Devil's Advocate – Rollerball A Necessary Evil

[Zhonatta]

Somewhere deep-deep-down under layers of suppressed anger, frustration, and fear you do in fact admire the simplistic and devastating nature of the enemy known as the Rollerball. To think of all the enemies you have ever faced a ball, that rolls, would bring you to your knees. It's not that it out smarts you, out maneuvers, or out damages you. Lets face it when comparing intelligence, tactics, and technology you the “Tenno” are it's superior in every way. None the less you are now at the brink, but one step from leaping into the cold depths of insanity all... over... a rolling ball. Your quiet pathetic when you think about it.......

 

   - Last Thoughts of Dying Tenno

 

So, I would argue that those enemies we love to hate are in fact the most needed out of them all.

 

Discuss

Edited May 25, 2013 by Zhonatta

[Rezule]

you are a god Amung Men.

[Gestalt]

There needs to be a Grinder Warfame. It'll just be a giant Grinder with a Tenno piloting inside. Grineer Grinders can't touch that stuff. Wtf do you do to a huge ball with a bunch of small balls? That's right: nothing.

[Zhonatta]

There needs to be a Grinder Warfame. It'll just be a giant Grinder with a Tenno piloting inside. Grineer Grinders can't touch that stuff. Wtf do you do to a huge ball with a bunch of small balls? That's right: nothing.

 

This was essentially my suggestion for a new Warframe. Justice is a dish best served with balls of steel.

[Cypherdiaz]

Soo basically...Tenno in a giant metal hamster ball?

 

And the Rollers become a lot less scary/more funny when you handle them as we do in my little group.

We call them Hamsters because they remind us of evil hamster balls. The screams over skype of "HAMSTER ATTACK" are hilarious.

 

But those damn balls..no one can say the Grineer don't have balls of steel (Yay bad Duke Nukem pun)

[Zhonatta]

But those damn balls..no one can say the Grineer don't have balls of steel (Yay bad Duke Nukem pun)

 

Exactly, my point they make the Grineer challenging. Every time you walk up to a corner or door you think, " There might be a roller ball or two or three. Do I have enough energy for Ability 4?"

[TisEric]

[BoompigXD]

These things are a rushers nightmare....................

have more of them

[TisEric]

These things are a rushers nightmare....................

have more of them

 

a rusher wouldn't even blink at the rollers.... true nightmare are slow team mates.

[Zhonatta]

PIC

 

Wow I can't stop laughing at this post. I have no idea what your intent was, but damn if it isn't appropriate.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Zhonatta

[BoompigXD]

a rusher wouldn't even blink at the rollers.... true nightmare are slow team mates.

then make them faster or just have an entire horde of them that fills up the whole room

[Zhonatta]

Honestly increase the frequency of lock downs and such would fix the " Rusher Issue".

 

Then there are the scorpions.....

Edited May 24, 2013 by Zhonatta

[BoompigXD]

I'm probably going to start a topic on how to fix the Rushers.

[Zhonatta]

I'm probably going to start a topic on how to fix the Rushers.

 

Have at it.

[Aerensiniac]

They say that haters are also fans.

Its in fact true. An enemy that can get a reaction out of you, is an enemy that has fulfilled its role.

I hate roller balls and thus i love them. They are an enemy that fulfill their role, and alas if someone is too stupid to press 4 then he/she deserves to stagger into death.

[Zhonatta]

They say that haters are also fans.

Its in fact true. An enemy that can get a reaction out of you, is an enemy that has fulfilled its role.

I hate roller balls and thus i love them. They are an enemy that fulfill their role, and alas if someone is too stupid to press 4 then he/she deserves to stagger into death.

 

Depends on what 4 your are pressing if you catch what I am throwing :D

[Zhonatta]

I would argue that same point can be made for the Ancient Infested Disrupters, Toxic, Healers.

 

I honestly cant think of anything very menacing in corpus missions. Hopefully DE will look into that.

 

Maybe rolling cubes?

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Exactly, my point they make the Grineer challenging. Every time you walk up to a corner or door you think, " There might be a roller ball or two or three. Do I have enough energy for Ability 4?"

That's not really a challenge though. It's tedium.

[Zhonatta]

That's not really a challenge though. It's tedium.

 

No, killing Rollerballs in themselves is not a challenging task. I wouldn't agree with it being tedious given their head on attack pattern and relatively low health. Not to mention the abundance of abilities that can kill them easily. If you are paying attention you can dispatch them with relative ease.

 

Annoying is a better word. They are so effective because of there low profile, speed, persistence, and CC.

 

In essence they are the a perfect support drone. Not only do they wear on you physically in game, but mentally out of the game and that my friend is why they are great and an essential opponent in the game.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Zhonatta

[RealityMachina]

No, killing Rollerballs in themselves is not a challenging task. I wouldn't agree with it being tedious given their head on attack pattern and relatively low health. Not to mention the abundance of abilities that can kill them easily. If you are paying attention you can dispatch them with relative ease.

 

Annoying is a better word. They are so effective because of there low profile, speed, persistence, and CC.

 

In essence they are the a perfect support drone. Not only do they wear on you physically in game, but mentally out of the game and that my friend is why they are great and an essential opponent in the game.

It's posts like this that make me glad certain people like you on the board aren't video game developers.

 

Because holy S#&$ you people wouldn't know good video game design if Yager Development or Koijima Productions spent entire years trying to teach you people on what constitutes effective out of game engagement with the players.

[Argoms]

Adding difficulty by taking control away from the player doesn't make things any more fun. Rollers being fast moving, hard to hit enemies that can deal damage is fine, but the fact that they stun you is just annoying. 

[Zhonatta]

It's posts like this that make me glad certain people like you on the board aren't video game developers.

 

Because holy S#&$ you people wouldn't know good video game design if Yager Development or Koijima Productions spent entire years trying to teach you people on what constitutes effective out of game engagement with the players.

 

I have to chuckle a bit at this comment and your attempt to degrade my position without any kind substance when in fact people like me are game developers and you might possibly be playing one of their games....maybe. 

 

Adding difficulty by taking control away from the player doesn't make things any more fun. Rollers being fast moving, hard to hit enemies that can deal damage is fine, but the fact that they stun you is just annoying. 

 

If the Rollerballs didn't have a stun you would simply ignore them, the Grineer assault would be that much less challenging, and we wouldn't be having a conversation about how people find it overly difficult to prioritize a detrimental game mechanic that is very easily avoided with what you have available to you and if you are paying attention.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Zhonatta

[RealityMachina]

I have to chuckle a bit at this comment and your attempt to degrade my position without any kind substance when in fact people like me are game developers and you might possibly be playing one of their games....maybe.

I'm quite willing to take my chances with someone who thinks "annoying" is somethnig to be strived for in gameplay.

If the Rollerballs didn't have a stun you would simply ignore them, the Grineer assault would be that much less challenging, and we wouldn't be having a conversation about how people find it overly difficult to prioritize a detrimental game mechanic that is very easily avoided with what you have available to you and if you are paying attention.

Protip: If large portions of the playerbase is reporting problems with them, perhaps they're not as easy to avoid as you think.

 

I mean this is before we get into the fact that they're just a terrible enemy in general since the only way they can be in anyway a threat to players is through their staggering capabilites when they attack in swarms, and has resulted in the absurdity of the most dangerous thing in the Grineer arsenal being a fast moving metal ball. (Though with update 8, now they're in a contest with lightly armoured Grineer women who can somehow impart much more force against a Tenno despite not having what looks like an exoskeleton nor the muscle mass to compensate for that.)

 

I mean something has gone wrong when playable characters from a much more cover focused game (ME3 MP), are mechanically much stronger when it comes to the resisting forced movement capabilites than the co-op game that's supposed to be about badass space ninjas.

[Argoms]

If the Rollerballs didn't have a stun you would simply ignore them, the Grineer assault would be that much less challenging, and we wouldn't be having a conversation about how people find it overly difficult to prioritize a detrimental game mechanic that is very easily avoided with what you have available to you and if you are paying attention.

Then give them some other mechanic that makes them a threat. Stun isn't a good penalty because it takes away control from the player.

 

Have them disable shield recharge on hit.

Have them reduce armor temporarily on hit.

Have them slow the player on hit.

Have a portion of their damage ignore shields.

Have all enemies focus on the player most recently hit by a roller.

Have them push the player in the direction that they were hit.

 

Just don't completely remove the player's control over his character for a few seconds.

[Zhonatta]

Then give them some other mechanic that makes them a threat. Stun isn't a good penalty because it takes away control from the player.

 

Have them disable shield recharge on hit.

Have them reduce armor temporarily on hit.

Have them slow the player on hit.

Have a portion of their damage ignore shields.

Have all enemies focus on the player most recently hit by a roller.

Have them push the player in the direction that they were hit.

 

Just don't completely remove the player's control over his character for a few seconds.

 

If any of those effect were implement to such a degree to render the same threat level effect as the stun you would be equally as annoyed and in some cause worst off. The fact of the matter is they are weak and easily killed. The trade off is that if you ignore them they can indirectly result in your death .

 

 

I'm quite willing to take my chances with someone who thinks "annoying" is somethnig to be strived for in gameplay.

 

 

Protip: If large portions of the playerbase is reporting problems with them, perhaps they're not as easy to avoid as you think.

 

I mean this is before we get into the fact that they're just a terrible enemy in general since the only way they can be in anyway a threat to players is through their staggering capabilites when they attack in swarms, and has resulted in the absurdity of the most dangerous thing in the Grineer arsenal being a fast moving metal ball. (Though with update 8, now they're in a contest with lightly armoured Grineer women who can somehow impart much more force against a Tenno despite not having what looks like an exoskeleton nor the muscle mass to compensate for that.)

 

I mean something has gone wrong when playable characters from a much more cover focused game (ME3 MP), are mechanically much stronger when it comes to the resisting forced movement capabilites than the co-op game that's supposed to be about badass space ninjas.

 

I hate to be the bearer of bad new, but the portion of the player base who have voiced frustration with the Rollerballs does not account for a "large" portion of the player base. It is in fact a small "Vocal" portion and the "Large" portion are to busy enjoying the game to even come on the forums. At best several 100 players out of a couple 100,000 players have had an issue with the rollerballs. This just looking at past topics concerning this enemy.

 

As for your assessment of their threat level the same could be applied to most every other enemy in this game and most other games for that matter. Which enemies other then bosses in this game are a threat by themselves? The answer to that is a staggering zero. I can't think of a single non-boss enemy in this game I would fear facing 1v1. This is the nature of Warframe the Grineer attack with an assortment of classes that are created to compliment one another. 

 

Instead of thinking about what you are up against try thinking about what they are up against. 1-4 human players with vastly superior abilities and weapons able to think and perform outside of a pre-scripted environment. That is a tall order to create a challenge for. So when you are playing by their rules and not accounting for their weakness of course you should get rolled, so to speak.

 

Please don't try to rationalize a fictional game let alone use another games universe to do it. In this universe for some reason unbeknownst to us they have sufficient mass, acceleration, and technology to knock you over because "Magic".

 

I do however wish that the heavy units were a tad bit more challenging.

 

I stand by my previous statement that they add far more to the game play then they take away. Of course this is just my opinion and everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Zhonatta