De Please Answer Us! Will You Buff Any Contents Inside The Founder Pack?

[Chaosyn]

 

 

 

What I mean is that they aren't up-to-date with what Prime frames provide. I'm sure you knew that.

Also what I meant.

[Eidolon_Slayer]

 

We have had plenty of lore changes in the past. There is no reason why we can't have one more with this frame. If you say that Excal P and a farmable advanced Excal shouldn't be on the same level, then you are just being petty, selfish, and greedy. This excal also wouldn't be a recreation. It would be missing the aura polarity(possibly) and the Gold adornments of Excal p, so it wouldn't be a complete recreation. 

 

Changing the lore is the DE's decision. Until then, we can't form a realistic -logical- conclusion if we dwell within fictional boundaries in our decisions. Saying that I'm petty, selfish, and greedy just means that you want to make decisions based on unrealistic facts. That you can't best my opinions based on hard fact. 

[Chaosyn]

 

We have had plenty of lore changes in the past. There is no reason why we can't have one more with this frame. If you say that Excal P and a farmable advanced Excal shouldn't be on the same level, then you are just being petty, selfish, and greedy. This excal also wouldn't be a recreation. It would be missing the aura polarity(possibly) and the Gold adornments of Excal p, so it wouldn't be a complete recreation. 

 

 

 

 

There's really only a few options: Buff the Sweatshop 3,or remove all buffs (aside from Death Orb energy)from all Primes (making them cosmetic again). Adding something that is non-Prime that's just a Prime without gold isn't possible.

Primes are as powerful as they are because of the Orokin. Basics are as powerful as they are because that's the best Tenno can do.

If DE changes the lore,fine....go for it,but as it stands now that's the limits of the tech we have.

[LordOfScrugging]

I know it just seems like you guys are painting everyone opposing a buff as jealous. 

there is a good bit of jealousy when it comes to excal prime. 

 

 

We have had plenty of lore changes in the past. There is no reason why we can't have one more with this frame. If you say that Excal P and a farmable advanced Excal shouldn't be on the same level, then you are just being petty, selfish, and greedy. This excal also wouldn't be a recreation. It would be missing the aura polarity(possibly) and the Gold adornments of Excal p, so it wouldn't be a complete recreation. 

 

 

 

 

and by that logic, there would also be advanced versions of other frames so why bother making primes anymore?

 

there are 2 options when it comes to ALL primes. either buff the 3 primes with no differences (excal p, frost p, and mag p), or nerf the 5 primes with advantages (rhino p, loki p, nyx p, nova p, and volt p)

Edited June 11, 2015 by LordOfScrugging

[OumaNoUta]

Honestly if it meant Excal prime got a buff like other primes over normal Excal I wouldn't mind him being re-released but not as a permanent access like other primes. Could be something like dex ever year, were you can buy excal prime again like we founders did. Everyone gets there chance for Excal prime, skana prime, and lato prime again. If you missed it to bad wait till next year, but everyone still has a chance at getting them.

[K0bra]

Lets try to get an answer from DE in the next Devstream.Lets make a question in the Devstream topic.

[LordOfScrugging]

Lets try to get an answer from DE in the next Devstream.Lets make a question in the Devstream topic.

there was someone who asked [DE]Rebecca if there were any plans to update the older primes and although vague in the sense that she didn't say excal prime wasn't included, she said its on the table but nothing soon

[Chaosyn]

You know what's funny? Remember how much DE HATED Arcane Helms? Had they kept them they could have easily made non-founders happy.....

Just release a helm that makes him ALMOST as strong as a Prime(and is Basic Excal ONLY)....I bet if they did that a lot of the hatred for a needed buff would go silent...

(As in whatever buff EP got the Basic Excal ONLY helm could have had half or 1/3 of it for example)

[(PSN)deathfrombelow5]

Changing the lore is the DE's decision. Until then, we can't form a realistic -logical- conclusion if we dwell within fictional boundaries in our decisions. Saying that I'm petty, selfish, and greedy just means that you want to make decisions based on unrealistic facts. That you can't best my opinions based on hard fact. 

If you want to talk about uses of the ad hominem fallacy, we can start with your post calling all non-founders jealous.

 

 

Why? Because jealously. They can't have what we have, so they're complaining on how it isn't fair. As if Excalibur was the sole frame they use.

 

I re-quoted it here for your convenience. 

 

Also, there is no reason, lore wise, preventing an advanced excal from receiving an identical buff to a prime excal.

 

Lets take shields as an example. As part of the quest for the Dex Excal frame, the lotus could uncover a "shield efficiency modulator" that allows a warframe to have more effective shields, without the warframe having to divert more energy to the shields. This would increase the warframe's "shield capacity" without compromising any other systems. Because of the unique make-up of the device, It only works with the specially modified "Dex Excalibur frame". 

 

There is your valid lore reason. 

[swodaem]

Just wondering if DE would have answers to this? It wouldn't have to be much, 20 armor and call it a day. Also wondering if a Prisma Excalibur would happen just to work around the "exclusive" founders pack like they did with Skana.

[K0bra]

I think this whole discussion comes back to the point that people want to rerelease Founder stuff what DE said trillion times that they this stuff will never coming back.So why discuss people about that?There isnt any point when the trillion statements are clear and everybody can see them.

This thread was about buffs for the Founder gear not of avaiable or rereleasing them.

So lets try to get an answer from DE.Devstream?PM?

Edited June 11, 2015 by K0bra

[Eidolon_Slayer]

If you want to talk about uses of the ad hominem fallacy, we can start with your post calling all non-founders jealous.

 

 

 

I re-quoted it here for your convenience. 

 

Also, there is no reason, lore wise, preventing an advanced excal from receiving an identical buff to a prime excal.

 

Lets take shields as an example. As part of the quest for the Dex Excal frame, the lotus could uncover a "shield efficiency modulator" that allows a warframe to have more effective shields, without the warframe having to divert more energy to the shields. This would increase the warframe's "shield capacity" without compromising any other systems. Because of the unique make-up of the device, It only works with the specially modified "Dex Excalibur frame". 

 

There is your valid lore reason. 

Ad hominem also applies to you, indirectly calling me petty, selfish, and greedy.

 

Until a "shield efficiency modular" exists and serves the same purpose in the lore. I see no reason why you would need to incorporate that story into your decisions.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Prometheium

[Chaosyn]

If you want to talk about uses of the ad hominem fallacy, we can start with your post calling all non-founders jealous.

 

 

 

I re-quoted it here for your convenience. 

 

Also, there is no reason, lore wise, preventing an advanced excal from receiving an identical buff to a prime excal.

 

Lets take shields as an example. As part of the quest for the Dex Excal frame, the lotus could uncover a "shield efficiency modulator" that allows a warframe to have more effective shields, without the warframe having to divert more energy to the shields. This would increase the warframe's "shield capacity" without compromising any other systems. Because of the unique make-up of the device, It only works with the specially modified "Dex Excalibur frame". 

 

There is your valid lore reason. 

Actually Lore IS the reason ...Like I said.... Primes are Orokin and are the REAL Frames. They can't be duplicated as that art died with them.

Basics are Tenno made and are as strong as they can be....For Lotus to make an even stronger frame than the Tenno themselves (Lotus makes Dexes)is nonsense.... If she COULD make stronger frames then why do we even HAVE Basics?

[Eidolon_Slayer]

Actually Lore IS the reason ...Like I said.... Primes are Orokin and are the REAL Frames. They can't be duplicated as that art died with them.

Basics are Tenno made and are as strong as they can be....For Lotus to make an even stronger frame than the Tenno themselves (Lotus makes Dexes)is nonsense.... If she COULD make stronger frames then why do we even HAVE Basics?

That is the fact which I base my decisions on.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Prometheium

[Chaosyn]

Just wondering if DE would have answers to this? It wouldn't have to be much, 20 armor and call it a day. Also wondering if a Prisma Excalibur would happen just to work around the "exclusive" founders pack like they did with Skana.

 Any Prisma frame would be a skin only at this point. Otherwise they'd destroy (even more) drop tables,and there would just be too many frames with 3 versions of each. Also Basics would pretty much die off....No one would want them if they can have the equivalent of a Prime without having to Void farm.....Also Prisma Skana is not DE working around the Skana Prime...  It IS a better Skana (than the basic one),You make it sound like DE is wringing their hands and laughing that they got one over on founders....

[TheBrsrkr]

Just make the Hayden tenno skin give stats or something. No big deal.

[LordOfScrugging]

If you want to talk about uses of the ad hominem fallacy, we can start with your post calling all non-founders jealous.

 

 

 

I re-quoted it here for your convenience. 

 

Also, there is no reason, lore wise, preventing an advanced excal from receiving an identical buff to a prime excal.

 

Lets take shields as an example. As part of the quest for the Dex Excal frame, the lotus could uncover a "shield efficiency modulator" that allows a warframe to have more effective shields, without the warframe having to divert more energy to the shields. This would increase the warframe's "shield capacity" without compromising any other systems. Because of the unique make-up of the device, It only works with the specially modified "Dex Excalibur frame". 

 

There is your valid lore reason. 

by your reasoning, there should also be Dex Loki and Dex Nova as well, which will defeat the purpose of primes completely. Don't try passing it off as "well it only applies to excal for such and such reason"

[Karlox]

so you're telling me that you'd prefer founders having an entire frame family belonging solely to the founders? with said frame getting augments and a potential prime variant that also belongs to founders only?

 

You just need 3 exclusive things. The primes of the exclusives aren't necessary. And yes, I want you to have those exclusives not involving anything from the game that the players can actually get, the why's down here ↓

 

I understand you are frustrated. I feel for you. But you will NEVER get excal prime anymore. You missed out. Just like I missed out on primed chamber, or braton vandal, and the lato prime. 

 

Your frustration should not stop others who have it to get their prime warframe on the same level as the other prime warframes. 

 

I'll try to explain to you with oranges. We've both an orange, but yours is yellow, sure no problem. In the market there are some apples with their respective yellow version, melons with their respective yellow version, pineapples with their respective versions and so on.

 

We all have access to the yellow version of the fruits except for that orange, and that's a really bad move. Because the so called buff on the orange you want it's a necessary one for everyone, not for your exclusivity. Do you copy? That's the problem here. If they had make an exclusive banana only for you the rest couldn't care less because they never used the banana before.

 

That's what most of their jealously, frustration, whatever you want to say come.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Karlox

[(PSN)deathfrombelow5]

Ad hominem also applies to you, indirectly calling me petty, selfish, and greedy.

 

Until a "shield efficiency modular" exists and serves the same purpose in the lore. I see no reason why you would need to incorporate that story into your decisions.

It definitely applies to me. My point is that you should not tell others that they can't use facts, when you are on record using personal attacks instead of facts.

 

New lore is created as an avenue of introducing new concepts into the game. Any of the new frames can be used as examples for this. Many of the recent frames (Mirage, Limbo, Chroma) were introduced through new lore concepts. 

 

 

Actually Lore IS the reason ...Like I said.... Primes are Orokin and are the REAL Frames. They can't be duplicated as that art died with them.

Basics are Tenno made and are as strong as they can be....For Lotus to make an even stronger frame than the Tenno themselves (Lotus makes Dexes)is nonsense.... If she COULD make stronger frames then why do we even HAVE Basics?

 

The game occurs on a timeline. If the lotus just discovered this new part, then she can't have incorporated it into the standard model. Even if she could, Our starter frames are from the orokin era (We wake up after cryo sleep, we weren't just walking around), and so can't be modified from the gate. 

 

 

by your reasoning, there should also be Dex Loki and Dex Nova as well, which will defeat the purpose of primes completely. Don't try passing it off as "well it only applies to excal for such and such reason"

 

There are plenty of things in the game that are valid by lore standards but aren't in the game. Also, there is no reason why a frame could be built to support this experimental thing, and why that frame couldn't be excal (Whose prime has been "lost to the void").

Edited June 11, 2015 by (PS4)deathfrombelow5

[Chaosyn]

You just need 3 exclusive things. The primes of the exclusives aren't necessary. And yes, I want you to have those exclusives not involving anything from the game that the players can actually get, the why's down here ↓

 

 

I'll try to explain to you with oranges. We've both an orange, but yours is yellow, sure no problem. In the market there are some apples with their respective yellow version, melons with their respective yellow version, pineapples with their respective versions and so on.

 

We all have access to the yellow version of the fruits except for that orange, and that's a really bad move. Because the so called buff on the orange you want it's a necessary one for everyone, not for your exclusivity. Do you copy? That's the problem here. If they had make an exclusive banana only for you the rest couldn't care less because they never used the banana before.

 

That's what most of their jealously, frustration, whatever you want to say come.

That doesn't even come close to making sense.... If they can't have the banana and the banana has no other version then the collectors will be straight homicidally mad....Because that one piece of fruit is unique to all other fruit makes it MORE desirable not less.

[Karlox]

That doesn't even come close to making sense.... If they can't have the banana and the banana has no other version then the collectors will be straight homicidally mad....Because that one piece of fruit is unique to all other fruit makes it MORE desirable not less.

 

The problem is, with that thing they only would like the banana.

 

With the current situation, they want the yellow orange and the BUFF to be opened to them also.

 

The desirable level on both is the same because they're exclusive in both situations.

[Eidolon_Slayer]

It definitely applies to me. My point is that you should not tell others that they can't use facts, when you are on record using personal attacks instead of facts.

 

New lore is created as an avenue of introducing new concepts into the game. Any of the new frames can be used as examples for this. Many of the recent frames (Mirage, Limbo, Chroma) were introduced through new lore concepts. 

 

Mirage, Limbo, and Chromo follow aspects of current lore. Lore that doesn't seem appropriate is removed entirely. New lore must correspond with older lore. Your "shield efficiency modular" that is exclusively for a Dex Excalibur doesn't have enough backstory to explain why it would even be compatible solely with a specific Warframe.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Prometheium

[LordOfScrugging]

You just need 3 exclusive things. The primes of the exclusives aren't necessary. And yes, I want you to have those exclusives not involving anything from the game that the players can actually get, the why's down here ↓

 

 

I'll try to explain to you with oranges. We've both an orange, but yours is yellow, sure no problem. In the market there are some apples with their respective yellow version, melons with their respective yellow version, pineapples with their respective versions and so on.

 

We all have access to the yellow version of the fruits except for that orange, and that's a really bad move. Because the so called buff on the orange you want it's a necessary one for everyone, not for your exclusivity. Do you copy? That's the problem here. If they had make an exclusive banana only for you the rest couldn't care less because they never used the banana before.

 

That's what most of their jealously, frustration, whatever you want to say come.

you lost me on the fruit. also you made me hungry now. to what we were talking about. if there were an exclusive set of 1 frame and 2 weapons, then there are bound to be prime variants. if those primes exist, they'd have to be only accessible to founders since it would kinda be a giant middle finger. "hey you know that exclusive frame you bought for $250? well here is an even better version that everyone else can use :D" it's going to be the same regardless of what the exclusive set is. someone is gonna want it to get tweaked. someone will say no because they cannot get it. it will be a cycle of the same crap over and over again

 

It definitely applies to me. My point is that you should not tell others that they can't use facts, when you are on record using personal attacks instead of facts.

 

New lore is created as an avenue of introducing new concepts into the game. Any of the new frames can be used as examples for this. Many of the recent frames (Mirage, Limbo, Chroma) were introduced through new lore concepts. 

 

 

 

The game occurs on a timeline. If the lotus just discovered this new part, then she can't have incorporated it into the standard model. Even if she could, Our starter frames are from the orokin era (We wake up after cryo sleep, we weren't just walking around), and so can't be modified from the gate. 

 

 

 

There are plenty of things in the game that are valid by lore standards but aren't in the game. Also, there is no reason why a frame could be built to support this experimental thing, and why that frame couldn't be excal (Whose prime has been "lost to the void").

except to make it fair, the part should be usable on all frames, not just excalibur, which goes back to rendering primes useless if you can just take the vanilla and make it as strong, or even better than the prime version

[Kaiservadin]

A yes or no will suffice. Excalibur prime needs to be in line and consistent with the other primes. With the rework coming it is the perfect time! Many agree the other two weapons need a buff too. Please give us an answer thank you.

They don't normally respond to post aim at them from my experince i guess its because it would show favorism or something.

[Chaosyn]

The game occurs on a timeline. If the lotus just discovered this new part, then she can't have incorporated it into the standard model. Even if she could, Our starter frames are from the orokin era (We wake up after cryo sleep, we weren't just walking around), and so can't be modified from the gate. 

 

 

 

 

And you don't think that the Tenno would discover how to make THEIR frames stronger rather than or before an AI that usually can only state the obvious and send the oddest wake up calls in hotel history? (sorry I need to make SOME jokes....too much serious)