Lights Judgement Was Supposed To Be Infinite Like Wisp’s.

[OneOmniverse]

 

So I went and rewatched the streams where they talked and showed Jade and I was disappointed when I went back and saw that Jade's first ability was no longer infinite like it was shown in the dev stream, I completely forgot it was.

Having a duration limitation rather than being truly infinite makes the ability feel clunky to use in gameplay, and on stream it looked so much better support wise.

From what I’ve seen since her release is that everyone just spams the ability constantly to maximize uptime, rather than using it strategically like an infinite ability allows.

So really you not only changed it from what it was which was obviously better ,but at the same time made it worse with a duration that wasn’t supposed to be at all and on top made the duration way to short.

People now have resorted  to heavily altering builds to compensate for time,range,strength just to have more survial and support, reverting it to the original version shown initially would be a better solution. That version captured Jade's supportive playstyle more effectively.

Right now, other frames like Wisp, Dante and Trinity provide stronger support capabilities becuase her kit was so dumbed down to what it was. I think she has the potential to play a valuable role as an effective support similar to those frames.

Reverting her first ability back to infinite and making her other abilites decent would help her potential like it was shown in the dev stream she was very capable but not now not so much 

She is an interesting frame and I hope she will be changed back to what she was before to get that fun and supportive play as her initial dev stream portrayal showed.

[ZiIIion]

I hate to rain on your parade, but I'm gonna have to ask you to rewatch Devstream 180 again because her ability was never meant to be infinite even in development. This time, I'm going to be providing you timestamps:

22:08 Pablo first demonstrates Jade's 1 by putting it down. Pay careful attention on the lower right corner where the abilities are displayed as you will see her 1 active with a single instance. Yes, the indicator on the upper part of the screen next to Jade's health shows it's infinite, but that's only because he's the area being affected by his 1, which is also how it works ingame. 

22:26 If you're still watching the lower right corner as I instructed, you'll actually see the single instance of Jade's 1 expire and the ability is no longer active. Here, we see with Pablo's build of Jade's 1, it lasts around 18 seconds. Now 18 seconds is longer than the 10 seconds her ingame ability lasts now at max rank. But this could be due to Pablo playing Jade with mods, since the health of his Jade is at 930, which is the value you would get if you mod her with Vitality. It wouldn't surprise me if he had Primed Continuity and Augur Message in his build, which would explain why his 1 lasted as long as it did.

I made a post about this before in another forum thread, but I'll reiterate it here - Jade's 1 not being infinite might have to do with the fact that it deals damage kind of like a turret of sorts. Therefore, theoretically having an infinite-duration damage-dealing ability and being able to put down 5 of them would allow Jade to lock down a location, like an objective, and just AFK. If you've been playing Warframe long enough, you will know the devs, including Pablo himself, don't like that kind of playstyle where the game plays for you. That's why they made Protea's Blaze Artillery and Vauban's Flechette Orb work the way it does ingame with a set duration (they also brought this topic up in Protea's Devstream). Yes, an argument be made that the 500 heat damage on Jade's 1 is negligent on higher levels, but people forget high level content isn't the only content the game offers- you still got to factor in the rest of the game like regular Starchart and the more shrewd Tenno in the playerbase looking to farm or do stuff while putting in the least amount of work to do so. Try to picture a pre-made squad doing a Jade 4-stack with all their configs built with power strength and ability range on their now infinite-duration 1's, you don't see the problem with that?

Now, let's get back to your post.

2 hours ago, OneOmniverse said:

From what I’ve seen since her release is that everyone just spams the ability constantly to maximize uptime, rather than using it strategically...

...on top made the duration way to short.

People now have resorted  to heavily altering builds to compensate for time,range,strength just to have more survial and support.

Right now, other frames like Wisp, Dante and Trinity provide stronger support capabilities becuase her kit was so dumbed down to what it was.

She is an interesting frame and I hope she will be changed back to what she was before to get that fun and supportive play as her initial dev stream portrayal showed.

I do agree that the duration of her 1 is trash. 10 seconds without considering duration mods is much too short for anyone to try to play around with her ability and only promotes spamming to maximize uptime, you're 100% on the money. No, the duration doesn't have to be infinite, but it could use a buff. If they want players to really make use of her 1, the duration at the bare minimum needs to be at least 25 seconds and in line with other duration-based abilities. And with how squishy Jade herself is, she really needs her 1 up at all times unless you're playing her with Shield Gating.

Indeed, you're also correct that people are heavily altering builds to compensate from subsuming her abilities or building around her 4 with Aviator, Aerodynamic, and Brief Respite just to make her playable. The tools and mechanics the game provides you with are suppose to help make an already good Warframe more fun and unique, not serve as a bandaid solution to fix frame problems.

Now with that said, I don't necessarily think Jade is any worst than that of the aforementioned frames you mentioned - let me explain. If you crunch the numbers and do the math, her percentage healing more or less can give the same amount of healing as Wisp, assuming your teammates are using health mods. The more health you or your teammates have, the stronger Jade's heals become. The only reason why Wisp, Dante, and Trinity seem stronger is that their healing abilities do more than just heal for the team. But, Jade can strip armor, give allies bonus ability strength, and boost weapon damage. We can talk about maybe tweaking the numbers up a little on those abilities to make it more in line on how it was originally shown on the devstream, but to say other frames can provide stronger support capabilities is a bit of a stretch when you objectively look at what Jade herself can do.

Yes, Devsteam Jade was stronger than current Jade in a lot of ways. I don't think anyone can deny that, especially when we look at how her 2, 3, and 4 was planned to work and what we instead got. Admittedly, it is a shame that she got pre-nerfed before launch, but it was probably done to avoid another Dante situation.

Edited June 21 by ZiIIion

[Shinoyami65]

1 hour ago, ZiIIion said:

I hate to rain on your parade, but replay Devstream 180 again because her ability was never meant to be infinite even in development. This time, I'm going to be providing you timestamps:

22:08 Pablo first demonstrates Jade's 1 by putting it down. Pay careful attention on the lower right corner where the abilities are displayed as you will see her 1 active with a single instance. Yes, the indicator on the upper part of the screen next to Jade's health shows it's infinite, but that's only because he's the area being affected by his 1, which is also how it works ingame. 

22:26 If you're still watching the lower right corner as I instructed, you'll actually see the single instance of Jade's 1 expire and the ability is no longer active. Here, we see with Pablo's build of Jade's 1, it lasts around 18 seconds. Now 18 seconds is longer than the 10 seconds her ingame ability lasts now at max rank. But this could be due to Pablo playing Jade with mods, since the health of his Jade is at 930, which is the value you would get if you mod her with Vitality. It wouldn't surprise me if he had Primed Continuity and Augur Message in his build, which would explain why his 1 lasted as long as it did.

Yeah, on rewatch Pablo never actually mentions the duration of Light's Judgement. He only states that the healing effect is similar to Wisp's motes in that it last indefinitely inside the zone and begins ticking down outside, but never said that the zone itself functions like Wisp. The wording does seem to have made a lot of people assume that the zone itself would act like motes, but that's not what was actually stated.  

The ability itself definitely needs a duration boost or even an infinite duration, but after this and the Dante fiasco I think people need to pay closer attention to the specific words DE uses in their streams because they're usually pretty cunning/sneaky about avoiding making promises in advance and there's been a trend of people assuming that an ability would function a certain way or that a frame wouldn't get nerfed when that wasn't actually what was said.