How To Fix The Large Clan/small Clan Dojo Build....

[lMasterBetal]

EDITED VERSION: 5/28/2013

-Added in other proposals from comments of both Compilation Thread and this thread.

 

Contents

1:PPDC

2:Production Time

3:Cosmetics Vs. Gameplay

4. Dojo Size determines Clan Size (Via Upgrades)

 

PPDC

 

To cut to the chase. A solution I mentioned in the link below was meant to fix the large clan hording of members while small clans would be happy as well:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/52546-wp-dojo-clan-suggestion-compilation-wp/ (Go to #1 Proportional Costs)

 

So to clarify on the subject, us small clans have had difficulty building the Dojo while being hounded by the huge clans that have taken away the aspect of what Warframe was. Instead of having a few packs, these packs are now forced to lost their individuality by joining a Collectivized Clan based only on members and not who they are.

 

"We are the Borg. You will be assimilated" Ring any bells?

 

Explanation of PPDC (Proportional Progress of Dojo Construction)

PPDC would create a fair and equal construction plan for each clan regardless of size. How this would work is through proportions.

Example: Take my clan, the [Wolf  Pack].

 

Assumption: I require the following materials for construction of Reactor

 

For every 10 members you require the following resources(Again it's an assumption don't argue with the prices)

5 Forma

100000 Credits

5000 Alloy Plates

1000 Rubedo

700 Circuits

 

Assumption: A clan tries to cheat by recruiting more members for their resources to build said reactor and they reach 100 or 1000 members

.

For every 10 members you require the following resources for 1000 members (Which if divided by 10 members is 100)

5(00) Forma

100000(00) Credits

5000(00) Alloy Plates

1000(00)

700(00)

 

As you can see, each clan would require determination in constructing the Dojo instead of cheating by hording new members with resources just to gather for the Dojo.

 

Pros to PPDC

 

#1 Balanced Competition between clans: It will no longer mean that whoever has the larger clan wins but whichever clan is more dedicated to playing the game and constructing the Dojo would win.

 

#2 Larger clans would still exist only without having to recruit new people based on farming resources. 

 

#3 DE can alter the resource costs of all materials by altering the requirements for 10 members of a clan. They now have an ease of just simply changing the requirements for the smallest clans to fix the resource issue that every clan now has. 

 

Thank you for reading this thread. Try to keep this thread alive or you copy this idea. Please. DE needs to see this idea or else I fear that the clan system of Warframe will be ruined.

 

Production Time, the People have Spoken!

 

Production Time is an idea that is in favor by most clans regardless of their size. If you are not aware of what this method is. You essentially have reduced costs to make the Dojo for every clan however the production time is added in and becomes long.

 

Suppose I want to build a reactor for only 20000 credits but it takes 30 days. -10 Days per 10,000 Credits. 

 

The numbers do not matter what does matter is that larger clans would be able to get these rooms built faster without small clans suffering by the current system. While I do see some issues with Production Time, it is in favor and I think it is by far better than the current system.

 

Cosmetics Vs. Gameplay

 

One word. Micro-transactions. Well not really one word according to spell checker. Micro-transactions are viewed by the community as vile and sickening "OH MY GOD EEEEEVIIIIIIL!!!!". The problem with micro-transactions is that they are used as a crutch for gamers where you Pay2Win instead of Play2Win.

 

Cosmetic Micro-Transactions are good on the other hand because they do not affect gameplay. Riot Games does a pretty good job at this through selling skins and DE will learn eventually that as well. 

What does this have to do with Dojos?

My opinion on Micro-Transactions could be used for Dojos.

Take all the Dojos of every clan regardless of size and make it easy for them to construct while still requiring these clans to do hard work for these Dojos. Then offer cosmetics through the current construction system or a modified one in the last topic I mentioned (Production Time). Clans with a larger population will have the ease of making their Dojo look glorious while smaller clans will still have access to the gameplay features the Dojo offers IE the energy weapons; IE the Flamethrower.

 

This system could work just as well for both clans since what we really want is the gameplay access and then we will worry about looks.

 

4. Clan Size determined by Dojo Size (Via Upgrades)

 

This idea can be used with all of them and in short. The Dojo will determine how many members you have. This could work especially well with Proportions mixed a little with Timed Scaling. The Dojo would be required to upgrade or else no one will have access to it. This forces larger clans to build the Dojo upgrades first to allow for its hordes of members to flood the Dojo, doing nothing.

Edited May 28, 2013 by lMasterBetal

[Kadishia]

Yeah, I liked this idea. I never really want to join a oversize guild. It too many conversation and hard to get your voice through.

 

I love this idea you have!

Nice balance changes to it.

[lMasterBetal]

Thanks there are several other recommendations I made in the link below. You should check them out as well. You might like them as well.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/52546-wp-dojo-clan-suggestion-compilation-wp/

[Xoxile]

I too would like some kind of balance with dojos, but I think you are throwing it out of proportion by calling it cheating. It's more like doing what you gotta do to keep up with the competition.

[HeatHunter]

propotional costs would be bad imho, it just encurages a clan to start building a room, add all resources they can spare, kick all members finish the built and reinvite them...

 

I would like a time-based solution where you can add more resources to speed up the building process

a minimum  resource would be neccessary to start building. Any resources you add will speed up the building a bit.

 

Even if the time on minimum resources would be high (e.g. 30days)

[lMasterBetal]

I too would like some kind of balance with dojos, but I think you are throwing it out of proportion by calling it cheating. It's more like doing what you gotta do to keep up with the competition.

You're right it isn't cheating but it is a bad system to go by in my opinion.

[lMasterBetal]

propotional costs would be bad imho, it just encurages a clan to start building a room, add all resources they can spare, kick all members finish the built and reinvite them...

 

I would like a time-based solution where you can add more resources to speed up the building process

a minimum  resource would be neccessary to start building. Any resources you add will speed up the building a bit.

 

Even if the time on minimum resources would be high (e.g. 30days)

That is a loop hole of the system and should be monitored by DE. If a clan invites, kicks, and re-invites dozens of the same people, their clan should be shut down on the grounds of trying to cheat the system.

[HeatHunter]

That is a loop hole of the system and should be monitored by DE. If a clan invites, kicks, and re-invites dozens of the same people, their clan should be shut down on the grounds of trying to cheat the system.

 

you can't punish people for (ab)using game mechanics that are actually implemented...

 

a possible solution would be that you can't reinvite the same ppl for a defined time that multiplys every time that person get kicked.

e.g.

1st time 1day

2nd time 2days

3rd time 4days

8 days

...

 

I think you get the point...

[T2Cross]

propotional costs would be bad imho, it just encurages a clan to start building a room, add all resources they can spare, kick all members finish the built and reinvite them...

 

I would like a time-based solution where you can add more resources to speed up the building process

a minimum  resource would be neccessary to start building. Any resources you add will speed up the building a bit.

 

Even if the time on minimum resources would be high (e.g. 30days)

If a member is kicked from or leaves a clan then all resources that they have in queue should be returned to them. Easy fix for this exploit that requires no monitoring by DE.

 

I do, however, like your time reduction strategy. I would have no problem waiting a much longer period if it means that i can continue with a small, friendly clan.

[lMasterBetal]

If a member is kicked from or leaves a clan then all resources that they have in queue should be returned to them. Easy fix for this exploit that requires no monitoring by DE.

 

I do, however, like your time reduction strategy. I would have no problem waiting a much longer period if it means that i can continue with a small, friendly clan.

 

I agree the time idea is good and I added that to my whole compilation post. Thanks for the input Cross and Heat Hunter.

[Quazar123]

i 100% agree with OP and was trying to figure a way to post and word somthing like this myself and was failing to find the right words, Great job.

[Rechtglaubig]

Something has to be done.  We shouldn't all be pushed into one or two huge clans.  My situation doesn't allow me to join a large clan and I hope they can resolve this soon.

[Crazed_the_Lost]

What if every time you joined a clan you had to pass a test like when you rank up? That could stop people from kicking and re-inviting clan members, and help enable a proportional clan size payment system for building rooms.

My biggest issue is how expensive the hallways are. I can under stand the rooms that actually effect game play, but not ones you have to just build to get around.

[HeatHunter]

What if every time you joined a clan you had to pass a test like when you rank up? That could stop people from kicking and re-inviting clan members, and help enable a proportional clan size payment system for building rooms.

My biggest issue is how expensive the hallways are. I can under stand the rooms that actually effect game play, but not ones you have to just build to get around.

 

the rank up tests are pretty low, so this would not prevent it...

 

If there are really rooms (except the duelling room) that could affect Gameplay, they would have done something wrong :)

 

If you mean the research, you're right... But the new weapons should not give you an edge over ppl that don't own them...

[MrTrainee]

Best idea - limit clan sizes, lower dojo costs.

[HeatHunter]

Best idea - limit clan sizes, lower dojo costs.

 

you could also limit the clansize through the dojo...

theres a capacity value on the buildings and what if you limit the size of the clan to that total number...

 

lower the costs in general and add cost for every building of the same type, that increases the capacity...

therefor remove the capacity cost from the dojo-pieces (doesn't make sense either, if you have more space, you can put less people in there?) power requirements should be enough...

also the capacity of the starting room should be restricted to e.g. 20 instead of 100

 

this would mean, that if a clan wants to have >1k members, it has to built 5 great halls...

[Maxdoney]

Idea about variable room prices for creator of this topic: https://forums.warfr...-write-comment/

[vieuxchat]

propotional costs would be bad imho, it just encurages a clan to start building a room, add all resources they can spare, kick all members finish the built and reinvite them...

 

I would like a time-based solution where you can add more resources to speed up the building process

a minimum  resource would be neccessary to start building. Any resources you add will speed up the building a bit.

 

Even if the time on minimum resources would be high (e.g. 30days)

I wrote a lengthy one with maths inside :)

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/51931-a-proposition-for-the-dojo-costs/

 

PROS : no possible cheating, easy to implement, adapts well to any size of clan.

Edited May 28, 2013 by vieuxchat

[aTaVaX]

I dislike this idea because it would punish clans for having casual members.

 

i think a better system would be to support players to form smaller units inside of clans. So that people would not need to lose their individuality when joining a larger clan. Kind of like how an army is made up of different divisions with their own separate names and their own individuality within the larger army.  You can create your own company inside of the larger clan and make your own name and have as much customization as possible for your small group of friends. Everyone would be part of a large clan and for everyone that wants a smaller clan, they could have effectively a clan inside of a clan. Instead of small clans competing against large clans, they would be part of them. This would also make it easier for people with multiple groups of friends, because i could have like 4 different groups of friends in the same large clan without pushing them to socialize with each other when they likely wouldn't get along. 

Edited May 28, 2013 by aTaVaX

[Bombypupe]

So can you cheat this by having 10 man clan first, after finished building then switch to 1000 later?

[lMasterBetal]

ATTENTION I have made an update to the entire post instead of proposing one idea propose multiple ones for DE to read or for anyone. Thank you for your feedback. The People have Spoken!

[HeatHunter]

I dislike this idea because it would punish clans for having casual members.

 

i think a better system would be to support players to form smaller units inside of clans. So that people would not need to lose their individuality when joining a larger clan. Kind of like how an army is made up of different divisions with their own separate names and their own individuality within the larger army.  You can create your own company inside of the larger clan and make your own name and have as much customization as possible for your small group of friends. Everyone would be part of a large clan and for everyone that wants a smaller clan, they could have effectively a clan inside of a clan. Instead of small clans competing against large clans, they would be part of them. This would also make it easier for people with multiple groups of friends, because i could have like 4 different groups of friends in the same large clan without pushing them to socialize with each other when they likely wouldn't get along. 

 

I don't like that idea,

 

this would just encourage that every player in Warframe would be in the same clan...

 

I hate big clans where noone knows each other...

Also I would like to have the experiance of the building system myself, in large clans it's all set...

[XRuecian]

This idea could work. But i do believe that a larger clan should be rewarded in some way or another for being large. (Just not the way it is now.)
 

So a good suggestion is to have a base-cost of a room, and THEN increase it slightly per-member.

 

This way it will be harder for smaller clans, but not impossible, and the larger you get, the base-cost will begin to matter less and less.

 

[lMasterBetal]

I don't like that idea,

 

this would just encourage that every player in Warframe would be in the same clan...

 

I hate big clans where noone knows each other...

Also I would like to have the experiance of the building system myself, in large clans it's all set...

I always hated large clans since it creates a S#&$ty experience for the majority and only a little bit of good for the minority who rules.

[Xine_Erauqs]

I personally think that idea 4 would be the best. You have to upgrade your clan to have more members.

 

For example there would be stages and with every stages the things become more expensive.

 

5 Members

10 Members

20 Members

50 Members

100 Members

200 Members

and so on.

To prevent that they just kick the members this upgrades should be permanent. You can't change it afterwards an so it wouldn't make any sense to kick members. I think if there are acceptable prices than small clans have the same chance like big clans. It doesn't matter how fast the clans collect the resources because it will always be like this more member more resources but i think the important point is to give the small clans a chance and the big clans and challenge. So to summarize it i think Suggestion 4 would be perfect.