Buff The Kraken, Or Nerf The Kunai

[DeadlyNerd]

Whatever the OP said, kunai need to be nerfed. They're just too good, like a paris quickshot on steroids. What's the use for paris quickshot then?

[Dude_on_the_Moon]

agree with author

[Curzyfish]

What context is there to have, exactly? It shouldn't strictly matter what the target is, provided that it's the same target for each comparison.

Like, yeah, viper needs to reload pretty much after one second. It also reloads almost as fast as the kunai. It's not as ammo efficient as the kunai, yeah. But for raw damage in a given window, pretty much nothing beats it.

 

It'd be real nice if you guys who said this explained how. Considering how the boltor is full auto and armor ignore yet isn't wildly out of whack with other primaries. Simply having armor ignore + automatic fire isn't a gateway to OP.

 

 

Armor ignore is huge when you are looking at ancients / grineer in endless defense.  You don't even necessarily need to get to something like 50+ to see it.

 

Here is the thread regarding semi-auto fire.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/58427-fire-rate-on-semi-autos-is-meaningless/page-4?hl=%20semi%20%20auto

 

 

Also, regarding the boltor, its (relatively) poor accuracy and unpredictable projectile trajectory (kunai's are extremely accurate, and you can fully compensate for their trajectory) even it out quite a bit vs other weapons.  It was also previously nerfed.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Curzyfish

[CosyPigeon]

u can see  both Vulkar and Dread have fair amount of player use them, but Kraken and Kunia? 1: 30-50maybe? i just can't find a player in auto match taking a kraken with him after kunia came out

 

That's because Kunai are ninja, aesthetics play an important part in what weapons people choose to use in  PVE game.

[Xyfer]

lol kraken has long range capabilities man. Kunai does not, it has travel time and a throwing arc. Plus at long range it isn't consistently hitting the same same spot compared to the kraken. Just because you see people with kunai kills alot, CLOSE to MID range, doesn't mean you need to cry out NERF kunai. It's a trade off, you get good damage, only close range. Besides, kraken's a beast when fully modded. Get your facts right. Why don't you ask them to nerf the ogris as well, since it practically kills everything as it's a nuke launcher with multishot mod. God, this is a PvE centered game man, not some PvP games like Planetside.

 

P/s: read this before you cry foul.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/53259-dont-even-nerf-thread-till-you-own-it-please-give-it-a-read/

Edited June 17, 2013 by Xyfer

[MJ12]

Whatever the OP said, kunai need to be nerfed. They're just too good, like a paris quickshot on steroids. What's the use for paris quickshot then?

 

The Paris quickshot is crap. The Paris is a really weak weapon.

 

Everyone keeps going 'oh my the kunai are good because MY THOUSANDS OF HOURS OF FPS GAMING MEAN I BENEFIT FROM WEAPONS WITH HIGHER SKILL CEILINGS'. Well... um... duh? If we balance for the idea that people are already experienced at judging projectile travel time and ballistic drop and leading targets Tribes-style it means we make all the non-hitscan weapons underpowered (like the Dera) except for pro gamers. If we balance for the idea that they aren't, well, it means that you do better with high-skill-ceiling weapons. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

And yes, the Kunai have been 'shooting towards the top of the kill/damage list'. Because they're cool weapons that are fun to use and also because nobody trusts DE to do rational balance passes after they broke the Hek and Gorgon for a week, broke the Boltor until they realized how badly they nerfed it (within the same day) and Volt is still completely broken after the round of nerfs he took, which was something like 4 months ago. So the moment anyone claims a new weapon is 'OP' everyone flocks to it as hard as they can because they're afraid it'll become totally useless. No matter how OP the weapon actually is.

[ThinhMints]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/53259-dont-even-nerf-thread-till-you-own-it-please-give-it-a-read/

 

Credit to orginal poster: G.E.Y

[TheDoctah]

I think threads like this needs to get nerfed out of existence.

[Amistyrja]

Kraken requires Mastery level 0. Kunai requires Mastery level 2.

 

Your argument is invalid.

Not sure if troll or just silly

[Magarthryx]

I haven't seen these skilled kunai players. Most players make use of distracted enemies and they use them in close range. If this is the issue some paths for fixing this are focusing on the skill shot or removing this close range abuse. For the for focus on skill shots make them like a mini-paris. Charged shots, but you'd have to balance with better damage or some effect to allow the player to still make the kill before the target can go for an alarm. If you want to remove the range abuse reduce the damage at close range.

[AdamTheBean]

Or we could not nerf anything... if you don't like something don't use it.

[Zyfe3rX]

I don't think a OP weapon make us have more fun, it just Shorten the time of joy we can have.

 

No it doesnt !

 

OP weapons,i.e weapons that need mastery ranks are supposed to be used in higher levels. And stuff like kraken in lower levels.

 

Your freaking point is TOTALLY INVALID. Sticking with same gun from start to end is fun ?

 

You even forgot that Kunai requires like 3x more stuff than Kraken, duh !?

 

You made this thread only because YOU LOVE KRAKEN and you want it to be better than rest. Thats it .(period)

Edited June 18, 2013 by Zyfe3rX

[cary2010haha]

No it doesnt !

 

OP weapons,i.e weapons that need mastery ranks are supposed to be used in higher levels. And stuff like kraken in lower levels.

 

Your freaking point is TOTALLY INVALID. Sticking with same gun from start to end is fun ?

 

You even forgot that Kunai requires like 3x more stuff than Kraken, duh !?

 

You made this thread only because YOU LOVE KRAKEN and you want it to be better than rest. Thats it .(period)

 

"I don't think a OP weapon make us have more fun, it just Shorten the time of joy we can have." is not only about yourself, just like if DE put out a super large Aoe luncher and you don't have it, but you teammate use it kill eveythings, the joy also lost.

[Zyfe3rX]

"I don't think a OP weapon make us have more fun, it just Shorten the time of joy we can have." is not only about yourself, just like if DE put out a super large Aoe luncher and you don't have it, but you teammate use it kill eveythings, the joy also lost.

 

NO. I like to play with friends. Most of the players, including me only use Ogris while soloing or defense mission. And dude, i dont think you have played with player with Ogris. All you have to do is stand in middle, kill anything IF it comes closer. Its easy as hell.

 

Most people will ask you to go with them.

This is just like Rushers vs Turtles. Same stuff but with guns. Only solution, play with friends !

Edited June 18, 2013 by Zyfe3rX

[Lexandro-EGT-]

Threads like this are sooo....... let's say not intelligent ;-)

 

I will start my own thread soon: 

Buff the Grakata or nerf Ogris !

[Amistyrja]

No it doesnt !

 

OP weapons,i.e weapons that need mastery ranks are supposed to be used in higher levels. And stuff like kraken in lower levels.

 

Your freaking point is TOTALLY INVALID. Sticking with same gun from start to end is fun ?

 

You even forgot that Kunai requires like 3x more stuff than Kraken, duh !?

 

You made this thread only because YOU LOVE KRAKEN and you want it to be better than rest. Thats it .(period)

Screw sidegrades mastery rank should give players access to more powerful equipment

[Reemer]

Kunai HAVE to be strong at least regarding damage. What good is a silent weapon that doesn't injure an enemy without alerting them or killing them outright.

Of course stealth would have to be taken more seriously and expanded upon for this to remain the case. As it stands, the Kunai are indeed quite OP when the best way to farm or level up is to kill everything and throw stealth to the wind.

Edited June 18, 2013 by Reemer

[S3raph]

how far you want, there have not many target in WF farer than 44 m, and i am very sure i can hit a 100M target with kunai, Projectile falls but always drop on the same point, just like a real world sniper, but throw a knife should not have this "accuracy"

 

http://youtu.be/pFwS3SKZ6W0

 

Can I just say that:

 

First of all, you actually missed once. This by itself would already negate your "100% accuracy" argument.

Secondly, it took 30 SECONDS to hit that camera. If I have the luxury of spending half a minute to aim I will hit 100% everytime.

 

Let's just call this what it is, rather than keep pretending you are concerned for the game's balance. You're butthurt because you were outperformed by someone using the kunai and are now calling for a nerf. It's that simple.

[Venarge]

Why should new weapons are equal to old weapons.... Thats like complaining about and old battleship that does not the same damage like modern day battleships.

[Amistyrja]

The Kunai having high damage is understandable. But as a stealth weapon, were they meant to be dealing huge amounts of dps in open combat? I'm unsure.

[Dahrsis]

  Lex has only a bit more than half the magazine capacity of the kunai and doesn't have armor ignore.

There are some people who prefer the Lex and excell with it. I have a nice 3 Star Lex with max Hornet, Barrel Infusion, all Elemetal/AP and Crit, plus near max fire rate.

IF you can hit reliable the weak spot, everything turns to ashes at every range. Kunai and Despair are nothing compared to this.

[ToeSama]

Why should new weapons are equal to old weapons.... Thats like complaining about and old battleship that does not the same damage like modern day battleships.

Because bloat is an undesirable effect no matter what the game subject is. Older options and mechanics should be updated with new design directions to validate such choices longer, rather than just for the couple of months that they're good before something comes in and changes the way the game works on a near global scale.

Older options in real life often do not withstand the test of time. A video game, however, can adjust such things for a far lower cost, and with greater speed, so there is no reason for a game production team to not boost where boosts are needed, or nerf if and when needed. I don't think the Kunai should get a nerf. They were quintessential in the design direction that many weapons should be taking in regard to both usability, flavor and fun. I DO think that older weapons that need a proper boost should get them however.

[TwilightAsh]

I am not one to call of nerfs, but I do think kunai should have an adjustment to its effective range. I think it's fine in almost every way, except the fact that it can be used to snipe effectively. I could kill enemies standing at one end of the bridge while I am at the other end of the bridge (the 3 long bridges in the Corpus ship map). That's a little overkill and pretty much is the same issue as what Hek had. Tweaking the effective distance of Kunai could bring it in line to it's intended purpose (fast throwing knives). Besides, being a thrown weapon, it should lose it momentum after traveling a certain distance.

[Amistyrja]

I am not one to call of nerfs, but I do think kunai should have an adjustment to its effective range. I think it's fine in almost every way, except the fact that it can be used to snipe effectively. I could kill enemies standing at one end of the bridge while I am at the other end of the bridge (the 3 long bridges in the Corpus ship map). That's a little overkill and pretty much is the same issue as what Hek had. Tweaking the effective distance of Kunai could bring it in line to it's intended purpose (fast throwing knives). Besides, being a thrown weapon, it should lose it momentum after traveling a certain distance.

NO LOL KUNAI HAS MASTERY RANK 2 AND IS A NEW WEAPON SO UR ARGUMENT IS INVALID NEW WEAPONS MUST ALWAYS BE BETTER THAN OLD WEAPONS SCREW THE SIDEGRADE POLICY THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO KEEP PLAYERS IN THE GAME!!!!1!11!11one111!1

[Ruelle]

I don't like the defense of the Kunai being a higher "Rank" requirement and thus having to be flat out better... if that was the case variety "or" difficulty of the entire game has to suffer insanely!

Everyone Defending Kunai should PLEASE stop trying to defend it, the whole "The enemy has to sit still" notion is hurting my brain since it doesn't even have slow travel time and fires insanely fast for a weapon that does good damage per hit and you CAN snipe with how small maps really are. 

I don't use Kunai because they are boring, easy weapons to use. I'd say the Vipers are harder to aim with then Kunai :P 

I'm not saying the Kunai need a damage nerf, maybe even a buff if they get that fire rate nerfed to the ground - tossing them out like my wrists are kunai guns



I'm all for stealth weaponry and I want some more stealth mechanics but these things should NOT be the machine guns they are now.