Warframe Power Scaling Needs To Change

[YagoXiten]

Too many frames have corrupted mods (and to some extent regular mods) that become just make them utter cheese or work in incredibly strange ways.

 

I mean, Narrow Minded on Trinity or Ash is pure win with pretty much no noticeable drawbacks. (Or Fleeting Expertise on EVERY Warframe--that thing is massive bullS#&$, if we're honest for a second.)

 

The way certain abilities benefit and others don't from certain mods completely breaks some frames. DE seems to be aware of this, because to prevent abuse certain abilities scale weirdly.

 

Like Vauban's Tesla and Oberon's Renewal...
.

 

The problem is that this is really counter-intuitive, a band-aid fix to the problem, and is honestly rarely much of a detriment. It doesn't matter if Vauban's Tesla does not zap as much if I can place FOUR for the price of one.

 

With the way that Oberon's heal works, you're better off with a slow HoT rather than a quicker heal because  either lets you heal just fine in between rooms and you end up overhealing AND wasting Energy most the time with your quick powerful heal. (Plus Fleeting Expertise lets you spam Reckoning which is a lot more efficient for regeneration and damage mitigation than Renewal.)

 

These kinds of things are honestly just silly.

 

[Kickboxing_Banana]

They should add cooldowns for some abilities, and Fleeting Expertises negative effect on power duration should make the cooldown last longer. Done, problem solved for one of the mods.

Edited December 28, 2013 by GalliumGD

[Makya]

Doesn't Fleeting also take a crap on most, if not all CC abilities which are must haves for later survival/endless defense?

[YagoXiten]

They should add cooldowns for some abilities, and Fleeting Expertises negative effect on power duration should make the cooldown last longer. Done, problem solved for one of the mods.

See, that's called a 'band-aid' fix. It doesn't address the actual cause of the issue--the way that Warframe abilities scale is broken--but it fixes the problem.

It's not a very good design tactic.

 

Doesn't Fleeting also take a crap on most, if not all CC abilities which are must haves for later survival/endless defense?

 

Nope. The way Fleeting Expertise scales is a 1:1 ratio.

 

You have to cast slightly more often but you get the same CC duration for the Energy cost, and it's pure win on any ability without a duration...Like most Warframe room-clears.

 

It's technically a 1: .95 or so ratio due to the half second or so spent in animation, but you can also counter act that REALLY easily by slapping on Continuity or Constitution.

[Makya]

If it is just a 1:1 Ratio you don't gain anything and have to consistently use the ability, making moot that you lowered the cost..

[YagoXiten]

If it is just a 1:1 Ratio you don't gain anything and have to consistently use the ability, making moot that you lowered the cost..

 

Except that Warframes have more than one ability, and many of them have abilities that are STRICTLY BUFFED BY THIS.

 

Volt: Loses nothing on his damaging powers.

 

Ash: Loses nothing on any of his powers.

 

Nova: Loses nothing on her Anti-Matter Drop or Molecular Prime.

 

 

And it doesn't matter on for example, Volt, that you have to cast Speed more often if you can spam Overload or Shock to just clear rooms and chain stun.

 

EDIT:

Death is the best form of CC, and being able to clear low level rooms for no cost and to constantly chain stun or kill higher level rooms with powers like Frost's Avalanche or Mag's Crush can completely break some frames.

 

Vauban loses some CC potential, but can put out so many Tesla grenades with 1 that he can easily solo 20 wave Defense missions with the right loadout.

Edited December 28, 2013 by YagoXiten

[Makya]

I said CC and I said at High wave, later survival of which damage from frames is mostly useless save fore a smaller pool.

 

It messes with Vaubon shrinking his abilities by more than half(the CC frame)

 

Valkyr can be utterly ruined by this late gate as her timing is dropped risking her being being useless only focusing on a few targets or worse, being killed quickly from not being able to finish off her target to save her from the damage back lash. Her buff is now also spammy and short lived.

 

All of Ember's abilities, save her 1, while now more spammy are crippled from this as they grow with duration

 

Trinity has to spend most of her time spamming her skills more than doing much else and even screws with her 1 2 combo if there is any lag.

 

While it is optimal for some frame, it is not for others.

[YagoXiten]

I said CC and I said at High wave, later survival of which damage from frames is mostly useless save fore a smaller pool.

 

It messes with Vaubon shrinking his abilities by more than half(the CC frame)

 

Valkyr can be utterly ruined by this late gate as her timing is dropped risking her being being useless only focusing on a few targets or worse, being killed quickly from not being able to finish off her target to save her from the damage back lash. Her buff is now also spammy and short lived.

 

All of Ember's abilities, save her 1, while now more spammy are crippled from this as they grow with duration

 

Trinity has to spend most of her time spamming her skills more than doing much else and even screws with her 1 2 combo if there is any lag.

 

While it is optimal for some frame, it is not for others.

 

It's always going to end up optimal on every frame. The duration penalty can easily be counter-acted with Narrow Minded and Continuity, if need be there's Overextended and/or Blind Rage.

 

By itself--yes. It has some frames it breaks and others that don't want it.

Fleeting Expertise combined with other corrupt mods will end up breaking EVERY frame.

Vauban doesn't care that he loses power range, because casting it more and having a smaller AoE means that he can target his CC better and avoid the target cap on Bastille.

Trinity doesn't care if she loses Power Range because her Blessing hits everything regardless.

Ash doesn't care about losing Power Range because it just makes his Bladestorm end quicker and be more focused.

Volt doesn't care at all that he loses duration because Electric Shield is mostly S#&$ and Speed is laughable later for offensive purposes.

 

Regardless, that is not the major point of this thread. Like I mentioned previously, Warframe abilities scale in non-intuitive and silly ways.

 

[VKhaun]

Being able to burst and use a power multiple times, or save energy and hold it should be the operator's choice. If you want to limit that, the limitation should create gameplay not lock you out of gameplay. Nyx/Rhino for example need to kill their targets before they can cast their AoE CC again (Power In Use) creating gameplay and a new trade off to consider for +/- duration on mods.

 

A timer reduces gameplay and adds nothing to a game with only four skills. Their purpose is to prevent people from just using only a few buttons in more complicated games, by forcing the player to fill time while waiting for timers and create attack chains. This brings nothing to warframe.

[YagoXiten]

Being able to burst and use a power multiple times, or save energy and hold it should be the operator's choice. If you want to limit that, the limitation should create gameplay not lock you out of gameplay. Nyx/Rhino for example need to kill their targets before they can cast their AoE CC again (Power In Use) creating gameplay and a new trade off to consider for +/- duration on mods.

 

A timer reduces gameplay and adds nothing to a game with only four skills. Their purpose is to prevent people from just using only a few buttons in more complicated games, by forcing the player to fill time while waiting for timers and create attack chains. This brings nothing to warframe.

 

I'm not sure on-what you're exactly commenting.