Djego27
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Posts posted by Djego27
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Well I hope there will be still room for some adjustments.
WoF
I think nobody is really happy with the current semi toggle state:
- the toggle on minus duration builds is pointless, it runs only like 5-6s and when you switch it on you want that 6s, else you would have just used fireball
- duration builds are punished by higher energy use, beyond the current limitation of duration builds on Ember what make them more or less pointless outside soloing low level interception without spamming energy restores, because the lack in desperatly needed power strength and range to handle level 40+
- you tend to overstock on energy because of the constant drain doesn't prevent you from picking up extra energy orbs that you would have not needed in this momemt
-> Make it a true toggle without duration(removes duration mods) or make it a duration skill again(increase the base duration a bit to 12-15s) to make duration builds a bit more rewarding. Both options would be better than the current state of WoF.
It still needs a small amount(2-3% of the armor/shield added to the damage) of the target to help with the scaling, where Ember has still big issues. Another thing would be Infested. By design Ember should be very good vs Infested(and it actually is, however only on low levels), her AOE damage transforms her into a trinity for Ancient healers, the knockback of fireblast becomes compleetly pointless by the aura of ancient healers and takeing them down with direct damage against multiple of them(level 78 eximus, 34 waves into a defence) solo is next to impossible because of the massive damage reduction you suffer. A fire damage proc(being in panic) should prevent them from giving out the damage reduction and reciving any damage reduction(as a general thing for all infested). Currently Ember is just to limited in high level infested situations because you can't split them up, knock them back, archive anything with AOE dps or deal with multiple ancient healers with your own dps. This mechanic actually would give Ember a very good niche and make her far more useful in high level content.
Also WoF focuses on closed turrets in corpus missions like mad, make it ignore them or just destroy them that you don't waste all that ticks on a target that takes zero damage.
Fireball frenzy
Fireball frenzy needs a rework, put it on Fire blast to apply the buff as AOE or allow it to be applied by the AOE of fireball at least, currently hitting a teammate directly is next to impossible in current gameplay because they don't stand stillif it is not a mesa and fireball is not hitscan. Another thing is the duration, what is far to short given that the mod only makes sense in negative duration builds with high power, make the base duration 2-3 minutes to make it more reasonable(for all damage arguments) and give you the ability to do something else instead constantly running after your teammates to add a new buff every 15s. Another thing is that when it combines with other elements it becomes pointless again, since it prevents it stacking with accelerant. The fire damage should stand alone on weapons and abilitys to benifit form accelerant.
One more thing would be that sidearms as well as melee weapons lack a 2. fire mod like blaze or wildfire(that is not a event mod but can be aquired by normal gameplay). Stacking fire with multiple mods is farily required for the frame to work at high levels and while primed heated charge did help more options for melee and sidearms would be good.
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Ok did play quite a bit more hours with her by now, including solo defence for syndicates against L30 corpus.
Fire Blast: It can fail if targets are partial behind cover, what is a big issue if you try to revive somebody against corpus/grenier, it works like a charm against infested. It should be a cheaper to cast and make the effect more transparent, since it it makes it very hard even for somebody that is used to haveing a lot of explosions on the screen with WoF to still shoot stuff while you use it, combined with the ring of fire that also hinders sight on targets. It also should have knockdown, since some enemies still shoot you while getting knocked back, what makes it fairly bad when you try to revive somebody.
WoF: The toggle as it is implemented now makes nobody happy. It is still duration based, uses more energy, duration builds get punished by becomming less energy effiencent and turning it off before it runs out hardly helps to conserve energy because of the high inital casting cost outside of a very high duration build, with my 7s duration on it I would use fireball anyway if I don't have enught targets for WoF anyway. While I can now again pick up energy again/use energy syphon while it runs I can't use energy restores, what is vital for point defence like today in a corpus defence with a random 6% damage loki prime that managed to die 5 times and forced me to nuke the energy pool multiple times just to keep the pod alive after spending 20s away from the pod to pick him up again. While I get why Mirage and Mesa should not be able to just drop energy restores while keeping her 4 running(especially with mesa) Ember still dies very quick to direct damage while WOF is running, it includes a lot of movement and gun play(to shoot what shoots you first because WoF has the tendency to rather hit something in the next room instead of the enemy in front of you) and has to be right on top of targets. This restriction is huge issue for me, since I need to put WoF off in situations where I desperatly need the extra dps to clear a point quick. Ember is as far as you can get away from P42W gameplay that you see done by so many Excalibur and Mesa players because the range and damage of WoF doesn't make it suitable for that and you still can be killed very quick because you don't have amazing damage migration like mesa to stand right in front of the target and shoot it down or the range to just stand in the centre of a map and spam 4 like Excaliburs do. If you make it a toggle, reduce the activation to 10 energy and let it consume energy every second, this way turning it on and off would make sense and removes the need for duration mods on her. Else just keep it as it was before, with the faster animation you can just recast it if it runs out, duration builds get more energy efficiency and while for transient fortitude and fleeting expertise setups the changes are hardly noticeable(for me at least).
While I first was in the impression that WoF also boosts speed by showing the volt like effect, it just feels faster. Adding a 20-30% speed buff to ember while WoF is on would be fantastic for her run and gun game play and help to cover more space quicker to bring WoF to where it needs to be.
One more thing, the animation for casting WoF looks strange now, it starts at the speed it had before the changes and speeds up in the middle to much higher speed what looks strange. A overall faster animation at the same speed would be better.
My Ember looks like this: http://warframe-builder.com/Warframes/Builder/Ember_prime/t_30_023402302_2-3-10-4-7-5-5-6-5-6-0-5-8-8-5-14-1-5-16-4-5-55-2-3-411-5-10_6-11-14-5-55-5-2-6-16-11-411-8-5-5-4-9-8-5_0/en/1-0-4 -
Ember got a .1 speed buff. And considering enemies in void have mostly hitscan weapon and silly stuff like homing rockets, your running speed is not going to be enough to avoid anything serious.
Ember got actually 2 speed buffs, one build in and the 2. one on WoF, what brings her up to full Volt speed if you run a rush mod.
As for void I did 40+ minutes with my old ember without a reactor and 5 forma on it, while running out of ammo on my 6 forma catalyst Tiberon(what is a high dps and ammo efficent gun if you aim for headshots) and seeing the dps of my abilitys drop that hard that you can't manage the heavy gunner in front of you any more. At this point, speed is what keeps you alive and most void units don't have hitscan weapons.
I acutally do run mag prime more than everything else for void missions today, because the frame gives me great dps(and by great I mean 60+ percent in a 4 man team) and utility(people are down, everybody calls it a wipe and the mag saves the day with CC, plus for some reason nobody else in my clan really uses the frame, so if we use a mag, I play it every single time), different to Ember where dps doesn't scale at all and utility was missing compleetly before the accelerant fix. However, looking at her performance against infested, I would say that it now comes down to preference(dps and up close vs slow down and to use range) and playstyle if you pick a Ember or Nova, outside of long def/survial where you need the slow down. Before the changes Nova was just miles better at staying alive and to handle big amounts of targets, now Ember can do that as well in skilled hands(then again nova dies just as quick as a Ember if you make a mistake as player). I think that is a good thing, because I like in your face dps Ember a bit more than slow you down Nova when it comes to solo gameplay, while I still will run the Nova if nobody else bings one if we do 40+ waves or minutes in defence or surival.
I love the Ember gameplay of in your face dps and with the higher speed, AOE knockdown and armor it got a lot more practical and useful for the team.
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In my opinion having the 'same survivability as nova' means not having any at all.
Let's calculate how much the tiny armor buff actually helps. Ember had 15 armor before. Having 300 health, that amounts to 315 effective health, if you are fighting enemies that do not deal puncture damage(as the vast majority of corpus do).
Now with the armor buff of 125, that goes to 425 effective health against enemies without puncture damage. That's a 34% increase on health.
Now for overall health + shields, it goes from 615 to 725, a tiny 18% increase in effective hp. Basically nothing.
The point is that I can solo survial for a good amount of time with my Nova because you will not get hit(at all) by the high speed of the frame and the slow down of mprime. Ember with the changes makes it possible to prevent getting hit at point blank(I will still keep my max rush mod, because speed is what you need the most) and with a maxed vitality mod even doing a mistake and getting hit once will not kill you(outside of enemy levels where the vitality mod becomes useless and doesn't make a difference), that is a huge different compared to the old Ember.
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Disclaimber: This is the opinon of somebody that did play ember during a time accelerant did not refresh the stun, in content where you got one hitted by everything and with a min/max minus duration build to stun more and pack enught dps to survive at close range. Overall, the new Ember is outright fantastic, the only anoying thing is that you can't pick up energy during WoF, what should be fixed since toggle adds nothing to it(nobody would hit it and then stop it after 2s, since you would simply use fireball in that case).
Just did a L35 infested survial with the ember changes, WoF now adds a speed buff, if you run allready a maxed rush mod, combined with the speed buff it makes Ember rediculus fast, able to actually dodge stuff at close range and super offensive with my boar prime. WoF duration went a bit down, from 8s to 7s, no big deal to me, just let me pick up energy when it runs.
As for people calling the armor buff useless, combined with the higher speed it gives ember nearly the same surviability that Nova got, I did solo a room with like 30 infested in it without takeing more than 80% health damage at a time, that is for a Ember Prime player that is used to get one hitted like playing a rino with infinite iron skin. Fire blast is great to give you some room to manuver now, the line of sight restrictions are not that bad if it comes to self defence, a bit limited if it comes to block choke points or try to clear the field to revive somebody.
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The sobek is probably the best shotgun that I did level for mastery if you look at builds without catalyst and forma, it got a huge magazine, good burst dps and a ok spread(compared to the boar prime that hits litteraly the hole room if targets are over 20m away from you). I acutally just switched to the secondary weapon when the magazine was done and started reloading after the targets where down.
The syndicate mod would be worth it if it does increase base status chance instead of adding a flat number, because status is the thing that gives shotguns punch(base damage not so much if you compared it to high end rifles), a 80% status boar prime or akbronko prime will take down heavy units very quick with lots of corrosive, viral, poison and magnetic procs. Blast procs make them super effective to deal with groups of infested. Unfortunaly I can't test it since I sold my sobek, but since the mod for the supra got fixed there might be a good chance that the mod for the sobek gets fixed/is fixed as well.
As for the build, it looks ok. I for myself went away from the utility mods on my boar prime(no ammo mutation/clip size/reload speed/fire rate) in favour of more elemental damage mods to improve damage each shot what helps with the stopping power, how many targets you can take down per clip and status chance(you do need a ammo efficent secondary weapon for that playstyle and a maxed primed point blank with 165% is unfortunaly a must have, even on the best primary shotgun in the game).
Shotguns really need a review, the to long reload speed on most is just crippling and if you can't lay down more dps at close there is hardly any point outside the akbronko prime and boar prime that use status chance to nuke stuff in a couple of hits at a level where targets will take a full clip of a boltor prime. Really the thing that makes shotguns work is status chance, because it helps a ton against heavy units when it come to killspeed.
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+1 If the team could benifit from it, it would be a lot better compared to a ton of shield before the change and now not enught to make it worth it agianst high level units.
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It is more or less what most people wanted, a faster Ember with better CC that doesn't die in a single hit(that did happen so many times to me at 40+ charger levels during the time accelerant did not apply the stun again when the effect was already on the target). The higher armor will help to a certain point, preventing getting killed in a single hit up close, it does improve the gains of life strike hits, that you use to recover health similar to saryn.
Ember is by far the most squishy caster warframe(nova got more armor, speed and mprime helps a lot to avoid incoming damage), saryn and mag a lot more HP and armor and for mag even a ton of CC to lock down hole rooms and the ability to heal yourself with shield polarise. Fireball and world on fire make it more of a close range caster warframe(I normally run her with a rush mod and max burst dps shotguns to help with the survivability and dps), what does bring some issues with it, given the limited survivability. While I don't mind playing high dps glass cannon(one of my favoured play style in games) at a certain point of difficulty and with warframes random spawning, where a charger can spawn directly behind you and instantly kills you, it is not hard to see why so many people have issues with it. I do agree that most frames that don't have to utilize her skills at close range, or got better CC or better HP/armor/survivability skills survive better in long defences or survival, compared to being in the same situation with a ember.
I don't think she compares this close to Oberon, Mag is far more similar to him in my opinion. The knock back with fire blast will help to make the frame a bit more versatile, since honestly ember was just dps and nothing else while the accelerant bug was present(since it vastly limited the CC effect to not being available when you really need it), what made the frame so limited in the long run, because once your skills didn't do that much damage to targets any more you got killed very easy and you couldn't contribute much to your team with the frame at this point.
As for Overheat, I didn't play the game back then, sure survivability by damage reduction is a great thing but I couldn't imagine doing any reasonable dps without accelerate and it's effect on weapons, fireball and world on fire. With the fixed accelerate stun and the upcoming knock back of fire blast plus the added armor I think you have enough tools to keep yourself and your team alive reasonable well.
The only thing that I still looking for is a bit of scalable damage for WoF, like 2-3% of the armor/shield HP of the target it hits on top of the static damage to help with the scaling and that it could prioritize closer targets, like the charger directly in front of you to also help a bit as defence against melee targets.
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The changes are all very nice and the fire blast buff sounds great to give you more control in a area full of infested.
I think 2 things still remain, the issue that you need to stack power efficiency, duration, strength and range all at once, a bit more range on WoF and accelerant or reduced energy cost for her ability's would help a lot to give you more choice when it comes to modding.
Another thing are the argument mods atm. The damage buff to your team should be delivered with fire blast, since it is AOE and much easier to apply to teammates constantly in that way. Fireball could be given additional knockdown/knockback on direct hit what would help players that use it a lot at close range for the added dps and the pocs.
As for WoF, the main problem is that the static damage becomes much less viable later on, a small percentage of the base shield/armor of the target(2-3%) as base damage + the static damage would help a lot with the scaling and remaining viable as damage source against higher level units.
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I hate to say it, but the truth is that she is useless, and can't stand the comparison with other frames ...
She might be usefull ... in the very beginning of the game. But then what ? If you can't use a frame against half the ennemies of the game once they are above lvl 30, i call that useless ... Try to solo a mission versus those grineer eviscerator. Even at lvl 30 they can one shot you ...
So yes, she is useless in her current state. Why would you use her ? Restore shield ? Trin does that 10 times better. Bullet deviation ? here is zephyr. Crush = 0 damage and awful cast time, better take rhino stomp, ennemies are stunned longer and the frame is way more tanky.
That is a very limited view on what you can do with mag. Mag is one of the best dps frames for void(the absolute best vs corpus), because while other people dps falls with higher enemy level, mag scales upwards with enemy levels. Also she got the best CC of any kind of nuke frame and the best surviability even without this mod as well(high shield, instant shield recharge, pull to stop incomming fire, crush to stunlock everything in even the biggest room in the void if you run overextended).
Mag/Oberon as healer/nuke frame hybrids are incredible good to solo nearly everything. As for the question of why you use her, you bring Mag for DPS and CC, the shield restore is also incredible useful to keep other people and yourself alive. While she is quite a bit more specialized then other frames as where she shines(different compared to the other nuke frames like nova, saryn and ember), she does shine a lot(she is not glass cannon, got scalable DPS, got incredible good CC and can heal herself and her team). Mag prime is my most used frame in the void, because she is not just a good dps frame but brings tons of utilty to the table that is extreme useful for your team.
As for the mod, the cap on mag should be higher, since when you really want that mod, a extra 1.2k shield will not make a big difference and mag got plenty of tank for the normal stuff so that makes the mod kind of useless with the 1.2k overshield cap.
IMO: At least allow mag to overshield every teammate...that way she would at least have a great utility and take away some work from Trinity.
This would be indeed actually a good enught tradeoff for the mod slot even at 1.2k overshield. Make it so!
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I agree that it is broken, when I solo or stay behind doing the last 5-10 waves till 20 in a defence solo in a random group you really feel the massive difference after the host migration. The worst thing are grenier snipers that headshot you with pinpoint accuracity over halve the map when you just be in sight for halve a second and a single hit is strong enught to remove 300 shield +100-200 HP on my Ember even while the enemy level is just 20-25 compared to the 150-200 shield damage you normaly take as client, what makes me believe they headshot every singel time in this scenario.
I have not noticed this problem that much when I host a tower mission, but that can also be just by haveing less enemys with hitscan weapons.
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That is a massive nerf to the shield transference mod. =/
It still costs a slot and 1.2k isn't all that much, since you kill most of the shields during the frist few seconds of a wave in defence and can't drain from that point on till the next wave, the cap should be higher for the mod. It is not like tanking low level content with Ironskin, it is only usefull for high tier survial/def because Mag got plenty of tank allready and if you need more, you need a lot more. Mag has allready probably the best surviabilty of all nuke frames with 1k+ shield, nearly instant recharge and plenty CC to handle a room full of stuff without breaking a sweat allready so the mod is only useful in situations where your 1k shield gets killed off so quick that you can't use shield polarise in time, at this point 1.2k extra shield is not that usefull and in my opinion not worth the slot. It should be considerable higher on mag. I do however love the changes to the shield restore, finaly a reason to use them. \o/
- Fixed an issue where enemies already affected by Ember's Accelerant Heat debuff would not become stunned when the ability is recast. Enemies will now be stunned and Heat debuff duration will be refreshed.
Big hug from me. That makes Ember so much more viable again and I can stop stacking negative duration to migrate the problem while mostly spamming fireball instead of WoF. \o/
Ember still needs tweaking(speed, HP and energy use/duration focus) but this is really the thing that did make me stop playing the frame on high tier stuff, because glass cannon without the ability to put CC up when you need it becomes RNG real quick instead of something you can adapt to with your gameplay(you can do everything right but you are still 2s on your accelerant and can't envade that charger that 1 hits you).
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As somebody that played Ember a lot and invested a lot of time to farm for NM and Curruped mods and forma on it as the first frame to mod and build properly to get into T4 def or survial I mostly agree with the OP. Compared to other nuke frame options(Mag, Saryn, Nova), when I look at the results on the DPS at the end(T4 40 waves or 40 minutes) or just my general gameplay, the results with ember are rather underwhelming. Like 23% vs 61% damage done in a 40 waves T4 def against a saryn, that is farily bad for a DPS frame(NM/Coruped mods on both and similar high dps weapons) and players with a lot of routine how to position and move around get as much dps as possible on the mobs that approach from different directions.
Ember would need even more speed then the 1.1, in general without a maxed rush mod you lose tons of effectivness and survialbility up close and the performance becomes fairly bad(because you can't bring world on fire where it needs to be quick enught before it runs out and you get major issues to dodge chargers at close without it). The only situation where I remove the rush mod is high level defence where you rarly leave the snow globe later on anyway. Even if that forces you to use energy restores a lot because you actually need the slot for duration, it is a small price to pay compared being squishy, slow and at close range. I don't really care so much about hp and armor if you would have CC you can work with, since later on CC will keep you alive, while a few HP more or less will not make a big difference.
The main problem in my eyes is that the CC of accelerant is not reliable at all since it only work when the targets are not under the effect of accelerant allready, as well as any other form of CC that is RNG based(hi fireball and fire blast), this is what kills you all the time once you go up in enemy level and my main reason why I don't bring the frame to longer survial/defence runs this days. It is plain and simple not playable if your survialbiltiy is based on CC that doesn't work properly and after 30 waves/minutes the non scaling dps of WoF doesn't bring a lot to the table anymore(while stacked at all time with Accelerant allready). Saryn, Mag and Nova are a lot better in this regard, because they are not as squishy(for mag and saryn with HP/heal mechanics, for nova because mprime helps a lot to not get overwhelmend and to avoid hits by chargers etc.) and have CC build into her ultimates what is way more useful than the damage in the long run.
WoF needs some amount of scalable damage on top of the static damage. The reason for this is that shield/armor scaling makes Ember fairly bad later on, while other frames have scalable damage(like mag with shield polarise or Saryn with procs) or utility that makes them useful later on(like the slow of mprime). Lets say 2% of the shield/armor, affected by mods that gives you about 3.85% after Transient Fortitude and Intensify.
One more thing to adress would be the problem that Ember has to stack duration, strength, energy efficency and range like no other warframe I am aware off, while you still need slots to compensate for basic problems(speed mostly). The reason for that is that you need duration for your WOF, else running it non stop will kill your energy pool. You need tons of efficency since you non stop stack 2 ablitys on top of each other, plus useing fireball vs groups. Overall compared to my other nuke frames(Mag and Nova) I feel 1-2 slots short on her when it comes to modding, simply because you need 7 of your 8 slots to make WoF work properly with a sufficent uptime(I use the last one for vitality).
I don't need a rush mod on Nova, because the frame is fast enught allready and doesn't have to be that close for mprime. While I use flow because it makes energy management easy and you got a spare slot for that I probably wouldn't even need fleeting expertise, since even if you use antimatter drop a lot it is nowhere close to the 200 energy(before mods) you burn with ember every 10 seconds -> WoF + at least 2 times accelrant is what you have to keep up at all time). I don't need rush one on my Mag, because with overextended(what you can't use on Ember because it kills your dps and you lack the slots to compensate) I got plenty of range, so being not that fast doesn't really matter. All this frames feel to offer some slots that you can use on utility, like flow or gear it to specific tasks with mods like overextendet, blind range, narrow minded or syndicate mods. Ember needs more duration/range on WoF or less energy use for WoF and accelerant to at least have 1 slot to play with in a reasonable build. Currently you need every single slot just to make WoF work, even if I just add the rush mod(that you honestly need to get the dps of WoF on the targets quick enught), it directly penalizing me with a lot less duration what results in more energy I have to burn in the same time and less dps by the haveing the 2.2s cast every 8s instead of 10s.
Currently I only use the frame to farm interception or defence for T1 or T2 keys or rushing invasions/allerts, not because I couldn't do it just as quick in my nova or mag, but because the frame is actually a lot of fun to play with and I love to take it for a spin but most of the time I can't really justify it because other frames bring a lot more to the table for difficult content. That is very sad in my opinion.
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Try Helene Saturn, you get 1-2 if you do 20 waves and it is doable with a nova or a ember in like 10 minutes solo, more like 6-7 in a Mag max range build what clears the hole wave with 3x crush each wave till wave 15(you need 6 after that till 25).
Can We Have Lex Prime Buff Maybe? :)
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It allready works better in a crit build than in a raw damage build, but a bit more critical chance and crit multipier would make it really stand out as crit pistol.
Another thing would be the reload speed, what only makes the gun viable against lots of targets with a reload speed mod. 1.7s with maxed stunning speed just feels ok to me and would be a very good base value for it(I would probably still put a reload speed mod on it, but it would be much more reasonable without one). A similar thing is true for my akbronko prime, that fires a lot faster and is only viable with icestorm(giving it 8 bullets instead of 6) and stunning speed(reducing the reload time down to 1.7s), even with this two mods you still spend more time watching it reloading then actually shooting it.