Aura System Discussion 9.1.4 Thread Merger

[BoOz]

I don't have a problem with the new system for auras, but I feel that halving the amount of boost would be a fair compromise for the people who dislike it. In other words, a maxed aura would give 7 instead of 14.

[Oranjeboom]

OP is right..

There is no reason to forma if you have a reactor

and no reason to use reactor if you have a couple of forma

There are less factors to consider making a build now.

To sum it up

-Less forma.

-If you play a caster frame, max the caster mod AND the aura mod AND max at least the shield mod...and still points left

-Utility frame you go full utility mods AND defence mods

well you get the idea..you can have everything.

There is no need for loadouts anymore if you got the mods atleast once for each of your frames

I understand people like the change since the whole , farm and build forma, choose on what frame you ll use it, re level and repeat can be furstrating, BUT it was part of what made "comming up with builds" enjoyable...

You had to make sacrifices and choose what mods fit your gameplay...

Overall its just a badly rushed change

The aura on sentinel was the best idea...plus if you had all 3 sents.. you could set lets say wyrm for energy, cube for rifle amp, shade for enemy radar....and switch em with 2 clicks.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Oranjeboom

[Orthusaku]

Blame the min/maxers for whining about how they couldn't use all their maxed out mods and use their auras at the same time. :/ sad day when the game gets easier when it is already pretty damn easy.

[NalkorRN]

OP is right..

There is no reason to forma if you have a reactor

and no reason to use reactor if you have a couple of forma

 

There are less factors to consider making a build now.

To sum it up

 

-Less forma.

-If you play a caster frame, max the caster mod AND the aura mod AND max at least the shield mod...and still points left

-Utility frame you go full utility mods AND defence mods

 

well you get the idea..you can have everything.

 

There is no need for loadouts anymore if you got the mods atleast once for each of your frames

 

I understand people like the change since the whole , farm and build forma, choose on what frame you ll use it, re level and repeat can be furstrating, BUT it was part of what made "comming up with builds" enjoyable...

You had to make sacrifices and choose what mods fit your gameplay...

 

Overall its just a badly rushed change

The aura on sentinel was the best idea...plus if you had all 3 sents.. you could set lets wyrm for energy, cube for rifle amp, shade for enemy radar....and switch em with 2 clicks.

No, taking away from mod points was a badly rushed change.

[EetNotErn]

I'm sorry I didn't quote or direct any of my comment at you nor did I pay attention to your earlier post. There are three or so threads already like this one. The only reason I can see regarding someone complaining about the energy bonus is remorse over formas.

My point is that it hasn't even been a couple of hours yet and folks (ok jerks was a bit strong) are already crying nerf. It hasn't even been a day yet.

 

 

Yeah I got a little defensive there, sorry.

[MrHeartless]

It's easily 30-40%. But as you said, most don't frequent the forums so won't be talking.

 

GETTING capacity for leveling up a skill is counter-intuitive. Which is VERY BAD for casual players(the ones you mistakenly think you're speaking for).

 

GOALS are a prime proponent of this game. But as it stands, you can max(yes, MAX) a frame with 11 full mods without a single forma. That takes away a major goal of the game. A major thing to work for. People already leave this game constantly due to lack of content because there's so few goals to push towards. This is going to exacerbate this problem greatly.

 

 

Ignoring the fact that dual mods wouldn't matter(as they cap at lower levels, so end up with similar/same max capacity), that is again the future. A future where DE themselves already conceded levels are likely to be higher. Meaning you'll have even more excess capacity to work with.

 

But you're right, this change doesn't affect me. So why would I be so adamantly against it? Hmmm. Could it be that I'm a sadist and a misanthrope who wants to make everyone else miserable? If you believe that, then nothing I say will sway your very warped and very dilusional view. Or, perhaps the more likely reason is because I KNOW it's going to hurt the game to the casual audience, which means less money for the devs, which means less support, which means a dying game.

There is no way that you could say with any accuracy, whether by forum posts or by word of mouth that 30-40% of the Warframe community dislikes the new system. Or, conversely, that 30-40% of the Warframe Community comes to the forums. This game has hundreds of thousands of players now. (Check Raptr's site for a quick indicator) And majority of them, just as with ANY other MMO do not come to the forums. At most 20-25% of the Total Community of Players and out of that 1-3% are the hardcore guys, and even that is a stretch cause we'd still be talking in the ten thousand plus range. So I hope that rational breakdown causes you to understand the level of crap you are talking.

 

Getting Capacity for using an Aura is different, the ONLY reason I can see for this is as I said, the future. Rather than just make it cost 0 points like the Artifact system, they decided to make it ADD points. Either way it WILL NOT affect those who forma'ed their frames to accommodate max rank mods as there would be no overall INCREASE in capabilities as they would have already reached the power ceiling.

 

I suspect either more tweaks are coming or that more demanding mods are in the works. Nevertheless it helps the new players who don't yet have reactors, gain a free boost to their capacity.

[Drusus]

Are people really having a cry because they get more mod energy?

I take the view as a beta participant that it's not about what I want personally but what makes for a better structured game.

I'd be an idiot not to exploit having more mod power available, and rest assured, I shall.

That doesn't mean I get this change, agree with it or think it's better overall to just keep amping our ability to 'do more' with no meaningful opportunity costs on our warframes. :)

Besides, couldn't someone say the same about people having a cry because they had to forma one more time or manage their mod energy differently due to a change and ignoring the grand scale of the changes overall benefits long term?

People freaking out on either side does none of us any good and the forums are a more hostile place for all because of it, unfortunately.

[Mak_Gohae]

Yeah, it's too much.

I dont have any frames with Forma and could put in a bunch of maxed out mods if i match polarity. 

But i guess this is an answer to the "difficulty jump" the game had.

[xveganrox]

Love it!! Extra build versatility to go along with more difficult levels.

[OxexRaclir]

 BUT it was part of what made "comming up with builds" enjoyable...

You had to make sacrifices and choose what mods fit your gameplay...

What game are you playing? It certainly isn't Warframe. The only "builds" you need are ones that kill things the fastest or get from point A-B the quickest. Vauban notwithstanding because lol Bastille.

[NessOnett]

I'm sorry I didn't quote or direct any of my comment at you nor did I pay attention to your earlier post. There are three or so threads already like this one. The only reason I can see regarding someone complaining about the energy bonus is remorse over formas.

My point is that it hasn't even been a couple of hours yet and folks (ok jerks was a bit strong) are already crying nerf. It hasn't even been a day yet.

 

And let's just say, hypothetically, that they decided to triple the damage on the Ogris next patch. What would you say to that? Would you say "let's just wait and see, maybe it won't be as bad as everyone thinks." NO!

 

There'd be two groups of people just like there are now.

1. The group "crying" for it to be nerfed because it is BLATANTLY broken and messes horrendously with game balance.

2. The group screeching in defense of the new system because they want to abuse it as much as they can.

 

The numbers would be skewed much more towards the first than they are in this situation, but it's the same basic principle. Everyone can see it's a terrible balance decision as it makes the game far too easy and limits variety. But people want it to stay because they don't understand that when things become stupidly easy for them that they will get bored very quickly.

[Fireblac]

I like the idea a lot. It's basically like giving every frame a forma or such. However, all I ever wanted was to have the auras take no mod space away from my frame and they come up with this. I think it is pretty awesome for lower level frames looking to add more mods on to help them level but near end game I seems like they are giving us a bit too much. I have a dam good feeling this will change and they will keep this system but maybe give us 2-5 max capacity not 14 though I can't complain at the moment. I just hope they make up their minds soon and or tell us what to look forward to do so we can forma frames appropriately until then.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Fireblac

[Drusus]

Getting Capacity for using an Aura is different, the ONLY reason I can see for this is as I said, the future. Rather than just make it cost 0 points like the Artifact system, they decided to make it ADD points. Either way it WILL NOT affect those who forma'ed their frames to accommodate max rank mods as there would be no overall INCREASE in capabilities as they would have already reached the power ceiling.

 

I suspect either more tweaks are coming or that more demanding mods are in the works. Nevertheless it helps the new players who don't yet have reactors, gain a free boost to their capacity.

I hope this is exactly the case Heartless and suspect it must be or an expected re-balance of mod power is coming, in general.

Otherwise, the decision to me is pretty unfathomable as anything other than a wild knee jerk choice.

As always, I try to give DE the benefit of the doubt that more information is pending, but this one is puzzling.

[F1ddleD1ddle]

There are also the players who spent alot of time and even platinum on polarising and re-polarising their frames to accomodate the previous version of the aura system. The people who complained were the lazy people who didnt want to have to re-level thier warframes to continue to use the aura mods.

 

Now after this change my 5* Nyx has 20 extra mod points and everything at max, 3 hours before I still had all the mods equipped, at max including the maxed aura mod, but I had no points left to use. Now my last 2 - 3 formas have been a total waste of time, resources and platinum. 

 

I know i'm still in the minority but it doesn't seem fair that the pro-active head down and get on with it players get a big slap after putting in the effort.

[Oranjeboom]

No, taking away from mod points was a badly rushed change.

 Yes it was too...

as i said sents was the best idea...basically we got the same crappy change in reverse.

 

People who had 5-6 formas on a frame where disappointed (i guess) with the time wasted.

And people can complete a build with no penaltys in less time..i dont really find this good gameplay wise.

[krisp]

Been away for a few days (stupid antihack system) and now we're getting free drain?

 

 

I like it. I like it a lot, actually. Now I don't have to polarize my warframe slots so much and can just roll with less grinding levels. That's great. There's no talk of power creep here, the new system is nothing you couldn't have gotten with the old one if you forma'd enough times - only this time there's less grind.

 

They just need to tweak the aura mods a bit, at least Rifle Amp is silly powerful.

[MrHeartless]

There are also the players who spent alot of time and even platinum on polarising and re-polarising their frames to accomodate the previous version of the aura system. The people who complained were the lazy people who didnt want to have to re-level thier warframes to continue to use the aura mods.

 

Now after this change my 5* Nyx has 20 extra mod points and everything at max, 3 hours before I still had all the mods equipped, at max including the maxed aura mod, but I had no points left to use. Now my last 2 - 3 formas have been a total waste of time, resources and platinum. 

 

I know i'm still in the minority but it doesn't seem fair that the pro-active head down and get on with it players get a big slap after putting in the effort.

I understand where you are coming from but as this game is in development and developing at a rapid pace, your convenience purchases, for your own comfort cannot be the main consideration when balancing the entire game. Its unfortunate but its exactly why I did not forma my Aura slot as I knew changes would eventually come. Maybe some newer mods will come in Update 10 that fill up that space.

Edited July 16, 2013 by MrHeartless

[Oranjeboom]

What game are you playing? It certainly isn't Warframe. The only "builds" you need are ones that kill things the fastest or get from point A-B the quickest. Vauban notwithstanding because lol Bastille.

Vauban has 1 build cause he has 1 role

 

Rhino can go tank or go caster same with frost and saryn

Loki and ash could go tank / ulitity or caster...

 

Now just grab everything and you are good to go.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Oranjeboom

[MrHeartless]

 Yes it was too...

as i said sents was the best idea...basically we got the same crappy change in reverse.

 

People who had 5-6 formas on a frame where disappointed (i guess) with the time wasted.

And people can complete a build with no penaltys in less time..i dont really find this good gameplay wise.

How are they going to complete it in much less time? If you had all the formas already made and it was simply a case of releveling your frame, you could reach max rank about 2 to 3 times a day doing Kappa alone. So I dont think it changes much in that regard. Yes Forma is not as needed on Warframes but that is only for the time being.

 

I have been playing for 2 months and I still only have redirection and Vitality at ranks 6 and 5 respectively. The time sync is still and always will be, getting to a decent point where you can farm mods to rank up your existing mods. New players have it a lot harder than those who have been playing for a while do. It will take me months to max redirection and vit, let alone my damage mods... cringe.

[Orthusaku]

No, taking away from mod points was a badly rushed change.

 

No one was forcing you to min/max your warframes.

[NessOnett]

I understand where you are coming from but as this game is in development and developing at a rapid pace, your convenience purchases, for your own comfort cannot be the main consideration when balancing the entire game. Its unfortunate but its exactly why I did not forma my Aura slot as I knew changes would eventually come. Maye some newer mods will come in Update 10 that fill up that space.

 

Someone needs to look into a mirror. "Your own comfort cannot be the main consideration when balancing the entire game." Those are the words I would use to anyone in favor of the system. All they consider is "yay, this will make MY life easier." And refuse to accept, no matter how blatantly it's spelled out for them, how negatively this system will impact the game.

[F1ddleD1ddle]

I understand where you are coming from but as this game is in development and developing at a rapid pace, your convenience purchases, for your own comfort cannot be the main consideration when balancing the entire game. Its unfortunate but its exactly why I did not forma my Aura slot as I knew changes would eventually come. Maye some newer mods will come in Update 10 that fill up that space.

You say convenience purchases, but I farmed for all my weapons, frames and Potatos, I've only ever bought slots, marketplace only's and now a few forma. The majority of the forma were farmed like everything else and so this change seems all the more unfair. But I agree I am in the minority here with such a highly modified warframe, and although my gripes arent that important when compared with the effect it will have on the game as a whole, it should still be at least looked at and evaluated. Alienating all the hard-working players in the same boat as me, won't be a good move for DE or warframe.

[MrHeartless]

Someone needs to look into a mirror. "Your own comfort cannot be the main consideration when balancing the entire game." Those are the words I would use to anyone in favor of the system. All they consider is "yay, this will make MY life easier." And refuse to accept, no matter how blatantly it's spelled out for them, how negatively this system will impact the game.

Huh? You arent making very much sense. People like it because it saves them forma and time, forma'ing their frames. Also because they can get on max rank mods that much easier. It doesnt change the fact that you could get on max rank mods before this change. Meaning, there is no increase in actual power, just the ease with which you can do it. So no, it does not affect the game negatively. If the boost is too much, it can be tweaked, simple.

[XSuzumeX]

I swear people complaining about the difficulty and relating it to the aura system.Before the aura update I was running around with semi-maxed mods on my frames because i didn't think maxing them was worth it/necessary besides the powers of course .After the aura update all that changed was that I removed syphon and didn't feel like I even needed it on caster frames because I know how to conserve energy. After the update all that is going to change is that I get to have my syphon back and have an extra 14 points. Formaing frames was never about difficulty but about personal customization.The only thing I see different with this change is that people without potatoes get to have an easier time which is better for them imo. 

You want to complain about difficulty?complain about how all the enemies have simple patterns,some of which don't even make sense. Nerfing/buffing the aura system is not going to do much for you if you want difficulty.
 

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

And let's just say, hypothetically, that they decided to triple the damage on the Ogris next patch. What would you say to that? Would you say "let's just wait and see, maybe it won't be as bad as everyone thinks." NO!

 

There'd be two groups of people just like there are now.

1. The group "crying" for it to be nerfed because it is BLATANTLY broken and messes horrendously with game balance.

2. The group screeching in defense of the new system because they want to abuse it as much as they can.

 

The numbers would be skewed much more towards the first than they are in this situation, but it's the same basic principle. Everyone can see it's a terrible balance decision as it makes the game far too easy and limits variety. But people want it to stay because they don't understand that when things become stupidly easy for them that they will get bored very quickly.

The only thing you haven't accounted for are the casual players like me. Casual doesn't mean unskilled at all, but frankly I have no time or need to max vitality or redirection on any of my frames. Almost all of my mods like flow, streamiline, etc. that I have equipped on my frames isn't fully maxed and like serration which I will probably never max I just have no need to make my gear so OP that I would breeze through the game.

I don't spam my abilities and no my killcount isn't low.

On my unpotatoed frost I now have extra points to equip more mods. What does this tell me? The free players or players that couldn't buy or haven't gotten a potato can have a chance at the more difficult levels now.

Isn't this a good thing?

I see nothing broken with this change for the game and frankly people haven't even had a chance to try it out for a couple of hours yet. Only the folks with multiple formas and already maxed out stuff would find it redundant.

Edit: Let's just keep comparing apples to apples. Triple the damage on the ogris isn't equal to 14 more energy points on a warframe. Triple the base damage on an ogris would let players one shot a boss with relatively little modding. THAT WOULD break the game. ;)

Edited July 16, 2013 by sushidubya