Luck Is The Only Way To Progress In Update 7.

[ZexSRB]

This is my first and possibly the last contribution to this forum. I've logged in yesterday after pause of about one week due to my system upgrade. My First impression about V7 was that it sucks. Cards, modding and too much luck dependency now in contrary of well planned and greatly executed UI with mods on previous versions. Nevertheless, I've tried to play and found myself trying to play cards instead of real time shooter. Guys, I am sorry but this version and new modding way suck.

Instead of playing with cards I am out until you fix this and make real 3D shooter.

Peace all!

Bye!

[Aggh]

Armor is useless on literally half the Warframes and only marginally useful on all but two others. That's a 'survivability alternative' in the same sense a water pistol is a 'weapons alternative' to a fully-automatic nuclear missile launcher. 'Shield recharge rate' mods are basically useless because they don't actually make you survivable on higher level areas, because one burst will put you right into health, and the Guardian precept is bugged and requires you to have a Sentinel.

Which can die. This insistence that if you aren't "bad at the game" you can simply use whatever mods you get and win at everything forever is condescending claptrap that has no actual relation to reality. Maybe you can. All hail Aggh, Master Tenno. Who the hell cares? You don't speak for everyone. You clearly don't speak for the average player. Your goalpost shifting between "IT'S TOTALLY EASY TO FIND VITALITY/DEFLECTION MODS, SEE, A TINY SELF-SELECTED MINORITY OF THE PLAYERBASE HAS FOUND THEM" and "IT'S TOTALLY EASY TO BEAT THE GAME WITHOUT ANY" is aggravating and has no point except to insult others.

Anyone that efficiently grinding the right missions has a health mod. It's the clueless people like the OP who QQ while still grinding tolstoj ( which doesn't have a guaranteed common mod) that don't have it. I've gotten 2 more vitality mods today grinding m prime for shield mods. They're not nearly as hard as you're making them out to get. Rushing m prime means a practically guaranteed common mod every 2 minutes. There are only so many common mods so it's inevitable that you'll eventually get a vitlality mod.

If you move around you'll rarely get your shields dropped. I don't know why you're trying to say that you get one bursted in higher levels, that's not true at all. You have plenty of time to take cover and regen.

Don't speak for me then. Why should the game be dumbed down for people that can't handle a tiny bit more difficulty? If the game is too easy people will get bored.

Guardian isn't bugged. It's a setinel mod. Of course it can only be used on sentinels. Did you even bother reading its description?

People just think HP and shield mods are necessary because they f***ing are. Hell, the shield mod nerf before at least let you keep 250 base shields and most people, besides masochists and people who solely play this game due to schadenfreude and their need to insult other players, were already extremely displeased with it. Then they actually rebalanced shield mods and the game was better for it. People were angry because they nerfed shield mods so bad that there was basically no point to ever using them since even level 30 shield mods were like... +30 shields.

Tell that to all the people in this thread that have all said they've been getting on fine without them :|

Edited March 23, 2013 by Aggh

[krisp]

Don't speak for me then. Why should the game be dumbed down for people that can't handle a tiny bit more difficulty? If the game is too easy people will get bored.

This isn't a matter of difficulty. It's a matter of consistency. It is NOT good game design for someone to get a shield mod in the first hour of play and someone else to not get any in 12 and counting (which actually happened btw).

Meaning some people will have a harder time than others through no fault of their own. Not because they're unskilled, not because they made a mistake. Because the game is inconsistent and difficulty is apparently a die roll now.

THIS IS NOT GOOD GAME DESIGN and you should feel ashamed of yourself for defending it.

[MJ12]

Anyone that efficiently grinding the right missions has a health mod. It's the clueless people like the OP who QQ while still grinding tolstoj ( which doesn't have a guaranteed common mod) that don't have it. I've gotten 2 more vitality mods today grinding m prime for shield mods. They're not nearly as hard as you're making them out to get. Rushing m prime means a practically guaranteed common mod every 2 minutes. There are only so many common mods so it's inevitable that you'll eventually get a vitlality mod.

Wrong WRONG WRONG WRONG. Learn basic probability. The chance of you getting a Vitality mod are independent per mission due to how random numbers work. Thus, there is no inevitability. If you have a 1/10th chance of getting a Vitality mod per mission, and you've done 99 missions before without one... you still only have a ten percent chance of getting one.

Anyways, thank you for conceding that they are pretty much necessary for enjoyable gameplay.

If you move around you'll rarely get your shields dropped. I don't know why you're trying to say that you get one bursted in higher levels, that's not true at all. You have plenty of time to take cover and regen.

That's funny, because it actually does happen. Or maybe that's from grenades, which still are really hard to see. Either way, it turns out there are plenty of things which will instant kill you from 100/100 shields/HP.

Don't speak for me then. Why should the game be dumbed down for people that can't handle a tiny bit more difficulty? If the game is too easy people will get bored.

"Dumbed down" = "Don't have to depend on the generosity of the RNG to give you the mods you need to play the game unless you're an UBER MASTER TENNO like Aggh"?

If you want the game to have difficulty levels so you can choose to play a harder game and maybe get buffs to mod drop rates and credits, ask for that. Don't screw other people by insisting that only people who agree with you should be able to enjoy the game.

Guardian isn't bugged. It's a setinel mod. Of course it can only be used on sentinels. Did you even bother reading its description?

Yes, and I noted that Sentinels can die (unpredictably and with no warning) and that it seems bugged because its activation is unreliable. Certainly there's no indication of what its cooldown is, if any. Maybe you should actually read my post?

Tell that to all the people in this thread that have all said they've been getting on fine without them :|

Yes, "getting on fine" by cheesing Infested missions and other game-breaking behavior which relies on AI exploits. Hmmm. Doesn't sound 'fine' to me if you can't play the game as intended and have to cheese it.

[Zeful]

I'm on a 20 down 5 up cable connection.

Not really relevant. After about 1mbps, the "excahge" rate of your connection is meaningless. I have at best 300kbps down and likely a third of that up, and I still can play internet games because they'll never need that much unless they are literally streaming all of the game to me for local processing every time I do something. At best you will not suffer lag or disconnection resulting from lost informaiton, as well as can support many devices using bandwidth without your experience suffering.

Lag is a result of the time it takes your machine to send a signal and recieve a response back, and there's not really all that much one can do about it without physically moving, as it's related to things outside of cosideration from about every contract an ISP provides. For example, my default ping is 180ms. It takes eightteen-hundredths of a second for any signal, after leaving my computer to reach the DNS server that connects me to the internet. The only way I'm getting a better connection is to connect to a closer DNS server (not happening, that one is the closest) or to connect to the DNS server using lower ping lines, which will be impossible for the next 5 or so years, because they are still working on running the lines in the city, so it won't be available without paying for the run myself.

[Aggh]

This isn't a matter of difficulty. It's a matter of consistency. It is NOT good game design for someone to get a shield mod in the first hour of play and someone else to not get any in 12 and counting (which actually happened btw).

Meaning some people will have a harder time than others through no fault of their own. Not because they're unskilled, not because they made a mistake. Because the game is inconsistent and difficulty is apparently a die roll now.

THIS IS NOT GOOD GAME DESIGN and you should feel ashamed of yourself for defending it.

Wrong WRONG WRONG WRONG. Learn basic probability. The chance of you getting a Vitality mod are independent per mission due to how random numbers work. Thus, there is no inevitability. If you have a 1/10th chance of getting a Vitality mod per mission, and you've done 99 missions before without one... you still only have a ten percent chance of getting one.

Ikr? It's not like I didn't go and grind m prime for a 45 minutes and get another one. There are only so many common mods. You actually will get one eventually. Since you have an incredibly lower chance of not getting a common mod, it means your over all success rate is going to better.

Anyways, thank you for conceding that they are pretty much necessary for enjoyable gameplay.

When did that happen?

That's funny, because it actually does happen. Or maybe that's from grenades, which still are really hard to see. Either way, it turns out there are plenty of things which will instant kill you from 100/100 shields/HP.

Only if you stand around and let it hit you :|

"Dumbed down" = "Don't have to depend on the generosity of the RNG to give you the mods you need to play the game unless you're an UBER MASTER TENNO like Aggh"?

If you want the game to have difficulty levels so you can choose to play a harder game and maybe get buffs to mod drop rates and credits, ask for that. Don't screw other people by insisting that only people who agree with you should be able to enjoy the game.

Or maybe the devs could just not cave in to whiny people who can't deal with a tiny difficulty increase?

Yes, and I noted that Sentinels can die (unpredictably and with no warning) and that it seems bugged because its activation is unreliable. Certainly there's no indication of what its cooldown is, if any. Maybe you should actually read my post?

I can count the number of times my sentinel has died on one hand :|

Yes, "getting on fine" by cheesing Infested missions and other game-breaking behavior which relies on AI exploits. Hmmm. Doesn't sound 'fine' to me if you can't play the game as intended and have to cheese it.

Yay for assumptions!

[AsteriskCGY]

No one likes to gamble for progress. See: Korean enchanting systems. Also: why most MMO's have a dungeon token system on top of loot drops.

Edited March 23, 2013 by AsteriskCGY

[MJ12]

Ikr? It's not like I didn't go and grind m prime for a 45 minutes and get another one. There are only so many common mods. You actually will get one eventually. Since you have an incredibly lower chance of not getting a common mod, it means your over all success rate is going to better.

A sample size of... one. The plural of anecdote is not 'data'. The singular of anecdote is even more worthless. "There are only so many common mods. You actually will get one eventually." This is blatantly wrong mathematically. Let me prove it.

Mods are independent of each other-if you have a mod, you will still get duplicates of it with about even probability. We can postulate this because the devs have not said that mods are biased towards ones you don't have. Because it is possible for a mod to not be a health or shield mod, your chance of getting a health mod is p, which is less than 1. Your chance of getting a shield mod is q, which is also less than 1. P + Q is also less than 1.

So your chances of not getting a health or shield mod from a mod drop is (1 - [p + q]), which is... greater than 0. Because (as postulated above), mod drops are independent and each can be treated as an individual event, your chance of not getting either a health or shield mod over n drops is (1 + [p + q])^n, which is greater than zero unless you take the limit of the function as n goes to infinity. Which is saying the same thing as "you're only guaranteed a mod of this form if you play the game literally forever." Not figuratively. Literally playing it for infinite time.

Please learn basic probability before actually trying to talk about it.

When did that happen?

Given that you're failing to address any other part of the argument without making up blatant lies ("it's easy to avoid being hit by hitscan projectiles from enemies with 0 reaction time") it might as well be a concession.

Only if you stand around and let it hit you :|

Yeah, tell me how to avoid hitscan attacks again when Grineer have 0 reaction time? Or the fact that grenades don't always land on your position and thus can instantly kill you anyways? Or the fact that you're still insisting that 'if you make one tiny mistake you die' is acceptable gameplay for anything but the Super Hard mode that Warframe doesn't have?

Or maybe the devs could just not cave in to whiny people who can't deal with a tiny difficulty increase?

What 'difficulty increase'? Oh, you mean the fact that you can no longer have weapons that fire 32 bullets per trigger pull, dropping your theoretical max DPS by 7/8th or more? I don't see anyone actually complaining about that. What I see is people talking about how the current design where progression is entirely luck-determined is completely and utterly broken and unfun, giving people no actual milestones to their progress which tell them when they're ready for a new world.

I can count the number of times my sentinel has died on one hand :|

So can I. Five times. Out of five missions. 100% of the time. Turns out... anecdotes are not data!

Yay for assumptions!

Either that or they're loading up on Rhino Skin/Invisibility and cheesing the levels that way. Turns out, if you die in three hits and you can't reliably avoid those hits you have to cheese the game.

[NoirProxy]

My love for this game died a few days ago and hasn't come back since. Whoevers idea it was to completely scrap a happily acceptable levelling system should be fired. A big problem is that the devs just implemented it without community input first. They all assumed and believed everyone would like it but this is what happens when devs get too confident and far ahead of themselves.

I mean it wasn't even a small step forward but instead a large leap in a different direction for the game. How reckless do you have to be? There is a lesson to be learned here. Listen to the community and not your creative ego in determining the success of your game.

There is a point to a BETA and that is to not keep redoing your entire game when the BETA testers have no problem with it. When something is a sucess, you build upon it and add to it. The game is weeks away from release and they go and mess with the entire balance of the game? Genius.

Edited March 23, 2013 by NoirProxy

[ttv_Typical_Tilly]

Of course he would say that, it doesn't change the fact that he's starting with a level 30 frame. If you're playing the right missions, you can easily at least get a vitality mod, armor mod, and a sentinel by the time you've leveled a war frame to level 30. You don't need luck for that.

And to top it off, those aren't even really necessary to get off the starting planets, which is problematic for his argument since it hinges on HP and shield mods being necessary to progress.

Your again speaking as others have about being forced to use 1 very careful slow playstyle to play the game in a game that encourages diversification of playstyle.

An easy solution would be to nerf the max health/shield mods down to 10-20% per level, and give frames a small shield/health gain with every level. There's a steady progression, and if you randomly find a good HP mod then all the power to you. It's just ridiculous that people have grinded for hours and hours and hours in 7 and haven't gotten a basic common mod that is the lynchpin of progress.

Or, hell. Give us a shield/health mod for beating Mercury, just for the first time, and then the other one for a later planet.

Most of us have stated and agree with this.

Anyone that efficiently grinding the right missions has a health mod. It's the clueless people like the OP who QQ while still grinding tolstoj ( which doesn't have a guaranteed common mod) that don't have it. I've gotten 2 more vitality mods today grinding m prime for shield mods. They're not nearly as hard as you're making them out to get. Rushing m prime means a practically guaranteed common mod every 2 minutes. There are only so many common mods so it's inevitable that you'll eventually get a vitlality mod.

If you move around you'll rarely get your shields dropped. I don't know why you're trying to say that you get one bursted in higher levels, that's not true at all. You have plenty of time to take cover and regen.

Don't speak for me then. Why should the game be dumbed down for people that can't handle a tiny bit more difficulty? If the game is too easy people will get bored.

Guardian isn't bugged. It's a setinel mod. Of course it can only be used on sentinels. Did you even bother reading its description?

Tell that to all the people in this thread that have all said they've been getting on fine without them :|

You shouldn't have to grind certain missions to find certain things. You should be able to do each mission on each planet 1, maybe 2 times to progress to the end planets. It seems dumb to say "oh well your doing the wrong mission to get that mod or this rarity." It is not dumbing down the game its putting it back to how its supposed to be. Furthermore iof the game were put to a basic stat increase, would dev fanboys leave the game? NO, but is over half the community about to if they already haven't? YES

This isn't a matter of difficulty. It's a matter of consistency. It is NOT good game design for someone to get a shield mod in the first hour of play and someone else to not get any in 12 and counting (which actually happened btw).

Meaning some people will have a harder time than others through no fault of their own. Not because they're unskilled, not because they made a mistake. Because the game is inconsistent and difficulty is apparently a die roll now.

THIS IS NOT GOOD GAME DESIGN and you should feel ashamed of yourself for defending it.

Exactly, I don't understand why anyone is defending it. If I wanted a game based on chance I'll go play casino and gambling games. I wanted a co-op shooter.

[krisp]

Ikr? It's not like I didn't go and grind m prime for a 45 minutes and get another one. There are only so many common mods. You actually will get one eventually. Since you have an incredibly lower chance of not getting a common mod, it means your over all success rate is going to better.

M Prime doesn't have a guarranteed common mod, stop talking out of your &#!. We did about 3 runs today, one of the special rewards was an uncommon mod, the other was a large health restore.

And you still don't understand what consistency means.

[Aggh]

A sample size of... one. The plural of anecdote is not 'data'. The singular of anecdote is even more worthless. "There are only so many common mods. You actually will get one eventually." This is blatantly wrong mathematically. Let me prove it.

Mods are independent of each other-if you have a mod, you will still get duplicates of it with about even probability. We can postulate this because the devs have not said that mods are biased towards ones you don't have. Because it is possible for a mod to not be a health or shield mod, your chance of getting a health mod is p, which is less than 1. Your chance of getting a shield mod is q, which is also less than 1. P + Q is also less than 1.

So your chances of not getting a health or shield mod from a mod drop is (1 - [p + q]), which is... greater than 0. Because (as postulated above), mod drops are independent and each can be treated as an individual event, your chance of not getting either a health or shield mod over n drops is (1 + [p + q])^n, which is greater than zero unless you take the limit of the function as n goes to infinity. Which is saying the same thing as "you're only guaranteed a mod of this form if you play the game literally forever." Not figuratively. Literally playing it for infinite time.

Please learn basic probability before actually trying to talk about it.

What do you not get that this mod isn't from a drop? Raid missions give you a mod/health restore every time even if you don't pick one up at all during the whole mission. And on m prime that reward is almost always a common drop. This means that you always have a shot at getting a common mod, which means you always have a shot at getting a vitality or shield mod. On top of that it can be rushed very easily without any worries so you can finish it quickly over and over.

Btw, I started grinding m prime for another half hour and got another vitality mod. And if I did it again, I'm pretty sure I could get one within that amount of time.

Given that you're failing to address any other part of the argument without making up blatant lies ("it's easy to avoid being hit by hitscan projectiles from enemies with 0 reaction time") it might as well be a concession.

Yeah, tell me how to avoid hitscan attacks again when Grineer have 0 reaction time? Or the fact that grenades don't always land on your position and thus can instantly kill you anyways? Or the fact that you're still insisting that 'if you make one tiny mistake you die' is acceptable gameplay for anything but the Super Hard mode that Warframe doesn't have?

They're bots, they're incredibly easy to predict. Strafe shoot on corners, sliding to cover, etc. etc. it's not hard. They don't have the best accurcy in the world and they generally slowly move from cover to cover and slow burst at you. It's hilarious that you're implying that you can't avoid their fire and that they can kill you instantly.

What 'difficulty increase'? Oh, you mean the fact that you can no longer have weapons that fire 32 bullets per trigger pull, dropping your theoretical max DPS by 7/8th or more? I don't see anyone actually complaining about that. What I see is people talking about how the current design where progression is entirely luck-determined is completely and utterly broken and unfun, giving people no actual milestones to their progress which tell them when they're ready for a new world.

Which still hinges on the idea that health and shield mods are a necessity for progressing in the game.

So can I. Five times. Out of five missions. 100% of the time. Turns out... anecdotes are not data!

Or it means that people aren't modding their setinels properly and are playing poorly.

Either that or they're loading up on Rhino Skin/Invisibility and cheesing the levels that way. Turns out, if you die in three hits and you can't reliably avoid those hits you have to cheese the game.

Where are you getting this three hit kill thing? I just went on ceres with a volt with no shield or hp and a lancer couldn't even kill me in 4 bursts while I stood in front of it. I just ran around and killed stuff without have to put any thought or effort into it. With a well modded akbolto you can kill them before they even get a single hit on you.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Aggh

[Aggh]

M Prime doesn't have a guarranteed common mod, stop talking out of your &#!. We did about 3 runs today, one of the special rewards was an uncommon mod, the other was a large health restore.

And you still don't understand what consistency means.

AMG you occasionally get a shield recharge or a marathon. The greater majority are commons regardless, and you'll never get a rare one. Three whole runs? That's a lot of grinding isn't it? Oh wait. And the point still stands that you can still do without them as long as you have decent mods on your weapons.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Aggh

[ttv_Typical_Tilly]

What do you not get that this mod isn't from a drop? Raid missions give you a mod/health restore every time even if you don't pick one up at all during the whole mission. And on m prime that reward is almost always a common drop. This means that you always have a shot at getting a common mod, which means you always have a shot at getting a vitality or shield mod. On top of that it can be rushed very easily without any worries so you can finish it quickly over and over.

Btw, I started grinding m prime for another half hour and got another vitality mod. And if I did it again, I'm pretty sure I could get one within that amount of time.

They're bots, they're incredibly easy to predict. Strafe shoot on corners, sliding to cover, etc. etc. it's not hard. They don't have the best accurcy in the world and they generally slowly move from cover to cover and slow burst at you. It's hilarious that you're implying that you can't avoid their fire and that they can kill you instantly.

Which still hinges on the idea that health and shield mods are a necessity for progressing in the game.

Or it means that people aren't modding their setinels properly and are playing poorly.

Where are you getting this three hit kill thing? I just went on ceres with a volt with no shield or hp and a lancer couldn't even kill me in 4 bursts while I stood in front of it. I just ran around and killed stuff without have to put any thought or effort into it. With a well modded akbolto you can kill them before they even get a single hit on you.

Your contributions to this thread are terrible and useless.

[krisp]

AMG you occasionally get a shield recharge or a marathon. The greater majority are commons regardless, and you'll never get a rare one. Three whole runs? That's a lot of grinding isn't it? Oh wait. And the point still stands that you can still do without them as long as you have decent mods on your weapons.

We do most of the runs in Tolstoj because that's where I got my only shield mod and that's where one of my friends got 4 shield mods. We're not gonna sit around in an inferior instance to get freakin' large health restores tyvm.

And your "point" is a piece of S#&$. Stop seeing things from your exclusive perspective and thinking everyone has the same experience and playstyle as you.

[MJ12]

What do you not get that this mod isn't from a drop? Raid missions give you a mod/health restore every time even if you don't pick one up at all during the whole mission. And on m prime that reward is almost always a common drop. This means that you always have a shot at getting a common mod, which means you always have a shot at getting a vitality or shield mod. On top of that it can be rushed very easily without any worries so you can finish it quickly over and over.

The fact that it's not from a drop is irrelevant. Unless you're saying that M Prime and raid missions in general use different RNG rules. Which is an extraordinary claim which needs... extraordinary proof. If each mission reward is independent, and you have not made the assertion that they are, my math is completely correct. Please, learn basic probability instead of trying to make up bulls**t.

Btw, I started grinding m prime for another half hour and got another vitality mod. And if I did it again, I'm pretty sure I could get one within that amount of time.

Sample size: 1

Error margin: +/-99.999%

Confidence Interval: Nonexistent

You could have gotten 200 health/shield mods in a row and it'd still be meaningless.

They're bots, they're incredibly easy to predict. Strafe shoot on corners, sliding to cover, etc. etc. it's not hard. They don't have the best accurcy in the world and they generally slowly move from cover to cover and slow burst at you. It's hilarious that you're implying that you can't avoid their fire and that they can kill you instantly.

So you're saying you can avoid hitscan attacks from enemies with 0 reaction time? They 'don't have the best accuracy in the world', no. That is, however, totally illusory. And the fact that people who have put dozens to hundreds of hours in the game don't seem to think they're 'incredibly easy' and shield/health mods are 'totally unnecessary' seems to disagree with the idea that it's "not hard". I did manage to beat a whole bunch of shooters on the hardest difficulty level, so it can't be that I'm just extra-awful at shooters. Maybe you're really good. Maybe your experience is just entirely different from mine.

Which still hinges on the idea that health and shield mods are a necessity for progressing in the game.

"Idea" = "Undeniable fact for 90+% of the playerbase". Sure, maybe the elite 10% or less can progress without them. They're a tiny minority of the playerbase, and because of how skill is only developed by playing if this system stays you will literally watch the game die around you. But you don't really care, do you? As long as you can feel smugly superior to the unwashed masses.

Or it means that people aren't modding their setinels properly and are playing poorly.

Ah yes modding them poorly with the... shield and health mods that haven't dropped for me until recently? Anecdotes. Not data.

Where are you getting this three hit kill thing? I just went on ceres with a volt with no shield or hp and a lancer couldn't even kill me in 4 bursts while I stood in front of it. I just ran around and killed stuff without have to put any thought or effort into it. With a well modded akbolto you can kill them before they even get a single hit on you.

Really now. Considering that when I 'ran around and killed stuff without having to put any thought or effort into it' pre-UD7 I could actually lose shields once in a while this is just more proof that you're either blatantly lying or some kind of magical super-elite Warframer who is not anywhere near close to the audience that they have to cater to unless they want the game to die. And I get laid flat all the time with one, maybe two bursts on Ceres/etc. without shield or HP mods. Maybe that's from more than one guy. Considering how many guys spawn, it doesn't matter.

If you want difficulty ask for difficulty settings. Don't support fake difficulty with terrible mathematics and anecdotes in lieu of data.

Edited March 23, 2013 by MJ12

[Aggh]

We do most of the runs in Tolstoj because that's where I got my only shield mod and that's where one of my friends got 4 shield mods. We're not gonna sit around in an inferior instance to get freakin' large health restores tyvm.

And your "point" is a piece of S#&$. Stop seeing things from your exclusive perspective and thinking everyone has the same experience and playstyle as you.

Ikr? Only a select few can run around left clicking at everything in sight and occasionally go to cover for shields to recharge. Obviously no one else plays like that.

[krisp]

Ikr? Only a select few can run around left clicking at everything in sight and occasionally go to cover for shields to recharge. Obviously no one else plays like that.

"Game's easy bro, you just have to not take damage and you win everything forever"

How could I have been so blind

[WarhawkX]

If you are trolling the OP I feel bad for you for the following reasons:

1. You must be under the average intellegence of internet posters.

2. You have not played this game enough.

Alright that aside moving forward.

Mods should not be the only way to increase your stats. If you recall, there was this LEVELING mechanic in this game that previously HELPED, to scale you to appropriate level of enemies. What does it do now?

It lets you equip more mods, mods that are random, that have to be gotten over and over on a random system to increase your effectiveness at the game.

In fact... I am on my second warframe trying to get to the Frost frame location. I had no problems with these missions prior to update 7, and now even with 3 other folks I die up to 3 times a mission.

Why the sudden change? I no longer have my point tree giving me appropriate sacaling.

Stop, and actually think about it before you say that the system is fine. IF the system is fine, then we don't need levels for weapons or frames at all and the mods slots would just be there.

[Aggh]

"Game's easy bro, you just have to not take damage and you win everything forever"

How could I have been so blind

No, you just have to not blindly rush into groups of enemies. Even on vs level 30 mobs you can still tank a decent bit of damage.

If you are trolling the OP I feel bad for you for the following reasons:

1. You must be under the average intellegence of internet posters.

2. You have not played this game enough.

Alright that aside moving forward.

Mods should not be the only way to increase your stats. If you recall, there was this LEVELING mechanic in this game that previously HELPED, to scale you to appropriate level of enemies. What does it do now?

It lets you equip more mods, mods that are random, that have to be gotten over and over on a random system to increase your effectiveness at the game.

In fact... I am on my second warframe trying to get to the Frost frame location. I had no problems with these missions prior to update 7, and now even with 3 other folks I die up to 3 times a mission.

Why the sudden change? I no longer have my point tree giving me appropriate sacaling.

Stop, and actually think about it before you say that the system is fine. IF the system is fine, then we don't need levels for weapons or frames at all and the mods slots would just be there.

Levels still define how powerful you can make you frame or weapon even without innate passives :|

Edited March 23, 2013 by Aggh

[WarhawkX]

The fact that it's not from a drop is irrelevant. Unless you're saying that M Prime and raid missions in general use different RNG rules. Which is an extraordinary claim which needs... extraordinary proof. If each mission reward is independent, and you have not made the assertion that they are, my math is completely correct. Please, learn basic probability instead of trying to make up bulls**t.

Sample size: 1

Error margin: +/-99.999%

Confidence Interval: Nonexistent

You could have gotten 200 health/shield mods in a row

You have to remember, these idiots have no education, and no brains... I mean I get that data, but come on your on the internet, they are trolling you out of ignorance and nothing better to do. Frankly you should just be posting in here for only the devs to read at this point.

[WarhawkX]

Levels still define how powerful you can make you frame or weapon even without innate passives :|

I understand that, but why the F*** bother on a RNG loot/scaling system?

[Aggh]

I understand that, but why the F*** bother on a RNG loot/scaling system?

Good weapon mods aren't even that hard to grind. The only really problematic mod is the shield mod. All this *@##$ing would be easily fixed if it had a slightly better drop rate. Though it would probably still be there because then people would $#*(@ about how expensive it is to upgrade and how it still doesn't let them get the same shields they could before.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Aggh

[krisp]

No, you just have to not blindly rush into groups of enemies. Even on vs level 30 mobs you can still tank a decent bit of damage.

The only way you're finishing any level 30 mission without dying is if you get carried by people who already have shield mods. There's no such thing as "cover" in a game where enemies can spawn behind you and try to surround you all the time. And if you do make it, using a full inventory of health items and scrounging for all the health globes you can find, it's still not remotely the same experience as someone who just found a shield mod and can kill enemies before they take his shields away. Maybe you wanted to be that guy. Too bad, farm crappy missions because a guy on the forums says that you can *eventually* get shields without any evidence to back himself up.

No, you're doing it wrong, bro. See in this game, you can have a nice moderate challenge or you can be in for the most gruelling time of your life especially if you're a newbie and not familiar to the game yet. The actual outcome is completely random. So come, roll the dice! Play warframe NOW!

BECAUSE THIS IS GOOD GAME DESIGN OH GOD WHY AM I EVEN ARGUING WITH YOU

[Aggh]

The only way you're finishing any level 30 mission without dying is if you get carried by people who already have shield mods. There's no such thing as "cover" in a game where enemies can spawn behind you and try to surround you all the time. And if you do make it, using a full inventory of health items and scrounging for all the health globes you can find, it's still not remotely the same experience as someone who just found a shield mod and can kill enemies before they take his shields away. Maybe you wanted to be that guy. Too bad, farm crappy missions because a guy on the forums says that you can *eventually* get shields without any evidence to back himself up.

No, you're doing it wrong, bro. See in this game, you can have a nice moderate challenge or you can be in for the most gruelling time of your life especially if you're a newbie and not familiar to the game yet. The actual outcome is completely random. So come, roll the dice! Play warframe NOW!

BECAUSE THIS IS GOOD GAME DESIGN OH GOD WHY AM I EVEN ARGUING WITH YOU

I guess the sliding, rolling and crouching mechanics are in this game just for show then.