Single Weapons

[ROSING]

Soo I'm really excited for the new weapon. Gauntlets are always nice, but now we've got to realize something about the weapons that we have.

For one thing, I don't want to come off as ungrateful but we have a lot of melee weapons. But thanks to clan tech we have a lot of primaries too. The thing that seems to be wanting is secondaries. We onyl got one clantech wep that's in that class and precious else save for those really BA throwing knives.

But that's not what I wanted to talk about. The issue that I want to acknowledge is the marginalization of single weapons, as the title says.

Within the subclasses of melee weps, single light weapons (Skana, Cronus, etc.) are the largest group. Yet who uses them outside of being retro and for the feel? They are outclassed by everthing else, It's rare taht you'll bring a wep like that to Xini except for the hell of it. Heck if you used a potato on one I'd guess you did it because you have nothing else to potato or that you did it for, again, the feel of it, because let's be honest, using a single sword provides a special feel of awesome that your hammer just can't provide.

Yet none of them, not even the new ones, are worth using over the other weapons. We've had 3 new additions to the type in recent months: Mire, EtherSword and Machete. remember those?

I don't either.

And not only single melee weapons. Despite balance changes, I'm pretty sure no one uses a bolto over an akbolto. WHile it's not as much of an issue, it merits some attention as well. It's not only balance, it's how viable of an option of a weapon is.

TL;DR, buff single weapons.

[LasersGoPewPew]

i'd love it if single longswords had more base damage than their dual versions, as they are just a single long sword and not two short swords that look like the long sword, what your suggesting would work with melees, but for guns it wouldn't work as ak/dual weapons are two of those same weapons in each hand., you reduce the reload time on the single weapon the reload time should logically be reduced on the dual weapon as they are the same weapon, just one in each hand.

[gam3addict]

I've heard it suggested that single swords have very high single target dps, but only hit one target at a time. This way, against, say, heavies or bosses single blades are the weapon of choice but crowd control is best done with a Fragor, Gram, Orthos, etc.

[Zanzibarr11]

As for the dual pistols, the whole point of getting two is as an upgrade. when you think about it, holding two weapons gives you twice the fire power. On the other hand, you have less accuracy. Im fine with that.

 

Single Melee weapons definately NEED a buff. Just some added damage would do the trick really...

[Grilleds]

This topic gets made every few days, so I'm going going to point out that the problem with single weapons isn't their stats, its that the mods that boost them don't stack well enough in the higher levels. Aside from the Plasma Sword and Dark Sword, all single swords have a higher DPS with normal attacks. However the mods that boost them... Well:

Some of these mods need huge buff.

Shocking Touch : 5% per mod level, maxes at 30% making it by far the weakest elemental mod for melee, and every other type of electric attack mod maxes at 90%. Needs to be as good as the fire elemental mod for melee.

Pressure Point: Improves the base damage from what elemental mods are calculated from, but its still not enough to justify its incredibly low boost for its mod space. 7% per level, compared to Sundering Strike which takes less mod space, has a higher boost, is armor piercing, also works with charge attacks, and maxs higher. This mod being weak is the main reason why normal attacks are severely underpowered. Pressure Point should only take 2 mod space and have the same boost as Sundering Strike. This would make it still weaker than Sundering Strike, but at least it would make it a workable investment in potatoed non-charge attack oriented melee weapons. This would allow weapons like the daggers, Cronus, and Heat Sword to have somewhat workable normal attack builds. They still wouldn't compare to charge builds with weapons like the Orthos, Dark Sword and Plasma Sword, but would at least its a step in the right direction.

True Steel: Most melee weapons already have low crit rates, so having this max at a lowly 30% while taking 9 mod space is kind of silly. It's the same polarity as Killing Blow too, which also has a high mod space requirement but offers a much better bonus. True Steel could be buffed by lowering the mod space and having it max at 80% or higher, which would result in making crit builds work with weapons like the Plasma Sword and Dual Cleavers, or having it max at 125%-150% and keeping the same mod space or even upping it, allowing crit builds to work well with potatoed and formaed weapons.

Pressure Point needs a MASSIVE buff before single swords will have any competitive viability. Boosting the stats of the swords themselves will do very little since most of a weapons damage in higher levels is due to their mods.

[ROSING]

I guess that's true. Normal melee really doesn't get a lot of love either...

[ReiganCross]

Ok, i'll be fair here and point out that Dual Broncos are actually useless near the awesomeness of a single Bronco... Why?... Because the strenght of the Bronco is not in Fire rate or Clip size, but Reload speed. Quickdraw makes the reloading process of a single Bronco into it's very own fire rate, while clip size serves only to increase the number of shots we fire while discharging it. The reload of the bronco is actually a shorter interval then the pumping of the Strun (unmodded, offcurse) which makes it basically a 2-shot monster, especially dangerious with Multishot (Which for pistol is 120%, so 4-shot monster!)

When you make the Bronco into Dual Bronco you loose it's most powerful trait, the reload speed. Now the reload speed is clunky and happens all the frigging time because 4 shots will end way too fast, especially because of the doubled fire rate. Bronco may be the ONLY example i can think of, but that's a weapon that is way superior if you bring only one of him into play.

[Vaskadar]

Ok, i'll be fair here and point out that Dual Broncos are actually useless near the awesomeness of a single Bronco... Why?... Because the strenght of the Bronco is not in Fire rate or Clip size, but Reload speed. Quickdraw makes the reloading process of a single Bronco into it's very own fire rate, while clip size serves only to increase the number of shots we fire while discharging it. The reload of the bronco is actually a shorter interval then the pumping of the Strun (unmodded, offcurse) which makes it basically a 2-shot monster, especially dangerious with Multishot (Which for pistol is 120%, so 4-shot monster!)

When you make the Bronco into Dual Bronco you loose it's most powerful trait, the reload speed. Now the reload speed is clunky and happens all the frigging time because 4 shots will end way too fast, especially because of the doubled fire rate. Bronco may be the ONLY example i can think of, but that's a weapon that is way superior if you bring only one of him into play.

I'm not sure you read the original post, but... yeah. Single bronco is indeed better (imho) than dual bronco.

Also: As pointed out in the live stream somewheres close to the 55 minute mark, pressure point is indeed getting a major buff soon. I think charge damage on all single swords should be increased as well, considering you ARE WIELDING IT WITH BOTH HANDS, as opposed to the dual swords.

[ReiganCross]

I'm not sure you read the original post, but... yeah. Single bronco is indeed better (imho) than dual bronco.

Also: As pointed out in the live stream somewheres close to the 55 minute mark, pressure point is indeed getting a major buff soon. I think charge damage on all single swords should be increased as well, considering you ARE WIELDING IT WITH BOTH HANDS, as opposed to the dual swords.

I did, and i was just trying to make an argument that sometimes, single weapon can actually outclass dual wielding weapons. Unfortunately, this is the actual only time i can think of that an actual dual outclasses the main... Viper, maybe?... Dual Viper reload time kind of suck and clipsize is very little...

[BadAimbot]

Ok, i'll be fair here and point out that Dual Broncos are actually useless near the awesomeness of a single Bronco... Why?... Because the strenght of the Bronco is not in Fire rate or Clip size, but Reload speed. Quickdraw makes the reloading process of a single Bronco into it's very own fire rate, while clip size serves only to increase the number of shots we fire while discharging it. The reload of the bronco is actually a shorter interval then the pumping of the Strun (unmodded, offcurse) which makes it basically a 2-shot monster, especially dangerious with Multishot (Which for pistol is 120%, so 4-shot monster!)

When you make the Bronco into Dual Bronco you loose it's most powerful trait, the reload speed. Now the reload speed is clunky and happens all the frigging time because 4 shots will end way too fast, especially because of the doubled fire rate. Bronco may be the ONLY example i can think of, but that's a weapon that is way superior if you bring only one of him into play.

 

While all of that is true, the Dual version is easier to use because it doesn't punish you as hard for missing a shot, as well as having more front-loaded damage. I think the balance between the two is actually good, unlike most of the other single/dual weapons.

Edited June 30, 2013 by BadAimbot