A Bit Of Feedback From A Fan.

[iamLoveless]

Well, this recent update was sort of... disappointing, given the way Vauban was released and other issues that arose. So, this being another large disappointment of an update I've been exposed to, I decided to give a bit of constructive criticism.

 

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First off: Pricing. Let's just get this out of the way right now, because this magnifies other problems I see with the way DE is currently doing things.

 

The platinum costs of ingame items are, quite simply, far far too high. Look, I know this is a business you guys have going here and you certainly need to make money off of the hard work you guys put into this game, but that does not mean charging a full game's worth of money for a single frame is acceptable. Vauban just launched, and right out of the gate he costs 300 platinum or $20... just to play one character. This isn't ok, $5 for a frame I could see, but what someone could spend buying an entire game for a single character is just silly. An upwards of $15 on a single weapon is also a tad insane. I shouldn't really need to explain why.

 

For some examples I put together a short list displaying the real world value of certain weapons and frames in U.S Dollars.

 

1: Boar 225 Plat. - $15                                                        1: Banshee 225 Plat. - $15

2: Glaive 150 Plat. - $10                                                      2: Ember 225 Plat. - $15

3: Fragor 150 Plat. - $10                                                     3: Frost 375 Plat. - $25

4: Afuris 225 Plat. - $15                                                       4: Rhino 375 Plat. - $25

5: Snipetron 225 Plat. - $15                                                 5: Vauban 300 Plat. - $20

6: Gorgon 225 Plat. - $15                                                    6: Trinity 225 Plat. - $15

7: Paris 225 Plat. - $15                                                        7: Saryn 225 Plat. - $15

8: Bronco 190 Plat. Roughly $12.66                                    8: Ash 375 Plat. - $25

 

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Second: The alert system needs... to be addressed. I bring this up because you guys clearly have not learned this from the Glaive fiasco.

 

With the way the alert system works we have a random chance every half hour to have a certain item available. These alerts last 30m to 60m long. So if we're lucky to have a certain item "drop", we have 30 to 60m to get this item, but if we are either sleeping, working, are busy, disconnected due to internet issues, or just forget to pay attention for a bit, we lose that item. Alerts are not nearly frequent enough to make up for this issue, as the norm is around 2 alerts per hour, and given the rarity of "?" alert occurrences along with the fact that most of "?" alerts are simple artifacts, the availability of items via the alert system is simply too low to use it for anything as important as an entire warframe. 

 

Specifically Vauban, the chances of an alert appearing with a "?" reward is already low, add the extra requirement that the specific alert is a Vauban component and the likelihood that these components will repeat(i.e 2 helmet alerts) and we're left with the fact that the availability of this frame to most players is extremely low. 

 

 

Anyway, I hope the fact that I didn't spend $100 dollars to get into your design council doesn't keep you from paying me any mind. I love this game and I want to see it get better, that's why I spent an hour composing this thread.

 

Thank you for your time,

~Loveless

[Xoxile]

For the prices. Yes. Spot on. I'm with you.

 

For the alerts. I don't know what the problem is. It's RNG. It's no different that forming a 40 man raid party to do a 5 hour raid to slay the last boss to find out that the boss did NOT drop the one item you are looking for. The only difference now is that your misses are in your face. You are now aware of your missed opportunities so it's more painful.

[Soulie]

I find it a bit irritating when devs say they're not happy with the alert system the way it is and plan on making some changes, then they go ahead and throw the new Warframe's blueprints into the mix. 

 

Seriously.  What the hell?  People were already irritated about the increased difficulty of finding Banshee parts as random rewards.  Now they're encouraging people to not even play, but watch the twitter feed instead.

 

I really don't like where this is going.

 

Can we bring back boss farming please?  That at least encourages some in-game productivity.  Even when you're not getting the boss to drop what you want, you're still gaining mods, resources and credits along the way.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Soulie

[EvanTheNewbie]

Weapons have always been overpriced in this game and I agree that they should be vastly lowered. Maybe 1/3 of the current price, excluding some of the cool gimmick weapons. 300 is a reasonable price for a hard to get new frame. Anything over 300 should be lowered to a more reasonable price. The thing about changing the plat price, however, is that you have to reimburse the people who actually bought them, which sounds very lengthy and hard to pull off.

[Eisvogel]

Well, definitely agree on the prices. Mostly because they are actually discouraging a lot of people from buying them, quite a lot of friends would buy the frames if they were a bit more reasonable in prince. Maybe they could also reduce the benefits and see what happens? (Like reducing the price and taking out the auto potato?)

 

The alerts.... yeah, it's becoming more of a problem. What xoxile said above... well, it's not really taking into account the whole picture or anything of the previous issues. It's not about being RNG, that has nothing to do with this.... the main problem is that you are actually releasing a NEW FRAME, and saying.... ok F2P players, go F*** yourselves! Good day! They made it plat or random "?" alert??? Really? A frame? And people are supposed to just happily wait to have the decent luck to get ALL 3 PARTS before actually getting something? again.. a frame! Nah it's.... a disaster. The glaive was already a major blow..... and now it seems to be going towards making plat or "?" alert items.

[FasterTH]

Well, definitely agree on the prices. Mostly because they are actually discouraging a lot of people from buying them, quite a lot of friends would buy the frames if they were a bit more reasonable in prince. Maybe they could also reduce the benefits and see what happens? (Like reducing the price and taking out the auto potato?)

 

The alerts.... yeah, it's becoming more of a problem. What xoxile said above... well, it's not really taking into account the whole picture or anything of the previous issues. It's not about being RNG, that has nothing to do with this.... the main problem is that you are actually releasing a NEW FRAME, and saying.... ok F2P players, go F*** yourselves! Good day! They made it plat or random "?" alert??? Really? A frame? And people are supposed to just happily wait to have the decent luck to get ALL 3 PARTS before actually getting something? again.. a frame! Nah it's.... a disaster. The glaive was already a major blow..... and now it seems to be going towards making plat or "?" alert items.

as person who have lot  F2p for long not as bad as other F2P game and system is somewhat alright  could do bit work will ? appearing but alright  in my opinion  eis

Edited May 18, 2013 by FasterTH

[Eisvogel]

as person who have lot  F2p for long not as bad as other F2P game and system is somewhat alright  could do bit work will ? appearing but alright  in my opinion  eis

 

I have played countless F2P and also "F2P". This is a great great game, with a lot of potential..... no one is saying otherwise so don't take it the wrong way faster :3. The problem is how the flow of things is taking a turn for the worst, when previous experiences have already proven so. The alert system for a new frames, it's a really cheap and low blow to the player base. It's already complicated enough with the random factors, the timezones, the brief brief time of each alert's duration...... and now also that you can't start a mission and wait for your friend because after ending they can't join..... even worse for low lvl players that cannot finish some missions or don't even have them unlocked for the alerts.

 

If this is what we are looking forward to.... a system of "plat or RNG rare "?" alerts". Then the already problematic alert system needs to be reworked and the players need to feel a sense of progression. For instance, instead of being in the exact time at the right moment... "?" rewards could be annihilated and it's place, we could get a progression alert system...... for instance, each alert nets coupons or fills a bar, with enough of that... the player would access the reward. There are lots of ideas, and prolly can find more among feedback threads.

[EvanTheNewbie]

I have played countless F2P and also "F2P". This is a great great game, with a lot of potential..... no one is saying otherwise so don't take it the wrong way faster :3. The problem is how the flow of things is taking a turn for the worst, when previous experiences have already proven so. The alert system for a new frames, it's a really cheap and low blow to the player base. It's already complicated enough with the random factors, the timezones, the brief brief time of each alert's duration...... and now also that you can't start a mission and wait for your friend because after ending they can't join..... even worse for low lvl players that cannot finish some missions or don't even have them unlocked for the alerts.

 

If this is what we are looking forward to.... a system of "plat or RNG rare "?" alerts". Then the already problematic alert system needs to be reworked and the players need to feel a sense of progression. For instance, instead of being in the exact time at the right moment... "?" rewards could be annihilated and it's place, we could get a progression alert system...... for instance, each alert nets coupons or fills a bar, with enough of that... the player would access the reward. There are lots of ideas, and prolly can find more among feedback threads.

So we can't get a certain frame, so what? There are plenty of other frames you can farm out. Everyone is so spoiled when it comes to frames. You know what isn't fair? DE creating new content with no payback. They work hard creating this content, so they should be able to implement the way to get it any way they choose.

[FasterTH]

I have played countless F2P and also "F2P". This is a great great game, with a lot of potential..... no one is saying otherwise so don't take it the wrong way faster :3. The problem is how the flow of things is taking a turn for the worst, when previous experiences have already proven so. The alert system for a new frames, it's a really cheap and low blow to the player base. It's already complicated enough with the random factors, the timezones, the brief brief time of each alert's duration...... and now also that you can't start a mission and wait for your friend because after ending they can't join..... even worse for low lvl players that cannot finish some missions or don't even have them unlocked for the alerts.

 

If this is what we are looking forward to.... a system of "plat or RNG rare "?" alerts". Then the already problematic alert system needs to be reworked and the players need to feel a sense of progression. For instance, instead of being in the exact time at the right moment... "?" rewards could be annihilated and it's place, we could get a progression alert system...... for instance, each alert nets coupons or fills a bar, with enough of that... the player would access the reward. There are lots of ideas, and prolly can find more among feedback threads.

well reward as you once said when i was still part of asuro the rewards were kind of crap  and change that base on feedback prob adjust system but exact moment part  is annoying but beat grinding and feeling won lottery and prob adjust alert system overtime this is beta after all

 

and this again is my opinion and entitle that much 

Edited May 18, 2013 by FasterTH

[Eisvogel]

So we can't get a certain frame, so what? There are plenty of other frames you can farm out. Everyone is so spoiled when it comes to frames. You know what isn't fair? DE creating new content with no payback. They work hard creating this content, so they should be able to implement the way to get it any way they choose.

 

You are missing the point. If DE is gonna choose Pay2Play, then make it official and do it right..... don't mask "F2P" with lies and spins. I am completely sure than a lot of players would pay a subscription for this game.

 

But if you are going to stay F2P, you can't expect to make it so that something as big as frames is virtually highly restricted to F2P players. And you don't need to rejoice in your ignorance to try and make a point, it has nothing to do with being spoiled or some other random crap you may throw as soon as it crosses your mind.

 

DE can make the game in any way they want, but they should state it so. It's in their best interests to keep the player base as big as possible. Also, this being an open beta, the actual point of all this is try to tune up the game, give constructive feedback and try to make the final product the best it can be.... what can i get from your post? What constructive thought or positive reasoning to ease the tension?

Yeah.... that's what i thought.... nill

[Xoxile]

You are missing the point. If DE is gonna choose Pay2Play, then make it official and do it right..... don't mask "F2P" with lies and spins. I am completely sure than a lot of players would pay a subscription for this game.

 

Are you playing the game? Are you paying for it? Then it's free to play. Nothing else is required to fall under this category.

[iamLoveless]

So we can't get a certain frame, so what? There are plenty of other frames you can farm out. Everyone is so spoiled when it comes to frames. You know what isn't fair? DE creating new content with no payback. They work hard creating this content, so they should be able to implement the way to get it any way they choose.

The game is based around the frames, they determine the overall experience of your gameplay. Vauban is not equivalent to Nyx, because they are different. If someone wants to play Vauban it is not satisfying to play as Volt. Who is spoiled when it comes to frames? The people that grind bosses for hours on end for that one piece that hasn't dropped yet? The people that have access to the content they want to play? DE has much better ways to monetize the game than overpricing and making items near platinum exclusive. And whether or not they work hard on the content they create has no bearing on whether or not it's good. The players choose if a game lives or dies not the developers. 

[Eisvogel]

Are you playing the game? Are you paying for it? Then it's free to play. Nothing else is required to fall under this category.

 

Really boyo? That's your focus from all what has been said? So narrow minded that can't see the point? Want to replace that for the Pay2Win paradigm? Where we can enter an endless and pointless exchange, about how a PvE can't be Pay2Win but still works as if and limits the F2P playerbase?

 

Let's try to keep the focus on the constructive ideas shall we? I'd rather not engage in pointless discussions derailing the thread. If anything, go watch that link they posted about Extra Credits.

[Xoxile]

Really boyo? That's your focus from all what has been said? So narrow minded that can't see the point? Want to replace that for the Pay2Win paradigm? Where we can enter an endless and pointless exchange, about how a PvE can't be Pay2Win but still works as if and limits the F2P playerbase?

 

Let's try to keep the focus on the constructive ideas shall we? I'd rather not engage in pointless discussions derailing the thread. If anything, go watch that link they posted about Extra Credits.

You try to keep focus. You are the one bringing up free to play.

[Qynchou]

Disagree with prices completely. I bought the founders package and the only thing that I bought from the shop were some pataters and color schemes, Thats it.

Acquisition of weapons/frames is much more easier compared to how much you need to pay, hence it not being pay2win since the prices discourage players from buying.

When youre asking for lower prices youre basically asking for pay2win.

Look up a guide where you can find warframe parts, go farm the map, ITS EASY.

 

As far as frame parts only from alerts, I agree with that and it would take too long to farm a new frame. This is where the situation I mentioned earlier is turned around. Buying the frame is much faster compared to how much time youll spend farming it (could take up to weeks as when another frame can be farmed in a day).

[iamLoveless]

Disagree with prices completely. I bought the founders package and the only thing that I bought from the shop were some pataters and color schemes, Thats it.

Acquisition of weapons/frames is much more easier compared to how much you need to pay, hence it not being pay2win since the prices discourage players from buying.

When youre asking for lower prices youre basically asking for pay2win.

Look up a guide where you can find warframe parts, go farm the map, ITS EASY.

 

As far as frame parts only from alerts, I agree with that and it would take too long to farm a new frame. This is where the situation I mentioned earlier is turned around. Buying the frame is much faster compared to how much time youll spend farming it (could take up to weeks as when another frame can be farmed in a day).

If you can't see that $15 for a single weapon is too much, I don't think you should be posting in this thread. Your comment about lowering prices is completely baseless, and your mention of a guide is irrelevant to the issues being discussed.

[FasterTH]

technically this  shouldn't be place here just saying topic should realy put in feedback pages this more feedback  then anything

Edited May 18, 2013 by FasterTH

[iamLoveless]

You try to keep focus. You are the one bringing up free to play.

He brought it up because it is relevant to the matter of pricing and monetizing. 

[FasterTH]

If you can't see that $15 for a single weapon is too much, I don't think you should be posting in this thread. Your comment about lowering prices is completely baseless, and your mention of a guide is irrelevant to the issues being discussed.

doesn't  that discourage pay to win +

potato are cheap and only thing that really after slots should spend any money on after comsteic

 

and again this should be place in feedback instead of general

 

you even worte Feedback in the tilte

Edited May 18, 2013 by FasterTH

[Qynchou]

If you can't see that $15 for a single weapon is too much, I don't think you should be posting in this thread. Your comment about lowering prices is completely baseless, and your mention of a guide is irrelevant to the issues being discussed.

Why are you ignoring my post? So you want to buy everything? All the weapons? You want them to be cheaper so you can just put your wallet on the table pay your way faster through content than everyone else?

[iamLoveless]

Why are you ignoring my post? So you want to buy everything? All the weapons? You want them to be cheaper so you can just put your wallet on the table pay your way faster through content than everyone else?

You should probably read what I said. I said that you don't have a grasp on value and how it applies to free to play games, and because of this you shouldn't make statements regarding the issue. I also pointed out that your points are both irrelevant and baseless. There is no need for me to address a post that has no value in this discussion.

[Qynchou]

You should probably read what I said. I said that you don't have a grasp on value and how it applies to free to play games, and because of this you shouldn't make statements regarding the issue. I also pointed out that your points are both irrelevant and baseless. There is no need for me to address a post that has no value in this discussion.

Great argument. Still didnt respond to anything I said, I guess thats how you hold a conversation, by completely ignoring the other person.

All you did was whine how weapons are expensive and completely ignored my points.

 

I wont bother with your ignorant attitude anymore. Stay small.

[Rowr]

I agree on the prices, weapons and frames are extreamly overpriced. I believe they would make way more money if the reduced the prices by a lot. It's not like It's hard to farm your stuff anyway. And I saw someone talking about "pay 2 win" wtf man this Is no pvp based game and the weapons are quite balanced so you can't really buy yourself a victory. I mean i think a lot of people like to craft their stuff by materials somehow it feels more personal and rewarding that way and that is a victory in itself. What they currently make money of imo Is the warframe slots, weapon slots and of course the different founder packages.

[FasterTH]

i feel that alright with price for frame though really should put harder to get frame bit higher then rest and starter less and boss getting ones avg pricing

 

weapons prices make plat is indeed expensive but make more not pay to win though did say add more mastery thing for clan thing if remember correctly (Don't quote me on this my memory is the best) but yeah expensive but discourage p2w and alert thing is alright in my book  loot from them (alert) is kind trash wep mainly after ya got them or gimmick like grieve which get kind boring now got 5 them for no reason

 

 

yeah their are  grammar and possible English mistakes  i try correct them hopely or ask friend to do it

 

and again shouldn;t this entire topic be move to feedback pages

and thier topic well frist topic kind already in feedback pages

and why does my say rank novice pretty sure i not novice

Edited May 18, 2013 by FasterTH

[Kyrkitao]

I agree on prices, they are bad and need to change. I would not consider buying anything other than slots and colors (also feel high) with plat. Things should have lower costs with new things having higher costs and gradually being reduced to the new normal.

On alerts; I think the biggest problem is actually that the alert system as it currently stands causes a lot of perceived loss (and we hate losing things far more than not getting things). To compare to the MMO situation as an earlier poster did, in an MMO each boss has a chance to drop something, but you only lose the item if another player gets it instead. In the alert system you lose an item if you aren't there for it.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Kyrkitao