Smooth Movement Ruined Completely ( Update Rant)

[SniffYoBunnies]

Okay first off the powerslide doesnt look like you being a ninja but some sort of hyper jumping pony on steroids.Second thing is ninjas are not just Rush Trough This S#&$ kind of guys.They are masters of stealth and outmanuevering their opponents.Not just making the enemy go WTF with you frikin powerslide.

I actually think that restriction made the game like 20% cooler...

[Dataz]

Unfortunately, I'm forced to admit that this game is getting in wrong way...I don't who you are listening, devs, but one person wanted to nerf sliding course - you did it, someone else wanted to nerf Rhino - also easily done. Why don't you listen to what's all players opinion, but just hear one frustrated nerd?? Players give you their money by buying various things and you show them your &#! and force to shut up. IF you have a plan to change something, let it be discussed or voted in a poll! Nerfing slide made reaching Void secret rooms almost impossible...if something really ground-breaking isn't implemented into the game before vacations, I with friend discussed that we'll quit playing and paying for devs to keep just ruining it all further. sliding-running-sliding also became nerfed and inconsistent....

Edited June 10, 2013 by Dataz

[alphaMinus]

I hate this change with all my heart. Not only because it crippled my mobility it, it is also in my opinion a change that insinuates backwards mentality.

 

Backwards mentality when:

-Assuming (or basing assumptions on user feedback with  subjective arguments) that by making changes on mobility will act as a countermeasure to  "rushing".

-superficial approach to the implementation of changes to the core of the game; that is mobility.

-taking action to remove mechanics that many users grew to love without adding a replacement to compensate.

 

It frustrates me beyond reason because I was since hoping since I start playing that Warframe would be moving towards adding more movement mechanics, more mobility. I thought it was logical to presume that in a game about fast power armored psychos the developer would struggle to find more ways to increase mobility, even through emergent gameplay. Especially through emergent gameplay where players use creatively existing mechanisms to achieve more. 

 

But I must add that I think this is for the best. We had to reach this point in order to exhibit the gravity of the issue and it's value to a large enough part of player base. In order to show that rushing is irrelevant to mobility or that speed is low, or that the current implementation of mobility mechanics are not enough.

 

What is the next step? This in my opinion, is the most important issue right now. This is the best time to ask for official mechanics to fill the gap left by the general toning down of mobility.  

[Mietz]

 

What is the next step? This in my opinion, is the most important issue right now. This is the best time to ask for official mechanics to fill the gap left by the general toning down of mobility.  

 

Lots of mods, thats been the official stance on everything.

 

"Augmented Sliding", "Friction Coating" or some other bullS#&$ incoming.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Mietz

[ZWarhammer]

Can anyone post a video showcasing the changes to clear eyes on some of these people who still don't know what's this all about ?

Would be appreciated.

[alphaMinus]

Lots of mods, thats been the official stance on everything.

 

"Augmented Sliding", "Friction Coating" or some other bullS#&$ incoming.

 

Yes! Great, more band-aid no-brainer solutions to core mobility issues!

 

Saw Scott and Steve mentioning a couple of times module additions nodding satisfyingly to each other in total agreement.

 

I find that depressing.

Edited June 10, 2013 by alphaMinus

[Mietz]

Yes! Great, more band-aid no -brainer solutions to core movement mechanics!

 

Saw Scott and Steve mentioning a couple of times module additions nodding satisfyingly to each other in total agreement.

 

I find that depressing.

 

I think mods are cool. Modding is cool. Customization is cool.

 

However where the buck stops is variety in movement and combos. 

Its one thing to make your weapon hit faster/harder or to sprint faster/longer and another thing entirely to change movement or combo variety.

 

IF mods is the preferred route for DE, then make additional special mod categories like a combo-menu (Godhand/Remember Me) where I can slot things like Wall Run, Charge Attack or Slide and then use these movement mechanics freely with all the cancels, breaks and chaining I want.

 

I do not think the current system works well with things being put on cooldowns because they are inaccessible for players and the controls just feel inconsistent for people that don't know about them. If you want to control chaining you have to make these mechanics visible and accessible to everyone, not have arbitrary rules set in place.

 

I mean if DE decides that this game is now semi turn-based like WoW then S#&$ I cant stop them, but at the very least implement "cast bars" so I can efficiently play without pressing buttons and them not working because of some invisible cooldown.

[shukudai]

 

I see the same amount of people making tons of noise. That's different than tons amount of people boycotting a change.

 

In fact, going to the gameplay feedback not only i do not see other threads "boycotting" this change, but i actually see more threads commending DE on it.

 

Would just like to reply to this specific statement - the pro-mobility segment of the community have defended and refuted the detractors and beta shielders ad nauseum in countless threads, answered every objective point logically, and have been ignored.

 

Honestly, we're done talking.  The same few final vestiges of what are being thrown about as the arguments against mobility techs - looking stupid, isn't what a ninja is about; are all are subjective (and consequently inarguable).  Again, many of us are done talking.  Detractors have failed to respond to reason, and we know better than to keep trying.  But don't think pro-mobility players are not around, and are not unhappy with what's happening.  

 

The irony being, the very people who continue to insist on perpetuating this ruinous trend, will be the same ones who leave with a sneer when the game fails.

Edited June 10, 2013 by shukudai

[aerokiss]

Yes! Great, more band-aid no-brainer solutions to core mobility issues!

 

Saw Scott and Steve mentioning a couple of times module additions nodding satisfyingly to each other in total agreement.

 

I find that depressing.

scott and steve just shouldn't even be involved in the idea process.. at all..ever...

[alphaMinus]

I think mods are cool. Modding is cool. Customization is cool.

 

However where the buck stops is variety in movement and combos. 

Its one thing to make your weapon hit faster/harder or to sprint faster/longer and another thing entirely to change movement or combo variety.

 

IF mods is the preferred route for DE, then make additional special mod categories like a combo-menu (Godhand/Remember Me) where I can slot things like Wall Run, Charge Attack or Slide and then use these movement mechanics freely with all the cancels, breaks and chaining I want.

 

I do not think the current system works well with things being put on cooldowns because they are inaccessible for players and the controls just feel inconsistent for people that don't know about them. If you want to control chaining you have to make these mechanics visible and accessible to everyone, not have arbitrary rules set in place.

 

I mean if DE decides that this game is now semi turn-based like WoW then S#&$ I cant stop them, but at the very least implement "cast bars" so I can efficiently play without pressing buttons and them not working because of some invisible cooldown.

 

You said it all man. Can only hope that they will follow this train of thought.

 

Just to expand,

 

They need to work and expand on the basics. Players want to be able to go faster and have more mobility on a global level. Before Warframe choice, or module modification are taken into account. In my opinion we need a baseline increase of mobility and action combos that present versatile movement possibilities.

 

I also totally like and support solutions based on the module system like the examples you presented. But I believe it could be tricky. Basing my assumptions on recent mod additions, (flame repellent; Dear gods why) I feel insecure.

 

Same think with Warframe powers design. They need to take a spherical approach to the whole issue at hand and think hard and plenty about issues. 

 

If anything the whole issue with "rushers" and what some choose to call exploits and others call "emergent gameplay", proved that some players need more mobility.

 

Concerning the hidden counters or c/d's and stealth changes approach; it is bad! More transparency will go a long way to help us solve issues and gain the trust of players along the way.

[Mietz]

You said it all man. Can only hope that they will follow this train of thought.

 

Just to expand,

 

They need to work and expand on the basics. Players want to be able to go faster and have more mobility on a global level. Before Warframe choice, or module modification are taken into account. In my opinion we need a baseline increase of mobility and action combos that present versatile movement possibilities.

 

I also totally like and support solutions based on the module system like the examples you presented. But I believe it could be tricky. Basing my assumptions on recent mod additions, (flame repellent; Dear gods why) I feel insecure.

 

Same think with Warframe powers design. They need to take a spherical approach to the whole issue at hand and think hard and plenty about issues. 

 

If anything the whole issue with "rushers" and what some choose to call exploits and others call "emergent gameplay", proved that some players need more mobility.

 

Concerning the hidden counters or c/d's and stealth changes approach; it is bad! More transparency will go a long way to help us solve issues and gain the trust of players along the way.

 

Yes.

 

My idea of slotting attacks and combos is just that, a quick idea how to give control over things like chaining and make them appear to be "legit".

 

I've already written a long thread on how to improve melee and make it more varied instead of holding/spamming E, it would go a long way to incentivize interesting gameplay styles without being accused of "exploiting"

 

The thing is, I even agreed that adding a stamina requirement to move-chains would be a good thing to not upset the game balance and create a situation where stamina becomes entirely meaningless (imho it is anyways at high lvls right now).

THAT is not a problem, I think bringing movement chains/combos in line with other movement options reliant on stamina is fine because its a gating mechanic, but limiting it with an arbitrary CD you can't manage is -not-

 

I think nobody here would actually disapprove if -infinite- slide chains would be removed while keeping the chaining intact.

Adding stamina to the movement combos would make them even more skill-based as you have to actually manage a resource.

[Vanadio]

We can still jump-crouch-melee-fly like retards in our Frosts, outrunning Lokis that don't worship the practice.

 

Bad move against the issue...

 

Rushers, explorer, whatever, you must find the balance with game mechanichs, not engine mechanics. Stop putting cooldowns, they are retard.

[alphaMinus]

Yes.

 

My idea of slotting attacks and combos is just that, a quick idea how to give control over things like chaining and make them appear to be "legit".

 

I've already written a long thread on how to improve melee and make it more varied instead of holding/spamming E, it would go a long way to incentivize interesting gameplay styles without being accused of "exploiting"

 

The thing is, I even agreed that adding a stamina requirement to move-chains would be a good thing to not upset the game balance and create a situation where stamina becomes entirely meaningless (imho it is anyways at high lvls right now).

THAT is not a problem, I think bringing movement chains/combos in line with other movement options reliant on stamina is fine because its a gating mechanic, but limiting it with an arbitrary CD you can't manage is -not-

 

I think nobody here would actually disapprove if -infinite- slide chains would be removed while keeping the chaining intact.

Adding stamina to the movement combos would make them even more skill-based as you have to actually manage a resource.

 

It is a very good idea. My only concern with an articulated idea is with time, or how long it would take to implement such a system. But if they do choose to use the module system in a fashion you described I would support them as long as they do it carefully. 

 

In my opinion now they should:

 

-Revert the change.

 

-Expand on mobility with improved systems (many creative suggestions), this time around with knowledge of what players like and use. 

 

In my opinion, this is a detrimental issue with Warframe that will always emerge, because mobility is very important factor. I find that I need more mobility every second I play and find current mobility lackluster (especially after the changes).

[Mietz]

It is a very good idea. My only concern with an articulated idea is with time, or how long it would take to implement such a system. But if they do choose to use the module system in a fashion you described I would support them as long as they do it carefully. 

 

In my opinion now they should:

 

-Revert the change.

 

-Expand on mobility with improved systems (many creative suggestions), this time around with knowledge of what players like and use. 

 

In my opinion, this is a detrimental issue with Warframe that will always emerge, because mobility is very important factor. I find that I need more mobility every second I play and find current mobility lackluster (especially after the changes).

 

To add, to this.

I would like to see these parkour options incorporated into level design.

Make optional areas of the map that need chain wall runs or the helicopter to reach with some loot chests. Reward creative or skillful play and exploration/curiosity.

Quake had areas implemented that needed rocket jumps, precedent exists.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Mietz

[Estred]

Can anyone post a video showcasing the changes to clear eyes on some of these people who still don't know what's this all about ?

Would be appreciated.

Essentially the flow of movement has been slowed because of a cooldown being implemented. The "speedrunning" is actually caused by using slash-dashes to catapault yourself through the air. So this neither addressed the issue, if indeed there is an issue about Speedrunning. It really wasn't needed, now that I have tested, read the other players sides and discussed it. I see that really the Cooldown didn't fix anything it only toned down our mobility.

[Versal]

Do some of you people honestly think adding more Rare and Uncommon mods to an already saturated pool of useless warframe skill mods in the loot table would be advantageous rather than just, I don't know, reversing a 'fix'? It took me 50 hours to get a damn Flow, I am not going to spend another 50 more awaiting a magical RNG drop just to move how I did before they 'fixed' what I believed to be FUN gameplay.

[LikeABawsh]

Its funny that you say "whiners get what they want from DE", when you are whining to get what YOU want from DE.

Ironic, eh? Or rather...

 

a HIPO-CRITICAL-HIT! :D

[fishworshipper]

Could I at least get a little timer somewhere on the screen to indicate that jump-sliding is going to propel me forward rather than bring me to a complete halt?

[VoidWraith]

This patch completely ruined the smooth flow of movement this game had.

This so called change was clearly implemented because of little ( insert f word) demanding that everyone shares their play style of space turtles .

WE are supposed to be space ninjas ! this is the only thing this takes away from!

This won't stop me from rushing at ALL! in fact to boycott this change that's the only thing i'm gonna do now.

Thanks for the toggle sprint button that helps me with the rushing a lot!

This whole change did not effect rushers at ALL. What it does do is take more fun outta the game.

If this is how whiny complainers get their point across to you DE and ruin our game that's exactly what i'm gonna do from now on.

I'm starting a petition to reverse all the changes to movement and stop experimenting till you actually figure out a way to promote both play styles without shoving down a specific play style in our throat!.

 

I myself am not a rusher, 90 % of the time i will run off track to kill a few enemies and loot a few chests but does that mean that players who decided to skip that should be penalized ? NO! they might already have the stuff i'm farming for so they are not obliged to do the same.

I'm not gonna go around looking for every locker on the map because i know that redoing the mission and popping a few chests on the way will grant better results.

We are not bodyguards to so called explorers who try to loot every single corner on the map if they wanna do that they can play solo or with friends.

 

So i ask fellow Tenno who want to keep this space ninja game the way it's supposed to be and not turn us into space turtles! to boycott this change by rushing every mission just to show DE how badly they messed this up!

I love this game and it pains me to see it ruined by people who want EVERYTHING to be their way.

 

Edited to be more welcoming for people who can't stand rude language as asked by the community moderator.

 

 

just like explorers/resource gathering farmers could make their own party with friends or solo. the problem right now is that the contact list isnt really working that great. at most they could probably add a couple more options to party like letting us add title tags to the party to let others know, or rushers could make their own party or solo. what you say to another group of people that have a certain play style can also be used to say the same about you. not everyone is a rusher and not everyone is a explorer/pick everything up player. do not assume that there are more rushers than explorers and vice-versa. while your opinion has been voiced, its ultimately up to DE how they wish this game to be progressed. you can *@##$ and whine like as you say "a little (insert f word)" all you want. you are entitled to do so. but not everyone shares your way of thinking. there will always be a chance that you might pair/team up with rushers like you, or explorers like the other player base.

 

TL;DR: you may do as you wish and continue to irritate other players who are explorers when you unfortunately team up with one/some, while also irritating yourself for these "explorers not setting their play to solo or private". no one wins.

[Jugganatha]

As I've said in all the other slide nerf threads I came across, this nerf, quite frankly, threw off my groove.

 

And I was groovin' too. Man you should have seen me. I was the flippinest, jumpinest, slide-attackinest most air-kickinest space ninja around, but now I have an arthritis attack <=[wut?] every other movement I make and it legitimately throws my game off sometimes. Seriously. I've been killed by this nerf due to the lack of mobility now imposed on me.

 

As far as solutions, I've seen people say that rushers should just play solo if they want to rush. Problem with that is that rushers may be rushing to reduce farm time, and we all know how farming can get on an RNG drop system. I can say the same thing about looters too, that they should just resign themselves to solo play and deal with challenges by themselves. Another solution I've seen is that there should be a matchmaking preference system that would divide people online into "pro," "looter" and "rusher" categories.

 

The problem I have with the above solutions is that it ultimately divides the warframe community, where one type of player only sees the game through their shared point of view. This is the ultimate limiting which I am afraid of.

 

But enough about community, I want my slide back! Fix the rushing problem a different way later, that is if you count not waiting for slowness rushing.

[PositronicSpleen]

Lots of mods, thats been the official stance on everything.

 

"Augmented Sliding", "Friction Coating" or some other bullS#&$ incoming.

They actually thought Acrobat was a good idea for a mod. I would not blink if I read that mods like those were added. And they would probably be some dopey value like 30% faster slide for 9 points, and nobody would use it.

Edited June 11, 2013 by PositronicSpleen

[shukudai]

They also thought reducing pistol zoom and introducing a pistol zoom mod would add depth to the game.  All it has done is made the game slower and clunkier.

 

edit: (... unless you buy forma™.)

Edited June 12, 2013 by shukudai

[ZWarhammer]

They also thought reducing pistol zoom and introducing a pistol zoom mod would add depth to the game.  All it has done is made the game slower and clunkier.

 

edit: (... unless you buy forma™.)

If they keep nerfing stuff like that they could at least increase the total amount of mods slots since we now have to waste them on pointless mods that should have been in there to begin with.