Dear De: Dont Forget To Fix Nyx

[wgrant]

My point is its not broken its just not what you want. Absorb is NOT supposed to be used in a boss fight to destroy the boss and him missions! It is a defensive power with token damage tossed onto it as an afterthought which you should use to shield an ally reviving another ally during a boss fight with no threat of damage to anyone.

Maxed Chaos/ 75 energy = ~33 seconds of enemies doing nothing but shoot each other.

Maxed Teleport/ 75 energy = teleport to one enemy and stand there.

It's not even close to balanced.

Psychic Bolt and Shuriken SHOULD NOT be even closed to balanced. Nyx should not be able to deal good damage with her spells compaired to ANY other frame, she is NOT damage focused.

[unmog]

Maxed Chaos/ 75 energy = ~33 seconds of enemies doing nothing but shoot each other.

Maxed Teleport/ 75 energy = teleport to one enemy and stand there.

See the difference between my example and yours, is Teleport isnt related at all to Chaos. Its like comparing apples to oranges.

 

At least all of Ash's abilities have a purpose, I'd kill for a teleport ability for Nyx.

 

Though I do agree Ash's teleport ability should be an attack that deals damage for how much it costs.

 

 

Psychic Bolt and Shuriken SHOULD NOT be even closed to balanced. Nyx should not be able to deal good damage with her spells compaired to ANY other frame, she is NOT damage focused.

This is only because her damage abilities are broken. If she isnt meant to do damage, then she shouldnt have damage abilities. The fact she does have them means your wrong. But I'd be more than happy with trading them for other abilities that didnt do damage, like an ACTUAL shield of some kind perhaps since you seem to think shes meant to be defensive. Id vote for a psychic snowglobe, make it happen please :)

Edited June 24, 2013 by unmog

[wgrant]

My ridiculous example is to show that you have to balance frames not abilities. You can't compair frame abilities without addressing the whole frame. Nyx is arguably more powerful than Ash by far even if Ash get almost three times more damage out of his damaging skill.

Use Psychic Bolts to clear out trash mobs and free up firing lanes. All of her abilities have a use they just aren't as obvious as other frames.

[unmog]

You dont need an ability to clear out trash mobs, it does less damage than just shooting them. Thats what I have guns for after all. Seriously if DE is in agreement with you that she shouldnt be a damage dealer, dont give her damage abilities. Loki doesnt have damage abilities, but all of his are cool. Its as simple as that really, frames dont need useless abilities.

 

All of the abilities should be more balanced, I'll give you that. It isnt just Nyx that needs work. They all need to be looked at again so their cost vs effect is more comparable so there isnt useless frames. Ideally Ash should be just as good as Nyx, and Mag should be just as good as Saryn. Even if their abilities were radically different, they should be more balanced in terms of usefullness.

 

If an ability isnt working well, or is unbalanced somehow then its our job as beta testers to let them know. Thats the point of this thread.

Edited June 24, 2013 by unmog

[Dr.KennethNoiswater]

You dont need an ability to clear out trash mobs, it does less damage than just shooting them. Thats what I have guns for after all. Seriously if DE is in agreement with you that she shouldnt be a damage dealer, dont give her damage abilities. Loki doesnt have damage abilities, but all of his are cool. Its as simple as that really, frames dont need useless abilities.

 

All of the abilities should be more balanced, I'll give you that. It isnt just Nyx that needs work. They all need to be looked at again so their cost vs effect is more comparable so there isnt useless frames. Ideally Ash should be just as good as Nyx, and Mag should be just as good as Saryn. Even if their abilities were radically different, they should be more balanced in terms of usefullness.

 

If an ability isnt working well, or is unbalanced somehow then its our job as beta testers to let them know. Thats the point of this thread.

loki kind of does have a damage ability with his invis though since he gets a damage buff to his melee and cannot be targeted for the duration.

 

 

 

And as for the defense mission with DERebecca it sure looked like it worked the second time she used it. Just like it looked as though most of the enemies were on the inside of the bubble the first time she used it.

[goodgimp]

The only thing I want fixed with Nyx is when I shoot Psychic Bolts in the air it absolutely murders performance on my machine in a few rooms in particular (the non-galleon Grineer defense map comes to mind). I'm not sure if it's horribly inefficient pathfinding or what, but something is messed up with that. I get the same result on three machines with latest drivers, and my friends have the problem too, so I don't think it's a specific problem to my computer.

[Vyaldyn]

I'm going to mention this once again;

 

Psychic bolts need a look because they don't target properly, not because they're underpowered and

 

Absorb needs a look because it's too situational to use it. I don't really care what it does as long as it's useful enough to use the mod points for it. Currently, it's nowhere near useful enough to use the 5-7 mod points for it. It just isn't. It's only useful in very specific situations when you have friends around you who know what they are doing, and there's no cover around you. With the current maps, that is a very rare scenario.

 

If a skill isn't worth the mod points, it needs another look. I'm fine with it if it costs me 1-2 mod points, but I'm not fine with investing 7 into it at max rank, even with potato on it.

 

I like the idea behind Absorb, but it's simply not worth it at the moment without going through cover or getting the aggro from enemies. It doesn't even prevent Shade from making you invisible, which makes the whole ability completely useless, not to mention infested that don't even count towards the damage output (based on what I've heard, I haven't tried since the ability is too situational and mostly useless against infested anyway).

Edited June 24, 2013 by 3ventic

[unmog]

And as for the defense mission with DERebecca it sure looked like it worked the second time she used it. Just like it looked as though most of the enemies were on the inside of the bubble the first time she used it.

The first time she used it, she hit no one. The second time she "maybe" killed one normal enemy. Thats not how an ultimate should work is my point. Need to cast an ultimate twice to kill one normal mob? I think the video speaks for itself though for how broken that ability is. Maybe if it cost about as much as mind control in terms of modcapacity and energy cast, then "maybe". But as it stands, mind control is much more useful than her ultimate, this should be seen as a big problem.

 

The only thing I want fixed with Nyx is when I shoot Psychic Bolts in the air it absolutely murders performance on my machine in a few rooms in particular (the non-galleon Grineer defense map comes to mind). I'm not sure if it's horribly inefficient pathfinding or what, but something is messed up with that. I get the same result on three machines with latest drivers, and my friends have the problem too, so I don't think it's a specific problem to my computer.

Ive actually never experienced this before... since I dont fire my psychic bolts randomly in the air... dont even usually carry them on me. Wasted mod capacity.

 

Psychic bolts need a look because they don't target properly, not because they're underpowered

I think they need a look at because theyre both underpowered, and dont work correctly.

 

Absorb needs a look because it's too situational to use it. I don't really care what it does as long as it's useful enough to use the mod points for it. Currently, it's nowhere near useful enough to use the 5-7 mod points for it. It just isn't. It's only useful in very specific situations when you have friends around you who know what they are doing, and there's no cover around you. With the current maps, that is a very rare scenario.

Like you mention, it isn't useful. I believe all the things you mentioned is because the ult has problems differentiating "cover" and other enemies, it litterally will miss one enemy whos standing behind another enemy who was hit. If they got rid of enemies being protected by cover, increased the range, and made sure range and power mods worked with it correctly it might end up being a usable ultimate. For being an ability which locks you in place for 10-15 seconds, it needs to have the range to hit enemies who are still moving around the entire time... currently it doesnt. If its supposed to be just a shield, then by all means replace it with an ultimate psychic snowglobe. Maybe smaller, and maybe it increases the damage of your bullets that go out of it and deal damage or mind control enemies that walk inside of it.

[BadAimbot]

I disagree, for one Im not saying buff her ability, just fix it. Right now its broken and doesnt work at all, so these "buffs" as you call them are necessary for Absorb to be FUNCTIONAL. And instead of calling for nerfs all the time, people should instead ask for fixing/increasing other warframe abilities to be just as useful and cool

 

For instance are you saying that Chaos is Overpowered? Because if so, thats a seperate topic really. But what is "too powerful" and who gets to decide? I think Chaos is fine as it is. Instead of damaging and instantly killing huge waves of enemies, she causes chaos as they start attacking everything randomly. Really by your logic youd be saying "Nerf everything to Mags level of usefulness" when most people seem to agree that Mag needs a lot more work and her abilities need to be better.

 

And what REALLY gets to me is your not even denying that her ultimate is broken and useless, you're just saying its fine because she has one ability that IS good. Shouldnt all the warframes abilities be good?

 

First of all, I'm not saying it's okay that she has abilities that don't work properly. Every Warframe should have all of their abilities be useful for something, especially considering the sort of things they have to compete with in the mod slots. But, like it or not, Chaos is really, really good. And the effectiveness of the other abilities is going to suffer to balance that. Psychic Bolts and Absorb should be fixed to work the way they should. And if Nyx becomes too powerful, then some sort of balancing needs to occur. What is 'too powerful'? That's for DE to decide. But I think debilitating every enemy in a huge radius for a good period of time regardless of level is pretty damn powerful.

[Nykxx]

You can clearly see in the trailer how absorb is supposed to work, and the idea is great but it doesnt work that great at the moment. it should draw aggro and increase in range and damage for damage absorbed during the charge time. It shouldnt however take away aggro from other players "like iron skin should". its meant for situations, where you are already under heavy fire and use that to your advantage. So if another player walks closer to the enemys that are shooting you, they try to shoot them instead. this lets absorb work like ibntended without turning it into a "tank" ability where you save your team and cryopods with it (chaos is already good for that).

 

psychic bolts are just lame... overpriced single target damage ability that doesnt that much damage (wich it doesnt necessary have to do) but also offers no other advantage. It should do something special like doing the same damage as now, same energy cost, but disarm the one target. Or, let the enemy explode, when it dies from the bolts to create an Aoe (that grineer was shot with some bullets but runs into cover with his friends?... bolts around the cover, killing him, and possible the others behind the cover as well). To be a worthwhile single target ability in a game that already has guns, these abilitys need to offer something special to warrant a mod slot. If they dont, then you wont even bother with them, because you already have single target range attacks in the form of guns.

[unmog]

But, like it or not, Chaos is really, really good. And the effectiveness of the other abilities is going to suffer to balance that.

See this is the main point I disagree on. Just because she has one really good ability doesn't make it okay to have two useless abilities to compensate for it. And I believe that for all the other warframes too. But it seems to be that most warframes have one or two good abilities, and the rest suck.

 

For instance the only ability I run on my Frost most of the time is snowglobe. Freeze sucks and the other two are mediocre since they dont ignore armor so its pretty worthless on bosses or big dudes. I dont need help with waves of smaller dudes, thats what I have weapons for. With excalibur I mostly use slash dash and his ult, I dont bother with the blinding crowd control since you can get better crowd control by just ground slaming with heavy cold dmg weapons. And superjump feels clunky and unnatural to use, in my mind it'd be 10x better if it just increased your natural jumping distance for a set duration. I won't go through all the other frames, just I feel those two are some of the most basic ones I see people using so I figured they'd know what I mean. And I wont even go into Mag, all of her abilities are underwhelming.

 

You can clearly see in the trailer how absorb is supposed to work, and the idea is great but it doesnt work that great at the moment.

Exactly my point, and if they're showcasing her in the E3 Trailer they should make sure it works as advertised.

 

 

psychic bolts are just lame... overpriced single target damage ability that doesnt that much damage (wich it doesnt necessary have to do) but also offers no other advantage. It should do something special like doing the same damage as now, same energy cost, but disarm the one target.

I think for the cost of its mod capacity alone it should be doing way more than what it currently is. Then throw in the price of its energy use and the whole thing feels like a ripoff. If it mind controlled people it hit? Maybe. If it disarmed them? Or stunned them, knocked them down maybe? Pushed/thrown them somewhere would be better. If they increased the amount of bolts, maybe then as well, as long as they fix the trajectory.

 

What gets me though is Phorids bolt attack doesnt seem to have any issues homing in on me, and that crap does more damage, and bypasses my shields doing straight health damage. I'm not even sure if its effected by my armor or not. I would normally assume my psychic bolts would be even better than that fully modded.

 

Personally though I'm not against giving her a more defensive ability. I think it would be nice if all the warframes had more than 4 abilities to choose from, maybe 6-8. The more I think about it, this psychic snowglobe idea that is, the more I love it. I also think throwing in a more team oriented buff ability would be good for Nyx, maybe something like Volts shield that you can shoot through for a buff in electric dmg. Right now though none of her abilities require much teamwork, other than maybe using absorb on a decoy or something and that ability is broken like I've already said.