The Challenge And Endgame (Feedback)

[weikor]

Hi there, 

 

Before I start I would like to say that I've spent a lot of hours playing warframe, and want to congratulate the devs for making this awesome game. I'm going to point out the biggest problems I have with the game.

 

 

1.0 Overpowered and underpowered.

 

1.1 Warframes

 

I want to first start by saying, I know that most, if not all warframes have huge boosts to what they can bring to the party. Everyone has something that is strongly overpowered.

 

Frost - Icebubble

Trinity - Immunity 

Vaubahn - Crowd controll

Banshee - 500% damage

Rhino - 100% damage for everyone

Others - strong ultimates.

 

Now, this feels awesome to play. The big issue though is, that in combination, or even on their own some of these skills feel like im playing with cheats and they take the complete challenge of this game away.

 

The frost zone negates All ranged damage from corpus or grineer.

Trinity - the immortal warframe, if done properly never dies or runs out of energy.

Banshee, if you manage to hit the target can oneshot everything without shield.

Vaubahn lifts all Infested enemies, theres not one that can do anything against it. 

Some ultimates (mainly nova) oneshot complete waves of even the highest defence missions.

 

Now that might be cool, yet with that Wave 500 in endless defence would be possible if players didn't fall asleep or lose focus.

Mostly players just quit defence missions after seeing the insane hitpoints enemies get, not because they get a lot harder.

 

1.2 Stacking of Mods and Auras

 

the incredibly strong skills taken into consideration, stacking things like energyregeneration Aura (0.6x4 per second = 2.4 Mana regeneration) becomes very potent, possibly even too much.

 

Maybe skills wouldnt feel as overpowered if you couldnt spam them due to high manacosts.

 

1.3 Enemies.

 

Aside from the Ai, which I assume is a *@##$ to programme enemies just cant deal with certain abilities. If enemies ran into the frost - zone, I think it would be less of a problem, yet everyhitng just keeps firing away at it.

 

Also the fact that even the strongest enemies in the game, get crowd controlled equally easily as a level 1 enemy just makes them a joke to deal with.

 

1.4 Resurrecting

 

Especially in a party of 4, and with some of the guardian abilities, Its near impossible to fail a mission completely. considering you can self rez 4 times as well.

 

2.0 Lack of Challenge.

 

The above points beeing said, this makes the endgame incredibly easy and dull to play (unless you're looking for easy farming). Lets look at the options

 

T3 Void missions - Except for the defences, all of them can easily be done solo. I have no problem just Ramboing through every single one, killing enemies as I run past them. I need 0 Tactics to complete this.

 

Every mission except defence - Usually they are really simple to play, I cant think of one where I really had to stop and think about what I was doing.

 

2.1 Defences 

 

Endless defence, and defences are not Really challening.

They take time - yes, and Its possible to die doing one, but mostly that happens if you dont Start them with a proper setup, or do them random.

 

Frost / Vaubhan / X / Y  with 4x energy regeneration turns any defence mission from hard into "takes long".

 

And the sad thing is, defence missions are not hard because of their challenging enemies. They  are only hard because enemies will blindly suicide the cryopod and you need to keep them away. - not really to engaging

 

2.2 Nightmare mode

 

The rewards are cool, yet farming low level nightmare missions is equally rewarding as high lvl. Most of the challenges, arent really a problem to deal with. 

 

I know this is underdeveloped, and there really is a lot of potential here. 

 

but, for example the -% hp thing. Partially it felt like a buff I gained more hp than I could have had. Aside from that, Trinity, Group heal pack and just plain ressurecting negate that.

 

3.0 Suggestions

 

If you read this far, here are some suggestions that I would have. 

 

1. Nerfs.

I hate to say it, but some things just need to get nerfed. Why is sonar 500%, not 400 or 200. That would still be incredible. Why does trinity make the whole party immune to damage for 15 seconds, not 7? Why doesnt the frost bubble absorb a certain amount of damage?

 

2. Addition of spellbreaking mobs

 

If nerfing isnt your thing, you need to add something that negates the casting power. Maybe an enemy that makes everyone in a 10m Radius highly resistent to spells, meaning he would need to be sniped first.

 

Or an enemy that despells fields etc. That would also add depth to the game, giving a target priority.

 

3. Bigger enemies should be resistant to controll abilities. 

 

Add a counter of how many times an enemy needs to be targeted by a controll for it to work or make it last shorter on them. something needs to be done. Armor is not the answer.

 

4. Nightmare 

 

Either give us an ability to turn it off / on for all missions, or make every planet have one or two missions as nightmare. Nightmare missions on mercury are NOT challenging. 

 

5. Boss like enemies

 

If you havent, please go play mass effect 3, the defence missions there to see what I mean. There are enemies called, and they are terrifying, yet so much fun to play against - simply because they pose a danger nothing else does. they are hard to kill, can end a players life instantly if he gets too close etc. You really need to evade them at all costs.

 

These are also immune to crowd controll.

 

6. Add a level 90, 100, 120 defence mission so I dont always have to start at 0

 

7. My biggest wish and Idea

 

In the  future there would be a mode where the host decides how challening a mission becomes.

 

In addition to EXP, these missions have a point tally (like a highscore)

There is at least one of these missions for every race and each mission has a leaderboard, where players get ranked in comparison to others.

 

Every one of these missions has a set amount of waves 10 maybe 15 or 20. Or different goals

 

The host can set a number of different options to increase the multiplyer.

 

Options could be something like this 

 

Speed - Enemies attack faster, target you faster and run faster 1x, 2x, 3x... etc.

 

Hitpoints .- Enemies have 2x / 4x / 6x....  as much hitpoints and regenerate 1% 2% 4%.... life per second.

 

Resistance - Enemies break free of spells 20, 40, 60, 80% earlier, and have a resistance to the damage..

 

Spawn - Waves spawn 10, 20, 40, 80% faster

 

and so on...

 

this would give players something more to do.

 

So all in all, please give players an option to do hard content.

 

 

 

[weikor]

Ehm sorry to bump but i felt this got lost due to the time i posted it!

[LazyKnight]

Ehm sorry to bump but i felt this got lost due to the time i posted it!

I think one issue is they do not seem to use a benchmark to measure weapons, war frames or challenge against. Balancing appears to just be a kind of free floating add stuff as long as it doesn't sink the boat.

[Rei_Ikari]

IMO, nerf not the frames but buff the enemies. You've got some good ideas gng there,  where its not a a generic buff hp/damage of the mobs, but introducing new enemies that counters the frames; eg. a grineer that can shatter snowglobe or uses laser, infested that has range abilities to negate vauban, something to silence Trinity's spell casting and so on :)  

Edit: nerfing frames WILL bring lots of QQ and *@##$ing, trust me on that. 

Edited July 16, 2013 by Rei_Ikari

[weikor]

yes, I agree, but something needs to be done to make this game harder. 

 

I dont feel like im "beating anything", at the moment the fun of this game comes from farming items and seeing bigger numbers.

 

The most fun Ive had is failing at something, and learning how to become good enough to beat it. There just needs to be something extremely hard in the game, where even high end players struggle. Its not even about getting better Items, just give more bonus exp, a public highscore

or something and that will be fine.

[rohver]

I understand your opinions but majority of the players are not that 'hardcore'. Many people play this casually too and you have to take them into consideration. 

[Tr1ples1xer]

yes, I agree, but something needs to be done to make this game harder. 

 

I dont feel like im "beating anything", at the moment the fun of this game comes from farming items and seeing bigger numbers.

 

The most fun Ive had is failing at something, and learning how to become good enough to beat it. There just needs to be something extremely hard in the game, where even high end players struggle. Its not even about getting better Items, just give more bonus exp, a public highscore

or something and that will be fine.

Nonononono, i want to have fun not be stressed out, if you want harder take out your mods and fight like a man, they dont force you to use them, and this way the enemy will get a big buff for you and ill be able to enjoy playing and not raging.

[Oizen]

I always thought people quit defense early because they got something good.

 

I mean theres no real reason to go beyond round 5. Just do up to round 5 again. The rewards don't get better.

 

Its really just pointless bragging if you've gone to a level 50 defence

[weikor]

I really dont mean to make the game harder in low level areas, I just feel like I have so many cool things at my disposal that ive farmed for, yet theres nothing in the game where I need to use it.

 

Just add some missions at the top that actually require me to play the game properly, they dont have to be mandatory.

[LazyKnight]

I really dont mean to make the game harder in low level areas, I just feel like I have so many cool things at my disposal that ive farmed for, yet theres nothing in the game where I need to use it.

 

Just add some missions at the top that actually require me to play the game properly, they dont have to be mandatory.

There are ways to make the game feel more rewarding without making it markedly harder. Most people want to feel that earned some type of merit and do not necessarily want it punishing just the thing being asking of players take some planning(like killing 3 bosses on the same mission or 2 bosses at once). One of the most poplar games in history was Tetris and that was a very simple easy game to play. If they balance it right the fun factor can be just as addicting as a game like dark soul. The current the balance is just in many direction at once DE needs to buckle down and test stuff or get some play tester(if their staff isn't good at video games) and make the game have a consistent difficult slope.

Edited July 17, 2013 by LazyKnight