[Weapon Request] Lucerne -- Slow-Firing (Approx 450 Rpm), Hard-Hitting Automatic Rifle

[Nuntium]

Well, Mjölnir wouldn't be too weird for a rifle I guess.

I mean, Mass Effect has the Mattock.

 

Still, lower RoF please.

Something in the 3-5 range.

Higher damage and crit chance to cover for it.

Something like... 42 accuracy (do the numbers even mean anything?).

 

Anyhow, I support the cause.

The burstron would sound right if it wasn't for the whole burst-shot thing.

 

Sooo.. the Latron?

[Volt_Cruelerz]

First off, I'm for a heavier-hitting weapon than the current autos (I really wish they wouldn't have buffed the Braton so much... makes things a lot more difficult :( ).  

 

Let's look at a few related weapons first...

 

-Braton-

Damage: 20

Rate: 11.3

Magazine: 45

Reload: 2.3

Crit Chance: 5%

Crit Damage: 150%

Accuracy: decent

Polarities: none

Raw DPS: 242.95

True DPS: 154.06

 

-Burston-

Damage: 21

Rate: 3.3x3

Magazine: 45

Reload: 1.9

Crit Chance: 5%

Crit Damage: 150%

Accuracy: extreme but with vertical climb

Polarities: 1xV

Raw DPS: 223.49

True DPS: 157.62

Other: burst-fire

 

-Latron-

Damage: 40

Rate: 4.2

Magazine: 15

Reload: 2.4

Crit Chance: 7.5%

Crit Damage: 150%

Accuracy: extreme

Polarities: 1xV

Raw DPS: 186.9

True DPS: 111.81

Other: appears to have some level of sound suppression for stealth

 

 

Let's try something along the lines of this:

 

-Mjölnir-

Class: Heavy Assault Rifle

Damage: 25

Rate: 8.1

Magazine: 17

Ammo: 255

Reload: 1.05

Crit Chance: 7.5%

Crit Damage: 200%

Polarities: 1xV

Accuracy: high

Raw DPS: 232.88

True DPS: 155.16

 

Now, let's take a look at what these numbers mean.  By these numbers, the Mjolnir splits the DPS gap between the Burston and the Braton as well as carving out a niche where it can fire at will for a brief period before its magazine is exhausted, promoting obsessive reloading which is enabled by the low reload time.  In addition, due to its boosted crit stats, later in the game, it should be able to periodically instagib max-level mobs, though not reliably.  This reduced average TTK then gives it a helping hand later on in the game towards its overall potency.  When fighting bosses, this weapon would not be a good choice due to its low ammo reserves, but against standard mobs, it would be quite good at killing the small groups that they generally appear in, provided the user is accurate.  The lowered RoF also promotes more efficient use of ammo which is needed for something with a reduced reserve.  Also, it shouldn't crowd out the Latron due to the fact that it cannot reliably instagib and that it is less accurate.

Edited June 4, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[Vaskadar]

I say that the magazine size needs to be divisible into 540. That's something that has been considered for pretty much every weapon in the rifle category. 90 goes into 540 evenly, as does 60, 45, 30, 18, 9, and 4. 17 is an odd number and doesn't mathematically make much sense. The reload time is also absurdly fast for the Mjolnir. Your average marksman with most rifles can't reload that fast with a dry magazine, pull the charging handle, and aim again.

25-30 seems reasonable to me, at least. The higher the damage, I say the weapon should consequentially have higher vertical recoil. If the weapon has a fire rate of 5.8 to 6.8, its fire rate should be comparable to 600-650 RPM (or at least I feel it should), but I'd like it if someone could convert for me the values in the game into firing intervals. If it were a firing interval of 0.05s it would have a 1200 RPM. A firing interval of 0.10s would be 600 RPM, comparable to an M60, or better yet, a very slow rate like an early M2 Browning.

My other gripe with the fire rate you proposed is that the Boltor has an 8.8 fire rate. Dropping the fire rate while raising the damage is desirable.

[Thor]

Interjecting to say that I'd rather have Mjolnir be a throwable melee weapon (But different from the glaive!). :(

 

You may now resume regularly scheduled discussion.

[Nuntium]

Interjecting to say that I'd rather have Mjolnir be a throwable melee weapon (But different from the glaive!). :(

 

You may now resume regularly scheduled discussion.

 

I c wut u did thar.

[UncommonUnicorn]

Sooo.. the Latron?

 

Except automatic fire.

or better yet, a very slow rate like an early M2 Browning.

Yes please.

Maybe with a scope on it as well.

[Sagonene]

I think what he is going for is more:

Push button-shot-moment to correct aim-shot-moment-shot-release button.

Bang, move sight, bang. Like a old style bolt action. Something with a 1 second delay between shots that hits hard.

I also agree mjolnir doesn't fit as well as gugnir and jackhammer should be for the upgraded boar. Maybe a different myth system and call it a John Henry or a Sisyphus.

[Vaskadar]

It's supposed to be an automatic. A 1 second delay between shots? Bolt-action? Lolwut? What thread have you been reading?

Going for something that hits like an M14 and fires as fast as an M60E4. Also: I has a doodle for my original post. Once again, my scanner cables are broken, so... I can't get a full-quality image up, but still.

First post is updated.

Edited June 6, 2013 by Vaskadar

[Vaskadar]

Interjecting to say that I'd rather have Mjolnir be a throwable melee weapon (But different from the glaive!). :(

 

You may now resume regularly scheduled discussion.

Name changed in the name of Thor.

[Sagonene]

Sorry my copy of Jane's universal guide is in my other pants. 1 second was clearly too long. I don't know the weapon you're talking about.

[Nuntium]

Base Damage: 30

Base Firing Rate: 6.0

Accuracy: 24.2

Base Magazine Size: 20

Base Reserve Ammunition: 540

Base Reload Speed: 2.8s

Base Critical Chance: 7.5%

Base Critical Damage: 150%

Stun Chance: 15%

 

Just FYI, the title says "approx 600 RPM" but the stats you have up indicate 360. (RoF stat in this game is expressed in rounds per second)

 

A bigger recoil than what Latron has would render a higher rate of fire weapon pretty useless in automatic mode. Crosshair would travel half the screen upwards in several shots.

 

Current state of automatic rifles is pretty balanced and we've yet to see how the corpus lmg performs.

 

Frankly anything with damage close to the damage of Latron and higher fire rate would render Latron inferior. Low accuracy/high recoil is a design no no for automatic guns in fast paced games where you 

Well, I didn't say I wanted it to have higher recoil than the Latron, just higher than the Grakata. I feel that the inaccuracy would be offset by the high DPS. Besides, it could be burst fired to work at slightly longer ranges.

 

 

Except automatic fire.

 

Except the Latron's fire rate is 4.2 (I believe), so it would just be a Latron that you didn't have to click to fire.

[Vaskadar]

Please tell me what would bring it to 600 RPM, since there's no obvious mathematical formula for conversion.

[Nuntium]

Please tell me what would bring it to 600 RPM, since there's no obvious mathematical formula for conversion.

10. Normally RoF is expressed in RPM, but Warframe decided to do it in RPS, so just divide the RoF you want by 60.

[Vaskadar]

It doesn't seem or feel that way with the weapons, I'd say a fire rate of 450 rpm sounds more reasonable.

[Nuntium]

It doesn't seem or feel that way with the weapons, I'd say a fire rate of 450 rpm sounds more reasonable.

Yeah, the way they do the stats makes it easier to calculate DPS, but harder to kinda visualize how fast it is really firing, at least for people who are used to RPM (Read: Everybody.)

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Yeah, the way they do the stats makes it easier to calculate DPS, but harder to kinda visualize how fast it is really firing, at least for people who are used to RPM (Read: Everybody.)

I spend a lot of time playing RTS's, so I'm afraid I don't fall into that group lol. Edited June 7, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[Nuntium]

I spend a lot of time playing RTS's, so I'm afraid I don't fall into that group lol.

 

Yeah, I'm kind of a gun nerd, and since RoF in real life is always expressed in RPM I can sort of visualize how fast it is, RPS really throws me for some reason.

[Vaskadar]

Yeah, I'm kind of a gun nerd, and since RoF in real life is always expressed in RPM I can sort of visualize how fast it is, RPS really throws me for some reason.

Would you take a look at the Lucerne's sketch for me and give me some feedback as far as what I could change in a PM? I'd much appreciate that. It's caseless, uses an electronic trigger, and is fed from a sideways magazine. I hope the diagrams I drew provide an ample starting point for what its design is. Seeing as it is a first iteration of the rifle, the design might be a bit messy, and I don't really care to make my writing too precise as long as it's legible.

Edited June 7, 2013 by Vaskadar

[Nuntium]

Would you take a look at the Lucerne's sketch for me and give me some feedback as far as what I could change in a PM? I'd much appreciate that. It's caseless, uses an electronic trigger, and is fed from a sideways magazine. I hope the diagrams I drew provide an ample starting point for what its design is. Seeing as it is a first iteration of the rifle, the design might be a bit messy, and I don't really care to make my writing too precise as long as it's legible.

Sure, from what I saw with a quick glance at it, it looks pretty good. Definitely more usable then most of the other guns in this game.

[KF5AQX]

Well, I would like this gun, I admit. MK-1 is still one of my favorite guns. Too bad it's so outclassed in every way by, well, anything.

 

A heavier hitting version of it would be great. Braton MK-3, anyone?

 

As for the drawing, it looks fine to me. Only problem I can see is that the optics are a bit far forward (Why do Tenno need optics anyway?), and the rifle in general looks front heavy. In addition, the magazine appears very wide and chunky, which I don't think is what you were going for. Could use some more detail work on the rear end too. (Still a hell of a lot better than the Latron model though.)

[UncommonUnicorn]

A heavier hitting version of it would be great. Braton MK-3, anyone?

As long as it doesn't have the nerf gun looks.

[Vaskadar]

See original post for concept :P

[Nightfire37]

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would buy and use the weapon forever. Finally someone thinking along with me. I really like that weapon design too. A hard hitting assasult rifle with the rof slower then the mk1 braton. The Mattatok in Mass Effect is a single fire only weapon and the Latron is basically that. I would really enjoy it and sleep with it every night. Developers, USE THIS WEAPON!!!!! MODEL IT!!!!! CODE IT!!!!!!! DEVELOP IT!!!!!!!!!!!

[Vaskadar]

Bump, bump, bump it up!

[FatRefrigerator]

Looks like the bastard child of a P90, PDW-R, and a Latron