Feedback On Ash

[DeadlyNerd]

Just made myself one and while I really like the frame, but it's lacking in certain aspects, mostly cosmetics.

 

Shuriken could use 1 more projectile because 3 is, and has always been, THE number of anything.

2 shuriken just doesn't have the right feel, and definitely yields less enemy casualties. 4 would just be too many.

 

Bladestrom, while my favorite ulti(yes, I'm a Yurnero fan), has a horrible animation. I'm pretty sure DE is working on it, but on the interview the animations guy didn't really add anything but the awesome poleaxe animation.

I'd really like to see some decent animation for this ability rolling out in near future.

 

The second offensive polarity is useless on this warframe because Continuity doesn't effect anything but Smoke bomb, which is really just used for staggering enemies and not some elaborate stealth tactics. A tactical polarity would fit a lot better on this warframe.

Guess I'll just have to polarize it till this is addressed.

 

Mind you, I have shuriken maxed and the damage is most satisfactory. It's the number of shuriken that's the issue.

[tatcher]

Making Shuriken 3 would make it over powered, it's already VERY strong, so don't even go there :P 500 damage (650 with focus) each Shuriken and it's only 25 energy (19 with Streamline) Blade Storm.. You should've seen it before they updated his Blade Storm for the first time, it hurt your eyes to watch it, and they are most likely working to improve it right now to make it on par with the other Warframe's abillities animation wise, but it's hard to do it, and I'll tell you why. It needs to maintain speed so it doesn't take 5 minutes to complete the abillity, it locates targets, so fixing him hovering in mid air, going inside walls, inside the ground and inside the roof will prove a challenge, it has to be satisfying at the same time too, like all the other ones, as the enemies go splat or get sliced in half, sucked into a vortex, or Frozen and crushed. It needs to fit the Warframe, it needs to make sense also.

Edit: Forgot to add this. Smokescreen is more useful than you think, it's probably one of the most useful ones in the game, you go invisible, you stagger enemies around you, and your melee attacks crit 100% of the time, so the mod Continuity is also nice to have on him.

Edited June 1, 2013 by tatcher

[LunarWind]

The thing with Shuriken is that 3 would be too good.

They would have to reduce the damage per projectile down so that the overall damage stayed the same.

Then, instead of killing two enemies, you'd injure 3.

I don't know about you, but I'd rather kill one enemy than injure 3, killing two makes it an easy choice.

Also, two hands = two shuriken. It just feels right to me.

Agreed about the polarity.

I hope they will just release some more offensive polarity warframe mods.

On weapons, it's the best polarity ever, on warframes? No thanks.

[MarcusGraves]

people would quickly change their tune about that 2nd V slot if smokescreen had its duration raised to 8-10 sec. its not a problem with the 2nd V slot its a problem with the ability's duration being so low (6 sec max) which yields lower results from continuity than say loki using it for his invisibility which lasts 10 at max.

[DeadlyNerd]

The thing with Shuriken is that 3 would be too good.

They would have to reduce the damage per projectile down so that the overall damage stayed the same.

Then, instead of killing two enemies, you'd injure 3.

I don't know about you, but I'd rather kill one enemy than injure 3, killing two makes it an easy choice.

Also, two hands = two shuriken. It just feels right to me.

 

Yeah, didn't occur to me that he's throwing them with both arms because 1 is always occupied with the primary weapon.

 

As for damage, why should it be lowered? It's a PvE game and the most an extra shuriken guaranties is an extra kill, or 500(650) extra damage on something bigger and (if) solo. Not exactly a game changer.

All strictly offensive warframes have an aoe type 1st ability so killing only 2 enemies with ash feels a bit insignificant.

[MarcusGraves]

Yeah, didn't occur to me that he's throwing them with both arms because 1 is always occupied with the primary weapon.

 

As for damage, why should it be lowered? It's a PvE game and the most an extra shuriken guaranties is an extra kill, or 500(650) extra damage on something bigger and (if) solo. Not exactly a game changer.

All strictly offensive warframes have an aoe type 1st ability so killing only 2 enemies with ash feels a bit insignificant.

 

you do know shuriken can pierce and kill multiple targets right? its kinda like a ranged slash dash right now and not uncommon to kill 4-8 mobs in a good toss.

[tatcher]

DeadlyNerd, on 01 Jun 2013 - 7:10 PM, said:

Yeah, didn't occur to me that he's throwing them with both arms because 1 is always occupied with the primary weapon.

As for damage, why should it be lowered? It's a PvE game and the most an extra shuriken guaranties is an extra kill, or 500(650) extra damage on something bigger and (if) solo. Not exactly a game changer.

All strictly offensive warframes have an aoe type 1st ability so killing only 2 enemies with ash feels a bit insignificant.

No.. Because you can spam Shuriken FAST, it kills enemies, and it has a low cost. Making it 3 will make SOOOO many players rage and say he needs to be nerfed blah blah blah, 2 is enough. And even if the game is PvE doesn't mean the damage shouldn't be lowered if he throws 3, cause it stil needs to be balanced and on par with the other Warframes.

[tatcher]

MarcusGraves, on 01 Jun 2013 - 7:23 PM, said:

you do know shuriken can pierce and kill multiple targets right? its kinda like a ranged slash dash right now and not uncommon to kill 4-8 mobs in a good toss.

No not really, since they added heatseeking, or targetseeking whatever you want to call it, to the Shurikens, I only hits 2, I've never hit more than 2 with my Shurikens since they changed it.

[DeadlyNerd]

you do know shuriken can pierce and kill multiple targets right? its kinda like a ranged slash dash right now and not uncommon to kill 4-8 mobs in a good toss.

I wouldn't be complaining about it if they were piercing enemies.

 

 

No.. Because you can spam Shuriken FAST, it kills enemies, and it has a low cost. Making it 3 will make SOOOO many players rage and say he needs to be nerfed blah blah blah, 2 is enough. And even if the game is PvE doesn't mean the damage shouldn't be lowered if he throws 3, cause it stil needs to be balanced and on par with the other Warframes.

 

So basically excalibur dash should be nerfed in damage because it hits everything in its path. Saryn ulti should also have its damage lowered because it hits absolutely everything regardless of it being outside the room.

Worst thing they could do is balance warframes according to their statistics. Rhino got "balanced" that way and see what happened.

 

The only situation 3 shuriken would help with are swarms of enemies because rarely there are more than 2 enemies in the LoS of the player, and even then it's not exactly certain that trajectory of shuriken will allow hitting those enemies. Seeing how swarms of enemies don't occur that frequently, this buff still isn't a game changer.

 

Edited June 1, 2013 by DeadlyNerd

[MarcusGraves]

No not really, since they added heatseeking, or targetseeking whatever you want to call it, to the Shurikens, I only hits 2, I've never hit more than 2 with my Shurikens since they changed it.

 

i was knocking out multiple targets pretty consistently after the change. i played ash up until this recent hofix and just tested him now they are not being consistent or doing puncture anymore. 

 

either they broke it (surprise) or stealth nerfed 

[tatcher]

I wouldn't be complaining about it if they were piercing enemies.

 

 

 

So basically excalibur dash should be nerfed in damage because it hits everything in its path. Saryn ulti should also have its damage lowered because it hits absolutely everything regardless of it being outside the room.

Worst thing they could do is balance warframes according to their statistics. Rhino got "balanced" that way and see what happened.

 

The only situation 3 shuriken would help with are swarms of enemies because rarely there are more than 2 enemies in the LoS of the player, and even then it's not exactly certain that trajectory of shuriken will allow hitting those enemies. Seeing how swarms of enemies don't occur that frequently, this buff still isn't a game changer.

Let's see.. Slash Dash can be blocked by anything, props, players, and targets that does not get one shot by it, Saryn's nr 4 has the shortest range so you are wrong, and it isn't too powerful considering it's her ultimate, and the range is SHORT. I have all the Warframes at lvl 30, I've played since closed beta, I know how they used to work and how they work now also.

Edit: There is RARELY swarms of enemies? you must be blind or new to the game, swarms occour in ever room, almost.

Edited June 1, 2013 by tatcher

[Overrwatcher]

I definitely agree about the polarities. With only half of what my Loki had in mods, I already filled up most of my modding space. I would love to see it replaced with a tactical mod, as a defense mod would feel out-of-place.

[DeadlyNerd]

Let's see.. Slash Dash can be blocked by anything, props, players, and targets that does not get one shot by it, Saryn's nr 4 has the shortest range so you are wrong, and it isn't too powerful considering it's her ultimate, and the range is SHORT. I have all the Warframes at lvl 30, I've played since closed beta, I know how they used to work and how they work now also.

Edit: There is RARELY swarms of enemies? you must be blind or new to the game, swarms occour in ever room, almost.

If one is a blind nab, yes, slash dash wont be of much use to him. Shuriken wont either.

Saryn's ulti has perfect range for the type of gameplay Warframe offers. It's an instant room cleaner and with flow and streamline it can be used from one large pack of enemies to another with energy to spare. I know because I'm doing just that.

 

Look, you know what I meant under swarm and I don't feel like explaining it to you if you didn't. Let's just say that there aren't enough situations per mission where 1 extra kill per shuriken throw would yield great advantage to ash.

 

Don't feel entitled just cause you own everything and not to sound rude, but there are many people who have high end gear in WoW but can't lift a finger against a regular player in PvP, as in use their character to the fullest.

And don't bother replying after stating "I have more stuff than you, I'm better".

[Bubsters]

I agree with a fix on bladestorm. It feels really slow after spamming 1 all day.

Everything else is just fine.

[TactileDream]

I'm going to be a rebel and say that he's fine as is. After the buff the shuriken is awesome, the smoke screen and teleport serve their purpose, and blade storm is hilarious as well as decent at clearing mobs. Maybe the smoke screen and teleport could be tweaked some, I haven't played with them enough to be sure, but that's a small issue. Ash is very low on the fix list, even just in terms of frames, let alone other stuff.

[DeadlyNerd]

Fair enough, I guess I wouldn't feel that shuriken is so insignificant if it had better targeting so it doesn't just fly off into some 2 random enemies that happen to be behind obstacles, rather than the 2 in open, further behind them.

[S3raph]

Did anybody notice shuriken doesn't do damage to the shield osprey things in the void??? Or is it just me?? It just goes through them dealing no damage...

[Faethore]

Am I strange because I don't use blade storm or shuriken at all?  I love smoke screen (max continuity + Smoke screen) and teleport is very useful.  Then again, I love to kill things with my weapons and not powers...which is why my nyx, ember, mag, and banshee are collecting dust after reaching lvl 30. =b  My first forma will be to change one of the V's to something else...but not because of the reasons stated above...but because I don't have much use for focus. =b  God I love this game!! hehe

Edited June 3, 2013 by Faethore

[Keiiken]

you do know shuriken can pierce and kill multiple targets right? its kinda like a ranged slash dash right now and not uncommon to kill 4-8 mobs in a good toss.

 

 

Actually I didn't know the shuriken will penetrate and damage multiple target. I use Ash as my primary and this skill pales in comparison to slash dash when I use it.

[MarcusGraves]

Actually I didn't know the shuriken will penetrate and damage multiple target. I use Ash as my primary and this skill pales in comparison to slash dash when I use it.

 

refer to my 3rd post as right now it isn't puncturing consistently like it was when they added 2, noticed after hotfix 8.0.6.1

Edited June 3, 2013 by MarcusGraves