I Think The Infested And Stun/knockback Things Need Some Tweaking.

[BlueCremeSoda]

I'm not complaining that infested are too hard or anything, but stunlock is simply cheap and unfair to the player. I don't care that I get knocked back for getting close to something or whatever, but literally every enemy I see on the infested faction knocks you back or down and leaves you unable to defend yourself. Couple this with chargers (who supposedly have weak attacks yet knock you back CONSTANTLY?) and you end up surrounded with 3+ chargers, ancients, runners, all stunning you or knocking you down. Then on top of that throw in one of the disruptors and you're pretty much screwed no matter how you look at it.

 

I don't care about all these things on their own, but there's literally nothing that can be done and you end up failing missions or getting killed while helpless the entire time and it simply isn't challenging, it's just cheap.

 

I know I'm not the only one that's tired of getting knocked into a corner or group of chargers only to get stunlocked to death.

 

Make the chargers stun less, make the knock backs or knock downs less frequent or something. As it stands, it's incredibly hard to even dodge an ancient who's about to tentacle you in the face. Rolling does nothing the majority of the time, sprinting does the same, which makes it incredibly frustrating as a player when coupled with being knocked around by everything. Maybe someone else could have more ideas on how to fix it to be less cheap and more actual challenge for the player rather than artificial difficulty with the use of cheap mechanics that leave the player defenseless. It basically ruins the experience and takes away any sort of chance the player has to get out of a bad situation. Couple the frustrating amount of stun and knockdown with an enemy that will suck all your shields and energy just because it touches you? It's not a fun time and you stand no chance unless you simply just don't die really.

 

Even Grineer and Corpus will punch you in the face resulting in a stun, but they don't stunlock you from 20 feet away with every enemy doing it as well, and with them a shockwave moa can really ruin your day, but again at least you aren't being stunlocked by every enemy in the room. Just feels like there has to be a better way to handle the infested and that something needs to be done.

[Renan.Ruivo]

You're just flogging a dead horse mate, sorry to say that. Infected are like this since january i believe, and they're not going to be changed as far as what the Devs said about them. According to them, they're balanced enough. In my opinion, i think they need further improvement since you can defeat the whole faction just by standing on a tall place.

 

BTW i have a foggy memory, don't quote me on the date. I think it was during U6 rollout on february...

Edited April 22, 2013 by Renan.Ruivo

[BlueCremeSoda]

If it won't even be looked at or consider a change that's quite sad really. It's like they haven't experienced them or something. I'm not one of those people who thinks something is too hard because I can't beat it with ease, but all the stunning and the whole combination of what all they do is just... it's awful. It's not a fun experience. It's often not worth the hassle if you can rush past these things and I don't think that should be the case with any faction or enemy.

[Balo]

How are people getting stunlocked so easily? Ancients are the only ones that sometimes manage to knock me down and even then they're very reasonable to dodge with rolls. (stupidly easy if they've been hit by any frost damage)

 

Yesterday I did get knocked down by an ancient in a corner and swarmed by dogs, they knocked me around a good bit and it took me mashing ult and my teammates thinning the line a little to get me out alive. But that was MY FAULT FOR GETTING MYSELF SWARMED AND STANDING IN AN IDIOTIC SPOT and the game punished me appropriately, I have learned from it.

 

If you're meleeing you just need to kills the Runners so they dont stumble you, for killing dogs (and in general) you just need to weave in an out (if you're using fist weapons or daggers I can see this being tougher), for ancients you circlestrafe them to S#&$ (they're usually stunlocked anyways). This isn't resident evil and you don't need to go into over the shoulder mode to shoot. It's more like max payne and you can shoot while running away (and doing all sorts of action movie manuevers).

Edited April 22, 2013 by Balo

[BlueCremeSoda]

Try coming out of an elevator to be swarmed by chargers and ancients and runners and tell me how you put yourself in a stupid spot. The infested are unbalanced the way they stand and simply do not provide a true challenge and instead use cheap tactics like stunlocks resulting in an artificial difficulty that makes it harder but not through legitimate increase in difficulty, but rather making the player unable to act at all.

 

I never said this happens all the time or easily but it happens far too often as to what it should. It is not true difficulty or challenge, it is flawed use of artificial difficulty. It makes it no more fun or rewarding to defeat them and simply adds undue frustration when it arises. It's not even on par with oh I got too close to the shockwave moa and got shot to death it's oh the game decided I needed to die so I got swarmed with chargers and ancients to get stunlocked. That also does not touch adding in the unnecessary elements of draining every ounce of shields and energy you have because a disruptor touched you or the slightly less bothersome toxic avenger who will still stunlock you but at least doesn't leave you 100% defenseless as a result of its attacks combined with every other stunlocking capable member of the infested clan.

[LazyTemplar]

Er... so am I the only one that thinks infested are the easiest faction by a somewhat significant margin?  Serious question.  At equivalent enemy levels, I always find grineer and corpus to be more troublesome.  

[Aizeol]

Wondering why people have a problem with infested...

 

 

Wondering how people get stunlocked...

 

 

The issue, from what I can tell from my own experiences and listening to others, is that the infested are stupid easy if you are rolling through a map with friends or competent players but can wreck shop if solo'ed.

 

While they aren't completely game-breaking, the chargers do not have weak attacks.  Period.  A weak attack would do somewhere between 10-30 dmg, but the chargers I've encountered do more towards 70-125 dmg.

 

Combine that with the fact that they stun with every hit, and it is just bothersome.  Now, they are extremely easy if you melee them first or shoot them, but either the tooltip should be changed or they need to do less damage with a smaller stun chance.  Say 30% or so?  instead of 80-100%

 

Again, this is only a real issue when running solo or with players that don't understand what a team is.

[BlueCremeSoda]

The issue, from what I can tell from my own experiences and listening to others, is that the infested are stupid easy if you are rolling through a map with friends or competent players but can wreck shop if solo'ed.

 

While they aren't completely game-breaking, the chargers do not have weak attacks.  Period.  A weak attack would do somewhere between 10-30 dmg, but the chargers I've encountered do more towards 70-125 dmg.

 

Combine that with the fact that they stun with every hit, and it is just bothersome.  Now, they are extremely easy if you melee them first or shoot them, but either the tooltip should be changed or they need to do less damage with a smaller stun chance.  Say 30% or so?  instead of 80-100%

 

Again, this is only a real issue when running solo or with players that don't understand what a team is.

 

This is my main problem. It's the combination of everything that happens. The chargers are one of the biggest culprits because of this because of how many there are and how fast they can swarm you.

 

They're not a hard faction if you're rolling through them but if you have any situation where you get stuck you do get screwed so hard by them and it's really not a fun experience. And it's not because they're difficult, it just feels cheap.

[Galiath25]

I'm with everyone that thinks this is an issue of people not learning from their mistakes. I've only been stunlocked to death twice, and the second time was coming out of an elevator. Was I enraged? Oh god yes. OH GOD YES! Buuuuuut instead of coming on the forums and whining about "INFECTED OP, INFECTED OP" I took a deep breath and thought what I could do to avoid the same situation. I have yet to have any issues since then. Why? Believe it or not...I can remember the past xD, which means I can plan for the future! Don't go down an elevator if you don't have your ultimate ready (or having both your guns at 10% clip). Spend more time running away and shooting. Use the jump+melee slam atk. I don't know about your melee weapons, but I have yet to come across a pack of anything but ancients that won't all get one shot by the slam.

 

I do understand that some people just aren't very good at games, but there are plenty of options. Perhaps consider that the mission is just a bit out of reach? Maybe you need to go level? Join someone else doing that one mission so you can get through and be about your business? Go find some mods? Grind some credits and buy a new gun? You'd be surprised what finding the right mod can do. Once I found the +dmg mod for my rifle, pluto became a cake walk.

 

Still having troubles? Well, maybe you just aren't very good at shooters. It happens. Some games I'm a pro, some games I'm a monkey with downs syndrome. It happens. Games are supposed to be challenging. What fun is a game that doesn't make you think, or push yourself to improve? Sounds like a boring &#! game to me.

[xhero2503]

IMO Ancient Disruptor should Take away 125 Energy instead of all of your energy

[Anelyn]

I'm not complaining that infested are too hard or anything, but stunlock is simply cheap and unfair to the player. I don't care that I get knocked back for getting close to something or whatever, but literally every enemy I see on the infested faction knocks you back or down and leaves you unable to defend yourself. Couple this with chargers (who supposedly have weak attacks yet knock you back CONSTANTLY?) and you end up surrounded with 3+ chargers, ancients, runners, all stunning you or knocking you down. Then on top of that throw in one of the disruptors and you're pretty much screwed no matter how you look at it.

 

I don't care about all these things on their own, but there's literally nothing that can be done and you end up failing missions or getting killed while helpless the entire time and it simply isn't challenging, it's just cheap.

 

I know I'm not the only one that's tired of getting knocked into a corner or group of chargers only to get stunlocked to death.

 

Make the chargers stun less, make the knock backs or knock downs less frequent or something. As it stands, it's incredibly hard to even dodge an ancient who's about to tentacle you in the face. Rolling does nothing the majority of the time, sprinting does the same, which makes it incredibly frustrating as a player when coupled with being knocked around by everything. Maybe someone else could have more ideas on how to fix it to be less cheap and more actual challenge for the player rather than artificial difficulty with the use of cheap mechanics that leave the player defenseless. It basically ruins the experience and takes away any sort of chance the player has to get out of a bad situation. Couple the frustrating amount of stun and knockdown with an enemy that will suck all your shields and energy just because it touches you? It's not a fun time and you stand no chance unless you simply just don't die really.

 

Even Grineer and Corpus will punch you in the face resulting in a stun, but they don't stunlock you from 20 feet away with every enemy doing it as well, and with them a shockwave moa can really ruin your day, but again at least you aren't being stunlocked by every enemy in the room. Just feels like there has to be a better way to handle the infested and that something needs to be done.

How is FAIR for player to JUMP on a BOX, and laugh in face of all infested hordes?

 

And to answer your question with a question: How do you get cornered by infested? How do you get attacked by so many at same time? Do you run through rooms to trigger spawns until your stamina drops, then stop dead and try to shoot in all directions?

[Tetsmeha]

I'm with everyone that thinks this is an issue of people not learning from their mistakes. I've only been stunlocked to death twice, and the second time was coming out of an elevator. Was I enraged? Oh god yes. OH GOD YES! Buuuuuut instead of coming on the forums and whining about "INFECTED OP, INFECTED OP" I took a deep breath and thought what I could do to avoid the same situation. I have yet to have any issues since then. Why? Believe it or not...I can remember the past xD, which means I can plan for the future! Don't go down an elevator if you don't have your ultimate ready (or having both your guns at 10% clip). Spend more time running away and shooting. Use the jump+melee slam atk. I don't know about your melee weapons, but I have yet to come across a pack of anything but ancients that won't all get one shot by the slam.

 

I do understand that some people just aren't very good at games, but there are plenty of options. Perhaps consider that the mission is just a bit out of reach? Maybe you need to go level? Join someone else doing that one mission so you can get through and be about your business? Go find some mods? Grind some credits and buy a new gun? You'd be surprised what finding the right mod can do. Once I found the +dmg mod for my rifle, pluto became a cake walk.

 

Still having troubles? Well, maybe you just aren't very good at shooters. It happens. Some games I'm a pro, some games I'm a monkey with downs syndrome. It happens. Games are supposed to be challenging. What fun is a game that doesn't make you think, or push yourself to improve? Sounds like a boring &#! game to me.

 

You realize almost every ultimate skill is a get away free card and do tons of damage? The problem with ancients is that they stunlock you so that you get no chance to use it, and ancients just drain your energy and stunlock you some more. Are you really trying to say the best way to combat infect is to stand on a box? Because that's literally the most efficient way to fighting them.

 

And getting stunlocked by infected doesn't have anything to do with skill. The moment you're hit near a mob it's game. How is sitting there for another 20 seconds waiting to die any challenge or fun?

People may make a comparison of this games punishing deaths to hardcore games like Dark Souls or Monster hunter, but in those games you're punished for not using mechanics not given to you. In Warframe you're punished for not doing a specific action AKA exploiting the AI.

[Galiath25]

You realize almost every ultimate skill is a get away free card and do tons of damage? The problem with ancients is that they stunlock you so that you get no chance to use it, and ancients just drain your energy and stunlock you some more. Are you really trying to say the best way to combat infect is to stand on a box? Because that's literally the most efficient way to fighting them.

 

And getting stunlocked by infected doesn't have anything to do with skill. The moment you're hit near a mob it's game. How is sitting there for another 20 seconds waiting to die any challenge or fun?

People may make a comparison of this games punishing deaths to hardcore games like Dark Souls or Monster hunter, but in those games you're punished for not using mechanics not given to you. In Warframe you're punished for not doing a specific action AKA exploiting the AI.

 

When did I ever say I use boxes? Or that's it's a good option? I don't exploit a thing, I don't stand on a box and break the game...the enemy can always reach me. Seriously...what fun is it if I just stand on a box and shoot things. Until reading this thread, I didn't even know you could lol break pathing on the boxes. I won't do it now that I know, because that's stupid.

 

And the stuns don't get thrown down the INSTANT enemies see you, it's not like the door starts opening and BAM YOU'RE STUNNED AND YOU HAVE NO ENERGY...OMG! Also, there's nothing wrong with the ultimates being a get out of jail free card. The issue is how often energy orbs drop pretty much giving you "lol ima kill this whole group with a button" way more then you should be able to. Most of the time, I don't even use my warframe abilities on challenging levels, because it takes away.....the challenge. Also, MAG's pull is great for disabling an enemy (like a disruptor) while I slay the rest of the pack, and now it's just 1v1...which I'm sure you can handle.

 

Edit: Also, this game is nothing compared to dark souls. Dark souls killed me hundreds of times. This game? A few.

 

"People may make a comparison of this games punishing deaths to hardcore games like Dark Souls or Monster hunter, but in those games you're punished for not using mechanics not given to you. In Warframe you're punished for not doing a specific action AKA exploiting the AI."

 

So...dark souls punishes me for not using things that AREN'T in dark souls? And warframe punishes me for NOT exploiting?

Just making sure I'm reading that correctly. I don't even know what that means. I mean.....I know what the words mean, but stringing them together like that just sounds like gibberish.  :(

 

Every game punishes you for not doing a specific action. In a shooter, you have to shoot things and not get shot too much. Those are specific actions. In super ghouls and ghosts, if you just sit there and let the zombies run into you...you will die.

I'm not trying to be obnoxious (even though I'm sure people think I am) I guess I'm just not getting what your trying to convey.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Galiath25

[Tetsmeha]

When did I ever say I use boxes? Or that's it's a good option? I don't exploit a thing, I don't stand on a box and break the game...the enemy can always reach me. Seriously...what fun is it if I just stand on a box and shoot things. Until reading this thread, I didn't even know you could lol break pathing on the boxes. I won't do it now that I know, because that's stupid.

 

And the stuns don't get thrown down the INSTANT enemies see you, it's not like the door starts opening and BAM YOU'RE STUNNED AND YOU HAVE NO ENERGY...OMG! Also, there's nothing wrong with the ultimates being a get out of jail free card. The issue is how often energy orbs drop pretty much giving you "lol ima kill this whole group with a button" way more then you should be able to. Most of the time, I don't even use my warframe abilities on challenging levels, because it takes away.....the challenge. Also, MAG's pull is great for disabling an enemy (like a disruptor) while I slay the rest of the pack, and now it's just 1v1...which I'm sure you can handle.

 

Edit: Also, this game is nothing compared to dark souls. Dark souls killed me hundreds of times. This game? A few.

 

"People may make a comparison of this games punishing deaths to hardcore games like Dark Souls or Monster hunter, but in those games you're punished for not using mechanics not given to you. In Warframe you're punished for not doing a specific action AKA exploiting the AI."

 

So...dark souls punishes me for not using things that AREN'T in dark souls? And warframe punishes me for NOT exploiting?

Just making sure I'm reading that correctly. I don't even know what that means. I mean.....I know what the words mean, but stringing them together like that just sounds like gibberish.  :(

 

Every game punishes you for not doing a specific action. In a shooter, you have to shoot things and not get shot too much. Those are specific actions. In super ghouls and ghosts, if you just sit there and let the zombies run into you...you will die.

I'm not trying to be obnoxious (even though I'm sure people think I am) I guess I'm just not getting what your trying to convey.

 

You missed the entire point. During update 6 the best way to deal with infested was to kill everything before they blew up. When they nerfed shields, the best way to fight them was to avoid it entirely. You see how the most effecient method shifted? It's because getting stunlocked isn't fun. People complained about it even when they were nigh-invincible. It isn't about people being bad at positioning or anything. It's about the mechanic being so unfun that people avoid it entirely.

[Anelyn]

So... from your last post, you complain that NOT avoiding getting hit by dogs, charged by chargers, having runners blow up in your face, Ancients charging you, stunlocks you and is bad mechanic?

 

Am confused.

 

Anyway Tetsmeha, add me in game, and I'll do couple high level infested runs with you as observer. So you can notice how I dodge chargers charges, how I never get hit by runners exploding without shooting or hitting them at all, how I dodge ancients ranged attacks, and how I run circles around dogs (which is a funny mechanic, getting behind a dog or more dogs who are in the process of chasing you, but you end up chasing them, spinning in a circle, they will never stop to turn around, but continue to run in the circular pattern trying to catch you up).

 

PS: no stealth / invisibility or warframe skills will be used. This will be demonstrated with small groups (the normal spawns, 4-8) I won't be standing rambo waiting for 40 infested to fill the room then try to dodge them within a square meter.

[Tetsmeha]

So... from your last post, you complain that NOT avoiding getting hit by dogs, charged by chargers, having runners blow up in your face, Ancients charging you, stunlocks you and is bad mechanic?

 

Am confused.

 

Anyway Tetsmeha, add me in game, and I'll do couple high level infested runs with you as observer. So you can notice how I dodge chargers charges, how I never get hit by runners exploding without shooting or hitting them at all, how I dodge ancients ranged attacks, and how I run circles around dogs (which is a funny mechanic, getting behind a dog or more dogs who are in the process of chasing you, but you end up chasing them, spinning in a circle, they will never stop to turn around, but continue to run in the circular pattern trying to catch you up).

 

PS: no stealth / invisibility or warframe skills will be used. This will be demonstrated with small groups (the normal spawns, 4-8) I won't be standing rambo waiting for 40 infested to fill the room then try to dodge them within a square meter.

 

 

I already know how to do all that stuff. No need to condescend me as if I don't know how to play the game.

[Anelyn]

Then if you can do that stuff, why are you complaining about infested abilities?

 

PS: I wasn't condescending you, I was trying to be helpful and show you how to avoid getting in a situation where you could possible get stunlocked, and eventually die.

PPS: that's what Rhino & Trinity are for, to ignore knockdown / staggers etc. Stealth frames can avoid it completely. Normal frames have skills to help them deal with that (before you get stunlocked). Everyone has same movement / dodge available.

[V0LK]

It's fun to see how some people point at obvious problems with stunlocking mechanics, but other individuals state that you should just jump on boxes. Because use of exploits  is a one way of dealing with broken mechanic.

[Galiath25]

You missed the entire point. During update 6 the best way to deal with infested was to kill everything before they blew up. When they nerfed shields, the best way to fight them was to avoid it entirely. You see how the most effecient method shifted? It's because getting stunlocked isn't fun. People complained about it even when they were nigh-invincible. It isn't about people being bad at positioning or anything. It's about the mechanic being so unfun that people avoid it entirely.

 

Of course being stunlocked isn't fun...I hate it just as much as the next person. It's infuriating as S#&$.

I came in here after the shield nerf, so I didn't get to enjoy this invincibility you speak of, yet I still find myself pretty much unkillable. And of course people complained about it earlier, and no matter how many buffs or nerfs happen, someone is ALWAYS going to complain.

The mechanic is unfun, so people avoid it. So you're saying that because you don't like dying in games, you try to avoid that by staying alive?

So basically, you are every person ever.

 

Last time I checked avoiding things that killed you is how you stay alive. The fact that it's something people have issues with isn't the game's fault, it's the player's. Now if 90% of the people playing this game could never progress and a vote was called and every says nerf it...then fine, so be it. I don't believe at all that this is as big of an issue as people say. I think people are just being careless in their play and are dying because of it. Don't blame the game because you don't learn from your mistakes. To me that's no different than saying the mechanic of being shot and killed is annoying so you avoid it. Let's make it so the enemies don't have guns (lol)! All I see is people having troubles, and they want their hand held. Well I say TOUGH NUGGETS! xD

 

Buck up and take this challenge HEAD ON PEOPLE!

[neKroMancer]

I think the problem stemmed from the faction designed with melee/stunlock as main mechanic. 

 

It makes the Infest pretty easy if you know how to fight them since they have no choice but to engage player in melee (or a bit long melee range, in case of Ancients) in order to deal damage and threaten player with stunlock/stagger.

 

It isn't cheap design, it's lazy design.

 

Infest definitely need more mechanics in order to serve as an interesting faction.

[Galiath25]

 

Infest definitely need more mechanics in order to serve as an interesting faction.

 

So infested needs to be harder? That's the talk of someone with the heart of a champ!

 

YOU DONE ME PROUD, BOY/GIRL!!

[neKroMancer]

So infested needs to be harder? That's the talk of someone with the heart of a champ!

 

YOU DONE ME PROUD, BOY/GIRL!!

 

Not harder, more mechanics should be added in order to make Infest on par with the other two.

 

Take a quick look at the Grineer - they have standard mid range unit (Lancer with Grakata), short range unit (Strun Lancer), melee unit (teleporting prod-wielding lancer and shield lancer), Seeker, long range unit (Balista). Heavy units are the Grenadier, Napalm, Bombardier, Minigunner. Commander serves as an interesting unit, capable of putting you into danger without damaging ability.

 

- Variety of mechanics and range of engagement : Teleport, Switch teleport, Radial blast, AOE fire attack, Homing missile, Attaching/homing explosive.

 

Corpus : Standard crewman, Sniper crewman, Prod crewman, Moa, Shockwave Moa, Railgun Moa, Leech Osprey, Shield Osprey, Mine osprey.

 

- Variety of mechanic and range of engagement : Range stagger, Melee stagger, AOE stagger, Shield regeneration, DOT shield, Stationary explosive. Not as varied as the Grineer but still serve as a faction with cohesion. 

 

Infest : Runner (stagger/melee), Charger(stagger/melee), Leaper (stagger/melee), Noxious crawler(stunlock/melee), Ancient (stagger/melee).

 

- No variety, at all. There are only two interesting mechanics - disruptor shield/energy tentacle and toxic ancient's body odor. There's literally no cohesion within the faction. All of them just running toward you in order to deal damage and apply stagger/stun effect on player.

 

Infest definitely need more mechanics even as a melee-oriented faction. 

[Galiath25]

Not harder, more mechanics should be added in order to make Infest on par with the other two.

 

If it's not on par with the others, to me that sounds like the definition of it being easier.

If you have less mechanics to worry about, you will have less to focus on during combat.

In the end that makes it easier.

 

I certainly agree, though. There should be much more to the infested.

Unfortunately, if people are having so much trouble with what they already are,

I doubt adding more will be recieved with open arms.

 

Hell, maybe infest will be turned into zerg. No abilities, just LOTS of them running at you

REALLY FAST! We already have grineer and corpus, and I would say they are very well done/diverse.

The only problem I have with them is the lack of intelligent AI in combat. Sticking their heads out for easy

headshots. Not chasing you and finishing you off when you're CLEARLY cornered and #*($%%@. Etc.

 

I don't think it could hurt to have an enemy that isn't about strategy, but raw power and quick reflexes.

Or if you don't have a lot of power, more running and dodging xD. We are ninjas after all.

But, this is more my personal preference than anything.

[Tetsmeha]

If it's not on par with the others, to me that sounds like the definition of it being easier.

If you have less mechanics to worry about, you will have less to focus on during combat.

In the end that makes it easier.

 

I certainly agree, though. There should be much more to the infested.

Unfortunately, if people are having so much trouble with what they already are,

I doubt adding more will be recieved with open arms.

 

I think you misinterpreted him. He said the mechanics are not on par, because they are lazily designed. Just because there is only one mechanic to worry about doesn't make it easier. It means every unit uses the same attack, and makes a boring and annoying enemy.

 

Look at all the people saying that nerfing the stun makes the infested too easy. If the difficulty of the enemy relied so heavily on one mechanics how well was the mechanic in the first place?

[neKroMancer]

If it's not on par with the others, to me that sounds like the definition of it being easier.

If you have less mechanics to worry about, you will have less to focus on during combat.

In the end that makes it easier.

 

I certainly agree, though. There should be much more to the infested.

Unfortunately, if people are having so much trouble with what they already are,

I doubt adding more will be recieved with open arms.

 

Hell, maybe infest will be turned into zerg. No abilities, just LOTS of them running at you

REALLY FAST! We already have grineer and corpus, and I would say they are very well done/diverse.

The only problem I have with them is the lack of intelligent AI in combat. Sticking their heads out for easy

headshots. Not chasing you and finishing you off when you're CLEARLY cornered and #*($%%@. Etc.

 

I don't think it could hurt to have an enemy that isn't about strategy, but raw power and quick reflexes.

Or if you don't have a lot of power, more running and dodging xD. We are ninjas after all.

But, this is more my personal preference than anything.

Even the Zerg have abilities, lots of it. They can attack en mass with Zergling, shoot spike with Hydralisk, blow themselves up with Banling, shoot spore/infect base with Queen, shoot AOE spore with Devourer, etc.

As the above poster mentioned, the number of mechanic in Infrst is low compared to Grineer/Corpus which turn them into one-trick pony. All of their tactic can be countered by standing on box or high place.

They need more mechanics to be interesting. It's not about being hard or difficult.