Crowd Control And Nightmare

[RebornsAlmark]

The point of this thread is a suggestion to possibly include a chance that enemies in Nightmare have resistances to CC effects like Chaos, Rhino Stomp, Bastile, etc. This makes Nightmare more difficult (as intended) as a Nyx's Chaos or a Vauban's Bastile can easily turn a group of enemies into sitting ducks used for target practice. Furthermore, a Frost's Snowglobe combined with a Vauban's Bastile can easily make a almost flawless defense. Moreover, elite-type enemies like Elite Lancers or Infested Ancients should have higher resistances than their grunt counterparts in Nightmare (while bosses should probably have major CC resistance). As this will overall increase the difficulty of the game, this CC resistance on enemies should be kept to Nightmare only.

Edited July 23, 2013 by RebornsAlmark

[Lumireaver]

You can't just invalidate a bunch of Warframes/abilities/strategies.

 

Halved ability effectiveness would be a good idea for a mutator though.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Lumireaver

[correcthorse]

You can't just invalidate a bunch of Warframes/abilities/strategies.

Oh really? Take a look at pretty much every damage frame that's affected by armor.

[RebornsAlmark]

You can't just invalidate a bunch of Warframes/abilities/strategies.

Halved ability effectiveness would be a good idea for a mutator though.

This resistance won't invalidate a Warframe's abilities as my suggestion is to give normal grunt enemies maybe 20-30% (maybe 30-60% for elites, maybe 50-80% for bosses) chance to resist CC effects. It will merely stop Vauban's ultimate from making Infesteds a breeze and Nyx's Chaos from a field of enemies into a field of corpses without taking much damage. Additionally, this should only apply on Nightmare as most people playing Nightmare would probably expect a greater challenge, and using Banshee's Soundquake totally stun all enemies around you or using Chaos to faceroll enemies (in all seriousness, you can literally sit back and pick off the stragglers after using Chaos on Nyx) isn't much of a challenge.

My suggestion for Frost's Snowglobe and Volt's Energy Shield in Nightmare is to give it a certain amount of HP/armor and allow enemies to wittle it down and eventually destroy them.

Edited July 23, 2013 by RebornsAlmark

[Lumireaver]

A 23-30% chance to invalidate an ability still results in an invalidated ability. It'd be much better if instead of being a binary "affected/not affected" deal, it was an actual resistance. (IE: The capacity for an enemy to withstand whatever you're doing.) For example, nightmare enemies might not be slowed by slows as much, and they snap out of mind control faster. For things like Snowglobe, XX% of bullet damage could go through, etc. These are better than the immunities you're suggesting.

 

I do like where you're going, but you've got to be careful about making things useless.

 

 

Oh really? Take a look at pretty much every damage frame that's affected by armor.

 

True-ish, but I've got other things in mind for armor. Good ideas here.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Lumireaver

[RebornsAlmark]

A 23-30% chance to invalidate an ability still results in an ability. It'd be much better if instead of being a binary "affected/not affected" deal, it was an actual resistance. (IE: The capacity for an enemy to withstand whatever you're doing.) For example, nightmare enemies might not be slowed by slows as much, and they snap out of mind control faster. For things like Snowglobe, XX% of bullet damage could go through, etc. These are better than the immunities you're suggesting.

 

I do like where you're going, but you've got to be careful about making things useless.

 

Yes, this suggestion could be considered as a alternative to my suggestion. I just think there should be some sort of CC resistance on nightmare mobs and possibly end-game foes as some of the aforementioned abilities make enemies a pushover.

 

Regarding Frost's globe and Volt's shield, they have to be nerfed somewhat in nightmare if nightmare mobs receive some CC resistance as they provide invincible covers.

Edited July 23, 2013 by RebornsAlmark

[ToeSama]

I'm more of the mind that enemies on a whole need a boost, but making frame abilities not even effect them at all wouldn't be a good idea no matter if it was Nightmare difficulty or not. A reduction to the length of time that X enemy is affected by Y power might make more sense, but not to outright STOP the ability from even occurring.

[RebornsAlmark]

I'm more of the mind that enemies on a whole need a boost, but making frame abilities not even effect them at all wouldn't be a good idea no matter if it was Nightmare difficulty or not. A reduction to the length of time that X enemy is affected by Y power might make more sense, but not to outright STOP the ability from even occurring.

 

Except most decent CC abilities have AOE like Bastile, Chaos, Sound Quake, Rhino Stomp, etc. Having a small percent chance of Nightmare enemies being able to totally resist would be alright since only 1-3 of them per 10 enemies hit will be unaffected. While having them merely reduce the duration of the CC would bring up the problem of Vauban's Bastile which would just bring them back up into the Bastile. Moreover, Banshee's Sound Quake would hit them again thus stunning them again making the reduction in stun duration moot.

 

A more middle-grounded approach would possibly be giving Nightmare mobs a very small chance (like 5-25% based on grunt-type or elite-type) to totally resist the CC effect while also having some sort of resist (such as reducing duration of Chaos, the stun duration of Bastile, etc).

 

The enemies in their current state are dominated by CC. They have no resistance whatsoever and a Chaos from Nyx easily deals with most of them. Vauban + Frost combo can easily dominate any defense mission. Vauban's Bastile makes Infesteds a joke (as long as a Vauban keeps up Bastile, no Infesteds can hurt you unless you run into a floating Toxic Ancient). Sound Quake + Stretch destroys weaker mobs while stunning the elite types. Loki's Radial Disarm turns a bunch of formerly death from afar high level Corpus to Infesteds with sticks which can be dealt with relatively easily by a AOE ability like Saryn's ultimate or Nova's ultimate.

 

Edit : Moreover, DE has done something of the like as I've heard that Loki's Radial Disarm has no effect whatsoever on Elite Lancers, a newly introduced elite-type enemy. Might be a bug though.

Edited July 23, 2013 by RebornsAlmark

[Jykil]

A 23-30% chance to invalidate an ability still results in an invalidated ability. It'd be much better if instead of being a binary "affected/not affected" deal, it was an actual resistance. (IE: The capacity for an enemy to withstand whatever you're doing.) For example, nightmare enemies might not be slowed by slows as much, and they snap out of mind control faster. For things like Snowglobe, XX% of bullet damage could go through, etc. These are better than the immunities you're suggesting.

 

This. A thousand times this.