A Few Things To Consider Regarding Nerfing.

[insaninater]

It's a beta. Weapons will be balanced and re-balanced often. Get used to it.

 

But is it balance or is it just appeasement?

[Tiqalicious]

But is it balance or is it just appeasement?

It's balance, and the fact that you're not happy about it doesn't make it any less the case.

There are a very small number of occasions when a nerf in warframe has been unjustifiable and to be quite honest this entire thread has been solely about you complaining because you don't like nerfs instead of why they're actually bad for the game.

[insaninater]

It's balance, and the fact that you're not happy about it doesn't make it any less the case.

There are a very small number of occasions when a nerf in warframe has been unjustifiable and to be quite honest this entire thread has been solely about you complaining because you don't like nerfs instead of why they're actually bad for the game.

 

This is exactly what i mean by letting spite towards other players cloud your judgement. This isn't about you and me dude, it's about the game.

[Tiqalicious]

This is exactly what i mean by letting spite towards other players cloud your judgement. This isn't about you and me dude, it's about the game.

There's nothing clouding my judgement. Your feedback isn't constructive because it's based entirely on your theoretical assumptions about nerfs rather than on legitimate feedback. Most players have been extremely happy about the recent changes because they were a long time coming and a vast improvement whereas your negativity has been based entirely around the fact that you simply dislike nerfs of any kind.

Most of us here are happy to give DE constructive feedback. The difference between yourself and the rest of us is that we're not simply shouting at DE over knee jerk reactions.

[insaninater]

There's nothing clouding my judgement. Your feedback isn't constructive because it's based entirely on your theoretical assumptions about nerfs rather than on legitimate feedback. Most players have been extremely happy about the recent changes because they were a long time coming and a vast improvement whereas your negativity has been based entirely around the fact that you simply dislike nerfs of any kind.

Most of us here are happy to give DE constructive feedback. The difference between yourself and the rest of us is that we're not simply shouting at DE over knee jerk reactions.

 

I'm not shouting. I'm typing words into the internet, the same as you. You see, you assume i'm shouting because you've formed a prejudice against me. I don't dislike nerfs of any kind, i dislike nerfs for the sake of appeasement, and nerfs that are too extreme, and nerfs that are done without buffs done elsewhere to promote balanced balance.

 

You see, no matter what point i make, you won't accept any validity to any of it because you've formed a false image of me in your mind as some 6-year-old mad at the fact that their favorite toy got ruined, as someone who hasn't seen games ruined by both power creep and stagnation. As soon as you can recognize that i am trying to give constructive feedback, by pointing out that only nerfing, never buffing, isn't a good long-term solution, and you can put your hatred of me aside, then we can be on our way towards trying to put our heads together to think of how things can be done butter, but until you can see me as what i am, as a person who wants to promote the wellbeing of this game, it's players, and it's developers, it's useless to talk to you.

[Agullimux]

insaninater, don't worry enemies will be nerfed after all items, frames have been nerfed. =)

[ranks21]

nerfing is just bad no matter which way you pretty it up. more and more the weapons are getting weaker and weaker to the point of being useless, and the sad thing about all of this is. when you do talk about it in the forums you get all sort of flack from wanna be know it all as if they are good or better than you in game when they themselves cant last 30 mins with their best setup.

 

 revisited some of the once fun melee and guns after the last so called balancing of weapons and it made me have to make a post to bring the fun back. the game is not fun anymore even now @ rank 13 with the test pending there is literally no urgency to do anything. Took the galatine amongst other weapons out for a spin and I cant believe that a knife does more damage in all categories than a heavy sword. the galatine is nerfed to useless even a soda bottle can do more damage than it now.

 

 youre basically left with the latest releases of stuff to even spend  time in the game, when you could go and get any gear or setup to do any mission solo or coop.

   Solo is beginning to die out because of these nerfs, and lets face it not everyone likes to play this game with others especially in survivals when youre ranking up your gear. I cant speak for everyone else but for me there is a lot of fun taken out of the game because of nerfing and like the op said why spend $$ on a weapon or frame for the power it has then 2-3 hotfix it's nerfed to useless?.

[Nethaufer]

*snip*

  Solo is beginning to die out because of these nerfs, and lets face it not everyone likes to play this game with others especially in survivals when youre ranking up your gear. I cant speak for everyone else but for me there is a lot of fun taken out of the game because of nerfing and like the op said why spend $$ on a weapon or frame for the power it has then 2-3 hotfix it's nerfed to useless?.

I have been soloing for a while now and nothing has changed between U13 and U14. Only time when I random instead of solo is when either I want to get a mission done quick, such as invasions, or if I need to do a long grind session for items in survival/defence.

And also, the only thing they 'nerfed' about the rockets is that you have to shoot them less often and conserve ammo for big clusters. Damage is still the same, function is still the same.

[jennibear]

 the galatine is nerfed to useless even a soda bottle can do more damage than it now.

 

there are ways to make the galatine good, like there are ways to make everything else good. Do you have cleaving whirlwind on your galatine?

[ranks21]

I think I did a post and answered  a player about mods, modding, ect regarding to you mod to make it good. I ve been playing looong enough to put just 3 little mods on a weapon and it can out do your best setup ( that goes for modding) there is literally nothing you can teach me in that regards or say to me that I haven't done exploited already 100 folds over, and the best part of all I didn't listen to any of the so called experts or know it all who only knows to do stuff one way. whether it being modding for a frame's 1 or two ability or their favorite weapons.there is only a handful of stuff I literally don't build yet maxed, and discard of it because  I just don't need to. you can check my profile ingame or on steam for the game and you can see just about everything I have done and how many hrs invested and all the frame - only 4  non primes and around 8 sidearms and less than 10 melees and rifles that's not maxed or built yet. I pulled out all multipliers out of all melees I use since the inception of 2.0 and was doing wallrun combos as the launching point. right now its the hand and feet set of melees that I am currently maxing and using just because the craze has died down from the early out and I put them off till now. I  don't think you understand where I am coming from in regards of weapons so best is leave it alone.

Edited August 22, 2014 by ranks21

[WrathAscending]

As I said in the PSA thread about the changes to launcher ammunition, I think the nerf was mis-targeted; while 540 ammunition was obviously too high and did need to be changed, the real issue with launchers is not the ammunition count but the way mods like Serration, Split Chamber, and Heavy Calibre interact with the weapons' base damage and Damage 2.0 elemental mods, resulting in massively scaling damage. This high damage is then further augmented by skills like Hall of Mirrors or Rhino Roar (and maybe Rifle Amp, not sure if that combines with launcher damage). With pistol-type launchers it's probably worse given the interaction between Hornet Strike, Magnum Force, Barrel Diffusion, and Lethal Torrent; whereas a rifle launcher with Split Chamber on is only highly likely to fire an extra projectile, the pistol is guaranteed to and may fire a third, particularly with maxed Lethal Torrent and Barrel Diffusion combined.

 

I think it would have been better to address the interactions between those mods than to so heavily reduce ammunition capacity. As it stands, the response from players who have heavily polarised weapons is to just slap on an Ammo Mutation mod in one slot and continue business as usual, albeit with damage reduced a bit.

 

The other reason launcher-type weapons are favoured by so many players is the grind inherent in the game and the way enemies scale at higher levels. Credits are an issue, as are the affinity points to level items and acquire new mastery ranks. The net result of that is players using Dark Sectors to gain quick credits and an XP bonus; since the Infested like to clump up a launcher allows you to reliably deliver high damage, getting through 5 waves fast if you are there to farm credits or to handle the tough Ancient and Eximus enemies that appear if going past five.

 

Ultimately there's a lot of factors that lead to players using launchers. Reducing the ammunition count doesn't really address those.