Buff To Mk 1-Braton

[Ss3trnks2]

I contributed, i suggested we should buff the strongest guns in the game currently. Personaly I hate the MK1-Braton but it does make sense to have a starter gun to have a progession feel to the gamer otherwise it's just basic pve get loot dont feel rewarded or progess, alot of guns do need to be re-balanced but remember: Beta is Beta.

Almost any gamer will look at the fact that there are other guns and will try several different guns until they find the style of gun they like. Why would a gun like this which is significantly different from the braton or boltor be forced to be lesser than both when it fits some people's play style. If there we're a buffed version of this gun that you could buy at a later date available in the market I wouldn't care at all. (Mk 2- Braton, idk) But since this is the only gun available atm that really fits the niche high accuracy hitscan, I feel like it should be buffed a little bit. As I stated in my first post, the buff i'm asking for isn't even that big of a buff, just something to make it more viable late game.

[LordAsmolicious]

That buff is called mods. and forma

[Ss3trnks2]

That buff is called mods. and forma

You don't think that's apart of the late game I speak of?

[Dirt_Nap]

I agree with the op, the mk1 could use a gentle buff to put it on par with the regular braton. Vertical progression is just blandly climbing up a ladder - horizontal progression on the other hand requires actual forethought and decision making. I wish people could get past the everquest mindset where time spent grinding trumps all else. I'd like to see the starter weapons be very well rounded weapons that do everything fairly well but don't excel at any one thing, and the mk1 is pretty close, I just think it needs a little boost.

[TxVirus]

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Braton_Vandal

My point is more than valid, and once again Beta is Beta, everything is subject to change.

[Rhorge]

Braton is the buff to MK1 Braton.

[neKroMancer]

No point buffing the MK-1 since the Braton already does the job just fine.

 

It's a starter weapon. Asking it to be buffed to be useable in lategame is just like asking Diablo2's shortsword to be able to kill Diablo. As it stands, the MK-1 is probably the only gun with logical straight upgrade available but it's logical since you're supposed to sell it when you have enough credit for Braton or get 3000 mastery out of it. Buffing it to be on par with Braton isn't really a good argument since there will be two weapons with similar/same statistic - what's the point of doing that in PvE game?

[Ss3trnks2]

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Braton_Vandal

My point is more than valid, and once again Beta is Beta, everything is subject to change.

Never said it wasn't. The Vandal was a promotional deal only.

 

Braton is the buff to MK1 Braton.

 

No point buffing the MK-1 since the Braton already does the job just fine.

 

It's a starter weapon. Asking it to be buffed to be useable in lategame is just like asking Diablo2's shortsword to be able to kill Diablo. As it stands, the MK-1 is probably the only gun with logical straight upgrade available but it's logical since you're supposed to sell it when you have enough credit for Braton or get 3000 mastery out of it. Buffing it to be on par with Braton isn't really a good argument since there will be two weapons with similar/same statistic - what's the point of doing that in PvE game?

They function different. The mk 1 is a high accuracy low damage rifle. The braton is a mid damage, medium accuracy rifle. So to say that one is a buff of another isn't really a good comparison.

[Rhorge]

They function different. The mk 1 is a high accuracy low damage rifle. The braton is a mid damage, medium accuracy rifle. So to say that one is a buff of another isn't really a good comparison.

The accuracy is difference is not even an actual factor in most cases as you can simply burst the Braton and have a nail driver. The only real difference is damage, RoF and mag size. Other than mag size, Braton is pretty much a straight upgrade.

[Ss3trnks2]

The accuracy is difference is not even an actual factor in most cases as you can simply burst the Braton and have a nail driver. The only real difference is damage, RoF and mag size. Other than mag size, Braton is pretty much a straight upgrade.

The braton also reloads slower, if i wanted a burst fire weapon i'd use the burston if it weren't a junk weapon in it's current state.

[Rhorge]

The braton also reloads slower, if i wanted a burst fire weapon i'd use the burston if it weren't a junk weapon in it's current state.

I'd use a burst fire weapon with the option of going full auto if it existed. Too bad you can only do it the other way around.

[Dirt_Nap]

No point buffing the MK-1 since the Braton already does the job just fine.

 

It's a starter weapon. Asking it to be buffed to be useable in lategame is just like asking Diablo2's shortsword to be able to kill Diablo. As it stands, the MK-1 is probably the only gun with logical straight upgrade available but it's logical since you're supposed to sell it when you have enough credit for Braton or get 3000 mastery out of it. Buffing it to be on par with Braton isn't really a good argument since there will be two weapons with similar/same statistic - what's the point of doing that in PvE game?

The mk1 and the braton are similar, but not identical. I wont lecture you, you know The game. Like I said, horizontal progression and sidegrades are a good choice for eliminating boring vertical progression - "Ok I got my blue text gear, time to grind this dungeon for my purple text gear so I can grind another dungeon for my orange text gear..." ad infinitum. Of course opinions will differ, but I'd rather start as a jack of all trades, then figure out as i go specifically HOW I'd like to whoop &#!.

[Niryco]

 It'd be nice to see a little buff to the mk 1 braton to make it a little more viable in the late game. As it stands, it has less damage and fire rate when compared to the boltor, and the boltor has armor ignore. So other than the accuracy, there is no reason to even consider the MK 1 Braton. If it we're buffed to at least 18 atk and given a higher fire rate of around 9-10 I think more people would continue to use it in the late game. But as it stands, it's only good for until you get 25 k credits, which is like a single void run. Any thoughts?

The main point of the Mk1 braton is to ensure players actually move from weapon to weapon to get a good weapon. Also every weapon modded is fantastic. A Mk1 braton fully modded with say 2 forma can outdo the Braton in range and combat safety as well as ammo consumption which makes it a more efficient weapon overall.

 

If you don't like the Mk1 braton change weapons. The point of it is not about settling on a weapon, it is about moving on. If there are weapons that are better than move on, because if everyone were to settle on a gun that can be used at the start of the game to settle all your late game challenges, what is the point of a mastery rank?

 

What is the point of other weapons when the weapon you start with can compete with them? What is the whole point of even leveling up your own character? Just so you can use other weapons that are similar or weaker? That makes no sense in terms of progression, there is no growth disparity and overall it would make player turnover even faster since i can use a weapon that i get at the start to win all my battles, i know how the game is going to be like, i rather not improve.

 

Are you willing to say that because you buffed one weapon that we receive at the start, you see no more people playing anymore? Because overall all weapons can't compete with a near full accuracy, 60 mag clip that does 16 damage. It can outmatch boltors accuracy, it can outmatch Bratons accuracy and clip size, it can even outmatch a bratons DPM at the start.

 

Braton = 45 x 20 = 900. Mk1 braton = 16 x 60 =960. Overall with an ammo mod the Mk1 braton would benefit even further. So really there is no point buffing the weapon because simply it is already good as it is.

 

A braton Damage Per Mag at full level serration is 45 x (20x165/100)+20) compare to 60 x (16 x165/100)+16). You get 2385 vs 2520. The gap is now so much bigger, overall the Bratons full clip will all its bullets will do an overall lesser damage compared to a MK1 braton. Get your facts right, the Mk1 braton can deal even more damage than an upgraded braton. Silly, clearly you never even looked at all your facts.

 

All you want is more damage a shot, which would make the braton even more obsolete. Please look at all factors before considering a weapon weak, you are clearly blindly putting wrong facts which are nitpick for their low value and not the overall weapon itself.

[Niryco]

I am going to double post just to nit pick on alot of facts that makes the MK1 braton probably the best weapon in game.

 

The MK1 braton has a full damage per mag of 960.

 

Your boltor can over come that limit with 18 x 60 = 1080.

 

That is cool assuming we are shooting the enemy in the face, your boltor will miss well over 8 shots and thus can't even compete with the MK1 braton since its 960 is fully accurate number even at long ranges.

 

Further more you have bullet time for boltor so it is overall even worse. We have the braton but we know it loses out to 900 in one mag.

 

A full modded MK1 braton would be doing [[(165/100 x16) + 16] x 90/100] x 4 + [(165/100 x16) + 16] = 119 per shot at near full accuracy.

That is assuming i round down all the MK1 bratons damage since with full serration mod it is equal to 26 2/5. Thus even giving more bias to braton.

 

Our dear braton would be 33 x 90/100 x 4 + 33 = 152. (151 4/5). so 152 x 45 vs 119 x 60 = 6840 VS 7140. Who would be better off a whole mission if there is little rifle ammo dropped? You figure. Who would work overall better when fighting for an extended period of time? Go figure.

 

So now lets move on, the braton has a 2.3 second reload while MK1 has 2.2. Small diff? well it sure is but would you want the difference of 0.1 seconds? from your post totally.

 

The MK1 braton seems to be an overall amusingly better weapon for efficient survival which the braton clearly is not able to. Thus this would mean you need to level up your survival skills as well as lessen your run and gun methods. That is not the MK1 braton. It is for long drawn games, something like T3 void and killing everything just with your MK1 braton not Braton.

 

Thus it would seem your whole idea of a useless MK1 braton is flawed. A fully modded and even a base Mk1 braton can outperform the Braton in endurance games which the Braton can't. Thus it clearly is a playstyle issue not a gun issue.

 

Not to mention with the slower fire rate, chances are you would be conversing more ammo than spending, however for the braton? Would you? Obviously not, i play my braton with full speed trigger to treat it like a mini gun, against bosses i usually have 100 to 200 bullets left after my 702 start. Tell you so much about ammo economy.

 

Furthermore the braton vandal which is the cross may even outperform the braton in terms of ammo economy as well given its impressive accuracy and saving fire rate. You clearly can't consider all the factors if not it would ruin your post.

 

Sorry for being dreamy eyed, they probably should buff the braton to make it compatible with the MK1 braton since it is outperforming the braton in what end games are, endurance games not fast paced shooting. You have thus turned the whole facts on your own head. The MK1 braton would succeed further than any Braton since it can endure much more and be of more use in long engagements which are in late game when you have mobs with levels of 50 which are ridiculous.

 

Want to use your braton there? I did, i wasted 3 life tokens even with a nyx and chaos, full stretch and continuity. End game isn't all about speed, it is all about killing your enemies, one less enemy, one less thing to worry about that can eat at your life. Thus overall it would probably serve to be a reminder, that you probably haven't really tried end game non defense missions which are a torture.

[Xoxile]

Once you buff the Mk1 people are going to feel that their Bratons are not strong enough, and ask for those to be buffed. Then people who love Gorgon, or Supra are going to get scared because the Braton is creeping up on their favorite weapon's efficiency, and then ask for their weapons to be buffed. And then the people who love Mk1 will feel like the are doing poorly in games compared to the people who love the Braton, Gorgon, and Supra so they change to the Ogris to show hose elitists who's king of the score boards. And then people will ask for a nerf to the ciphers.

[Oleker]

Mk1 is the mos accurate of the bratons...  It can out-perform easily the normal braton and of course the Burston witch is a EXTREMLY under-performing long range gun.

[Amistyrja]

There's a reason why Mk-I Bratons and Latos don't give Mastery so easily. New players won't lose out on mastery points if they throw these starter gear aside in favour of the more specialized weaponry in the game.

[Paradoxbomb]

That's the point of this gun - you use it until you can get, for example, normal Braton - which is viable gun even in late game. MK1 is a starter gun, i barely had a patience to level it to 30 to get mastery.

It's kinda ironic that a game that's all about maxing out weapons strongly encourages players to immediately dump one and buy a better version (had I have actually realized there was a stronger version of the Mk-1, I probably wouldn't have mastered it.).

[Dasmir]

Its starter, its has good stats, its viable to fnish the game, dont need any buff.

[LasersGoPewPew]

if anything, the mk1 and the vandal just need more base polarities. the mk1 is the gun that gets you into the game, shouldn't it show you how to use polarity slots correctly? i.e having a polarity slot or two based on how it can be applied? like a D and a ~ polarity as it can be used as a cryo round cannon to maintain slow while also being good for mobil headshots which AP rounds aid in when it comes to corpus? a statistical buff isn't really needed, but i think it should come with atleast ONE polarity.

[Ss3trnks2]

@Jacate because you posted way to much to quote. 1. Your entire comparison of damage of braton to mk 1 is based off of clip size, to compare any gun to another except in some specific cases such as launchers, or melee weapons, you use Damage per second. Why? because it factors in damage,  and rate of fire. Both guns have the exact same ammo capacity all together, so if you look at it in the same way that you did (20*540) = 10800 vs (16*540) = 8640. That's over 2000 total damage difference in favor of the braton without any mods applied, realistically if you fully modded both guns, you would put the same mods on each gun as they are the same damage type. If you actually want to see the damage per second numbers, download a copy of this document and play around with the it (the braton does 146.84 dps unmodded, while the mk 1 does 83.93). https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Al651yf-IXPUdDBZSXpQeWZCdUV5ZWpOQ1RXYlBpSGc#gid=2

 

By buffing it to 18 damage with 8.3 firerate. Here would be the dps comparison of it to several other guns (unmodded and without enemy armor being factored):

 

Mk1 117.40 dps

Boltor 118.80 dps

Braton 146.84 dps

Braton Vandal 131.75 dps

Grakata 117.17 dps

Latron 104.25 dps

Latron Prime 118.69 dps

Burston 150.28 dps

 

Second, when comparing anything to the boltor you must consider its innate armor ignore which pay's off huge in the late game as the amount of damage it does to enemies increases greatly the later in the game you go especially with how enemy armor has been implemented in this game.

 

Here is a small example, if you took an infested ancient and shot it with the boltor vs other guns (dps without reloads factored).

 

All body shots:

 

Mk 1 38.28 dps

Braton 57.91 dps

Braton Vandal 48.76 dps

Boltor 162.36 dps

 

Grineer typically have higher armor, and corpus fluctuate pretty heavily on their armor depending upon where they are hit. But the boltor is putting out double the dps of the other guns simply because it ignores armor. And the braton has a %66 higher dps than the mk 1. 

 

Once you buff the Mk1 people are going to feel that their Bratons are not strong enough, and ask for those to be buffed. Then people who love Gorgon, or Supra are going to get scared because the Braton is creeping up on their favorite weapon's efficiency, and then ask for their weapons to be buffed. And then the people who love Mk1 will feel like the are doing poorly in games compared to the people who love the Braton, Gorgon, and Supra so they change to the Ogris to show hose elitists who's king of the score boards. And then people will ask for a nerf to the ciphers.

 Not trying to make it broken op, it's just putting it in-line with other weapons. The buffs i'm talking would only put it in range with some of the already lower end weapon dps. It would be about the same dps as the grakata unmodded. But we all know that a fully modded crit grakata will substantially pull away from this gun because of the grakata's high base crit rate. So really this gun will still be in about the same place, just more viable as an option.

Edited June 29, 2013 by Ss3trnks2

[Latronico]

Can't undertand why people speak about DPS bla bla and so on. Come on there are mods, and a set of mods is personal.
For example a player could put a maxed Speed trigger on a Mk1 but not on a Boltor or Braton, or on a Boltor but not on the Mk1, or on a Braton but not on the Mk1, same for damage mods bla bla bla. 

So, who cares about DPS for a weapon with basic stats? Basic stats ought to be considered JUST for set mod, nothing more. 

For example, RoF just shows if a weapon will PROBABLY need a maxed Speed trigger or not. Damage just shows if a weapon will PROBABLY need a maxed Serration to be usefull in the end game (instead of using it with a 105% Serration), or if it is PROBABLY usefull to put every maxed elemental damage or just someone.

Same for clip size, ammo and so on.....

 

No one ought to care about DPS because it's really linked to the set of mods of the weapon. With a particular set of mods a weapon can become way different from the basic one. Example? Look at the Mk1 (heavy modded is way better than a sniper rifle) or at the Boltor (with damage mods and a bigger clip size plus Speed trigger is better than a basic Gorgon), for example...

[Dasmir]

Can't undertand why people speak about DPS bla bla and so on. Come on there are mods, and a set of mods is personal.

For example a player could put a maxed Speed trigger on a Mk1 but not on a Boltor or Braton, or on a Boltor but not on the Mk1, or on a Braton but not on the Mk1, same for damage mods bla bla bla. 

So, who cares about DPS for a weapon with basic stats? Basic stats ought to be considered JUST for set mod, nothing more. 

For example, RoF just shows if a weapon will PROBABLY need a maxed Speed trigger or not. Damage just shows if a weapon will PROBABLY need a maxed Serration to be usefull in the end game (instead of using it with a 105% Serration), or if it is PROBABLY usefull to put every maxed elemental damage or just someone.

Same for clip size, ammo and so on.....

 

No one ought to care about DPS because it's really linked to the set of mods of the weapon. With a particular set of mods a weapon can become way different from the basic one. Example? Look at the Mk1 (heavy modded is way better than a sniper rifle) or at the Boltor (with damage mods and a bigger clip size plus Speed trigger is better than a basic Gorgon), for example...

 

+1 to this, you arent going to mod everything with the same mods

[KvotheTheArcane1]

+1 to this, you arent going to mod everything with the same mods

Really? I find I mod all my shotguns the same, all my pistols the same, and all the rifles the same. Base damage+, then multi shot if it ignores armor first, or AP if it doesn't, then the other mod. Am I alone in this?

 

Also, you compare DPS because that's how weapons are balanced mostly. (DPS standing for either damage per shot, or second)

Edited June 30, 2013 by KvotheTheArcane1

[Rudest]

I think it's a good middle ground "gateway" weapon.

It doesn't excel at the job of accurate semi-auto weapons like the Latron and the like.
It doesn't excel at a full auto role like the Braton and other similar weapons.

But what it does do is teach the new player which of the MK1's features he/she liked, so that aforementioned player can make an educated decision on what sort of weapon that they would like to move on to.

Edited June 30, 2013 by Rudest