Allow Us To Build More Same Items At Once

[zelgaris]

this is especially related to OrokinC, OrokinR and Formas.

I get the building times are here to encourage people to pay for rushing them for real cash, yet I see a fail in logic, when we can build ton of different items, yet no two same.

 

I have now about 10 orokinC blueprints, so I would like to change a loadout, add one to each weapon, yet I cannot, becauuse I have to first spend 3 days of waiting to do so...

 

Thank you.

 

EDIT1 (2013-07-22) --------------------------------------------------------------

 

Talking about twin weapons and foundry in general...

 

Some mandatory suggestions are following :)

 

 

1) Allow us to build more same items at once

Self descriptive (also main topic of this thread), related especially to OrokinC, OrokinR, Formas and building processes of dual side-arms. Somebody here wrote it's "ruining rushing plat mechanism", I say "Just making it more user friendly and less $&*&*#(%& considering we can built ton of different items at once, yet not two same".

 

 

2) Building times are too long.

Don't get me wrong, I actually like there is some kind of built time and we don't get everything at once (although I wouldn't mind that at all), on the other hand, waiting 3 days for new Warframe, that's just crazy... yeah, as somebody said, it's unique, but "unique" doesn't always mean "good".

There are people arguing that if you have 12+ hours to wait for new weapon/warframe/something, you can grind for more resources and thus waiting is good. Yes, you can, or you can just quit the game and forget about it for next 12+ hours. Not sure if quitting the game is what devs wanted to achieve :)

 

I say 12 hours is the limit for waiting, but there should be a way to speed up the waiting process. We already have an option to rush the building time in foundry, yet we need to modify it a bit...

 

 

3) Rush cost should be relative to remaining built time

Why can we have this system working in Dojo, yet foundry is unaffected. It's yet another case of how Warframe lacks unification.

I find it utterly unfair that rushing Vauban warframe one hour before the building is complete costs the same 50 plats as rushing it immediately after I hit "BUILD" button. I am a paying customer and sometimes I pay so I don't have to wait, but the most common scenario happening lately to me is this:

- I am ending my 1-3 hour play session and I decided to built something

- I start building it with an intention to claim it next day (or after three @(*()$ days in case of warframes) or later the same day

- When I start the next play session, I check the foundry to see I have an hour left

- In that moment, I would really like to pay some platinum for the remaining hour, yet this stupid system doesn't allow me to do so and wants to charge me the full rush price. Not going to pay that. So I would wait and DE don't get any platinum.

 

The point is, if you want to people spend real cash, make them to want to spend the real cash and make the spending as intuitive, user friendly and fair as possible. Paying 50 plats for 3 days of waiting and paying 50 plats for last hour (or less) of waiting is just wrong.

I assume you see the evident problem here.

 

But there is only this one option to rush the building, while we can still have another and that is...

 

 

4) Credits based payment for rushing building

I assume this option will get a lot of hate from paying players, but having a really expensive alternative is the way to go.

There is need and strong emphasis for proper balance between platinum and credit rushing.

I can already hear the arguments about how nobody would pay platinum for rushing, because they can pay ingame credits. If they really want to spend hours and hours of grinding to spend credits for rushing rather than paying for costly modding, let them do it. If they are grinding for other things already and having 8+ hours playing sessions, they will hardly pay any platinum for rushing manufacture anyway.

 

I just prefer to have more options. If I see three options (pay for plats, pay for lot of credits, or wait) I can decide to spend some time grinding for the credits to only find out, it's just takes too much time and time is money if you know what I mean. Sometimes you don't mind that it takes too much time, but sometimes you don't have that time (or don't want to spend it that way) - this is the right time for platinum payments.

 

 

5) Remove or drastically reduce the building times and manufacture costs of dual weapons, which are built from two single weapons

This is related to dual bronco, twin viper, akbolto and afuris. Let's be fair in this - creating mentioned dual weapons is just bullS#&$. In case of melee dual weapons, at least you don't lose your original weapons and you build completely new ones.

 

 

---

Considering above written, let's take warframe building as basic for our calculations. Building a warframe takes 3 days, i.e. 72 hours and rushing costs 50 plats.

Let's reduce these 3 days into 12 hours (above suggested limit) but leave the 50 plats there.

That is about 1 hour of rushing for 5 platinum, and 14 minutes for 1 platinum (we have to round up/down, so the partial rushing isn't cheaper than full rushing).

Considering the credit rush cost, I assume 1 hour for 100 000 credits is fair amount, yet DE should have some kind of statistics or at least some kind of information about how much money a player can effectively grind in hour to adjust the price. This price could be also adjustable and related to some kind of ingame statistics, because the credits can be earned in the game.

 

Any suggestions and opinions?

Edited July 22, 2013 by zelgaris

[Haldark]

Can't see why this would be a bad thing.

 

Though, I'm generally a patient person so it doesn't really bother me that much. But if it changed, I wouldn't complain.

[Maou]

I find people in WF patient. anyhow This would help alot if your building dojo items

[magusat999]

I recently found this out building two Broncos to build duel Broncos - seriously, twelve hours per Bronco and another 24 hours for the Dual Bronco? Are we THAT strapped for cash we need to make people wait 3 days to build a gun? How many games have I played that makes me wait 3 days for something... hmmmm... NONE. the longest I ever had to wait for something in a game was a Facebook game - and that was 8 hours for my energy to reset in Mafia Wars. They used to make people wait 24 hours until they did some analysis and found out anything longer than 8 hours is DETRIMENTAL TO THE GAMING EXPERIENCE and keeping the player's attention and interest. 

 

DE supposedly wants to take this to the consoles - console players don't have that kind of patience. Bethesda will come out with a new Fallout or Elder Scrolls, where you don't have to wait for a damn thing, and Warframe players will find their numbers dwindling. I said it before and I'll say it again - get rid of the abusive waiting periods and schemes or watch your game fail. Remember players waited long enough waiting for the parts to finally drop - then you want us to wait some more??? Come on, we can do better than that.

[PettiTheYeti]

Build times, I'm fine with. This isn't some super-duper RPG where you click a button and *POOF* a sword places itself in your hands. Things take time to build in the real world, and it's one of the unique things about Warframe; That you don't get ANYTHING immediately.

[ThePresident777]

/sign

 

I takes too long to get stuff made in this game.  When I come home after a long S#&$ty day at work, I want a new toy waiting for me.

[MECT_HET]

Ruining rushing plat mechanism? No way.

 

Besides, during one of my fieldrons is crafting, i've got enought time to farm the required resources for the next one (i'm gonna build Supra and need 8 fieldrons), so it's comfortable enough for me.

[GallyYum]

It would certainly make building clan weapons more tolerable.

[zelgaris]

Building akbolto, dual broncos, twin vipers and afuris is epsecially pain in the &#! scenario. I forgot to check the wiki before building twin vipers recently (for some reason we still don't have useful information such as manufacture cost, resources and build time in the description of the blueprint) and thus I expected that I will grab my two already built vipers, click a button, BAM, twin vipers ready. In the end, you just grab two same weapons and use them, what's the big deal, right?

 

Well, no - we all know, how it goes... 12 hours built time, 1 orokin cell and 20K credits.

I know it can be all explained, that the weapons have to be modified so they can be used as dual weapons... it can make sense, but in the end, it just a way how to explain bullS#&$ to get cash from players.

[zelgaris]

Talking about twin weapons and foundry in general...

 

Some mandatory suggestions are following :)

 

 

1) Allow us to build more same items at once

Self descriptive (also main topic of this thread), related especially to OrokinC, OrokinR, Formas and building processes of dual side-arms. Somebody here wrote it's "ruining rushing plat mechanism", I say "Just making it more user friendly and less $&*&*#(%& considering we can built ton of different items at once, yet not two same".

 

 

2) Building times are too long.

Don't get me wrong, I actually like there is some kind of built time and we don't get everything at once (although I wouldn't mind that at all), on the other hand, waiting 3 days for new Warframe, that's just crazy... yeah, as somebody said, it's unique, but "unique" doesn't always mean "good".

There are people arguing that if you have 12+ hours to wait for new weapon/warframe/something, you can grind for more resources and thus waiting is good. Yes, you can, or you can just quit the game and forget about it for next 12+ hours. Not sure if quitting the game is what devs wanted to achieve :)

 

I say 12 hours is the limit for waiting, but there should be a way to speed up the waiting process. We already have an option to rush the building time in foundry, yet we need to modify it a bit...

 

 

3) Rush cost should be relative to remaining built time

Why can we have this system working in Dojo, yet foundry is unaffected. It's yet another case of how Warframe lacks unification.

I find it utterly unfair that rushing Vauban warframe one hour before the building is complete costs the same 50 plats as rushing it immediately after I hit "BUILD" button. I am a paying customer and sometimes I pay so I don't have to wait, but the most common scenario happening lately to me is this:

- I am ending my 1-3 hour play session and I decided to built something

- I start building it with an intention to claim it next day (or after three @(*()$ days in case of warframes) or later the same day

- When I start the next play session, I check the foundry to see I have an hour left

- In that moment, I would really like to pay some platinum for the remaining hour, yet this stupid system doesn't allow me to do so and wants to charge me the full rush price. Not going to pay that. So I would wait and DE don't get any platinum.

 

The point is, if you want to people spend real cash, make them to want to spend the real cash and make the spending as intuitive, user friendly and fair as possible. Paying 50 plats for 3 days of waiting and paying 50 plats for last hour (or less) of waiting is just wrong.

I assume you see the evident problem here.

 

But there is only this one option to rush the building, while we can still have another and that is...

 

 

4) Credits based payment for rushing building

I assume this option will get a lot of hate from paying players, but having a really expensive alternative is the way to go.

There is need and strong emphasis for proper balance between platinum and credit rushing.

I can already hear the arguments about how nobody would pay platinum for rushing, because they can pay ingame credits. If they really want to spend hours and hours of grinding to spend credits for rushing rather than paying for costly modding, let them do it. If they are grinding for other things already and having 8+ hours playing sessions, they will hardly pay any platinum for rushing manufacture anyway.

 

I just prefer to have more options. If I see three options (pay for plats, pay for lot of credits, or wait) I can decide to spend some time grinding for the credits to only find out, it's just takes too much time and time is money if you know what I mean. Sometimes you don't mind that it takes too much time, but sometimes you don't have that time (or don't want to spend it that way) - this is the right time for platinum payments.

 

 

5) Remove or drastically reduce the building times and manufacture costs of dual weapons, which are built from two single weapons

This is related to dual bronco, twin viper, akbolto and afuris. Let's be fair in this - creating mentioned dual weapons is just bullS#&$. In case of melee dual weapons, at least you don't lose your original weapons and you build completely new ones.

 

 

---

Considering above written, let's take warframe building as basic for our calculations. Building a warframe takes 3 days, i.e. 72 hours and rushing costs 50 plats.

Let's reduce these 3 days into 12 hours (above suggested limit) but leave the 50 plats there.

That is about 1 hour of rushing for 5 platinum, and 14 minutes for 1 platinum (we have to round up/down, so the partial rushing isn't cheaper than full rushing).

Considering the credit rush cost, I assume 1 hour for 100 000 credits is fair amount, yet DE should have some kind of statistics or at least some kind of information about how much money a player can effectively grind in hour to adjust the price. This price could be also adjustable and related to some kind of ingame statistics, because the credits can be earned in the game.

 

Any suggestions and opinions?

 

Also OP was updates with this post.

[zelgaris]

Bumping and adding mutagen mass, fieldron and detonite injector to the list, because the whole research is just time consuming bullS#&$ - it's hard to call it anything else.

 

I finally waited these un-rushable three days (we can rush everything else, but not research, why is that?) for a weapon I would like to try to only discover I need two mutagen mass I can't build simultaneously because some "design decision" and thus I have to build one at a time... oh 12 hours per one mutagen mass, that's 24 hours for two and another 24 hours for the weapon itself...

 

Devs, seriously, isn't there any better and less stupid way to get money from us, like making the access to items we would pay for properly accessible?? I already asked for optionable monthly subscription before and got negative answer, although I am sure there would be a lot of people, who would pay for it monthly, there is also room for some experiments, but doing the "farmville" time-related bullS#&$ that's just really low...

[EdwardMarlus]

Well well, my little eye happened to spy a topic similar to OP's earlier in the morning, only for it to randomly vanish.

 

As for the topic at hand, I did not care to read the OP's solutions, but if there's a clause that allows for multiple craftings of the same item, I would consent to it. The whole IF U NO GIVE DEVS PLATINUM THEY GO BANKRUPT argument is very cliche and right now as it stands a part of the endgame for players is essentially building multiples of key supplies such as Fieldron/Mutagens/Detonites/Formas/Catalysts/Reactors. Wait times and even rush costs do not line up. I understand that there has to be a way to collect $$$ from players buying platinum but this isn't it. Besides, lots and lots of people are pretty much buying Master/Grandmaster packages anyways so nobody's going broke soon enough.

[Dr.KennethNoiswater]

I'm going to be that guy.

 

Clearly these wait time you claim to be detrimental haven't kept you from playing or crafting. In fact, if anything they keep you coming back. I don't think DE minds if you put the game down for 3 days while your new warframe is building considering the time and effort you just put in to crafting it, you WILL be back to use it.

 

Same with the research and clan weapons, it's not that they need you to use a Lanka. It's that you clearly want to use a Lanka and are now being coerced to continuing to play their game for at least a week longer because of craft times or rush which raises the chances that you will buy more platinum afterwards.. They don't need you to play every single hour of every day, as long as you come back to the game with a semi-regular schedule you're still performing the role they need you to fill as a player.

[zelgaris]

I'm going to be that guy

 

Clearly these wait time you claim to be detrimental haven't kept you from playing or crafting. In fact, if anything they keep you coming back. I don't think DE minds if you put the game down for 3 days while your new warframe is building considering the time and effort you just put in to crafting it, you WILL be back to use it.

 

Same with the research and clan weapons, it's not that they need you to use a Lanka. It's that you clearly want to use a Lanka and are now being coerced to continuing to play their game for at least a week longer because of craft times or rush which raises the chances that you will buy more platinum afterwards.. They don't need you to play every single hour of every day, as long as you come back to the game with a semi-regular schedule you're still performing the role they need you to fill as a player.

 

DE maybe don't mind me waiting and not playing, but these 3 days can be used to check other, possibly better games, which don't require redundant waiting - games that let the player decide when he wants to stop the game session rather than putting redundant restrictions in front of him - i.e. they can easily loose player's interest in the game and that is something they clearly don't want.

 

Or yes, you can spend time playing and farming resources or other blueprints, but this happens usually with already maxed equipment and warframe, so there is always this sense of "no progress at all" while waiting as well as sense of "this game is forcing me to stop playing".

 

Talking rushing, I see myself paying real money for the, in my opinion, broken rush right now... (see opening post (3))

You know what raises the change that i will buy more platinum? Adding a rush to research (which isn't there) or allowing me to pay small amount of platinum for being able to build more than one item of the same type at once (I would rather pay for this option than not being able to do this at all), or making rush in foundry actually fair and not broken, or allowing me to buy mutagen mass, fieldron and detonite injector directly from Market (seriously, why not?) or as already mentioned allowing us to buy resources directly and easily from Market and Dojo building screen. Hell i would pay real money to be able to turn off those stupid transition animations between screens, in foundry, in mod collection, etc.

 

Making me stop playing the game doesn't raise the chance that I will buy more platinum, especially in connection to broken rush.  

 

But let's also focus on the other points from opening post, because this thread is hardly only about waiting (and even in opening I declare I don't mind waiting a bit, but what is too long is quite subjective here).

 

There is still the thing with not being able to build two same things at time (as repeated several times already), but being able to build basically endless amount of other different things at once. My head still doesn't grasp the logic behind this. This thing especially is in my opinion the negative approach, i.e. preventing you from doing something, unless you pay for it, in comparison to positive approach, i.e. allowing you to do something and then allowing you to pay for making it better/faster, etc. But arguments aside, no matter the explanation, I will always find this 1 item a time limit, utterly $&*&*#(%&.

[basilioss]

/signed, we need to be able to build items at more than one at a time. Warframes also shouldn't take THAT long to craft. 

[zelgaris]

So I recently decided to buy the blueprint for Dual Ichor, since we researched it few days ago. Because I am the kind of guy, who don't really like to ALT-TAB from game to wikipedia to check BASIC information, which should be included directly in the game, i.e. blueprint resources, so I just bought the blueprint and two mutagen mass blueprints. Also we have no idea how many blueprints of clan items/resources/credits we have, while in Dojo.

So we have to remember/write down that stuff before entering dojo, or just spend some time entering/leaving/entering/leaving... dojo...you know the drill, it's stupid and it's unnecessary waste of time.

 

Anyway, back in the Foundry, I checked the weapon blueprint to find out it needs 4 mutagen mass - bought only 3 blueprints, thought I bought some before... found out I didn't so back to dojo to buy another one.

 

After few minutes we are back in Foundry and then I noticed 12 hours build time on mutagen mass...

 

So, building a Dual Ichor takes 24 hours (weapon) + 48 hours (for 4 mutagen masses) + 24 hours (for forma) and that's too much (i.e. 4 days) for two organic daggers we don't even knows the stats, unless we check the wikipedia. Why aren't the stats listed there in the research? To trick us to spend real money on the item to find out it's S#&$? Is the group of people, who purchase ingame stuff/rush for real money while not checking the wikipedia that big so this lazy design approach creates a profit?

 

Also this is 4 days only in perfect conditions, when we start building another mutagen mass directly after the previous one, but since we also have like real lives, school, work, sleep, random IRL stuff, this perfect conditions don't happen that much.

 

We can always skip the whole process by spending good amount of real money, but as was said before on several occasions, it doesn't feel like we get a bonus for real cash, but it feels like being punished for not spending real cash.

 

So in the end, not only we still can't build multiple same items at once, but the game is effectively punishing us by lack of proper ingame information for not remembering/writing down some resources/credits we have or not checking wikipedia for information, which should be already included in the game...

[Silatuyok]

/Signed

 

This is a serious issue that had I been aware of while I was still in awe of the engine and the gameplay I may have  considered having never payed to be a founder.

[Arka3L]

Agreed also, Im needing to build 5 items, each taking 12 hours.. Seriously? Give us the ability to select how many we want to build and leave it at that. 

[MattHarrigan]

They confirmed a feature to craft the same item multiple times today in dev livestream.

[Modeaus]

Finally, multi item building. I was just going to suggest that they let us buy more process queues with plat.