Puncture Mod Should Make The Gun Ignore Armor.

[Gryphticon]

Puncture mod should make the normal damage of the gun ignore armor (Serration, Hornet Strike). The first level should only ignore a % of armor but when it`s maxed, it ignores completely the armor of enemies. This way, puncture would be more useful for the mod point cost.

 

 

It would still keep the puncture ability while adding armor piercing abilities.

 

   It's not cheap at all

Edited July 26, 2013 by Gryphticon

[Kossuranta]

+1 Currently I don't know anyone who uses puncture because no slots and/or capacity.

[Cyberian_vs]

If you consider that a max level armor pierce mod costs 9 points by itself, without any kind of puncture, then that seems waaay too cheap for armor ignore and would just be OP

[RealityMachina]

If you consider that a max level armor pierce mod costs 9 points by itself, without any kind of puncture, then that seems waaay too cheap for armor ignore and would just be OP

You do realize puncture mods start at 10, right?

Edited July 26, 2013 by RealityMachina

[Gryphticon]

I thought of that since it can bypass corpus helmets so why not armor.

[Cyberian_vs]

You do realize puncture mods start at 10, right?

Yes it does start at 10, so are you saying that just with 1 more point you can just ignore the fact that enemies have armor? As a standalone mod currently yes it is way too expensive to be worth it, however if it added complete armor ignore than would make it very cheap since you could just line up some grineer and kill them all with full damage with a Snipertron for example (bad example since it deals armor piercing anyway but you get my point)

[whitejackale]

Puncture mod should make the normal damage of the gun ignore armor (Serration, Hornet Strike). The first level should only ignore a % of armor but when it`s maxed, it ignores completely the armor of enemies. This way, puncture would be more useful for the mod point cost.

 

 

It would still keep the puncture ability while adding armor piercing abilities.

It should ignore armour, and the distance that it travels after puncturing should be based on the armour of the enemy. The lighter the armour, the further that the bullet should travel after puncturing. Puncture should also make elemental damage mods deal increased damage since the elemental damage would be coming into direct contact with the insides of enemies.

[Seeryxlas]

Yes it does start at 10, so are you saying that just with 1 more point you can just ignore the fact that enemies have armor? As a standalone mod currently yes it is way too expensive to be worth it, however if it added complete armor ignore than would make it very cheap since you could just line up some grineer and kill them all with full damage with a Snipertron for example (bad example since it deals armor piercing anyway but you get my point)

 

he said that at max it would give full armor ignore(should not be full but 75% ignore?) but as you can see, it is definitely not just 1 point difference for complete armor ignore over the AP mod. this mod's basically one of the 3 most expensive mods right now for rifles.

Edited July 26, 2013 by Hssrak

[Gryphticon]

It should ignore armour, and the distance that it travels after puncturing should be based on the armour of the enemy. The lighter the armour, the further that the bullet should travel after puncturing. Puncture should also make elemental damage mods deal increased damage since the elemental damage would be coming into direct contact with the insides of enemies.

 

Good point, I think it should be affected by that too.

[DirkDeadeye]

It should actually puncture MORE given how expensive it is.

 

God forbid someone grabs a flux rifle slaps on a puncture mod and it acts like a damn laser.

 

Might have a little fun doing that. Just saying.

Edited July 26, 2013 by DirkDeadeye

[unmog]

Really the distance should just be greater than 0.1 like I heard it used to be before it got nerfed into utter uselessness. I'd suggest 0.5 or even 1 meter per level. I dont think a number like 3 or 6 meters would be more rediculous than using reach on my orthos to attack people through boxes which is about 6-7 meters away

 

If not... yes it needs some other gimmick like ignoring armor which makes sense. Or at least nerf the mod capacity required to equip it. But with so many other good mods they should reconsider un-nerfing it.

 

And while we're talking about buffing mods, bump up shocking strike's electric damage to 15% just like molten impact is.

[Alcoran]

It is rare, and can be easily made into a "dual stat" mod like the Nightmare mods.

 

Puncture

.1 - .5 Puncture

12% - 72% Armor Ignore

 

I don't think that it should be 100% armor ignore, as that still lets the current armor ignoring weapons keep some of their niche. But with this + armor piercing, you will get pretty good armor-ignoring damage.

[Gryphticon]

It is rare, and can be easily made into a "dual stat" mod like the Nightmare mods.

 

Puncture

.1 - .5 Puncture

12% - 72% Armor Ignore

 

I don't think that it should be 100% armor ignore, as that still lets the current armor ignoring weapons keep some of their niche. But with this + armor piercing, you will get pretty good armor-ignoring damage.

 

Puncture mods pretty much "punctures" armor but I think you're right, it should only puncture a high % instead of 100%

[PaperAlien]

Puncture mod

-goes through the target-

-doesn't go through the armour of the target.

Warframe logic!

[Gryphticon]

Puncture mod

-goes through the target-

-doesn't go through the armour of the target.

Warframe logic!

Exactly what I thought.

[Barnago]

I don't know that we need to change Puncture into armor ignore, but puncture definitely needs to be addressed somehow, as it is currently extremely expensive for a really lousy mod effect.

Edited July 27, 2013 by Barnago

[Aizeol]

I'm going to disagree, but more so on the grounds that the whole armor system is flawed and in need of a rework. Puncture needs to be made more relevant. That needs to happen not only by buffing the mod, but also by having the enemies be worth shooting through.

Shooting through enemies isn't relevant in almost any mission because they don't group up in a way that would help. Besides Kilken, and other defense missions using the same map, enemies don't normally form lines or group up in a way that an explosion won't be as effective as a straight line.

Add to this the already ridiculous nature that is armor in this game, and puncture is just a really expensive way to make one unit (shield lancers) way more boring to deal with, and therefore making the game even more stale than it is already becoming.

I'm all for Relkin's armor Redesign which combined with a better version of puncture (something as simple as a straight buff) would make the game much more engaging and much less stale.

[Gryphticon]

Aizeol, on 27 Jul 2013 - 12:42 AM, said:

I'm going to disagree, but more so on the grounds that the whole armor system is flawed and in need of a rework. Puncture needs to be made more relevant. That needs to happen not only by buffing the mod, but also by having the enemies be worth shooting through.

Shooting through enemies isn't relevant in almost any mission because they don't group up in a way that would help. Besides Kilken, and other defense missions using the same map, enemies don't normally form lines or group up in a way that an explosion won't be as effective as a straight line.

Add to this the already ridiculous nature that is armor in this game, and puncture is just a really expensive way to make one unit (shield lancers) way more boring to deal with, and therefore making the game even more stale than it is already becoming.

I'm all for Relkin's armor Redesign which combined with a better version of puncture (something as simple as a straight buff) would make the game much more engaging and much less stale.

I'm just suggesting them to add armor piercing abilities to the mod. It pierces through the target but not it's armor?

[Dasmir]

is just making another mandatory mod, -1 better DE do something with the $&*&*#(%& armor scaling.

[Aizeol]

I'm just suggesting them to add armor piercing abilities to the mod. It pierces through the target but not it's armor?

Again, I'm not saying the mod isn't flawed. I just believe that the whole armor system in general is more flawed than just the puncture mod. If armor was tweak, along with puncture and enemy behavior then I think puncture might be viable.

Right now, it's too situational as is on top of the fact that AP mods already exist. Puncture needs a buff to distance, and enemies need to actually group up in a way that makes the 10-15 mod energy worth it.

Edit: double check spelling

Edited July 27, 2013 by Aizeol

[Cpl_Facehugger]

It is rare, and can be easily made into a "dual stat" mod like the Nightmare mods.

 

Puncture

.1 - .5 Puncture

12% - 72% Armor Ignore

 

I don't think that it should be 100% armor ignore, as that still lets the current armor ignoring weapons keep some of their niche. But with this + armor piercing, you will get pretty good armor-ignoring damage.

I'm not sure their niche needs to be kept. Under this idea, they'd still have innate armor ignore without paying 15 mod points. On a potato'd gun, 15 mod points is 25% of your total.

[Gryphticon]

I'm not sure their niche needs to be kept. Under this idea, they'd still have innate armor ignore without paying 15 mod points. On a potato'd gun, 15 mod points is 25% of your total.

You can always polarize a slot.

[Winterbraid]

You can always polarize a slot.

 

Still, a slot used for Puncture is a slot not used for crit chance, reload, or an anti-faction mod. Puncture costs more and on average is harder to get, so it makes sense that it should at least compete with those in terms of utility. The only reason I use it on my Braton is because it's funny as hell on low- to mid-levels and later on I switch to Despair anyway.

 

As it is right now, Puncture is worth 7, maybe 9 points, not the 15 points it costs on rifles (and still wouldn't be used much). Considering Shotguns got an extra stackable AP dual mod, Puncture adding an extra % of AP damage wouldn't be game-breaking.

Edited July 27, 2013 by Winterbraid

[Lord.Finster]

Game mechanics vs. realism again.

 

There are two good ways to do this:

 

1)Realism:

For every level of the mod the bullet will travel 0.5 metres further after hitting its first target.

If the first target is an enemy, the hit will be amour ignoring.

Should a second enemy be hit by the bullet, his armour will be applied as usual.

Same goes when the first target is an inanimate object, like railings, boxes or Grineer shields.

Energy shields cannot be penetrated in this manner.

 

2)Mechanics:

Mod gets buffed to 1 metre per level.

So for 15 mod points the bullet will travel 6 metres through enemies and solid objects alike, dealing full damage to everything in its path.

Enemy armour applies normally. Energy shields will not stop the bullets path.

 

This mod is as expensive as multishot, make it worthwhile DE, plz.

A powerful penetration mod rewards good positioning by the player which means its use is dependant on skill.

Thus it should be potentially more devastating than multishot if used properly.

[Aizeol]

I'm going to keep saying that puncture really doesn't serve a purpose, even if it were to be buffed. I have honestly never seen an instance where puncture is actually viable at any distance that isn't ridiculous.