[Suggestion] Alternative Energy System

[Quetzhal]

There are still some qualms with the current energy system. Don't get me wrong, I actually think it works fine as is - It's just that the system as is doesn't encourage the use of some of the more basic abilities. People would rather save up energy for more powerful abilities than waste it on basic ones, and abilities simply don't factor into combat as much as they could or should (except in Defense, I assume).

But really, I'm simply suggesting this because I decided to see if I could come up with an energy system that didn't rely on energy or cooldowns. It's just a thought!

So here's the thought: Each power has its own "pool" - not an energy pool, per se, just a number that describes how many times you can use that power consecutively. Each power has a small bar below it. Each time the bar fills, the power's "pool" ticks up by one. Each pool has a maximum possible size, so you can't spam your ultimate four times in a row.

Each bar fills by grabbing one of the current energy orbs, but is not the main way to fill up each bar. The main way is by performing actions, each ranked differently to fill up the bars. For instance, killing an enemy fills up a bar a little bit, but just damaging an enemy by backflipping off a wall and turning that into a slide melee or jump attack fills it up much more. Or shooting while wallrunning. Etc. In other words, you can fill up the bar through normal gameplay, but the system is meant to encourage you to perform more actiony ninja things. And if you do you can use your powers more.

And they have separate pools so you don't have to worry about taking away your ability to perform your ultimate. I have no idea if it's feasible, since telling the game to recognise when you chain certain movements might not be. I'm just putting the idea out there.

Edit: Team kills should also get more energy over solo kills, of course, except in solo mode. Reward teamwork as well as being awesome. Reward being awesome as a team - possibly a kind of small buff to energy gained if teammates are working together?

Edited May 3, 2013 by Quetzhal

[Yikitama]

This is great, but it'd be better if some moves did share pools. I'd imagine that some pretty overpowered combos could be performed if you weren't limited in your overall Energy usage. For example, Loki's Invis and Decoy are pretty powerful when used together, so they would have a fused pool. They wouldn't necessarily be used up at the same time but they could detract from each other fractionally. Maybe even all of the 4 abilities could be "leech-linked" in some way to prevent overuse of all of them.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Yikitama

[vats3]

okay im with you on the basic concept because it is one i have noticed myself, current system has you picking favs and only using those, however you lost me and gaining more "pool" energy by killing and geting kills while being awsome. The basic problem you run into here is the game will start to move from working togeather and go to stealing all the kills for yourself or instead of just aiming at the person killing someone else you run up a wall, leting your team mate die but ending up gaining "pool" energy.

 

The concepted i devloped awhile ago is simply energy+cd, have a cd on every abilty but have a universal energy that can be used to remove the cd for an ability. When its off CD its free to use when it is still cooling down but you just need the ability just use some energy. I wont say the system is perfect but no system is

[Quetzhal]

okay im with you on the basic concept because it is one i have noticed myself, current system has you picking favs and only using those, however you lost me and gaining more "pool" energy by killing and geting kills while being awsome. The basic problem you run into here is the game will start to move from working togeather and go to stealing all the kills for yourself or instead of just aiming at the person killing someone else you run up a wall, leting your team mate die but ending up gaining "pool" energy.

Less energy for doing things solo, more energy for killing as a team/helping and aiding teammates. Unless you're playing in Solo mode, of course. I should probably add that to the OP, thanks for pointing it out!

I did read the hybrid concept, I actually thought it would be pretty effective. I was just curious to see if it might be feasible to develop a system not reliant on energy or cooldowns. Technically though, this still leans towards energy. Ah well.

 

This is great, but it'd be better if some moves did share pools. I'd imagine that some pretty overpowered combos could be performed if you weren't limited in your overall Energy usage. For example, Loki's Invis and Decoy are pretty powerful when used together, so they would have a fused pool. They wouldn't necessarily be used up at the same time but they could detract from each other fractionally. Maybe even all of the 4 abilities could be "leech-linked" in some way to prevent overuse of all of them.

Fair point! Also, good idea.

[vats3]

I actually find your idea pretty intresting and provides for some fun mods and possibly other fun things, like have the ult removed from everything else and having its own pool, or have a mod that with every rank lets you add more pools making it a optional thing done by mods. However I can see it being a U.I. nightmare and a hassal for new players, but I still think the largest problem comes from the idea of kills for energy. Let me explain, a kill is a recourse that can be stolen, and if I have learned anything about the internet is people will steal any chance they get. All machinics should encorge players to work with each other instead of against, there was once a time when energy was a 1 drop only thing and people would kill over it. Style shooting suffers the same problem, instead of geting players to fight the task ahead with there team they start trying to do crazy stuff they cant handle just to try and get "pool" energy 

 

in the end the basic concept i find pretty fun, only losing out in in the intensity of keeping 4 complete energy counts in a small UI and having new players try and figure out what they are doing 

[Quetzhal]

I actually find your idea pretty intresting and provides for some fun mods and possibly other fun things, like have the ult removed from everything else and having its own pool, or have a mod that with every rank lets you add more pools making it a optional thing done by mods. However I can see it being a U.I. nightmare and a hassal for new players, but I still think the largest problem comes from the idea of kills for energy. Let me explain, a kill is a recourse that can be stolen, and if I have learned anything about the internet is people will steal any chance they get. All machinics should encorge players to work with each other instead of against, there was once a time when energy was a 1 drop only thing and people would kill over it. Style shooting suffers the same problem, instead of geting players to fight the task ahead with there team they start trying to do crazy stuff they cant handle just to try and get "pool" energy 

 

in the end the basic concept i find pretty fun, only losing out in in the intensity of keeping 4 complete energy counts in a small UI and having new players try and figure out what they are doing 

I know what you mean! It's why I suggested giving energy for teamwork as well. Reviving a teammate, saving a teammate (by drawing fire away, that kind of thing). More than one person damages an enemy, and player B gets the last shot? All get the same amount of energy, slightly more than they would normally get on their own. Basically, make it so that it's never really quite as beneficial to be working on your own.

UI wise - no need for 4 complete energy counts per se. Just a progression bar beneath each power, then a number at the power itself indicating the number of times you can use that power before you're out. Small numbers.

Granted getting the system to take all the right variables into account would probably be a complete nightmare. I actually doubt this is very feasible. XD Just putting the idea out there for consideration really, since the game -does- need more ways to encourage movement, exploration, and generally not playing the game like a cover shooter. I have a few more detailed and more feasible suggestions I'll probably type out eventually to encourage this kind of thing.

[securitywyrm]

Interesting idea. On my Rhino, the only abilities I ever use are charge and iron skin. Under the current system, why would I use Rhino Stomp(100) when I could use Iron Skin (15 seconds of invincibility) twice?

[Quetzhal]

Interesting idea. On my Rhino, the only abilities I ever use are charge and iron skin. Under the current system, why would I use Rhino Stomp(100) when I could use Iron Skin (15 seconds of invincibility) twice?

Precisely!

There are actually a surprising number of topics on the subject, now that I look around. Most fairly recent, too. Hm. xD

I actually think vat3's hybrid energy/cooldown system is the most efficient way to go about it, but I wanted to put this thought out there anyway.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Quetzhal