants godmode, combo-ability, scaling with her melee weapons, AND free life strike. They've just gotten so much more powerful, and yet there's Saryn, with most of her abilities being either highly sitational or just horribly weak.

 

Venom: Throws out a toxic spore that spreads to nearby enemies when shot. I never find myself using this ability mainly because it just does such little damage. Now sure it spreads to other enemies in groups, but with their unpredictable movement patterns and every spores' small exploding? radius just makes it a chore to be useful. The ability almost REQUIRES Saryn to have some sort of shotgun. But even then, it just does so little damage that it's not even worth the energy.

 

Molt: Creates a clone of herself, similar to Loki's decoy. Molt is good... for low levels. Since it is affected by both duration AND health, it just becomes useless  towards late game because it's health does a disappearing act in 1 hit. And then toxin damage is just a tad low to really make a difference in an enemy's health. Sure at low levels, this ability is amazing. But it just loses its utility at later levels.

 

Contagion: Buffs melee weapon with additional toxin damage. Sounds really cool on paper, but the extra damage is almost negligible. I barely noticed any sort of increase in my melee weapon's damage. Also, this ability becomes absolutely useless in late game because melee isn't really a viable option when facing high level mobs with high powered weapons. It just won't end well, with all their guns being crammed up your behind.

 

Miasma: AOE that toxifies the air, corroding away at everything. Now this is the only ability that I find really useful on Saryn for early to MID-GAME. Now everyone has said to reduce her duration in order to get the most out damage out of miasma (and I have done this, so don't tell me to try it), but i only found it useful for early T3 missions, even with low duration and max power strength (blind rage and intensify). But this is essentially the only ability of hers that really does anything to the enemies.Not only does it do less than stellar damage compared to others, but all other ultimates always seems to have some sort of AMAZING cc capabilities. Rhino stomp does crap tons of damage and keeps everything suspended in the air for a decent amount of time. Oberon's reckoning picks up enemies and smashes them down, rendering them defenseless as they get back up and blinding all enemies around them. Even excalibues radial javelin is more useful since the slash, impact and puncture are all equal, and the ragdolling bodies kill others in their paths. But Saryn's miasma has a measly 15m radius, fairly low damage, and a slight chance to make enemies panic for 3 seconds.

 

Now I'm not saying she's a horribly underpowered frame either. She's still a pretty durable frame and I'm happy her armor value was buffed from 100 to 155 (love ya for that DE), but she just needs to be changed around in such as way that she can stand toe to toe against the "high tier" frames, whether it be her abilities are changed around or get a slight buff. Anything that will make her wanted, not neglected. This actually came out longer than I anticipated, so I apologize. But yeah, if you agree/ disagree, I'd love to hear from other fellow Tenno what their ideas are about her. And again, sorry for rambling on for so long.

[Sweetie_Belle]

Uhh, hey Geeky. How's it going? Nightshade is nice and cozy in here if and when you want to talk about it. I agree that she is totally underplayed though.

Venom: Good for group-spread by cutting HP on Viral procs. Its not Toxic spread anymore if that's what you meant.
Moult: The damage is unfortunate on it, there is just no real point to the buff with damage since everyone wants lategame warframes (as is necessary for good mission runs). Don't count it out though! It still draws a lot of aggro, and I think there's a way to buff its HP? Not sure. For 25 energy though, its nothing to cough at Geeky.
Contagion: Melee is rough lategame, pretty much Valkyr-only or for those that can heal themselves. I feel for Saryn on this ability. I understand where you're coming from.

Miasma: Geeky, who told you to put less duration on Miasma? It does BETTER with more duration! Even more damage than before. It always does 4 ticks no matter what. The damage is okay, but has too many drawbacks
Base stats: Whoo, health tanking! Base stats =/= survivability though. Can't protect you from knockdowns or regenerate health for tanking shots.

Conclusion: Saryn has issues with damage and survivability. Back in the day she was a well-loved concept, however, with power creep and Damage 2.0 she has fell to the DPS frames and CC frames. Venom could proc more Viral. Molt is okay how it is unless it needs more scaling, which I could see. Contagion doesn't go with her kit because she has no healing/defense for lategame melee. Last but not least, Miasma needs too much into too man mod stats to make it more comparable to other 4-abilities. Saryn could use a bit more damage, crowd control, or both.
EDIT: clarifying on some things

Edited September 21, 2014 by Sweetie_Belle

[Bietzsche1er]

Yes, totally agreed, i think they should make that miasma terrify enemies like the 3 of Nekros, working like the blind from reckoning, maybe.

Thx for this post, Saryn deserves it

[(PSN)friedricetheman]

Molt should proc Viral upon detonation. This would make the ability scale better to higher level missions.

Contagion should just be reworked as it is right now next to useless.

I do play Saryn but I find her coping badly at the 40 minute mark in T4 when her miasma only stuns Heavy Gunners. And Molt only lasts for a second before it gets blown up. Not to mention her health gets taken down in chunks once two heavies start to pew-pew her.

[GeekyGamerGirlx3]

Hey Sweetie_Belle. i guess it is sort of what I was trying to say. Thanks for that.

But the funny thing is, miasma actually does better with less duration because when i built her around duration, her miasma had the same number of ticks as when she had lower duration, but they did significantly less damage. Taking her into apollodorus, high duration miasma did about 400-500s. Minimizing my duration actually brought my damage up from that to about 900-1000, with the same number of ticks (at least thats what i saw at about 1 hour 30 minutes or so).

So the sad thing about her is that her abilities just need the trifecta of power mods (duration, range, and power) in order for them to do well, but significantly weakening some while empowering others. If i work on my miasma for low duration, my molt lasts for 2 seconds and my spores from venom will go bye bye in 2-3 seconds. Working on venom would would weaken miasma significantly because the duration is needed to give one enough time to pop the spores.

Also, her molt sadly still does only toxin, not viral. The only viral she procs is from her venom. :/

Edited September 21, 2014 by GeekyGamerGirlx3

[Eggzodiya]

I agree wholeheartedly. From start to finish, I've pretty much favored Volt but I've had my share of love for Saryn (4 formas). The idea of a poison-based warframe was alluring back then, but her abilities are definitely outdone but other frames, more so with the ones that came after her, such as Nova and Oberon. Even the ones who came before her are still better, such as Excalibur and Volt. Speaking of those two, I find it interesting that two out of the three starting frames are endgame-worthy. I don't know much about Mag, so I can't say much for her. Excalibur's radial blind is unappreciated by newer players but is a godsend to journeymen and veterans. All of Volt's abilities are handy, though I still think overload could use more work. Not to say it's bad, but I feel it has something missing - an example would be the long start up.

 

Then... there's Saryn. She really fell off the wagon. I still play as her from time to time, then get bad-mouthed during parties - though some tend to shut up when they start getting downed like flies and I have to rush in and revive them numerous times while not suffering any casualties on my end, but that's more of a player issue than the frame itself. If molt would deal a 100% viral proc, yeah, that would be lovely for endgame content. An idea for miasma is that if it kills a target, the poison it inhaled spreads around the area within a limited radius, infecting others caught in it. And if it doesn't kill the target, the poison instead affects the nervous system, severely slowing movement speed for a limited time.

 

She needs a lot of reworking, just to catch up to other frames, and I hope she gets it.

[HelloKelsey]

Saryn, despite her lack of usable abilities, is still one of my favorite warframes. Considering the reduction to duration and power strength mods, she does incredible damage during high levels- but my friends typically describe her as a glass cannon. Loads of damage with miasma, but goes down so easily late in the game. I hope that they prime her and give her more armor and health, kind of like they gave rhino more speed in is prime variation.

 

A Saryn rework of the first three abilities would be great though, agreed.

[Sweetie_Belle]

Hey Sweetie_Belle. i guess it is sort of what I was trying to say. Thanks for that.

But the funny thing is, miasma actually does better with less duration because when i built her around duration, her miasma had the same number of ticks as when she had lower duration, but they did significantly less damage. Taking her into apollodorus, high duration miasma did about 400-500s. Minimizing my duration actually brought my damage up from that to about 900-1000, with the same number of ticks (at least thats what i saw at about 1 hour 30 minutes or so).

So the sad thing about her is that her abilities just need the trifecta of power mods (duration, range, and power) in order for them to do well, but significantly weakening some while empowering others. If i work on my miasma for low duration, my molt lasts for 2 seconds and my spores from venom will go bye bye in 2-3 seconds. Working on venom would would weaken miasma significantly because the duration is needed to give one enough time to pop the spores.

Also, her molt sadly still does only toxin, not viral. The only viral she procs is from her venom. :/

Geeky stahp, Duration directly increases damage from Miasma. STAHPIT

EDIT: There will always be 4 ticks, negative duration will keep the same ticks but decreases the damage.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Sweetie_Belle

[GeekyGamerGirlx3]

They changed it to duration apparently. Base miasma spans over a duration of 4 seconds, which can be decreased using fleeting expertise to 2.6. HOWEVER, the damage it does will still be the same, just in less time. lets say miasma does 1000 damage over a span of 4 seconds. That means 250 damage will tick every 1 second for 4 seconds, adding up to 1000 after 4. Bringing down the duration to 2.6 will still do 1000, but over a shorter time frame, with each second doing about 384.6 damage for 2.6 seconds, still adding up to 1000.

So less duration is still better in terms of killing enemies faster with that ability. But the other three abilities still suffer from the loss of duration.

So I don't wanna be hearing that "more duration is better for miasma" business. Cuz they do the same damage, but more duration means a slower kill.

[SIDESTRE4M]

I have been playing Warframe for quite some time now (since update 8, i believe?) and its been a blast. Sadly, I have noticed that all missions I run has just become so saturated with the "high tier" frames, such as Rhinos, Novas, and Trinities. Now don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with that, but it seems a lot of popular Warframes have been just getting all the love recently. However, the warframes that are less used has, in my opinion, been left to pick up dust in peoples' inventories, Saryn being one.

 

Before damage 2.0, she used to be a VERY popular frame. I saw one for almost every run I've gone through. But after damage 2.0, she went from the queen of death and destruction to a frame that just isn't wanted in any of the late game content. Just the other day, I wanted to join a T4 survival and went on recruiting. The person asked which frame I was bringing along. I wrote Saryn, and the person SPECIFICALLY said Saryn is garbage, bring a rhino. She just isn't wanted at all anymore. I know there are other frames that undergo the same treatment, but with everyone just thinking Saryn is now sub-par, in comparison with other frames. I just think it's about time she gets a rework/buff. Something that will make her stand out again, like some of the more recent buffs for Oberon and Valkyr.

 

Oberon recently got all of his abilities buffed and now hes actually wanted because his abilities are just that much more powerful,  easily taking him into late game whereas before, he wasn't even wanted by many. Valkyr got her armor tripled from 200 to 600 and her hysteria now grants godmode, combo-ability, scaling with her melee weapons, AND free life strike. They've just gotten so much more powerful, and yet there's Saryn, with most of her abilities being either highly sitational or just horribly weak.

 

Venom: Throws out a toxic spore that spreads to nearby enemies when shot. I never find myself using this ability mainly because it just does such little damage. Now sure it spreads to other enemies in groups, but with their unpredictable movement patterns and every spores' small exploding? radius just makes it a chore to be useful. The ability almost REQUIRES Saryn to have some sort of shotgun. But even then, it just does so little damage that it's not even worth the energy.

 

Molt: Creates a clone of herself, similar to Loki's decoy. Molt is good... for low levels. Since it is affected by both duration AND health, it just becomes useless  towards late game because it's health does a disappearing act in 1 hit. And then toxin damage is just a tad low to really make a difference in an enemy's health. Sure at low levels, this ability is amazing. But it just loses its utility at later levels.

 

Contagion: Buffs melee weapon with additional toxin damage. Sounds really cool on paper, but the extra damage is almost negligible. I barely noticed any sort of increase in my melee weapon's damage. Also, this ability becomes absolutely useless in late game because melee isn't really a viable option when facing high level mobs with high powered weapons. It just won't end well, with all their guns being crammed up your behind.

 

Miasma: AOE that toxifies the air, corroding away at everything. Now this is the only ability that I find really useful on Saryn for early to MID-GAME. Now everyone has said to reduce her duration in order to get the most out damage out of miasma (and I have done this, so don't tell me to try it), but i only found it useful for early T3 missions, even with low duration and max power strength (blind rage and intensify). But this is essentially the only ability of hers that really does anything to the enemies.Not only does it do less than stellar damage compared to others, but all other ultimates always seems to have some sort of AMAZING cc capabilities. Rhino stomp does crap tons of damage and keeps everything suspended in the air for a decent amount of time. Oberon's reckoning picks up enemies and smashes them down, rendering them defenseless as they get back up and blinding all enemies around them. Even excalibues radial javelin is more useful since the slash, impact and puncture are all equal, and the ragdolling bodies kill others in their paths. But Saryn's miasma has a measly 15m radius, fairly low damage, and a slight chance to make enemies panic for 3 seconds.

 

Now I'm not saying she's a horribly underpowered frame either. She's still a pretty durable frame and I'm happy her armor value was buffed from 100 to 155 (love ya for that DE), but she just needs to be changed around in such as way that she can stand toe to toe against the "high tier" frames, whether it be her abilities are changed around or get a slight buff. Anything that will make her wanted, not neglected. This actually came out longer than I anticipated, so I apologize. But yeah, if you agree/ disagree, I'd love to hear from other fellow Tenno what their ideas are about her. And again, sorry for rambling on for so long.

 

I think what really destroyed Saryn is the existence of fleeting expertise.

One may ask why, because it makes her Ult stronger.

 

That's the point.

 

The other abilities weren't even bad back then. But the meta changed, and since fleeting expertise her first ability which was strong and cheap to cast against groups is no obsolete, because you can now ult spam for the same.

 

And so the only thing she really can do at the moment is just ultspam.

 

The community partly changed to mindless efficiency-robots. So everything must be either somehow invincible for illusionary endgame or wreck havoc or remove gamecontent. That's how to tier a frame.

 

lol.

[RiouHotaru]

I said it before, I'll say it again:

 

Make Contagion a toggle, make it effect guns and melee weapons, and it's gold.  You could leave it as is aside from that change and it'd be great.

[CommodoX]

The community partly changed to mindless efficiency-robots. So everything must be either somehow invincible for illusionary endgame or wreck havoc or remove gamecontent. That's how to tier a frame.

A Warframe that can't kill anything fast enough and dies quickly in higher missions is useless if solo.

You can do the same mission twice in the same time with a better frame.

In squads 1. will never tick off until wave 40+ = useless.

Skin = useless from beginning

Melee = a joke

Misma = just bad

 

And her butt is so fat Kim Kardashian called.

 

I build her today and regretted the invested time immediately, after he hits 30 I will never play her again unless she gets a serious rework. But we are talking about DE here so ..... giving half finished content then ignoring the problems is their specialty.

[011100110110000101101101]

A Warframe that can't kill anything fast enough and dies quickly in higher missions is useless if solo.

You can do the same mission twice in the same time with a better frame.

In squads 1. will never tick off until wave 40+ = useless.

Skin = useless from beginning

Melee = a joke

Misma = just bad

 

And her butt is so fat Kim Kardashian called.

 

I build her today and regretted the invested time immediately, after he hits 30 I will never play her again unless she gets a serious rework. But we are talking about DE here so ..... giving half finished content then ignoring the problems is their specialty.

Saryn bad?

 

I think you may need to revise your build.

 

1) Molt: You said her skin is bad, and by skin I assume you mean Molt.  Molt is one of the best abilities for late game survival.  I want to see a Rhino that can survive a blast from a heavy in late TIV, even through Iron Skin, it just won't happen.  Saryn on the other hand won't die because she was never hit.

 

2)Contagion isn't a great ability, but extra melee damage never hurts, although it's more lucrative to just replace it with health mods.

 

3) Miasma really isn't bad at all, it can kill TIV mobs in one damage tick if you mod her correctly.  Here's a tip, do not mod Saryn for duration as that actually lowers Miasmas damage, use corrupted mods to decrease it's duration.

 

And finally we get to her health

 

Saryn has very high health and shields, so much in fact that she is one of the only reliable health tanks.  She actually has the second highest effective health in Warframe, losing only to Valkyr, which is quite the achievement.

 

Saryn does need a buff, but she's not bad at all.

[Misgenesis]

Shes not bad, most of the frames just do her abilities better.

Needs buffing/Reworking.

Edited September 25, 2014 by Misgenesis

[CommodoX]

Saryn bad?

 

I think you may need to revise your build.

I'm trying to level her up at the moment. "I build her today" is very clear. Level 15 at the moment.

And she can't kill defecation (got 2 ban points for using the original word) without Miasma. With Miasma + 30% power range I can kill stuff in 10 meter radius ... WOOOOO. For 100 energy.

 

1) Molt: You said her skin is bad, and by skin I assume you mean Molt.  Molt is one of the best abilities for late game survival.  I want to see a Rhino that can survive a blast from a heavy in late TIV, even through Iron Skin, it just won't happen.  Saryn on the other hand won't die because she was never hit.

That would indicate you use Molt before you get shot = you know when you get shot = you can see in the future. Amazing.

 

2)Contagion isn't a great ability, but extra melee damage never hurts, although it's more lucrative to just replace it with health mods.

It steals a mod slot.

Why wasting energy when I can kill better with Miasma. Why use low range Miasma when I can use Boltor masterrace and kill 10x faster?

 

3) Miasma really isn't bad at all, it can kill TIV mobs in one damage tick if you mod her correctly.  Here's a tip, do not mod Saryn for duration as that actually lowers Miasmas damage, use corrupted mods to decrease it's duration.

So how much range and how much energy does that cost me? Compared to Nova chain reaction bombing or any other AoE-damage skill.

 

And Saryn is bad because she is not good.

Everything she can do - hitting 4 for Ulti spamming WOOO -  there is a warframe that can do better. And is faster. And doesn't has a Kim Kardashian butt and a tumor on her right leg.

If a frame can't compete with other frames it's bad, there is no neutral area. You can play the frame effectively compared to other frames or you can't.

 

And DE gives out content that a 5 year old wouldn't approve because 50% of the frame mods in general are useless, Saryn has 75%.

But hey, WE HAVE NYX PRIME BUY BUY BUY FOR ONLY 126 $$$$.

Edited September 25, 2014 by CommodoX

[SIDESTRE4M]

A Warframe that can't kill anything fast enough and dies quickly in higher missions is useless if solo.

You can do the same mission twice in the same time with a better frame.

In squads 1. will never tick off until wave 40+ = useless.

Skin = useless from beginning

Melee = a joke

Misma = just bad

 

And her butt is so fat Kim Kardashian called.

 

I build her today and regretted the invested time immediately, after he hits 30 I will never play her again unless she gets a serious rework. But we are talking about DE here so ..... giving half finished content then ignoring the problems is their specialty.

 

I don't say, she's absolutly fine right now. The meta changed, Saryn not so much.

 

However I rate frames whether their playstyle suits me or not. That's just an opinion though.

 

We did T4 Survival 45min with just Frost and Volt. Of course maybe another combination could bring us to 50 or even further. Screw that.

I could yolo with Loki disarm the whole time if I wanted.

 

So Saryn needs some work. I agree. Your reasoning,... not so much.

 

(I suggest you play with mirage if you want small butts, but whatever)

[CommodoX]

However I rate frames whether their playstyle suits me or not. That's just an opinion though.

(I suggest you play with mirage if you want small butts, but whatever)

I rate frames by their playstyle and their power. A frame that's playstyle indicates toxin everything but can't do that properly is crap for me.

I played with Nova but her butt is ... hanging. Like the one of an old woman. Building Mirage at the moment, will see if her butt pleases me more.