Ash Fix, Very Much Needed, Very Much Neglected.

[Sarge111]

Ash is in my opinion, a very great frame. But it's abilities need some work. Shuriken is pretty good, but it fails at accuracy without plenty of practice. Also, Blade storm Glitches on me every time I try to use it, so even if the concept is good, the power is of little use to me. Teleport downright stinks, because when trying to use it outside of stealth, the enemy turns and stock strikes me right in the face before I do any damage to him. I don't think the enemy should know when you teleport behind him. This is just my 2 cents, please leave comments below.

[ShadowTheBeater]

Ash's teleport would be nice without the flip but with a stun that way you could charge a melee attack before you get to him

[Aure7]

ash shuriken seeks for targets, you just can't miss it.

[Sass_Queen_Neo]

I think Ash's teleport needs to put you behind the target, and not do the flip, cause really all that does right now is not let you do anything as you get shot at.

[CheeseHasLeafs]

I've found that doing the air kick (sprint - jump + slide) and teleporting sometimes allows me to kick my target when I teleport to them. That is, do the air kick and teleport while in the midst of the kick.

 

And, no, please don't jump on me and say something 'that's not an official method, still needs to be fixed, still useless, air kicking is not possible in every situation, doesn't work all the time'. This is just if you're frustrated right now and would like to try something. 

[NightSniper]

ash shuriken seeks for targets, you just can't miss it.

Oh, yes you can my friend. Even though it seeks targets, it doesn't always hit.

[Flackenstien]

His stats are good, his Shuriken are good, Smoke Screen is good, and Bladestorm is good.

Teleport needs to be a bit more user-friendly, but it's potentially good.

What's the deal with people and Ash? (Not directed at this thread.)
His ulti doesn't hit whole crowds at once, so what? Go play Saryn/Nova..

Ash is a stealthy, high damage, and mobile frame that is great in solo, and has alot of flair in co-op.

Some fixes he could use are:

● Stun enemies that Ash teleports to, and make it easier to teleport to agile teammates. (Also allow Loki/Ash to swap/tele to explosive barrels.)
● Possibly add a stagger effect to Bladestorm to make it more desirable in team play.

[SanityRobot]

Ash is in my opinion, a very great frame. But it's abilities need some work.

 

How can it be a great frame if what makes the frame isn't good?

[Raitter]

Ash was built officially as a "Stealth" Warframe.

His Teleport is most used to pop up behind a Target and be able to "If you can pull it off." walk away completely undetected. Whilst either you can switch up to a devastating attack from behind. Be it a Execeute, Charge or whichever you prefer. Ash's Teleport was never used as a Aggressive Method, but as a Tactical Ability that leads to many new combinations in various situations you get into.

Shuriken is as it is lovely better lately. Its a Missile. Once a Target is aquired and aimed on, press 1 for win. It ignores Shields, so far. But a constant Heal, can deflect a possible Kill. POSSIBLE. Not entirely, depending the Heal Frequency, when its supposed to kill. It depends sometimes. Considering its mostly a good Anti-Heavy Ability. Good to take down dangerous targets fast.

Smoke Screen just for part makes you invisible and puts enemies in a state of confusion and afflicted by the smoke. Specific Enemies are immune to the effect, but not the Invisible, so far i've seen.

Bladestorm is lovely. It makes me giggle in glee of spree and murder. A true Massively exciting Cinematic Killspree. Where i can just pick up a Soda/Cola and sip some, while Ash shows me his urge to screw "Stealth" to "Let The Bodies Hit The Floor" translation.



Originally. I'm open for any improvements and changes to Warframes, Abilities and as please anything. But i find Ash's Bladestorm very much pleasing and finished in my eyes and opinion. But if more Animations and amazing stuff he does in Bladestorm Ability. Sure as sod to do so, i dare say.

Of any Stealth Based and deadly Warframes of Assassin Style. I see Ash as the most exciting of them all. But who knows? Maybe there will be a Warframe that rivals or comes up alike, but different?

As far as you say about Ash. I don't see him needing Fixes or so. Neglected, some says? Hmm...not really. Unless someone likes to play a Assassin Warframe, basically. Most often now, i see a lot of Novas, Nekros and such. That might be your cue of fewer plays him.

Note: Everyone as their own opinions and views about Ash and his current state and past state. To future state. As of currently, if any finds Errors, Bugs and issues with Ash. Screenie and send a message to them.

I've talked and rambled a lot now. Forgive me.

Edited September 20, 2013 by Raitter

[Sarge111]

His stats are good, his Shuriken are good, Smoke Screen is good, and Bladestorm is good.

Yes, Bladestorm is a great ability, but in effect I find it occasionally not hitting targets that are marked for an attack, and pausing between attacks, which allows him to be killed before the ability ends. 

[KiritoKun25]

Yes, Bladestorm is a great ability, but in effect I find it occasionally not hitting targets that are marked for an attack, and pausing between attacks, which allows him to be killed before the ability ends. 

same, i noticed i dont hit all targets marked for some reason, also if one target its stuck somewhere against a wall or door the skill doesnt even comes off, he teleports and comes back to his place.

[Raitter]

Never happened to me. Yet...

Its possibly that Bladestorm might be too far away from a Range, or you so barely miss the Target you aim at individually. So Ash starts attacking anyone else you didn't Target, still doing the Ability even so. Thats still lovely.

Kinda like how i imagine Ash being "Eh...ninja nugget this, i'm just gonna let out my rage anyninjas.". This might be a better idea to let Bladestorm initiate only if one or more Target is nearby, without having to aim at them to do so. I think i just blew my own mind...

[Kobalt]

I think Shuriken is trash.

I have been playing from the way back though, before the ability homed. It took a lot of practice, but landing headshot shuriken was one of the most gratifying things you could do in the game. I knew I hated the skill when I was facing infested enemies with it for the first time after the change. Disruptor running towards me with two chargers in it's wake, I sighted the ancient's head and cast...It killed the two chargers adjacent to it. The lack of control is angering to me, especially when it misses shots that I wouldn't have had I been allowed to aim. Next to Volt, Ember and Trinity I feel that Ash easily has the worst 1 in the game. Remember that it unlike other is also always limited to two targets and lacks utility. I wish they could find a way to give me back some kind of control with it.

Teleport is bad. It is even bad as a stealth tool unless you are running a shade. It is far easier to just walk on by than risk the down time on your landing if you don't want to be seen. It like all other direct target abilities is also not fun to aim in a high paced situation. Would be great if they made the skill target the closest target in a very narrow cone [say 15-20 degrees]. In a stealth situation you'd still have time to be precises and the skill would be usable in non-stealthed combat [also would get rid of the problem with range exceeding targeting functionality]. Would be nice if they sped up or got rid of the flip, I enjoy the flourish/style so I personally would prefer sped up. I really wish they would reward stealth throughout his kit, this skill is a great opportunity for that. Could give him a short buff on stealth kill damage to help him scale.

Bladestorm mainly suffers functionally, the skill has been bugged for the majority of it's existence. More over it doesn't play well with others. Does it need to be instant damage, no...But it need to take into account that almost everything else does. In group play anytime you want to cast it someone else wants to cast theirs. Usually making your cast wasteful as many of your targets will die before you ever reach them, even among considerate players. The problem with Bladestorm is that in a group it is not efficient. I dunno why it hasn't worked this way before now, but why doesn't Bladestorm seek out more targets when you don't execute them [iE: you only end up attacking/killing 7 people out of a possible 13]? One of the most painful things is seeing yourself waste 100 energy to kill 2 things in a room filled with 50 guys cause the marked targets went down. Why doesn't it evaluate marked targets every time you kill one. Also, why can't it refund you energy for any targets that someone else kills? Something like, (cost of bladestorm / number of possible targets) / 2. That way it's never good to spend bladestorm on a low number of targets, but it isn't as painful when you are denied your marked enemies. Lastly, I do not get why power duration effects do not increase the number of targets.

[Yefrign]

ash shuriken seeks for targets, you just can't miss it.

 

you'd think so but it IS actually possible, specially if you aren't hosting. 

[Raitter]

Kobalt.

Abilities aren't "Fully Homing" of such as "Homing" as it is. Shuriken requires timing, precision and patience. Especially in a very cramped and heavy situation, so with space in your area. Missing the shot, still hits a target. More often then not.

There's restrictions to what kind of Mods affects specific Abilities. The game isn't meant for you to make your Powers have effect of every single Power Mods in the game. Read the Wiki to what affects what. And take consideration if you want or need it.

Shuriken is a beast, once you get the hang of it and get used to it. I can slice down a Ancient, Heavy or anything. In just a flicker of a second. And if THAT doesn't kill them. Screw all that has to do with Energy, if they are heavily damaged. An all-out Assault on them ends the quota of hits by the recent Shuriken to the heart.

Warframe is NOWHERE near Easy, once you get to the more Difficult places, waves and etc. From there on, it comes down to Skill. Practice a Warframe, Experiment around and Practice on Abilities to get the hang of Warframe Abilities. Once understanding after reading, through such as mastering and developing habits to it. Becomes such a usual routine, that it no longer pose a difficulty matter to you.

If thats too difficult for you. There's such things as Dueling Rooms in Clans. Have a Player fight against you and keep practicing yourself. Someday, you will see that a Shuriken can end a Boss in just a matter of few shots even. And thats a solid fact on my experimentation in Warframe.

[Kobalt]

Raitter.

The Shuriken skill much like several other skills use the Bullet Attractor effect dragging the projectiles to center mass. You can find the same effect on skills like Psychic Shards and Null Star. The small difference being that the others continue to track once the projectile is in motion, while Shuriken keeps it's trajectory the moment it is cast. Against fast moving targets at medium range this can result in a miss. While target selection and aim can be finessed, it requires far too much effort to do so. This is coming from someone who has owned Ash since when there were only five frames. I used to land headshot Shuriken consistently back when people thought it was too difficult to use well. I can honestly say that if they let me aim the main Shuriken myself that I would deal better damage consistently than the assist does now. Shuriken as it is now is situational at best! It can be argued that it is good against infested, especially so against charger type enemies as it drags to their heads for bonus triple damage. The angling required to land head shots consistently across enemy types is silly [iE: being above humanoid enemies]. This disregards the fact that landing both shurikens on a single high priority target that is not alone is fairly rare. I could just as easily grab Excalibur and land headshot jumpinging slash dash for the same damage across far more targets, during which I am practically invulnerable.

As a damage dealer his 1 slot ability is simply outclassed by the same slot of other damage dealers, even before you consider the utility they get that he doesn't. PERIOD.

I never at any point said that I found the game hard, because honestly with time it isn't. What I said that as a whole his kit is lacking and does not reward the kind of play it champions, stealth. Shuriken isn't that great a damage dealing tool, Teleport is more of a liability than a boon and Bladestorm is usually buggy/inefficient in groups. I bother posting because I like Ash, he was my second frame. After 640+ hours of play across every frame, save Volt and Nekros, I would really like to see him get some justice. I've been fighting for Ash since back when all of his skills made noise and alerted enemies...Outside of that, Shuriken, some flash and bug fixes he hasn't changed that much at all.

Edited September 20, 2013 by Kobalt

[TurboPorridge]

lol I have never had Bladstorm bug on me, I remember on the survival weekend there was so much energy lying around it was just a constant bladestorm.  

 

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lol.  no bugs, although I have seen it bug We had a floating ash once.  :( 

[milkor88]

.....

Shuriken is a beast, once you get the hang of it and get used to it. I can slice down a Ancient, Heavy or anything. In just a flicker of a second. And if THAT doesn't kill them. Screw all that has to do with Energy, if they are heavily damaged. An all-out Assault on them ends the quota of hits by the recent Shuriken to the heart.

.....

If thats too difficult for you. There's such things as Dueling Rooms in Clans. Have a Player fight against you and keep practicing yourself. Someday, you will see that a Shuriken can end a Boss in just a matter of few shots even. And thats a solid fact on my experimentation in Warframe.

Umm yea i like your way of thinking. As a PVE game, we should practice with a P not an E, lol.

 

Anyway ash is no easy. I really mean it.

 

Myself, is a loki and ash player, i have never used the skill glory of nova vauban etc.

[Ganpot]

Every single one of Ash's skills needs fine-tuning.  They are all good in theory, but not in practice. 

 

Shuriken - Like other people have mentioned, the auto-aiming misses quite a bit.  It would be far better if players were just allowed to aim the thing themselves.  Get rid of the second shuriken, give the remaining one a straight and predictable trajectory, and have it deal 500 armor piercing damage and pass through enemies until it hits a solid object (ie, a wall, floor, or ceiling). 

 

Smoke Screen - This ability used to be perfect, but Update 10 changed it to not make Ash immune to damage (previously Ash and Loki were immune to damage but not knock-down effects).  Now the ability is extremely unpredictable due to enemy AI.  Due to the short duration of the ability and the 1 second stun it provides, players are encouraged to use this while in the middle of a group of enemies.  However, doing this on a higher level mission is a very good way to get killed, since enemies don't always stop firing in your general direction after you cloak.  Even if enemies do ignore you, melee combat while cloaked has become far more risky due to the likelihood of enemies shooting at something else and hitting you instead (since you will be right in front of them in order to melee them).  In short, the invulnerability needs to be returned. 

 

Teleport - Again, as others have stated, this should, at the very least, not have the 1 second self-stun from the flip.  It would be far better if it stunned an enemy target for 1-2 seconds.  It could also take a page from Nova's book, and simply allow players to teleport to wherever they pleased.  Lastly, it would be nice if it scaled with Stretch past the 50 meter mark. 

 

Bladestorm - The damage itself if great, so why are people complaining about the ability?  Two reasons: it takes forever to kill a sizable group of mobs, which means that someone else will probably kill them all before you do (or if you are soloing a defense / mobile defense mission, the mobs will just kill the object before you kill all of them).  Secondly, the ability has a cap of 13 targets.  Personally, the target cap is fair considering that the ultimate deals more damage per mob than most ultimates.  However, Bladestorm needs to deal its full damage either instantly or close to it.  It would be best if every selected target was killed at the same time (just recolor all of the extra copies of Ash to grey and call them ash clones).  The camera can just focus on the primary target, and play the animation as usual.