Incentives To Stop Running The Same Missions Over And Over:bountys, U8 Dojo/mod Market.

[xenapan]

Perceived problem:

What we have is a small minority of missions which people grind on, then the majority of "inbetween" nodes which no one ever goes to unless they are trying to unlock the rest of that planet.

 

Summary of suggested solution:

1. Have solar rail nodes accumulate bounty from inactivity.

2. Award bounty points for clearing a node with bounty on it.

3. Allow players to trade bounty points for mods inside clan dojo.

 

Detailed example implementation of bounty system:

I suggest we add incentives to planets after X minutes of inactivity represented by a bounty level.

 

There could be 5 levels:

Urgent bounty, heavy bounty, medium bounty, low bounty, no bounty.

Each indicating the amount of activity within the last X hours.

 

If a node does not have anyone complete a mission in the last hour, the bounty slowly increases.

When a node has a mission completed, the players get the bounty points that have accumulated on that node.

For instance we can have the bounties set respectively

Urgent:10 Heavy: 7 Medium: 4 Low:2 No:0

 

Numbers can be tweaked of course to balance out rewards and to compensate for increased activity.

 

Example implementation of a static mod market:

Then Tenno can accumulate bounty points to spend in the clan dojo. I assume there will be a market place of sorts for players to trade with each other, but you could add in additional levels of marketplace to increase the mods that show up there that can be traded for bounty points. There could be multiple levels of market place e.g. common/uncommon/rare (4 sections to build). Or it could be split up even further or by type. -Warframe/Primary/Secondary/Melee (also 4 sections). or Warframe/Primary/Secondary/Melee common/uncommon/rare (12 sections. with each of the commons being prerequisite for their respective uncommon and those being prerequisite for their rares). Building each section would allow you to purchase those respective mods for bounty points.

 

DE doesn't seem to like a static approach to things favoring randomized rewards (mod packs, mod drops being random) so....

 

Example implementation of a randomized mod market:

Or another way to implement mod market would be randomized slots. 6 slots per level of market 1 rare, 2 uncommon, 3 common. And each level adds the same amount of slots. So a level 2 market would give 2 rare slots, 4 uncommon 6 common slots. Each slot would be filled with a respective unique mod. So the more slots open on the market the more likely you are able to find a mod you want. After X hours the mods would change. Or if your clan wants new mods to choose from they can pay credits/resources/bounty points to also refresh the page of mods (eg. 20000 credits or 500 rubedo or 15 bounty) with the prices fluctuating as it gets more use.

 

Other details for the mod market:

Prices of mods are standardized across all clans: Rare mods start at 15, uncommon 8, common 2. Prices will go up based on supply/demand... but thats a whole different post in itself with either a hard cap at something like 45 points or a graduated "curve" on which demand(volume sold/day) increases price.

 

Bought mods can either be replaced immediately by a mod of the same rarity or decrease the timer at which all the mods are replaced, or decrease their individual slot timer for replacement.

[Lumireaver]

I think you may be onto something with the bounties and what not. Not so keen on the market suggestions you've worked out though. Going to drop a few bullet points here. Some food for thought.

• Perhaps accumulating a high average bounty-per-member could become a way to rank clans?
• The longer an area has been marked as low traffic, the higher up on the level range the enemies could be.
• Bounty points could be used to unlock additional structures/rooms for dojos, if they're not all immediately available. Lotus won't just let anyone have a high-class dojo, but if you've proven yourself...

[rksk16it]

If the mods purchased are randomized then whats the point doing high bounty missions ? The missions which people grind often are those which give lots of mods which are also... *GASP*... random.

 

So with your system or random mods aquired from bounty, I have options :-

1. Do a high bounty mission and get fewer drops while doing the mission + 1 extra random mod after accumulating enough bounty.

2. Do a low bounty (common grind) missions but get huge number of mods, albeit random.

 

But if we can *choose* mod in mod market, that will be a whole different story. But considering an option to choose a specific mod doesnt exist, even for platinum, I doubt its gonna be implemented anytime soon.

Edited May 14, 2013 by rksk16it

[xenapan]

If the mods purchased are randomized then whats the point doing high bounty missions ? The missions which people grind often are those which give lots of mods which are also... *GASP*... random.

 

So with your system or random mods aquired from bounty, I have options :-

1. Do a high bounty mission and get fewer drops while doing the mission + 1 extra random mod after accumulating enough bounty.

2. Do a low bounty (common grind) missions but get huge number of mods, albeit random.

 

But if we can *choose* mod in mod market, that will be a whole different story. But considering an option to choose a specific mod doesnt exist, even for platinum, I doubt its gonna be implemented anytime soon.

The mods are randomized in that they show up randomly in the market. Not that what you buy is a random mod with rarity X. It would cycle through the possible mods for a slot. eg. a rare slot can be populated with a hell's chamber. after X hours, it may be replaced with another mod like ravager. If bought, it would be replaced with another rare - say sound quake. You would be able to buy the mod of your choice with your points instead of getting a random mod just that you need to wait for a while for it to show up. Upgrading the market will reduce the time required to find specific mods.

 

Collecting bounty allows you to pick up a preferred but deferred mod later on.

 

And this idea is important because as new mods come in, the actual rarity of each mod increases as more and more mods enter the arena. Sure its not a necessity now but a few more patches with new mods added in will dilute the already saturated pool.

Edited May 14, 2013 by xenapan

[rksk16it]

The mods are randomized in that they show up randomly in the market. Not that what you buy is a random mod with rarity X. It would cycle through the possible mods for a slot. eg. a rare slot can be populated with a hell's chamber. after X hours, it may be replaced with another mod like ravager. If bought, it would be replaced with another rare - say sound quake. You would be able to buy the mod of your choice with your points instead of getting a random mod just that you need to wait for a while for it to show up. Upgrading the market will reduce the time required to find specific mods.

 

Collecting bounty allows you to pick up a preferred but deferred mod later on.

 

And this idea is important because as new mods come in, the actual rarity of each mod increases as more and more mods enter the arena. Sure its not a necessity now but a few more patches with new mods added in will dilute the already saturated pool.

 

Ah I see your point, but it may increase the rate at which players get their desired specific mods. As I can see it, currently only point of playing the game is to hunt for mods, if the mods come easy, players may not see any reason to play. Also, that also reduces the value of mod packs in market, again something DE doesnt want.

 

Not saying I wont like to have specific mods available, but my speculation says its not happening in near future, so I wont hold my breath.

[xenapan]

May? Thats kinda the point. Plus its designed to fix 2 problems at once. One existing problem (a handful of missions being grinded continually while others are ignored 90% of the time) and a soon to be problem (way too many rare mods with a tiny tiny tiny chance of dropping each individual one).

 

Will it increase the rate at which players get mods? Maybe... it would depend on how much the game grows. It could be there are people cleaning out mission bounties the moment they hit the smallest amount just to get them. Then it would be 2 bounty a mission if you catch one, and if everyone is looking for the same mod, it would be 45 (or whatever the cap is) which would mean it would take 26 missions run on a bounty to AFFORD a rare mod of your choice. Then you still need to wait for it. AFTER building multiple levels of your dojo. They could increase the difficulty by making the building more expensive etc. It would truly be to get those one or two mods you are missing while still providing benefit to new players who can pick up that common/uncommon mod they so desperately need (looking at you killing blow!)

 

The fact is.. its a system which I've been thinking about for a while now. The numbers look reasonable esp considering the number of players constantly playing, it might still be too hard and can probably use a bit more tweaking. What it will do is help spread people out. Give clans more incentive to get out there together and play as a team, populate the planets with players rather than stacking them all up on a few very select nodes. Its NOT just about adding a way to get a choice of mods... its also to help change up the meta of defense missions and boss grinding.

[rksk16it]

May? Thats kinda the point. Plus its designed to fix 2 problems at once. One existing problem (a handful of missions being grinded continually while others are ignored 90% of the time) and a soon to be problem (way too many rare mods with a tiny tiny tiny chance of dropping each individual one).

 

Yeap, fixing two problems for players, at the expense of creating one for DE. Any item available only for platinum, if gets less valuable, is a problem for them.

[Vanadio]

The fact is that we have basically 2 unique maps, and several mission types.

 

People farm the three types that gives final reward + defense.

 

Giving the incentive to change nodes would add nothing to the experience, since it would be same map. Even the mission types nobody plays, we already get them with the secondary missions.

 

Your idea is very good, but its effects would be nothing more than having to click on another circle to get the same thing.

 

The market idea instead, I have no idea at the moment. 

[Lumireaver]

It could be there are people cleaning out mission bounties the moment they hit the smallest amount just to get them.

 

This could always be implemented in an hourly kind of way, where every hour the bounties would change according to activity in the last hour.

[rksk16it]

This could always be implemented in an hourly kind of way, where every hour the bounties would change according to activity in the last hour.

 

No matter how do you put it, in the end you gotta give them higher chances of rewards (mods) for doing those bounties. Higher than those defense missions. Or higher chance of getting blueprints than what is possible via bosses.

 

I say higher, and not just equal, because most people like to keep things simple. Its much simpler to stick to one mission if you really (desperately) need something, they wont bother to click to different locations, or to figure out where the higher bounty is.

 

But as soon as you give higher probability of rewards, everybody will start doing it, effectively increasing the total reward rate among all players. Its like if there are two sources of rewards : A (60%), B (40%), and if you expect people to do both, thereby effective reward rate is somewhere in between, it wont happen. Everyone will just stick to A, and wont bother about B, until they got everything they wanted (which may take some time).

[xenapan]

This could always be implemented in an hourly kind of way, where every hour the bounties would change according to activity in the last hour.

Did you skip reading the entire first post?

Let me re-explain real fast.

1. Bounty accumulates per hour.

2. When it gets to a certain point the bounty is raised. to the next level.

Eg. Pretend we start at 0 bounty for M prime. After an hour, no one goes through so the value is raised to 1. the bounty level is still 0 (so you wont get anything from it). The next hour someone runs the mission (and gets no bounty. level is 0). The next hour it's entirely inactive again. The value gets raised to 2, M prime's bounty level gets raised to low. The next mission run here will give 2 points to each participant and reset the bounty to 0.

 

tl;dr. It takes an ENTIRE hour of inactivity to build up a bounty point. Not how much. If none.

 

edit:  Oh and it also helps people playing off peak times. Less groups + bigger bounty.

Edited May 14, 2013 by xenapan

[Firebat86]

How about instead of random market, you can spend bounty to get fusion cores.  Removes randomness, allows for people to get something useful and somewhat rare, and won't devalue mods/mod packs etc.

[rksk16it]

How about instead of random market, you can spend bounty to get fusion cores.  Removes randomness, allows for people to get something useful and somewhat rare, and won't devalue mods/mod packs etc.

 

Yes ofc, so many people need lots and lots of fusion cores... oh wait.. they dont have that first mod to start with.

 

People grind defense for rare mods AFAIK, if all those bounties gonna offer are fusion mods, then nobody will care for them more than temporary situations when they happen to get their desired mods.

 

Or maybe we can buy those fusion to upgrade those silly hellfire/streamline defense rewards and keep them in inventory (cuz all warframes probably have fully upgraded versions of them). They look good just sitting there !! :D

[xenapan]

How about instead of random market, you can spend bounty to get fusion cores.  Removes randomness, allows for people to get something useful and somewhat rare, and won't devalue mods/mod packs etc.

It does and its a good point. Though personally I would never buy fusion cores because I still have pages and pages. Plus all my non rank 10 mods are maxed out. I literally have no use for fusion cores.

[Weird_Stealth]

How about instead of random market, you can spend bounty to get fusion cores.  Removes randomness, allows for people to get something useful and somewhat rare, and won't devalue mods/mod packs etc.

I agree with this, granted I love gambling for a rare mod that I might want. But when it comes to hunting down for a mod I need/really want, I wouldn't mind having the ability to forgo the randomness, and just get what I want.

 

 

Most of the missions I grind on, are missions I know are easy, and simple so I can level up my gear so I can tackle harder missions that go beyond level 30, which I normally have trouble with lone wolfing them. If there was missions that offer bounty rewards that have a high chance of getting me something that could upgrade my warframe and/or gear to where I need it, I'm all for it.

[Firebat86]

It does and its a good point. Though personally I would never buy fusion cores because I still have pages and pages. Plus all my non rank 10 mods are maxed out. I literally have no use for fusion cores.

 

Please get back to me when you try and get your hornet strike/serration past a 115% or your redirection/vit past 200%.  Eventually they will become incredibly valuable.

 

Yes ofc, so many people need lots and lots of fusion cores... oh wait.. they dont have that first mod to start with.

 

People grind defense for rare mods AFAIK, if all those bounties gonna offer are fusion mods, then nobody will care for them more than temporary situations when they happen to get their desired mods.

 

Or maybe we can buy those fusion to upgrade those silly hellfire/streamline defense rewards and keep them in inventory (cuz all warframes probably have fully upgraded versions of them). They look good just sitting there !! :D

 

See above comment.  Once you do get those desired mods, how do you expect to level them? With all the duplicates you magically got along with it?

[xenapan]

Please get back to me when you try and get your hornet strike/serration past a 115% or your redirection/vit past 200%.  Eventually they will become incredibly valuable.

 

 

See above comment.  Once you do get those desired mods, how do you expect to level them? With all the duplicates you magically got along with it?

TRY? I'm sorry but you obviously don't really understand what I'm using. Past 115% or 200%? Try 200% AND 320%.

and in case you think I don't have enough cores to finish maxing them out... (yes thats 344 cores sitting there) and yes. thats a WHOLE page of rare and uncommon 10s. .

 

Edited May 15, 2013 by xenapan

[rksk16it]

See above comment.  Once you do get those desired mods, how do you expect to level them? With all the duplicates you magically got along with it?

 

Did you try to find all your mods after update 7 ? If not then I doubt you will be able to understand the problem.

 

In short, "getting ALL those desired mods" takes enough time to fill my inventory with limitless trash mods, the moment I get my next desired mod, it gets nearly maxed out immediately. Forget fusion mods, if I do pluto defense missions I will have enough number of hellfire to upgrade all other mods of maybe 2 warframes, just with them.

[Firebat86]

TRY? I'm sorry but you obviously don't really understand what I'm using. Past 115% or 200%? Try 200% AND 320%.

 

 

and in case you think I don't have enough cores to finish maxing them out... (yes thats 344 cores sitting there) and yes. thats a WHOLE page of rare and uncommon 10s. .

 

 

I do not, and you are in the minority when it comes to fusion cores. Assuming you played pre U7 and open BETA.  I have literally never seen anything past a rare or uncommon 5 drop.

 

 

Did you try to find all your mods after update 7 ? If not then I doubt you will be able to understand the problem.

 

In short, "getting ALL those desired mods" takes enough time to fill my inventory with limitless trash mods, the moment I get my next desired mod, it gets nearly maxed out immediately. Forget fusion mods, if I do pluto defense missions I will have enough number of hellfire to upgrade all other mods of maybe 2 warframes, just with them.

 

I did actually.  Started playing the weekend it showed up on Steam for open BETA.  I've done what you are talking about with some of my mods, and believe me when I say they go fast.  I never sold ANY of my mods, and not only does it get expensive it eats up those trash mods real quick even when they are of matching polarity.

[rksk16it]

I did actually.  Started playing the weekend it showed up on Steam for open BETA.  I've done what you are talking about with some of my mods, and believe me when I say they go fast.  I never sold ANY of my mods, and not only does it get expensive it eats up those trash mods real quick even when they are of matching polarity.

 

I dont know about you, but in my case all my trash mods are just lying around. I have maxed out what I can on my warframe mods. I didnt max out vitality or shield, I rather prefer to max out Flow and reach and after maxing them I have no spare points left. Maybe after they introduce resetting warframe/weapon back to level 1 with change of 1 polarity, then maybe i try maxing out vitality.

[Firebat86]

I dont know about you, but in my case all my trash mods are just lying around. I have maxed out what I can on my warframe mods. I didnt max out vitality or shield, I rather prefer to max out Flow and reach and after maxing them I have no spare points left. Maybe after they introduce resetting warframe/weapon back to level 1 with change of 1 polarity, then maybe i try maxing out vitality.

 

Yea I understand.  I'm more referring to the ABSURD amount of mods to get the Hornet Strike and Serration up as well as Vit/Redirection.  I'm working on them because they are pretty much all I have left at the moment... All primaries and secondaries to 30 and only 3 more melee...  Plus it's fun to throw a high lvl vit/redirection on a Rhino and laugh at things trying to shoot you.

[xenapan]

I do not, and you are in the minority when it comes to fusion cores. Assuming you played pre U7 and open BETA.  I have literally never seen anything past a rare or uncommon 5 drop.

 

 

 

I did actually.  Started playing the weekend it showed up on Steam for open BETA.  I've done what you are talking about with some of my mods, and believe me when I say they go fast.  I never sold ANY of my mods, and not only does it get expensive it eats up those trash mods real quick even when they are of matching polarity.

Yes. because cores only go up to 5. Only OLD mods converted from Pre 7 ever got converted into rank 6-10 cores. So of course you wouldn't. No one has ever seen a rank 6-10 mod drop because they dont drop. ever. All in all, its just a matter of time. I can tell you for a FACT that I only used identical mods to fuse stuff that maxes at rank 5. No cores. Not ever. Rare mods like streamline/flow were fused with more common but useless mods. All the crit stuff, sprint stuff, ammo/magazine stuff. The only time I use cores is after level 7 and I used them twice (hence why I have so many lying around) The only mods I've ever fused with cores are hornet strike and redirection. And I had those well past the values you indicated before I even used cores on them. I don't need that stuff because I play melee like 90% of the time and none of the melee mods ever go past 5.

[xenapan]

Yea I understand.  I'm more referring to the ABSURD amount of mods to get the Hornet Strike and Serration up as well as Vit/Redirection.  I'm working on them because they are pretty much all I have left at the moment... All primaries and secondaries to 30 and only 3 more melee...  Plus it's fun to throw a high lvl vit/redirection on a Rhino and laugh at things trying to shoot you.

the "absurd" amount is 2^10 identical mods. X2 for same polarity or X4 for non identical polarity. So .. yes. but thats hardly an issue. It's SUPPOSED to be a long term thing. Not to mention... NOT the issue at hand. please stop derailing my thread. There are FIVE mods that have 10 ranks in them. It doesn't mean you need to max them out. and even if you did, how does that make my suggestion any less valid?

[Firebat86]

the "absurd" amount is 2^10 identical mods. X2 for same polarity or X4 for non identical polarity. So .. yes. but thats hardly an issue. It's SUPPOSED to be a long term thing. Not to mention... NOT the issue at hand. please stop derailing my thread. There are FIVE mods that have 10 ranks in them. It doesn't mean you need to max them out. and even if you did, how does that make my suggestion any less valid?

 

LoL derailing your thread? Lord forbid should I have a different view on how your bounty system could work!  Without breaking mods and the mod system.  But whatever have fun in your dead thread anyways!!!

[xenapan]

LoL derailing your thread? Lord forbid should I have a different view on how your bounty system could work!  Without breaking mods and the mod system.  But whatever have fun in your dead thread anyways!!!

Thats not a view on how my proposed bounty system works. It has absolutely nothing to do with the proposed bounty system or any of it's mechanics. Please tell me.. what do fusion cores and the only 5 long term mods in the game have to do with my bounty system? How does my system break the current mods or the system?