Loki's Dueling Problem

[Vras]

"This is not PvP and will not be of our concern" posts. I dont want to hear it, they implemented it and have an obligation to make it work proper. Make it fair, or don't make it at all.

 

 

I don't know if any other warframes have this too, but Loki is horrible at dueling due to the change in his abilities.

I played a Rhino (Oh this will be fair) and he just did his ground stomp thing and that instantly killed me. I'm just going to assume that's his ultimate.

 

So if his ultimate can kill me, what can my Loki's ultimate do?

It can disrupt the other persons screen for around 3ish seconds, give or take. Yeaah.

Edit: It also takes away the persons shields momentarily. (Still won't always help)

 

Decoys? Pff, like anyone would fall for that.

Invisibility? Might save you from a sentinel, but a player can still see you. (and kill you)

Switch Teleport? No idiot is going to stand around looking confused while you try to mow them down. They'll immediately get out of the way as soon as you switch.

Radial Disarm? Disrupts the opponents screen for 3 (maybe 4) seconds. Is that really going to help you? In that small arena, anyone can just spray and pray with a gorgon and murder you.

^

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Those abilities are what makes Loki the advance warframe that he is. Without them, he has the weakest armor and shields and would not last long in a fight. Sure he is the fastest but in that tight area it wouldn't take much aiming to mow him down. This comes from experience.

I don't know much about the other warframes and if their abilities have been "nerfed" too, but this damages Loki the most as without his abilities, he's nothing. (Worst shields, health, etc etc) And I don't want to hear anything like, "It takes strategy to win dude, lol" Because it really doesn't. Anyone with a Kogake can just knock me down and shoot me in the head and insta-kill me. Nor do I want to hear, "You have to choose the right weapon and mods." Because I'm near Lvl. 30 And I have all the mods I'd need to make Loki great.

 

Disclaimer: I don't know if the DEs have anything in store to fix it, nor am I demanding them to do that. All I want is to bring this to attention. I also apologize if this has been mentioned and discussed before, (If so then kindly provide a link) Please reply kindly and thanks for reading.

 

-Vras

Edited July 21, 2013 by Vras

[Paprika]

Everyone agrees. Loki just isn't a good duelist, but the Devs, as far as I know, haven't made it their first priority to change the nature of a warframe's abilities simply to improve its pvp capabilities. It's a co-op game, and they're focused more on improving the co-op aspect of the game.

 

With that said, if enough people want a buff on Loki in dueling rooms, the Devs might consider it.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Paprika

[Vras]

I think the problem is that Loki could be an excellent Duelist,

 

so much in fact that the Devs had to "nerf" his Radial Disarm to near uselesness. (And let's be serious, that was the only thing that could help Loki in a dueling match.)

 

And you are right, it's most likely not their top priority, but I just wanted to bring this to attention just in case. 

Thanks for the reply.

[Paprika]

Just found this thread.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/14410-the-official-unofficial-pvp-thread/

 

Maybe this'll be of some use to you.

[Vras]

Ooh, thank you sir.

 

I'll be sure to read through and post my ideas there too.

[Estred]

6 Words: Not a Player versus Player Game.

 

 

 

Ok with that obligatory statement out of the way. You have valid points about his PvP issues. Though I doubt they will be addressed DE has hinted that they know that some frames will have broken OP skills in PVP and others will be horridly weak. It's not in their focus right now to fix it.

[Vras]

I realize that Warframe focuses on its PvE element.

 

But the PvP is just so broken and unfair, I'd rather they not implement it until they can make it work. (And yes Loki is my favorite and that is why I'm bringing this up, boohoo. This goes for all warframes that have a disadvantage in Pvp.)

 

 

But what bugs me is that Loki specifically got nerfed when everyone else got off free(?). I don't know if it's because they thought disarming your opponent would be to OP, (Like some other moves aren't)

 

And when you say, "they know that some frames will have broken OP skills in PVP and others will be horridly weak."

You make it sound as if they're not going to fix that and it will stay this way.

 

It's Beta, and Dojo is in Alpha. I realize it's not finished and there is much more to come. All I really want is someone to acknowledge this and say, "It's okay, we're going to fix it and make it right." 

 

All I've seen at the moment is, "Yeah we don't care we're going to do other things first." Which I'm fine with, as long as they say what's above.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Vras

[Alantar]

I agree that Rhino can destroy Loki with a stomp of his foot, but I find myself winning duels against my clan mates most of the time. The only thing that needs to be fixed is how Rhino Stomp effects players. Maybe remove the damage but keep the stun?

[Vras]

That could be a possible fix, but there are still many other warframes that have OP moves.

 

Also, whenever I try and Pvp my clanmates I get destroyed. And I'm by no means weak, Level 30 Frame with great mods, etc.

[TheHeraldXII]

Obligatory "this is not PvP and will not be balanced for PvP".

Now that's out of the way, the main issue here is that certain frames didn't get their instant win skill nerfed, like Rhino in this example. He can one hit pretty much any frame but Excalibur only does 150 damage per javelin if he tries that. Most 'frames got hit by the nerf stick in PvP but certain ones didn't. Loki seems like a decent if not exceptional duelling 'frame if your clan uses houserules, like most do, and try to make PvP fun rather than a Rhino quick-draw contest.

[Paradoxbomb]

Can they see you while you're invisible during a duel? I imagine if they couldn't then Invisibility would be an instant win since you could take pot shots and just be careful not to give yourself away. In not, they should make it so only a glimpse of you appears to your opponent while you're attacking, so you still have an advantage, but have to be careful about when and how you strike.

 

Perhaps radial disarm should disable other players abilities VERY briefly, as it would be a real game changer on Loki's part and it already kind of makes sense (enemies with abilities, like Grineer Commanders, lose them when hit with the radial disarm). That or make it so it does take away a player's ability to shoot, but again, very briefly. It couldn't be anymore OP than any other existing Ultimates.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Paradoxbomb

[Vras]

They can see the normal shimmer of invisibility.

 

And +1 to this. ^

[Vras]

And ParadoxBomb, as nice as houserules would be not everyone would feel obliged to abide by them and would probably kill you anyways. And it seems to me that the only other people in my clan that want to PvP are the ones with the Rhino frames / have items that could make them instantly win.