Valkyr And Armor...

[nekrojiji]

Can someone explain to me what is the damage mitigation formula for armor?!

 

So I have 1200 armor after which I activate Warcry. Even if the skill increases the base armor (600) I should still reach 1500 armor.

 

How come I take SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much damage?!

 

 

[Lordmsyk]

x / (x + 300) is your damage mitigation formula, where "x" is your current armor.

 

If you have 600 armor, it's 600 / (600 + 300) which means 0.66 (repeating), or you reduce damage by 66.66% (repeating).

[Dipstick]

Armor has diminishing return, the more you have, the less damage each additional point of armor mitigates. Stacking health, hp regen, shields, ect would add more to survivability. I run vitality, redirection, vigor, and rage. This way I have a bunch of health, and hen when I lose it I can get it back with hysteria. This also has the benefit of making paralysis hit like a truck

[Dipstick]

Sorry for the double post. To explain the dismissing return, use lordmsyk's equation.

With 1200 armor, you would only get 80% reduction, only a 14% increase. In the other hand, you can add vitality, which would more than double your health pool

[Darkwave1098]

 

How come I take SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much damage?!

 

That's because it's been broken for a loooooong time. I think it was prior to Nekros or even before, that a Frost with Aurora and Steel Fiber was able to tank thru Grineer and Corpus alike, even high level mobs ( to a lesser degree).

 

Valkyr needs an armor revamp to be useful. (cough Armor 2.0 cough)

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

Sorry for the double post. To explain the dismissing return, use lordmsyk's equation.

With 1200 armor, you would only get 80% reduction, only a 14% increase. In the other hand, you can add vitality, which would more than double your health pool

 

it's not entirely true that the returns are diminishing. if you max out your armor with steelfiber you're at roughly 80% damage mitigation which equals in 5 times the effective health. using a maxed warcry increases your armor by 114,5%, buffing it up to around 2,7k iirc, granting effective mitigation around 90%. while this is only 10% for 1,5k points in armor, your effective health doubles due to the way armor scales. that's interesting because valkyr is currently the only frame that reaches armor high enough to be surpass the gap where it might feel like diminishing returns.

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

 

That's because it's been broken for a loooooong time. I think it was prior to Nekros or even before, that a Frost with Aurora and Steel Fiber was able to tank thru Grineer and Corpus alike, even high level mobs ( to a lesser degree).

 

Valkyr needs an armor revamp to be useful. (cough Armor 2.0 cough)

valkyr with a maxed steel fiber/warcry/vitality can take more punishment than rhino with every survival mod+ maxed iron skin... just saying

[Thrymm]

it's not entirely true that the returns are diminishing. if you max out your armor with steelfiber you're at roughly 80% damage mitigation which equals in 5 times the effective health. using a maxed warcry increases your armor by 114,5%, buffing it up to around 2,7k iirc, granting effective mitigation around 90%. while this is only 10% for 1,5k points in armor, your effective health doubles due to the way armor scales. that's interesting because valkyr is currently the only frame that reaches armor high enough to be surpass the gap where it might feel like diminishing returns.

This is the key.  Armor works essentially the same way in this game as any other---each point adds the same amount to your effective health and time to die.

 

On most frames it's trivial.  Even Rhino and Frost have a high enough shield pool(and no ability to regain health outside of rejuvenation aura) and low enough armor to not really see the effects of it.

 

Once you wander out with a super high armor Valkyr, though, it becomes apparent.  The first thing you'll wind up doing is dropping your shield mods, the second is that you'll stop waiting for your health to get super low to pop hysteria because it probably isn't getting down there fast enough.  You're essentially out there with 4k or more of effective health, she's one tough cookie.

 

Beware the puncture procs, though.  Puncture is to Valkyr what a high slash stack is to all the other frames--you're gonna melt if you take fire with it on you.

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

puncutre only causes you to deal less damage afaik... still, puncture is bad for valkyr, you're right at that

Edited March 10, 2014 by MortalSin

[-Himari-]

Armor has diminishing return, the more you have, the less damage each additional point of armor mitigates. Stacking health, hp regen, shields, ect would add more to survivability. I run vitality, redirection, vigor, and rage. This way I have a bunch of health, and hen when I lose it I can get it back with hysteria. This also has the benefit of making paralysis hit like a truck

 

Good plan, I run something similar to this and it works out in the end for long lasting fights and things like that.

[Aglethe]

Sorry for the double post. To explain the dismissing return, use lordmsyk's equation.

With 1200 armor, you would only get 80% reduction, only a 14% increase. In the other hand, you can add vitality, which would more than double your health pool

That's sort of looking at it from the wrong way around though. Armour rating has diminishing returns because things like mitigation and avoidance have compounding returns. The closer you get to 100%, the more effective each percent becomes.

Going from say 98% to 99% halves your incoming damage from a one percent increase (from 99% to 100% is an out right infinite increase in damage reduction for a single percent).

If we look at the Valkyr example, while there may only be a 14% change (66% -> 80%) in the absolute percentage, that's around a 40% reduction in incoming damage (34 vs 20 damage received on a 100 damage attack).

So yes, Vitality is probably the higher priority over Steel Fiber, but you'll still want both in the end.

Edited March 10, 2014 by Aglethe

[Pure]

armor is working as intended.  80% damage reduction just doesn't seem like alot when all the enemies are focusing you.  level 20- enemies you can just stand there and take hits.  after 30+  you can take 8-10 per shot and that adds up to 10 enemies. easily 800 damage right there.

 

the enemy damage keeps scaling higher and higher.  so once enemies are do 1000 straight damage, 80% turns it to 200. so 200 is like 4-5 hits you're dead.

 

solo missions are harder because all the enemies will target you.  in groups it's not noticable because the ai will run by you or switch targets constantly.  for a frame that has god mode i don't see why complain about the armor.  it is very effective level 1-30 enemies

Edited March 10, 2014 by Pure

[nekrojiji]

Armor has diminishing return, the more you have, the less damage each additional point of armor mitigates. Stacking health, hp regen, shields, ect would add more to survivability. I run vitality, redirection, vigor, and rage. This way I have a bunch of health, and hen when I lose it I can get it back with hysteria. This also has the benefit of making paralysis hit like a truck

I understand about diminishing returns... it comes out of the formula. That's why i asked about the formula.

Ty!