Founders Not So "founders" Anymore.

[Cleesus]

The game is still in beta and so your still a founder until it gets released.  The point of the founder packages is to support the Devs, thats it. If you feel some kind of way because other people can join you in supporting the devs months after CBT ended then you are looking at this whole thing wrong.

[SymphNo9]

XAs I read through the posts and think of my experiences with "betas" it brings up another question which I think may add fuel to the discussion fire. Do you consider "open beta" the final stage in a f2p game? Most of us know that a game in beta means that major content/systems are still in production. But then the term "open beta" has been used in many games as the final stage as sort of an excuse for the game to remain incomplete and a scapegoat for bugs and game breaking glitches. What do you think of the term "beta" and when does it end?

 

OBT also often means, besides the trivia bugs/suggestions reports, an opportunity to stress test the servers and make sure they can handle the demand when they go "Live". And as long as content is being added, it can't really be considered as "in final stage".

 

 

 

 

Your opinion is obviously skewed by the fact that you started after Open Beta started and bought GM.

 

I would have bought the package anyway if it was called something different. My point is, why does it matter, if the only thing you change is the title?

[Kantazo]

Let freedom ring!!!!

[Nod_Off]

OBT also often means, besides the trivia bugs/suggestions reports, an opportunity to stress test the servers and make sure they can handle the demand when they go "Live". And as long as content is being added, it can't really be considered as "in final stage".

 

 

Here is the problem. The game IS LIVE! It is even on Steam for goodness sake...  If it is open, for everyone to sign up and play, it is for all intents and purposes live... 

Edited May 16, 2013 by Zackai

[SymphNo9]

Here is the p[roblem. The game IS LIVE! It is even on Steam for goodness sake...  If it is open, for everyone to sign up and play, it is for all intents and purposes live... 

 

Alright, that was my mistake for bad wording. Official released, then.

[Nod_Off]

Alright, that was my mistake for bad wording. Official released, then.

 

Tell me. What in your opinion will be the difference between the current "Open Beta" and the game being officially released?  I feel like the fact that it is Live on Steam is pretty Official, Semantics aside... Which is all this is, hence the frustration that it is live, DE lied. 

 

Not trying to be a rear end, just curious as to what other people think the difference is. Because I do not see one. Everyone can get in, everyone is playing, it is on Steam... 

Edited May 16, 2013 by Zackai

[SymphNo9]

Tell me. What in your opinion will be the difference between the current "Open Beta" and the game being officially released?  I feel like the fact that it is Live on Steam is pretty Official, Semantics aside... Which is all this is, hence the frustration that it is live, DE lied. 

 

If the game was labeled officially released, I would expect less server lag, less bugs appearing, more content to play with, a better security system, transparent stat indications etc. Overall more of a polished feeling.

 

DE has come a far way with the game and don't get me wrong, the game has a lot of potential. But it still has a long way. Currently, the game lacks heavily in the content and lore department, as end game is just farming. The network code could use a revision as the current host migration system is very iffy, too much relying on hosts with good hardware. The current security is only on its baby stage, and could be improved also, with more fool proof detection.

 

By labeling the phase as a "soft launch" allows DE to gain a bit of space and time to focus on improvements for a full official release.

 

In short, quality assurance.

[Ruzu]

Ok let's bring the focus back. Would you be in favor of a premium time system or maintain the current "pack" be it founders or supporters program DE has in place?

Do you not understand the flaw in your logic? This is a free-to-play title. Any kind of "premium time system" essentially makes the game pay-to-play. A true free-to-play system should only have one-time consumables type of thing. Exp/Credit boosters are a unique type of exception because they don't offer any special in-game perks.

 

As for the founders package being advertised as a CBT offer only, I'm indifferent. If DE chose to extend the program because they needed more funds, or wanted to give players on a different platform the chance to support the game as a founder as well, they probably thought long and hard on it. Casting aside the fact that DE lied on the package ending once CB was done, you are ultimately the ones that gave it to the temptation to only have the best.

 

A logical decision would be understanding that the time frame between you getting the means to acquire that very best item, and the time until the item offer ends is not worth the financial investment, so you decide to forgo it. Afterwards, you notice that the package is still being offered, thus you realize that you have another chance to get that item you wanted to so badly. Had that happened, you wouldn't be as angry, but confused. Unfortunately, we humans mostly act on impulse. We just "have to get it" for the sake of "having it". I'm guilty of that from time to time.

 

As for the solar landmark, it's a nice perk, but your feeling of "being privileged" is a pointless one at best. Let's say there are 200 stages in the game(hypothetically). During the CBT, 100,000 people were able to acquire it. That would mean 100,000/200=5,000 names per stage at least. With that many people listed per stage, then yeah, it's impossible to feel "unique" and you don't feel as important anymore, but let's face it, you are not any more important then the other 4999 people who bought the highest tier, and you are certainly not any more important because you might've been the first to bought it. Most importantly, why does pride still even exist? It is a useless sense of entitlement that only you care about. What purpose does it serve other then "knowing"? if you bought the highest tier, it would've been better if you bought it to support DE on the maximum extreme end of the scale, instead of doing it purely to have your name listed in the game. I agree it's a nice perk, but that's all.

 

And stop saying that OBT's are only saying this because they came in after CBT. What does that have to do with anything? I would have the same opinion on this founders package regardless of if I came here during CBT or OBT.

 

Anyways, those are my thoughts on the matter. I'm open to criticism on how I view things ofc.

[Soulie]

I kinda think Founders packs should stay in until the game leaves open beta.

[Nod_Off]

I kinda think Founders packs should stay in until the game leaves open beta.

Fair enough. DE has already spit in the faces of Closed Beta Founders, so might as well. 

[GoneM4d]

What if we just have a quick and simple fix where any founder package purchased before OBT were to be called founders and the post CBT just ''Supporter''? It also would be nice to have a little change in the Icon which would say ''Founder'' that would show that he/she purchased the game before OBT and was a true ''Founder''. Small, quick,easy fix and maybe leave the planet naming to ''Founders'' not ''Supporters''(just saying)

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

Fair enough. DE has already spit in the faces of Closed Beta Founders, so might as well. 

 

The comparison of spitting in faces is a bit strong man.  It is their game, and when we click that EULA we agree to their terms.  That being said, what's legal/policy and what makes people happy are two different things.  I got the founders pack and I'm a post Open Beta Founder.  While I see your point that they changed their word, things like this happen all the time.  I think that both sides arguing for their own right/wrong (being Closed or Open) is allot of energy gone wasted, as these concerns/feelings should be directed toward DE's management rather than each other.  After all, we can't technically step into each other's shoes, simply because well, some of us were here before and some of us were here later.  There's no changing that.

Edited May 16, 2013 by sushidubya

[Mak_Gohae]

I dont care for fancy badges and titles all i wanted was that Ex Prime,son!

DE can use whatever they want to bring money into the game.

 

And for the solar landmarks, maybe they should make some of those 2.5D cards for the people that get solar landmarks to use as the landmarks.

Those folks tell DE which of their Warframes they want to use for the card then they put in a button in each of the stages that when you press it brings up the list of cards.

[N4G4M4K1]

You have my full support on this issue. I thought myself very priviledged to have the Founders' program available to me, having joined the second week of OBT. A "Founder" should have the recognition they deserve, despite your repeated stating that it wasn't an entitlement thing.

 

At the very least, a time stamp for when they purchased it, so we can properly recognize and give respect to those who contributed to the game before it went public.

[Nod_Off]

N4G4M4K1, on 16 May 2013 - 2:30 PM, said:

You have my full support on this issue. I thought myself very priviledged to have the Founders' program available to me, having joined the second week of OBT. A "Founder" should have the recognition they deserve, despite your repeated stating that it wasn't an entitlement thing.

At the very least, a time stamp for when they purchased it, so we can properly recognize and give respect to those who contributed to the game before it went public.

That sounds like a very fair way to go about it. Thank you for understanding.

Mak_Gohae, on 16 May 2013 - 2:22 PM, said:

I dont care for fancy badges and titles all i wanted was that Ex Prime,son!

DE can use whatever they want to bring money into the game.

And for the solar landmarks, maybe they should make some of those 2.5D cards for the people that get solar landmarks to use as the landmarks.

Those folks tell DE which of their Warframes they want to use for the card then they put in a button in each of the stages that when you press it brings up the list of cards.

That is a cool idea, and not one I had even considered.

GoneM4d, on 16 May 2013 - 2:12 PM, said:

What if we just have a quick and simple fix where any founder package purchased before OBT were to be called founders and the post CBT just ''Supporter''? It also would be nice to have a little change in the Icon which would say ''Founder'' that would show that he/she purchased the game before OBT and was a true ''Founder''. Small, quick,easy fix and maybe leave the planet naming to ''Founders'' not ''Supporters''(just saying)

I think this is my favorite idea thus far, though, it would just ruffle more feathers, as you can see from this thread, there are some people who joined Post Open Beta, and feel very strongly that they are considered founders as well, even though they are playing a relatively stable, full game. Where Closed Beta members played a very broken game often, with little to no content at times.

The difference between Closed and Open, would be very hard to tell if you started Post Open Beta. If you did not play the closed beta, with the lack of things to do at times, etc, your understanding of the situation is not complete.

[Thypari2013]

You want to stop one of the best money making programs DE has, so you can feel more privileged?

Really?

 

 

As a founder I propose to make somebody lose his founders status if he makes or supports threads that go against DE or harms DE's business model for self profit. We are founders and we should support DE and their money-making methodes instead of destroy them for our self profit. Shame on you!

Edited May 16, 2013 by Thypari2013

[Promite]

So this is an "I wanna be a special snowflake" thread?

[Nod_Off]

You want to stop one of the best money making programs DE has, so you can feel more privileged?

Really?

 

 

As a founder I propose to make somebody lose his founders status if he makes or supports threads that go against DE or harms DE's business model for self profit. We are founders and we should support DE and their money-making methodes instead of destroy them for our self profit. Shame on you!

 

 

So this is an "I wanna be a special snowflake" thread?

 

 

Nope, just change it to a Supporter program, and call it a day. 

 

This is about DE having sold the Founders package as one thing, and then just ignored it completely. 

[SymphNo9]

That sounds like a very fair way to go about it. Thank you for understanding.

That is a cool idea, and not one I had even considered.

I think this is my favorite idea thus far, though, it would just ruffle more feathers, as you can see from this thread, there are some people who joined Post Open Beta, and feel very strongly that they are considered founders as well, even though they are playing a relatively stable, full game. Where Closed Beta members played a very broken game often, with little to no content at times.

The difference between Closed and Open, would be very hard to tell if you started Post Open Beta. If you did not play the closed beta, with the lack of things to do at times, etc, your understanding of the situation is not complete.

 

I'm sorry, but what has a "stable full game" and "lack of things to do" to do with the subject in focus? Are you saying I shouldn't be purchasing the Founder program because I didn't endure the same pain as you did during the CBT?

Edited May 16, 2013 by SymphNo9

[Nod_Off]

I'm sorry, but what has a "stable full game" and "lack of things to do" to do with the subject in focus? Are you saying I shouldn't be purchasing the Founder program because I didn't endure the same pain as you did during the CBT?

You dont, but that is not what I was saying at all.

I am saying, it is easy for you to claim one thing, while not having been a part of half the equation. 

[Nod_Off]

So this is an "I wanna be a special snowflake" thread?

 

I pitch to you a bag of seeds, to help grow your garden. I tell you these seeds will become a rare plant that is endangered. You buy it, then find out that it is not actually rare or endangered, and you actually now have the same trees everyone else does.

 

 

There really is no point in arguing about this, as it wont change, it is just disappointing, and frustrating. 

[Notso]

Do you not understand the flaw in your logic? This is a free-to-play title. Any kind of "premium time system" essentially makes the game pay-to-play. A true free-to-play system should only have one-time consumables type of thing. Exp/Credit boosters are a unique type of exception because they don't offer any special in-game perks.

 

You are joking right? It's Pay-to-Play because you can optionally Pay-to-Save-About-An-Hour-Of-Farming-And-4-Days-Of-Building?

[Bennyworld]

So true, the founder's program has been going on for too long now.

[Elyan]

Your opinion is obviously skewed by the fact that you started after Open Beta started and bought GM.

 

Whether it is true or not, it is not a worthwhile basis for a debate since you are assuming that one's opinion is completely dependant on their own interest without thought to objectivity. In that case, there would be no need to debate, the most popular result would follow directly from the numbers of persons in each category...

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

I pitch to you a bag of seeds, to help grow your garden. I tell you these seeds will become a rare plant that is endangered. You buy it, then find out that it is not actually rare or endangered, and you actually now have the same trees everyone else does.

 

 

There really is no point in arguing about this, as it wont change, it is just disappointing, and frustrating. 

 

But But....  You have the founder bling and the vandal bling....  =/