Warframe: Very Close To Pure P2W

[Scyfle]

So Valandras and other people are still whining about how Pay2Win this game is.

In the f2p market, this is among the least p2w.

Of course you'll disagree, you'll think that I'm just like one of those pathetic WarZ idiots that actually bought that game.

Get it together, play the game right, you don't need to pay a cent, especially if you have played games for years.

[Qeveren]

So Valandras and other people are still whining about how Pay2Win this game is.

In the f2p market, this is among the least p2w.

Of course you'll disagree, you'll think that I'm just like one of those pathetic WarZ idiots that actually bought that game.

Get it together, play the game right, you don't need to pay a cent, especially if you have played games for years.

I'm not entirely sure comparing Warframe to something that was an obvious scam from the beginning is a strong argument. ;)

[Scyfle]

That's what he compared us to, our forums to their forums.

[AngryNarwhal]

its really more "pay to not have to put up with the games bullcrap" like buying a warframe instead of screwing around for weeks upon weeks trying in vain to get a couple blueprints to drop from a borring jerk. so its pay or get borred and play something else, which is also terible.

[Barbzilla]

Sorry if you're frustrated but I can't see how we can make everyone 100% happy without giving away everything for free and going out of business. :(

We have been vigilant in always providing a way for items acquired through platinum having a blueprint or credit equivalent.

Hey Steve,

While I don't agree with his concept of the game being P2W, I do agree that the pricing is a bit off. If you guys look into the more successful P2P games, you will find that the average price range for items runs in the 5-10 dollar range. This is because of average disposable income levels. If you combine that with platinum purchase levels that start at $20 you will increase your sales by a fair percentage (perhaps even exponentially once the game releases). Let me explain why. The average person has a limited disposable income. These are the things you would normally use to buy an energy drink, coffee, cigarettes, snacks, ect. Most people keep that limit around 20USD a day (not sure in other countries, and the USD is going down, so you may see that change soon) for their budget (those without budgets will be your whales). When a person spends their disposable income they usually evaluate what they got for their money subconsiously to estimate the value they recieved per dollar. If they feel they got a good value for their dollar then they are more likely to store that as a safe transaction (in their mind).

Safe transaction status means that a person is more likely to impulse purchase said item. By having players purchase at least 20 dollars at a time in platinum you ensure that they will have multiple purchases (if you follow my pricing suggestions) or one big bundle purchase. They will have enough items to experience more of the game without feeling that they are making irresponsible purchases, but little enough that they still want more. Making them more likely to impulse buy more plat once the excitement of the new items has worn off.

Short example:

Tim is an average joe, he makes 34,000USD a year and has a 401k. He has a wife that ensures that he budgets himself well and as such is careful with his purchases. Tim has just found a new game to play. It is this amazing little number called Warframe. Warframe is a Free to Play game (meaning you can download and play the game without paying any fees or purchasing any software) that has space ninjas. Tim likes space and he likes ninjas, so naturally Tim loves this game. However Tim works 40-60 hours a week and doesn't have as much time as his online friends to play the game, so Tim elects to buy some new equipment rather than farm (repeating tasks with the goal of obtaining specific items or currency in a game) for them.

The game gives him the option of paying $20, $40, $60, $80, or $100 for a relevent amount of Platinum (in this scenario an in game currency for the game Warframe). Since Tim is new to the game and unsure how much value he will be getting for his realy money (also fearing the wrath of the nemisis of fun, his Wife, for overspending), Tim elects to purchase $20 worth of Platinum. Tim then returns to the game and goes to the in game store. He uses his $20 and obtains a new Frame (advanced armor that posseses traits that allow him to increase his power and use special abilities), a Catalyst for his Frame (an object that expands on his power), a new side arm, a new primary weapon, and an item to buff one of the weapons he purchased after figuring out which he likes better.

Tim is now really excited, he basically has a whole new set of equipment that will allow him to enjoy the game in a brand new way. He knows that the excitement will eventually wear off as he plays, but after looking at the store Tim now knows that he will be able to change it all up many more times, and all without incuring the wrath of the "Wife".

Granted this was all hypothetical and fictional, it is very true. The most successful F2P games make the majority of their income off of small purchasses that entice players to impulse buy. When a player knows that they are likely going to spend $20 (the average amount of splurge money a person sets aside for themselves a day) just to get one item, they are less likely to want to repeat the process.

Another major issue I have seen is, with how expensive things are, people might buy a warframe only to realise they like it less than the previous one. Now they have spent $20 and they assign a very low value on that purchase. This person will be unlikely to make another purchase, at least not soon. This is a lost sale. I mean sure you got his money (theoritically the amount of money this game would have sold for), but you have lost the potential for repeat income from him. You need some form of trial system. I would suggest somethink akin to League of Legends weekly free heroes. You allow one Warframe per week to be played as for free (provided they have a free slot to use it, so you can sell more slots, even to players who never intend to purchase a new frame). This gives the players a chance to try before they buy. If a customer likes that Warframe they will want to continue playing it after it has gone off of the free week. That gives the customers an option, they can either wait 9 weeks for the Frame to roll back around, or they can pony up the cash to purchase it. Trust me if the Frame only costs $5 - $10 and they like it, they will buy it rather than wait (unless they absolutely can't afford it, but then you haven't lost a sale either way). Same could be done for weapons, but I don't think that is neccessary. Though weapons need to be significantly less than they are now. Their is no reason for a pistol to cost more than some Warframes.

I would suggest that instead of changing the cost in Platinum for the items, you change the cost of Platinum itself. I would go somewhere around $20 for 500 platinum. That way you are only increasing it by 66%, and you will entice players to purchase larger chunks of Platinum leading to more market sales, as well as ensuring that the customer feels that they got a great value for said platinum.

You can take this advice or leave it, but I do encourage that you at least look into the validity of my claims. I am not just rambling on lightly about the increase in sales, I have seen the data that backs it up.

[Zeally]

Honestly disgusted in myself for reading though all six pages of this topic, but whatever.

Key point: Game is still in beta. Dev's have acknowledged discrepancies in the store and agree changes need to be made.

Aside from Barbzilla and a few others posts, the arguing in this topic kind of derails any possible good that it could have done becuase ego's or some sort of other social deficiency reign dominantly in the first several pages. Some of you need to chill, and or stop with the random accusations that have barely anything to do with the topic. How about instead, some constructive criticism like the one above my post, so something good can come of it, and people can be happy.

I also dont agree with the Founder bashing, though, there could be some bad eggs out there. It happens, get over it. But dont lump all of us in with them. I chose to pay for the Founder package because I was impressed at how polished the game was, and becuase I was, and still am having loads of fun with how little there actually is to the game right now.

On that note, I'd like to end with: I do think that the in-game store does need some work, but I believe DE will come through and change it enough to allow them to profit, while also making thier consumers confident that thier purchase was worth thier money.

[Barbzilla]

Honestly disgusted in myself for reading though all six pages of this topic, but whatever.

Key point: Game is still in beta. Dev's have acknowledged discrepancies in the store and agree changes need to be made.

Aside from Barbzilla and a few others posts, the arguing in this topic kind of derails any possible good that it could have done becuase ego's or some sort of other social deficiency reign dominantly in the first several pages. Some of you need to chill, and or stop with the random accusations that have barely anything to do with the topic. How about instead, some constructive criticism like the one above my post, so something good can come of it, and people can be happy.

I also dont agree with the Founder bashing, though, there could be some bad eggs out there. It happens, get over it. But dont lump all of us in with them. I chose to pay for the Founder package because I was impressed at how polished the game was, and becuase I was, and still am having loads of fun with how little there actually is to the game right now.

On that note, I'd like to end with: I do think that the in-game store does need some work, but I believe DE will come through and change it enough to allow them to profit, while also making thier consumers confident that thier purchase was worth thier money.

Agreed with everything in the post. The game is in beta, and we are here to test it to help them change it for the better (or I guess tweak would be a better word). So rather than argue we need more constructive posting, I'm doing another beta that I can not name at the moment, but their forums mods will lock a topic that degrades into name calling and arguing (with possible suspensions and loss of beta privilages for those who are extremely aggressive or offensive in their posting), I won't say that it doesn't have its issues, but at least we get constructive arguments that lead to positive changes.

As for founder bashing, I really don't get it. If I wasn't so restrictive on my game spending, I probably would have tossed down on one myself. I did go ahead and purchase some Plat though to show my support. I haven't really had any issues with the other founders, with the possible exception that they seem to be resistant to change (the majority, not all). I can understand being afraid the game will change for the worse (in their viewpoint), but the way they go about it is the cause of the odious nature of the responses. I won't get into the possible reasoning, but I am sure they all have the individual reasons.

I would like to add to the not bashing founders concept, and lets just not bash on anyone. Lets all be respectful of one another. I am not saying we need to sit in a circle singing kumbaya, sipping herbal tea, and dropping acid, but try to not be so argumentitive when you disagree. Something as simple as just saying "I disagree, let me show you why" would go leaps and bounds to creating a more constructive community. Who knows, that person you are arguing with might be the person who could save your butt further down the line, heck if you are charismatic enough you might sway them to your side of the argument. It just takes RESPECT.

[Zeally]

I would like to add to the not bashing founders concept, and lets just not bash on anyone. Lets all be respectful of one another. I am not saying we need to sit in a circle singing kumbaya, sipping herbal tea, and dropping acid, but try to not be so argumentitive when you disagree. Something as simple as just saying "I disagree, let me show you why" would go leaps and bounds to creating a more constructive community. Who knows, that person you are arguing with might be the person who could save your butt further down the line, heck if you are charismatic enough you might sway them to your side of the argument. It just takes RESPECT.

Ah good catch, I meant to post something of the like in my post, but forgot to. I agree and hold the same stance.

[PsychShaman]

I could see Mastery playing a part in unlocking new slots; a single weapon and warframe slot each rank up. Its few and far between but it opens the player to the next tier of progression and if they need a slot sooner they can still just as easily buy it. P2Convenience at its finest.

Read the whole thread, and I think this is the best post. This would give non-paying players more motivation to rank up, and would help end the slots argument.

Also, I really like that I can purchase extra revives with platinum. Apparently I'm a n00b cause I do buy them a lot. I could play it safe, but I solo and I'd rather charge into mobs with a sword. I don't mind paying 20 cents a revive to refill them either.

IMO, here's how to fix the F2P system:

1. Implement G3rman's idea above for fixing slots.

2. Leave revives alone.

3. Make it so new warframes are only purchasable through plats for 1-3 months.

4. The coloring picker system is overly generous. You could offer one-time-use dyes, and raise the price on an infinite color wheel system like we currently have.

5. Add actual avatars for warframes (like the new weapon skins), purchasable only via plats of course.

6. Finally, raise the plat:money ratio to 100 plats for $5.

[FateZero]

Read the whole thread, and I think this is the best post. This would give non-paying players more motivation to rank up, and would help end the slots argument.

Also, I really like that I can purchase extra revives with platinum. Apparently I'm a n00b cause I do buy them a lot. I could play it safe, but I solo and I'd rather charge into mobs with a sword. I don't mind paying 20 cents a revive to refill them either.

IMO, here's how to fix the F2P system:

1. Implement G3rman's idea above for fixing slots.

2. Leave revives alone.

3. Make it so new warframes are only purchasable through plats for 1-3 months.

4. The coloring picker system is overly generous. You could offer one-time-use dyes, and raise the price on an infinite color wheel system like we currently have.

5. Add actual avatars for warframes (like the new weapon skins), purchasable only via plats of course.

6. Finally, raise the plat:money ratio to 100 plats for $5.

1.) Okay, I agree.

2.) ^

3.) Whoa, that's making it worst for us F2P people, it'll be more P2W, since people who pay will have the newest frames, while we are stuck without them. How would that affect the blueprint drops from bosses? What will the boss drop then? If it drops the parts blueprints, but we can't buy the frame blueprint, that's going to &!$$ off a lot of people. Just NO.

4.) No, just no to one time dyes, unless it for credit...if not it'll be the dyes from Vindictus all over again. I say $5 for the colors is pretty good atm, seeing as there can be more and more palettes, and it is just colors...

5.) Agree, fits more into the F2P system, however not whole skins, I would like to know which frame is still which, maybe armor pieces.

6.) Can't say anything about that, don't have enough knowledge about the ratio, nor an objection or agreement.

Edited February 24, 2013 by FateZero

[Nokturnel]

Look you want something constructive?

There's currently no purely cosmetic features you sell besides colors.

Would be great to see new models/skins/designs for the Warframes, That don't add stats.

Sell cosmetic items, don't force people to buy Catalysts and Reactors, (you should be able to lvl all your weapons/frames up to max level without needing to buy something, that's just wrong.) That's just a huge turn off. Even though they're "available" in game it's pretty much pure luck, I mean how many people are above lvl 15 with frames and weapons but haven't been able to super charge them? That's messed up. It pretty much leads to players just saving what little catalysts and reactors they get for only the best Frame and best Weapons, which devalues the rest of the weapons and frames.

That's the main problem I'm sure people have with the pay-to-win, because you basically have to pay if you want to level your weapons and frames to lvl 30. Yea farming for Frames is obnoxious as well but if you know which frames you want you can set a goal to get those small amount of frames whether it be with cash or actual hard work.

You should definitely be adding items to the game that utilize the less needed ingredients as well. People shouldn't be sitting on Plastids, Nanospores, Polymore Bundles, Salvage, Ferrite and Circuits with nothing to do with them. Or change half the frames to requiring those.

Kinda messed up that only Rubedo and Alloys are needed for 90% of the recipes. Shouldn't force people to farm the exact same sectors. Make every single mission valuable in it's own way no matter what resource it gives you.

And for the love of god, no more recipes that require Alloy and Rubedo... there's too many.

My thoughts on P2W vs F2P are this.

A good model allows F2P players to get everything in game without too much hassle, it just takes time, but it's not extremely boring. It should be challenging, not boring. Players that pay on the other hand are given shortcuts to that content.

it works well because people with too much free time and no money can play the game and still have access to all the content, while people with 9-5 jobs can still get the content they want without having to play all the time.

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Edited February 24, 2013 by Nokturnel

[Klaptafeltje]

I just want to add something. If you buy a weapon or frame i find it fair that you dont need to buy a slot for it. So basicly when you buy a weapon you get a slot for free offcourse if you sell the weapon you lose your slot. So you still have your open slots and if you want more you can buy more but if you want a weapon or frame and buy it with real cash, you shouldn't be restricted by the slots.

I think if you implement this system people will buy weapons or frames faster.

[Mir.]

As for frames and weapons, I enjoy crafting them, running around and collecting materials, otherwise there's nothing else left in this game to do than to camp at Xini for mods.

What I can't stand is the minute amount of weapon slots, frame slots, catalysts and reactors. Sure they don't cost as much but they're much needed.

We all can't stay around the clock by the computer for alert missions. This actually kind of in a sense forces us to pay for reactors especially, unless you're that lucky enough to win it at daily logins or ? missions.

This may be an issue for the UI, but maybe most people are getting the impression that Warframe is P2W is because of all the Platinums icons everywhere on the market and arsenal, wanna revive more, get platinums, too impatient to wait for foundry, get platinums. The aesthetical value such as colors and skins are offered in platinums. Basically you see platinums everywhere, but do we actually need the above to do well? Only reactors/catalysts are needed and they're restricted by platinums (not so much on catalysts but definitely on reactors)

Say for example, Mag, everyone knows crush, it requires a reactor, I think it's safe to say that most of Mag's powers are restricted by a reactor.

and how do we get reactors, I barely see much ? missions with it now, and unless a player is that patient to log in everyday while his Mag sits at rank 30 with 15 unspent points and heaps of mod slots locked with no crush.

Other than that I actually feel that warframe is much more balanced than most other games. Say for another famous shooter F2P such as Combat Arms, anyone that has played for a day knows it's weighing heavily on money.

[neKroMancer]

Since no player knows about DE sale metric, assumption about what DE should sell may or may not be correct.

Pure cosmetic items in Warframe are obviously going to be color pallete and weapon skins. Are we sure that's enough to keep DE going for years to come? Comparing DE, an independent develper, with a juggernaut like Valve isn't a good since they have vast difference in term of capital and market share.

However, main grievance in multiple threads so far are focused on two things : Potatoes and Slots. Should F2Pers have better access to these features? If so, how accessible they should be?

With a lot more future updates ahead of us, it's a fact that slots argument will be surface on the forum due to the lack of said commodity compared to ever-increasing number of available frames and weapons. How many slots should f2per, which are the largest percentage of playerbase, have in such situation?

G3rman's solution has been proposed multiple times before by many forumers since the ranking system doesn't offer any benefit apart from unlocking some weapons. It's good solution. However, how many slots could be earned in this fashion? Problem arise when each rank requires substantial exp from multiple frames and weapons in order to progress. F2Pers will hit the ceiling with in a few ranks unless DE change how ranking works in the future.

Potatoes should be able to earned through gameplay with certainty? Probably.

Edited February 24, 2013 by neKroMancer

[Spiffmeister]

Aaaaaaand then the "micro"-transactions show up, and things nosedive rapidly.

They do have to make money some how...

I'm sure DE are constantly revising prices for stuff. I'm sure if they could afford to give people everything for free they would.

[Zyfe3rX]

The game is perfectly fine, the only bad side is that, warframes costing around 20$s, thats really insane. Everything is perfectly fine and you dont need platinum for anything other than Orokin catalyst/reactor !

What is need to be done is that, since is super hard to levelup, giving 1 warframe slot per level or giving 1 weapon slot per level would be fine

The only thing that keeps me in this game is the crafting system,and its beautiful when you can craft everything in this game, even if you have to grind for 3 days to get 3 blueprints !

Only things i have bought are Orokin catalyst(3)/reactor(2) and 1 slot for warframe and 2 slots for weapon, everything with me are crafted, i dont see any point in making a thread claiming"almost p2w", this thread is everyway is misleading and gives a FULL FREE TO PLAY game like warframe a bad face,

Hereby, i humbly request to closedown this thread / Delete it, since this thread has no valid points what so ever !!! (my opinion)

Edited February 24, 2013 by Zyfe3rX

[Cawkslapjones]

Since no player knows about DE sale metric, assumption about what DE should sell may or may not be correct.

Pure cosmetic items in Warframe are obviously going to be color pallete and weapon skins. Are we sure that's enough to keep DE going for years to come? Comparing DE, an independent develper, with a juggernaut like Valve isn't a good since they have vast difference in term of capital and market share.

However, main grievance in multiple threads so far are focused on two things : Potatoes and Slots. Should F2Pers have better access to these features? If so, how accessible they should be?

With a lot more future updates ahead of us, it's a fact that slots argument will be surface on the forum due to the lack of said commodity compared to ever-increasing number of available frames and weapons. How many slots should f2per, which are the largest percentage of playerbase, have in such situation?

G3rman's solution has been proposed multiple times before by many forumers since the ranking system doesn't offer any benefit apart from unlocking some weapons. It's good solution. However, how many slots could be earned in this fashion? Problem arise when each rank requires substantial exp from multiple frames and weapons in order to progress. F2Pers will hit the ceiling with in a few ranks unless DE change how ranking works in the future.

In a closed beta, no. There won't be enough of a player base to feed off of regularly. The Founders packs are working for the moment because it's a lot of money plunked down at once, but most of those players who have bought Master will never have a need to buy platinum again. The way this game will both survive and become successful is with a high population, same for all of this generation's F2P games. The competition between F2P's has become much more intense, as it's the model that more and more companies are adopting.

Keeping your players happy is extremely important for the game to keep a good word of mouth. People who are hardcore about MOBA's may say things like "LoL is for kids" but generally speaking, it's a game held in high regard. It got to where it is today because people loved to play it, and at no point were they held by the throat and asked for money. In a game that's purpose is to grind, there's no sense of progression when you have to sell of what you just finished grinding so that you can grind something from 0.

When this game goes into open beta/release, then there will be the possibility of getting by purely from cosmetic sales, people rushing build times, or straight up buying new weapons/frames. It's got a lot going for it, not only is it a fun game, but hot damn is it gorgeous to look at. At this time, I really feel tackling the slots issue is the last major hurdle in the game. The Alert system is still far from perfect, but it's at least better than it was, and you see Catalysts more than once a week. Aside from just adding more content (which will come with time) the slots are the only roadblock for it, IMO.

[Cawkslapjones]

The game is perfectly fine, the only bad side is that, warframes costing around 20$s, thats really insane. Everything is perfectly fine and you dont need platinum for anything other than Orokin catalyst/reactor !

What is need to be done is that, since is super hard to levelup, giving 1 warframe slot per level or giving 1 weapon slot per level would be fine

The only thing that keeps me in this game is the crafting system,and its beautiful when you can craft everything in this game, even if you have to grind for 3 days to get 3 blueprints !

Only things i have bought are Orokin catalyst(3)/reactor(2) and 1 slot for warframe and 2 slots for weapon, everything with me are crafted, i dont see any point in making a thread claiming"almost p2w", this thread is everyway is misleading and gives a FULL FREE TO PLAY game like warframe a bad face,

Hereby, i humbly request to closedown this thread / Delete it, since this thread has no valid points what so ever !!! (my opinion)

The very fact that it's gone on for over 6 pages means that it's a topic that people want to discuss. Deleting the thread would mean people will just have to make a new one that's similar. Additionally, I find it a horrible tactic to use, as it seems you're trying to "silence" people from saying something. If people want to talk about something, let them. Trying to shut them up doesn't solve whatever issue they are in conversation over, but it might start to frustrate them.

[Zyfe3rX]

See, most people goes to google and search something like " gamename - pay2win ", then it goes to a thread or post like this,

most readers read like 1-2 pages and this will give a bad impression about the game and most probably they wont play the game because its " Pay2Win"

[neKroMancer]

The very fact that it's gone on for over 6 pages means that it's a topic that people want to discuss. Deleting the thread would mean people will just have to make a new one that's similar. Additionally, I find it a horrible tactic to use, as it seems you're trying to "silence" people from saying something. If people want to talk about something, let them. Trying to shut them up doesn't solve whatever issue they are in conversation over, but it might start to frustrate them.

Agree, this is the point of feedback forum afterall.

This is the topic that has been posted in the forum multiple times and each time it's almost 10 pages long. It's the biggest issue in the game atm and it's worth discussing.

[Cawkslapjones]

See, most people goes to google and search something like " gamename - pay2win ", then it goes to a thread or post like this,

most readers read like 1-2 pages and this will give a bad impression about the game and most probably they wont play the game because its " Pay2Win"

Why would anyone be searching for a P2Win game?

Most people I know who look for a new game try to find videos of the gameplay. I tell you right now with a game that looks this amazing, people will not be searching the forums for the technical aspects of it's pay methodology, but will be rushing to download it ASAP (assuming that they are into shooters in the first place.)

[Nokturnel]

See, most people goes to google and search something like " gamename - pay2win ", then it goes to a thread or post like this,

most readers read like 1-2 pages and this will give a bad impression about the game and most probably they wont play the game because its " Pay2Win"

They don't have to just read this topic to find that out, once they play the game and go "How the hell do I level my frame/weapon passed 15? Ohhh... I gotta buy something? GD stupid P2W /quit"

Yes this game is made by a somewhat indie dev, but first off an open beta is a way to show off your game, you dont' want to scare off customers before you even release it.. I'm going to call this game open beta because of the open beta weekend and how easy it is for people to get access. Make the game fun, don't force too much P2W and let people voluntarily pay for things to help support you. Not mandatory if you actually want to level up your frames passed lvl 15.

Noone likes P2W games, paying for reactors/catalysts is a P2W aspect, get rid of it and more players will enjoy your game, therefore increasing your fanbase. People loved LoL from the start because it wasn't P2W heavy at all, it then grew from word of mouth into being a hugely popular game. (Heroes didn't all cost 6300ip at the start, barely any did actually)

You can get greedy later if need be, but right now you should be pleasing your playerbase not &!$$ing them off.

As if getting rid of paying for reactors/catalyst will make this game that much less P2W. You can already buy pretty much everything with cash.

With the growing amount of P2W and F2P games coming out recently, pleasing your playerbase should be #1 priority.

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Edited February 24, 2013 by Nokturnel

[WolfySoul]

its really more "pay to not have to put up with the games bullcrap" like buying a warframe instead of screwing around for weeks upon weeks trying in vain to get a couple blueprints to drop from a borring jerk. so its pay or get borred and play something else, which is also terible.

Really, weeks? You need MAXIMUM 3 days to get all you need to craft full warframe, it's not that hard as you say. EVERYTHING now is craftable without paying at all... The only thing I spend plat for are reactors/catalysts, because I don't have much time to farm ? and wait for a random drop (even so, I already crafted 3 catalysts and I'm really thankful to DEs for raising drop rate of them). I play 3-4 hours a day in the weekends and not more than 1 hour a day after work. You should stop whining and go play the game if you want to progress.

Edited February 24, 2013 by nano5hell

[Valandras]

They don't have to just read this topic to find that out, once they play the game and go "How the hell do I level my frame/weapon passed 15? Ohhh... I gotta buy something? GD stupid P2W /quit"

Yes this game is made by a somewhat indie dev, but first off an open beta is a way to show off your game, you dont' want to scare off customers before you even release it.. I'm going to call this game open beta because of the open beta weekend and how easy it is for people to get access. Make the game fun, don't force too much P2W and let people voluntarily pay for things to help support you. Not mandatory if you actually want to level up your frames passed lvl 15.

Noone likes P2W games, paying for reactors/catalysts is a P2W aspect, get rid of it and more players will enjoy your game, therefore increasing your fanbase. People loved LoL from the start because it wasn't P2W heavy at all, it then grew from word of mouth into being a hugely popular game. (Heroes didn't all cost 6300ip at the start, barely any did actually)

You can get greedy later if need be, but right now you should be pleasing your playerbase not &!$$ing them off.

As if getting rid of paying for reactors/catalyst will make this game that much less P2W. You can already buy pretty much everything with cash.

With the growing amount of P2W and F2P games coming out recently, pleasing your playerbase should be #1 priority.

---------------------

This man speaks truth. The devs dont want a new player to look at the game and think;

"Good god, this platinum currency is expensive. And it will take forever to grind for this weapon I want, and then I'll STILL have to pay to level it all the way!"

They want them to think:

"You know, this platinum is quite reasonably priced, and this frame/weapon isnt very expensive. It saves me a bit of bother, so why not throw a little money into the game?"

[TheDudeMachine]

This game is NOT P2W. You can craft everything you need in just a dew days. I know some people have ran bosses 100 times just to get blueprints, but I have multiple blueprints for all warframes just by accident, when I was farming for materials and XP. It doesn't take long. Even the catalysts/reactors can be crafted, with patience and a little luck.

Let's suppose for a second that you had to pay for catalysts/reactors. Sure, it may suck to be stuck at half power on everthing, but it doesn't make you unable to compete. Excalibur's first ability is amazing. Ash's first ability gets maxed out in the base upgrade path. You can definitely compete. How is making you pay to upgrade any different from a lot of AAA title DLC? In Battlefield 3, there have been a lot of DLC, complete with new weapons and maps. Nobody is *@##$ing about BF3's DLC being P2W because there are many new weapons that are only available if you pay for them, and nobody is *@##$ing that you have to pay to see new environments and maps. I would bet if DE came out with new planets that you had to pay plat for to unlock, there would be outrage. The hypocrisy is ridiculous.

One thing I don't get is the mentality of "I have to be a founder to get plat? BS!!" I became a founder, not to get plat, or for any other reason, but because the game is fun. I said to myself, "You know what, I've played this game about 50 hours in 2 weeks, I'm having fun, and it's a very solid game for closed beta. These guys deserve my money." I hardly even use my plat. It's not necessary to play the game and progress.