Smooth Movement Ruined Completely ( Update Rant)

[Mietz]

Update 8 was one of the biggest content updates since i joined warframe during Update 5. I wasn't refering to the registered players count, but there have been 27 pages of posts on the "introductions" forum since april. That's almost a 100% growth in posts since april, considering that the first posts date back to december.

And those are only the people that bother with making a forum account and introducing themselves.

 

[ZWarhammer]

Interesting can you pinpoint as to what happened when that big drop in player base hit ?

[Renan.Ruivo]

 

Well, that's a Steam graph. Steam is one of two (that i know of) publishing platforms that DE uses, other then their own website. People who joined the game through Steam in march quickly realized that there were more than a few issues with using it to play the game (several documented bugs).

So they opted to just play the game through the official downloadable launcher.

 

And since you grabbed a graph, i'll show some myself:

 

 

 

I wouldn't call that "not growing since april".

 

 

Interesting can you pinpoint as to what happened when that big drop in player base hit ?

 

 

I can, if i may. That was around the time that Warframe was starting to be distributed by Gamersfirst as well, and the aforementioned bugs with the Steam Platform during Warframe gameplay. Which have since been fixed, seeing how it shot back at the end of may, and a little more at the start of this month.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Renan.Ruivo

[Mietz]

Well, that's a Steam graph. Steam is one of two (that i know of) publishing platforms that DE uses, other then their own website. People who joined the game through Steam in march quickly realized that there were more than a few issues with using it to play the game (several documented bugs).

So they opted to just play the game through the official downloadable launcher.

 

And since you grabbed a graph, i'll show some myself:

 

 

 

I wouldn't call that "not growing since april".

 

 

 

 

I can, if i may. That was around the time that Warframe was starting to be distributed by Gamersfirst as well, and the aforementioned bugs with the Steam Platform during Warframe gameplay. Which have since been fixed, seeing how it shot back at the end of may, and a little more at the start of this month.

 

Raptr is like gamespy, not a representative sample.

Steam is.

 

The graph shot back up with update 8, its quite simple, it got a lot of advertisement on steam.

 

Its going to fall back down shortly. its the cycle of every Multiplayer game ever.

[Renan.Ruivo]

Raptr is like gamespy, not a representative sample.

Steam is.

 

The graph shot back up with update 8, its quite simple, it got a lot of advertisement on steam.

 

Its going to fall back down shortly. its the cycle of every Multiplayer game ever.

It's as much a representative sample as Steam is, given that while not a lot of people run Raptr while playing Warframe, not a lot of people use Steam to play Warframe either.

 

Neither graphs are truly representative, and only DE knows the real metrics.

 

 

So while i can't say that the game has grown since april, neither of us can say it hasn't either.

[ZWarhammer]

It's as much a representative sample as Steam is, given that while not a lot of people run Raptr while playing Warframe, not a lot of people use Steam to play Warframe either.

 

Neither graphs are truly representative, and only DE knows the real metrics.

 

 

So while i can't say that the game has grown since april, neither of us can say it hasn't either.

Actually most people use steam cause it's convenient to have your games and purchases made through it.

[Guest]

As I've stated in my thread about the sprint toggle

Rushing (or playing efficiently in some cases) in my opinion is something that can never be stopped by changing  mechanics.

 

If you remove every mechanic that increases movement speed from the game, you will still have those guys that get from point A to B faster than the guy who takes his time.

 

Rushing isn't movement alone, its doing a task without making other objectives get in between.

 

[Renan.Ruivo]

Actually most people use steam cause it's convenient to have your games and purchases made through it.

 

Yeah i know, i do use it as well to make purchases since i can pay with my local currency (means less taxes and no currency exchange). But while it's convenient to organize and purchase my games through, i prefer to run games without it whenever possible

 

Free-to-play games such as Warframe tend to have issues when being run through Steam, since most of them weren't initially developed with Steam in mind, unlike Triple-A retail titles.

 

 

As I've stated in my thread about the sprint toggle

 

Rushing (or playing efficiently in some cases) in my opinion is something that can never be stopped by changing  mechanics.

 

If you remove every mechanic that increases movement speed from the game, you will still have those guys that get from point A to B faster than the guy who takes his time.

 

Rushing isn't movement alone, its doing a task without making other objectives get in between.

 

 

This is definatly true. However, where has it been said by DE (and i mean directly, not hearsay and not conjecture) that this change was made to counter rushing?

[BoompigXD]

How about instead of creating and arguing in threads like this, we make creative threads and stop overshadowing them with this argument and stuff like that.

 

Right now the creative threads are being overshadowed by threads like this one

 

Links to creative threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/61649-suggestion-smarter-ai/

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/57682-suggestion-enemy-weapon-mods/

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/61672-new-sentinel-idea/

 

Edit: quoted from the other thread

Edited June 9, 2013 by BoompigXD

[PositronicSpleen]

An invisible cooldown timer is a bad design decision, even if it was made with good intentions. There's been some strange fascination with introducing invisible mechanics as far back as the Hek patch, and more recently with the second Rhino Iron Skin patch. User interface isn't optional!

 

Personally, I think a good fix would be to leave the unintended mechanic the way it is but instead of a cooldown, it could use a little bit of stamina with no stamina recovery while sliding.

 

This will stop people from spamming it but will still allow people to use it. This also would make mods like Marathon and Quick Rest much more appealing and less useless atm. Why waste a mod slot for more stamina when you can slide and recover it without losing speed?

With this solution there's a reason -- using established game mechanics -- why the new behavior exists, and it simultaneously helps other aspects of the game. It would also mean that I can use the slide->flip with actual momentum when I need it, something this patch has hindered.

 

Although to be completely honest, even if the invisible timer was turned visible, I would still prefer this alternative because it represents a use of the game's own internally consistent logic on "how things work". Not having stamina makes you not move fast, simple.

Edited June 9, 2013 by PositronicSpleen

[scavenge]

If it wont get reverted to exactly how it was before I'll likely forever be stuck in def missions camping.

Void raids rushing with the options we have left.

Void exterminate, self explanatory, just way slower than before cause you can't get around quickly.

Oh and the occasional alert mission which will just be completely rushed on purpose, leave all others behind.

[Majicebe]

Totally agreed, it just makes movement less intuitive as a whole, and overall makes the game less fun.

[Estred]

My gameplay hasn't been effected by this at all, beyond that I can't Sprint->Slide->Flip->Slide->(Rinse Repeat) and frankly I can deal with that. I saw no issue with it either. Complaining that you can't go as fast as you personally feel you should is not correct.

We have base speeds and stamina bars for a reason. Just as we have Speed Mods and Stamina mods for a reason. The intention was flipping, sliding, wall-running, slide-slashing, jump-slashing and the like are all extra moves we have access to in order to gain the upper hand on an enemy or traverse terrain. Chaining skills to ignore our Stamina and/or Speed to me sounds like players avoiding intended mechanics for their own enjoyment, then complaining when it get's fixed or adjusted.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Estred

[SymphNo9]

My gameplay hasn't been effected by this at all, beyond that I can't Sprint->Slide->Flip->Slide->(Rinse Repeat) and frankly I can deal with that. I saw no issue with it either. Complaining that you can't go as fast as you personally feel you should is not correct.

We have base speeds and stamina bars for a reason. Just as we have Speed Mods and Stamina mods for a reason. The intention was flipping, sliding, wall-running, slide-slashing, jump-slashing and the like are all extra moves we have access to in order to gain the upper hand on an enemy or traverse terrain. Chaining skills to ignore our Stamina and/or Speed to me sounds like players avoiding intended mechanics for their own enjoyment, then complaining when it get's fixed or adjusted.

 

This is one of the points why the change is so bad;

 

I really hate the slide nerf (was it even an official nerf?).  And I'm not just saying that because I play as Rhino. 

 

1. It reduces player control - this is my biggest complaint.  The new sprint system is unreliable.  Sometimes, sliding again right after an initial slide works exactly as before.  And then sometimes it only moves you 2 feet.  There's no way of predicting which is going to happen, which means that players can't accurately judge jumps or slide attacks.  I've fallen off cliffs and missed attacks dozens of times because of this.  On low levels that's just annoying, but on high levels that's a cheap death. 

...

 

You can have all fancy features in the game but if the basic control and movement are unreliable or unresponsive, it outright screams for bad user experience.

[ZWarhammer]

How about instead of creating and arguing in threads like this, we make creative threads and stop overshadowing them with this argument and stuff like that.

 

Right now the creative threads are being overshadowed by threads like this one

 

Links to creative threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/61649-suggestion-smarter-ai/

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/57682-suggestion-enemy-weapon-mods/

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/61672-new-sentinel-idea/

 

Edit: quoted from the other thread

Stop trying to go off topic when you lost all of your points of discussion!

This would be a good time to be able to ban someone like you from posting on this thread.

Edited June 9, 2013 by ZWarhammer

[BoogieMan82]

Remember, keep this on topic and no personal attacks.

 

If you have ideas of how to change it or what shouldn't have been changed please do so in a constructive manner so the developers can get a good idea of what changes (if any) are needed.

 

Thanks!

[Teleo]

Would be a better change to make the slide continue to drain stamina, and keep everything else the same.

 

If you want to rush, you should be forced to use rushing mods.

[scavenge]

Game is a complete chore now, grinding is not my issue in gaming but failed movement is. 2 hours a day and I'm done, before the slide cooldown I could pull 16 hours a day and enjoy them all xD

[Estred]

Game is a complete chore now, grinding is not my issue in gaming but failed movement is. 2 hours a day and I'm done, before the slide cooldown I could pull 16 hours a day and enjoy them all xD

I would rather they reward team-play than punish players. While I see no issue or impact on my end, perhaps i am just a lucky person. Still I can understand why some are mad, though I feel the sheer retaliation and degree of said displeasure is a bit unfounded.

[Excitonex]

I'm really stunned at this move by DE. The movement has changed to be very clunky and inconsistent. When I do a maneuver I need it to do the same thing every time. There is a large inconsistency in movement now and it is caused by this 'fix'. How could you ever imagine it was a good idea to stop rushers by gimping your movement system is beyond me. If you want to stop rushers there are many threads and suggestions out there. Making lazy fixes like this with no thoughts about repercussions is not going to do good things for Warframe once it goes live. In my experience, players don't usually come back after a change they see as game-breaking.

 

What should you do? Restore the movement to it's previous state for starters. If you think stamina is not useful in it's current state make some of these combo moves require stamina to execute. Elevators are a poor solution to rushing but things like yellow doors work well. You can also use tricks that other games use to hide loading screens, such as slow opening doors, strong but breakable walls, anything that slows down the first person or group to get there. Obviously placing too many obstacles would be frustrating but using them in combination would help slow people down and promote group play. Players are rushing because the meat and bones of the game is too easy to them. If you want us to slow down do it with difficult enemies, traps, doors, and objects. Don't ever cripple your movement system.

[scavenge]

Heh you guys should see ppl doing alert missions in the Europe area now. I've never seen more hardcore rushing, bet they all do it to show it's not fixed in any way. If ppl want to rush, they rush.

[Abradax]

Space Ninja.....turtles?

[CaucasianAsianX]

if you are anything like me, you are easily prone to motion sickness which causes nausea.  I love this game but with the screen constantly shaking and then constantly going back and forth for objectives eventually gives me motion sickness.  Usually it doesn't happen that much or it takes awhile to kick in.  One reason was it didn't take (what feels like) forever to get to the objective especially how sometime there are no enemies around. but since this update i have been motion sick ever since. It is not smooth anymore and very jerky and annoying. My mind thinks that my character is going to go forward with ease insteads just stands there after a slide which throws me off which in turns causes me to get nauseous. 

[Countess_Hapmuhr]

if you are anything like me, you are easily prone to motion sickness which causes nausea.  I love this game but with the screen constantly shaking and then constantly going back and forth for objectives eventually gives me motion sickness.  Usually it doesn't happen that much or it takes awhile to kick in.  One reason was it didn't take (what feels like) forever to get to the objective especially how sometime there are no enemies around. but since this update i have been motion sick ever since. It is not smooth anymore and very jerky and annoying. My mind thinks that my character is going to go forward with ease insteads just stands there after a slide which throws me off which in turns causes me to get nauseous. 

 

If you haven't already, I would highly suggest upping your FOV to counteract nausea.

[CharginTarge]

Space Ninja.....turtles?

 

Are they teenagers as well?

 

We need to start a petition for a new warframe that looks like a turtle! The game already has 4 player co-op!