[Suggestion] Hardcore Mode For Missions!

[MyXmaN]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/57306-game-too-easy-or-too-hard-vote/

http://www.easypolls.net/poll.html?p=51aac670e4b0604d061ed531

This poll showed that there IS some demand for the difficulty to be buffed - most players (that voted) find Warframe too easy.

 

One decision would be implementing a Hardcore difficulty mode for missions. That way players are given a choice - complete a mission in a normal mode, or face some challenge.

Hardcore mode should provide the necessary challenge for experienced players and some need for teamwork will be required in order to complete missions and reap the rewards.

 

 

So, here is the basic concept of this difficulty:

1) the mode is optional. You are not forced into that kind of difficulty.

2) the mode applies to any kind of missions except defense, mobile defense and assassination. Those need slightly different concepts.

3) the enemies are AT LEAST lvl50. Yep, even on Mercury.

4) there is no revive button. If your teammates fail to revive you - you have to forfeit the mission. (need even more hardcore? - when the teammate successfullty revives you, one of your daily revives is spent)

5) Some warframe abilities have a limited number of uses per mission. Use that Chaos or Miasma wisely, you only have one of those per mission! (no more spamming your ultimates)

6) there is an increased chance of a stalker appearing in a hardcore mission. His hitpoints and shields are at least tripled. Keep in mind, that you have no revive button (if he kills you, you have to forfeit).

7) there is always an optional objective. (need even more hardcore? - there is always a time limit optional objective)

8) To compensate you for your trouble, all the resource drops are doubled. This also discourages speedrunning (the final mission rewards stay the same).

 

Edit (some additions based on feedback):

9) ammo only drops when you have scavenger artifact. Blue orbs only drop when you have energy siphon. Red orbs = rejuvenation. (normal effects of rejuvenation and energy siphon are cancelled)

10) enemies with invisibility detection

 

 

 

Please post more suggestions and your thoughts about this!

Edited June 3, 2013 by MyXmaN

[Onite]

 

This has been suggested before with almost the exact same ideas to the number.

[MyXmaN]

This has been suggested before with almost the exact same ideas to the number.

Searched the forums, couldnt find it, shame on me...

But its great to know im not the only one suggesting these things.

[Onite]

Searched the forums, couldnt find it, shame on me...

But its great to know im not the only one suggesting these things.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/36786-game-options-toggles-easymode-to-hardcore/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/14340-the-game-is-way-to-easy-we-need-a-true-hardcore-mode-first-weeks-impressions/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/11683-hardcore-writters-needed-the-warframe-we-want-to-see/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/53688-end-game-hard-mode-suggestion/?hl=%2Bhard+%2Bmode

[neKroMancer]

To be honest, I think turning all ultimates into consumable with limited use per mission would be a good idea for the game. DE's vision on these powers are 'emergency button'. However, the current gameplay turns them into spam - run - spam power for some players. which is fun for some players but it's kind of mindless gameplay and it doesn't promote proper, tactical usage of powers.

 

Moreover, hardcore mode isn't needed imo. What we need is AI which is able to counter our powers and stand toe-to-toe with 4 players' damage output. I posted this ideas several times on the forum but I'll post it here again.

 

- Detector type: Detect cloaked unit. Ash, Loki, frame under Ghost's influence.

- Power Immunity type: Immune to powers. Similar to ME3' Banshee and Phantom. React to incoming powers with temporary immunity to power effect and damage.

- Tank type: Withstand 4 players' damage output while moving/firing similar to Grineer minigunner. 

- Anti-range type: Similar to DMC's Drekavac. Deflecting bullets and projectiles while trying to approach player and melee him to death.

- Anti-melee type: Subtype of tank. Heavily armored AI which can't be stunned or knocked down. Counter attack/deflect when attacked with melee weapon.

- Spawner type: Immobile, high duarbility AI which endlessly spawns weak units out of it.

- Cloaked type: cloak and silently approach the player and backstab him, dealing massive damage. Receive DR while cloaked.

 

Also, replace usual double panel door with 'Siege' mechanic. Group of AI set a barricade up with anti-ultimate force field in order to prevent player from advancing. In case of Infest, they need an overhaul imo.   

[MyXmaN]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/36786-game-options-toggles-easymode-to-hardcore/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/14340-the-game-is-way-to-easy-we-need-a-true-hardcore-mode-first-weeks-impressions/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/11683-hardcore-writters-needed-the-warframe-we-want-to-see/?hl=hardcore

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/53688-end-game-hard-mode-suggestion/?hl=%2Bhard+%2Bmode

 

These are quite not the same as my suggestion, actually. And the third link is completely irrelevant...

 

 

- Detector type: Detect cloaked unit. Ash, Loki, frame under Ghost's influence.

- Power Immunity type: Immune to powers. Similar to ME3' Banshee and Phantom. React to incoming powers with temporary immunity to power effect and damage.

- Tank type: Withstand 4 players' damage output while moving/firing similar to Grineer minigunner. 

- Anti-range type: Similar to DMC's Drekavac. Deflecting bullets and projectiles while trying to approach player and melee him to death.

- Anti-melee type: Subtype of tank. Heavily armored AI which can't be stunned or knocked down. Counter attack/deflect when attacked with melee weapon.

- Spawner type: Immobile, high duarbility AI which endlessly spawns weak units out of it.

- Cloaked type: cloak and silently approach the player and backstab him, dealing massive damage. Receive DR while cloaked.

  

 

Now these are some nice suggestions!

I was also thinking about tank units invulnerable from the front - you have to shoot them in the back (now shield lancers dont count. Lech Kril does.)

Edited June 3, 2013 by MyXmaN

[Stupid_Idiot]

even more hardcore:  No ammo drops unless you have scavenger artifact on, Energy siphon 's effect changes to only allow blue orbs to drop, rejuv only allows red orbs to drop instead of regenerating health.  

[Countess_Hapmuhr]

 

To be honest, I think turning all ultimates into consumable with limited use per mission would be a good idea for the game. DE's vision on these powers are 'emergency button'. However, the current gameplay turns them into spam - run - spam power for some players. which is fun for some players but it's kind of mindless gameplay and it doesn't promote proper, tactical usage of powers.

 

Moreover, hardcore mode isn't needed imo. What we need is AI which is able to counter our powers and stand toe-to-toe with 4 players' damage output. I posted this ideas several times on the forum but I'll post it here again.

 

- Detector type: Detect cloaked unit. Ash, Loki, frame under Ghost's influence.

- Power Immunity type: Immune to powers. Similar to ME3' Banshee and Phantom. React to incoming powers with temporary immunity to power effect and damage.

- Tank type: Withstand 4 players' damage output while moving/firing similar to Grineer minigunner. 

- Anti-range type: Similar to DMC's Drekavac. Deflecting bullets and projectiles while trying to approach player and melee him to death.

- Anti-melee type: Subtype of tank. Heavily armored AI which can't be stunned or knocked down. Counter attack/deflect when attacked with melee weapon.

- Spawner type: Immobile, high duarbility AI which endlessly spawns weak units out of it.

- Cloaked type: cloak and silently approach the player and backstab him, dealing massive damage. Receive DR while cloaked.

 

Also, replace usual double panel door with 'Siege' mechanic. Group of AI set a barricade up with anti-ultimate force field in order to prevent player from advancing. In case of Infest, they need an overhaul imo.   

 

 

These suggestions along with the OPs suggestions would seriously give everyone at end level something to go at. Furthermore, each level beat with hardcore mode should have a small indicator to show for this so that you knew which levels you'd beaten. Of course the rewards should reflect the successful completion of a hardcore mode level too, but as always, within the realm of sanity.

 

Even though I nowhere near mastering all the weapons in the game, I would jump at the chance to have my team annihialated by a mode like this :D

 

EDIT: Also, even though we might be happy going toe-to-toe with insanity, it doesn't mean that everyone else is. So having this as a separate mode will stop the QQ about it. I mean, seriously, just look at all the topics about Scorpion, an enemy I find to be trivial.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Hap-muhr

[Milkin]

I have been thinking about hc content too, i just woke up so my brain doesn't work for a while but here are some of my suggestions about detector units.

Grineer & Corpus could have somekind of infrated sight units which detect possible heat waves tenno leave behind. Maybe, grineer rollers, and corpus MOAS could have something like this? (Ofcourse this is no reason for normal grineers soldiers and corpus crewmen not to have high tech eguipment. sometimes they could carry "detection glasses of superiority" too.)

Ofcourse tenno ninjas have probably somekind of body cooling down system in their suit which keeps them out of sight from infrated sight units and stuff,,, but maybe grineer have already too advanced their technology :) (ofcourse they have).

When fightning against infested, maybe if hound bites you, (even once) he leaves somekind of virus-thing in tennos bloodcells that all other hounds can smell / somehow sense and follow up. Other thing could be if corpus crawler accidentally gets a chance to throw up on you, all infested units can smell(lol) / sense you.

Infrated sight & virus, and words like that are just "project names" for me. Only a way to tell about my suggestion without thinking too much about lore or anything.

In hc mode, i think invisibility should not be anymore INVINCIBILITY, you will become invisible, but if somebody shoots where you stand, or throws explosive at your feet, you will take damage normally.

And one more thing, about carrying a case in deception or spy mission. You don't get 2x ammos for your gun even if you are wielding dual weapons.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Milkin

[neKroMancer]

About detector unit.

 

I think factions should have their own mode of detection.

-Grineer seeker should be the detector unit. Change the seeker ball mechanic to fit the theme : Seeker throws the ball and the ball stop in middle of the room, emitting sonar out and temporary nullify cloak ability. Then it latch itself onto the nearest target and explode itself. If player manage to hide a solid barrier then the ball won't be able to detect you.

 

-Corpus drone. Out of the three, leech drone is borderlinely useless. Leech effect can be cancelled quite easily with normal melee. Why not turn them into flying detector with cloak capability, similar to Protoss' Observer in Starcraft? Invisibly scanning the ship for intruder. When detect an intruder, it fires a 'leech' which drain shield and cancel cloak effect. Player has to detect and destroy it before it detects him. Perhaps giving sound cue to warn the player when there is one within certain range. 

 

-Infest. Infest should have really different mode of detection. I think Infest's detector unit should detect movement instead of  relying on visual. If this creature detect non-Infest movement, it will viciously attack the target and stain him a scent, directing nearby unit to the target. Stand still to avoid detection. 

[DAWGUNITALPHA]

Hardkorest: every enemy instantly kills you. Go stealth or go home.

[MyXmaN]

even more hardcore:  No ammo drops unless you have scavenger artifact on, Energy siphon 's effect changes to only allow blue orbs to drop, rejuv only allows red orbs to drop instead of regenerating health.  

I will add this to the first post. Thats quite nice of an addition.

[overdosed]

There are so many ppl that want the game to be harder and that want the hardest missions not to be locked behind gimmicks like void keys(T3 comes to mind, even though its not really hard, its just the hardest the game has to offer) including me. Been playing the game for 2 months now, the forums have been filled with threads requiring harder difficulties ever since, and probably for a long time before that but DE havent done anything about it. They just release new(broken most of the times) content trying to increase the longevity of the game, not realising that the best way to do that would be to completely overhaul the AI which is terrible imo and start providing challenging gameplay all over the board and only after theyve done that continue to release new content. This also leads to the trend that me and many other players have to play with potatoed and formaed equipment on extremely easy levels which in turn leads to all the newbies(new players) and noobs(just plain old noobs) to constantly cry for nerfs. The lack of content for endgame gear is killing the whole game and i dont know if DE are gonna realise that or listen to its player base before its too late.

When doing balance you always have to first provide the difficulty and only then start balancing the items, not the other way around...

[CerebrateJoe]

I'm not much for some of these ideas, but I love the idea of a harder difficulty.  I want to see the game throw more enemies and more challenges at me.  The only time I ever loose is when there is a pod to defend.  The simple fact is that Tenno never loose.  Bring some threat into this game and it'll actually make it a lot better.

 

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