Nightmare Mode, Challenging Or Punishing?

[theangelbelow88]

I'll keep this short and sweet. When DE first implemented nightmare mode, it was fun and added some new elements to the game, and it felt like it added more of a challenge for those who wished it, but now to me it feels like it can sometimes be more punishing then anything, no shields + losing energy, no shields + losing life, losing life + losing energy etc., and when you couple those factors in with stronger enemies, they can kill a player almost instantly or just outright, these kinda things make going through a mission painful and almost completely un-soloable for those who like to go it alone.

 

I think nightmare mode for me at least, has become more of something to avoid, this is more noticeable for players doing solo, and when a level must be farmed for an specific item, nightmare mode can severely slow down the progress, on top of RNG factor being in play.

 

This is just my personal opinion, and I would love to hear other people's thoughts on this topic.

[vasRayya]

you aren't pro enough to handle nightmare mode

[Stinker]

you aren't pro enough to handle nightmare mode

I'm going to agree with this.

It's there to be brutally challenging and something to put all that "Op" gear to good use.

 

It's the type of game mode where your "style" might not cut it anymore. It's something that encourages you to play outside of the norm. It's something to be beaten instead of something you'll simply do.

 

I like it.

 

THAT BEING SAID. More variety in Nightmare mode pls.

Edited July 31, 2013 by Stinker

[theangelbelow88]

I'm going to agree with this.

It's there to be brutally challenging and something to put all that "Op" gear to good use.

Your assuming everyone has "OP" gear, also some people like to run solo, nightmare mode hits solo players harder then those that group up, and please don't say that this game was meant to be played "cooperatively", The devs have even said it themselves that they like the idea of a balanced game for both solo and cooperative.

[Revel72]

you aren't pro enough to handle nightmare mode

 

This is bull S#&$ right here. What this peep wrote. I consider myself more average player and I still kick down some of these missions with Loki. Try to survive 4 Grineer Napalms and Stalker while vampire what kills you.

 

To topic well nightmare missions are fun but I do see them uncommonly punishing. They punishes you because you didn't make right decision resulting a death or you have a good plan but executed horribly on some point and enemy decides to grab the situation on his hands and kill you.

 

Right now I don't even care about those. I have enough nightmare mods what I need well mostly. They became boring to me because I knew how to step on enemy's toes and put a dagger on this throat resulting simple but hard to approach.

[RoboDoge]

you aren't pro enough to handle nightmare mode

Surviving nightmare like a boss is all that matters.

 

On more serious note, NM missions can be challenging with all that debuffing that game throws at you, but if you know what are you doing then you are can survive them.

[BonneyZILLA]

you aren't pro enough to handle nightmare mode

 

It's cool for people who wants a challenge, but where is the fun? I believe there should be an option for people to choose nightmare mode or not when players are ready to step.

[theangelbelow88]

Surviving nightmare like a boss is all that matters.

 

On more serious note, NM missions can be challenging with all that debuffing that game throws at you, but if you know what are you doing then you are can survive them.

Its not always about knowing what to do or "surviving nightmare mode like a boss", its about feeling challenged, and having fun at the same time, is this not the reason we play this game? I can do ANY nightmare mode, I have done the highest level content in this game, the problem isn't "can I do this?, the problem is "am I enjoying this?".

[stacey69]

I'll keep this short and sweet. When DE first implemented nightmare mode, it was fun and added some new elements to the game, and it felt like it added more of a challenge for those who wished it, but now to me it feels like it can sometimes be more punishing then anything, no shields + losing energy, no shields + losing life, losing life + losing energy etc., and when you couple those factors in with stronger enemies, they can kill a player almost instantly or just outright, these kinda things make going through a mission painful and almost completely un-soloable for those who like to go it alone.

 

I think nightmare mode for me at least, has become more of something to avoid, this is more noticeable for players doing solo, and when a level must be farmed for an specific item, nightmare mode can severely slow down the progress, on top of RNG factor being in play.

 

This is just my personal opinion, and I would love to hear other people's thoughts on this topic.

Hi. I'm a big fan of Nightmare but playing solo. The new changes do offer more of a challenge but also can be punishing. Having no shields is a mode i like but having no energy at the same time is punishing. The gamer can not win in this situation. You will die and have to revive as the Grineer shoot through walls and have aim bots. No amount of skillful wall play or dodging will help. With just no energy or just no shields you add caution and more tactics and the game is still very doable.

 

Someone added a post a week or so ago with a Youtube video that tried to explain the difference between good old fashioned hard games and games that punish the gamer. Nightmare can still be good if you get no energy and no map. No shields and no energy would be punishing. A dragon with 1 million health and your char does 1 damage per second would be punishing. I think that Nightmare needs only a tweak so you don't get say no minimap and a timer mission or no shields and no energy together as your nightmare.

 

As it stands Nightmare is not hardcore gaming. It is punishing and can make some people ill through the constant effort and trying against something punishing and 99.9% impossible. This is not true of every situation when you load Nightmare but sometimes.

 

A few tweaks here and there and I will come back to Warframe but for now i am having a break. The only mode i could enjoy was made a tad silly. I found another game I am enjoying so i have 2 games to enjoy now once some tweaking has been done. I'll be back hammering Nightmare soon i hope. As for now i am leaving it alone as i am stupid and bash my head against anything impossible and it was making me feel ill.

[theangelbelow88]

Hi. I'm a big fan of Nightmare but playing solo. The new changes do offer more of a challenge but also can be punishing. Having no shields is a mode i like but having no energy at the same time is punishing. The gamer can not win in this situation. You will die and have to revive as the Grineer shoot through walls and have aim bots. No amount of skillful wall play or dodging will help. With just no energy or just no shields you add caution and more tactics and the game is still very doable.

 

Someone added a post a week or so ago with a Youtube video that tried to explain the difference between good old fashioned hard games and games that punish the gamer. Nightmare can still be good if you get no energy and no map. No shields and no energy would be punishing. A dragon with 1 million health and your char does 1 damage per second would be punishing. I think that Nightmare needs only a tweak so you don't get say no minimap and a timer mission or no shields and no energy together as your nightmare.

 

As it stands Nightmare is not hardcore gaming. It is punishing and can make some people ill through the constant effort and trying against something punishing and 99.9% impossible. This is not true of every situation when you load Nightmare but sometimes.

 

A few tweaks here and there and I will come back to Warframe but for now i am having a break. The only mode i could enjoy was made a tad silly. I found another game I am enjoying so i have 2 games to enjoy now once some tweaking has been done. I'll be back hammering Nightmare soon i hope. As for now i am leaving it alone as i am stupid and bash my head against anything impossible and it was making me feel ill.

If anything I believe that nightmare mode needs refining, like I also said I feel nightmare mode punishes solo players more then group players, I don't think nightmare modes needs to be removed or anything around those guidelines, but like you said it needs re-tweaking.

 

two simple things I would love to see happen is, if nightmare mode could be optional, so players could choose if they want to run nightmare mode or just a standard mission, and two, if the combinations on nightmare mode were more reasonable, no mini-map on extermination(really), no shield and draining energy etc.

[Tesrac]

I'll be honest, till they implement some kind of sensible change I won't be playing Warframe at all, nor spending my money, neither will any friends or family that play.  These are supposed to be experienced game developers, but they couldn't forsee setting up missions that take away half or more of your inate defensive strength, coupled with not allowing you to use any of your energy, while draining your health steadily would be a problem?  It's like the end game armor scaling....it makes me want to *head desk* out of sheer wonder.

 

They didn't think to set up categories?  One having energy/health drain/no shields, another with the environmental effects, and maybe a third with the radar/other odds and ends....then have it assign something from each category as your limiting parameters?  What kind of a retard goes "Ah hell, just hit them with all of it....it's nightmare mode....herp a derp"  This has made me question whether this game is worth ANY of my time anymore....it's just a stupid, inane, asinine means to implement this, with no forethought or consideration of how it would work.....

[Ozrik]

I'll keep this short and sweet. When DE first implemented nightmare mode, it was fun and added some new elements to the game, and it felt like it added more of a challenge for those who wished it, but now to me it feels like it can sometimes be more punishing then anything, no shields + losing energy, no shields + losing life, losing life + losing energy etc., and when you couple those factors in with stronger enemies, they can kill a player almost instantly or just outright, these kinda things make going through a mission painful and almost completely un-soloable for those who like to go it alone.

 

I think nightmare mode for me at least, has become more of something to avoid, this is more noticeable for players doing solo, and when a level must be farmed for an specific item, nightmare mode can severely slow down the progress, on top of RNG factor being in play.

 

This is just my personal opinion, and I would love to hear other people's thoughts on this topic.

No shields / no energy is doable against infested, against Corpus and Grineer forget it you will be mowed down in secs. Many frames depend on thier utility to survive, and the fact you can get no energy/no shields means your stuck playing a a tank type frame if you want to solo or not be huge hinderance to your group. They just need to set it so that combo can't come together, one or other is fine just combined is ridiculous.

[Ralthor]

Reminds me of the quote from Doom when you selected nightmare mode....

 

 

..... "Are you sure? This isn't even remotely fair"

 

*EDIT 

 

My personal response to nightmare mode as it currently exists is: F*** this, im off to play marble.

[MDaen]

My only complaint with nightmare mode right now is that it impedes farming.

 

I have no problem with nightmare mode when I'm in the mood for nightmare mode. But when I want to farm Nova blueprints, for example, and the mission is set to nightmare mode, I'm forced to play against higher level enemies from a disadvantageous position whether I want to or not.

 

Simple solution. Get rid of the alert-esque nightmare system, and make it a toggle. Click this check box on your planet-select screen, and available missions are now nightmare missions. Nightmare mods drop off bosses and have a 25% drop rate from mission completion. New blueprints for prestigious weapon and/or warframe skins drop from the bosses who drop the corresponding warframe's blueprints in normal mode. Problem solved.

 

Now I can farm normal mode without being forced into nightmare mode, and the community has greater motivation to play nightmare missions. Everyone wins.

[Stinker]

You see, I LIKE nightmare mode when I'm farming (Especially when farming blueprints). I like that they pop up randomly in a love/hate kind of way.

 

So nightmare forces you to go farm elsewhere or work a little harder for arguably the best frame in the game right now for pure enemy destruction. I think the better a frame, the more often it's mission should become nightmare mode.

 

The tweaks to nightmare mode should be on nightmare mode itself atm. More variety. Different things you have to adjust for. Some consistency.

 

Loadouts. That's what nightmare needs is loadouts. Give players a last chance to change their mod setup upon starting a nightmare mission/discovering what conditions they'd be under so they can load up a set of mods they've tailored to combat the challenges presented to them. You could make nightmare mode even harder / unforgiving! Also loadouts are just needed anyway imho. That's a different thread entirely.

[MDaen]

No player should ever be forced to play a mission that is typically at level 40 mission at level 60, just because of RNG. Especially if that level bump is accompanied by numerous debuffs.

 

I enjoy nightmare missions, but I should have the freedom to enjoy them when I want to play them. When the game decides the mission I logged in to farm leisurely is going to be a nightmare mission for the next 12 hours, I tend to log back off and just wait it out.

 

Even if the alert-esque system stays in place, a simple option to select the non-nightmare version of a mission would be a fantastic addition. Not everyone wants to play nightmare mode. It's a tougher scenario for players who want a greater challenge. That's all well and good, but sometimes, we just want a half hour of casual play in what should have been a low level mission. I shouldn't have to change my plans simply because other players think the difficulty of my missions should be determined by chance.

[Countess_Hapmuhr]

The only problem I have with nightmare is that I'm forced to do it for a specific node when I NEED to do something else there. (farming, playing with friends, etc) If it were optional, I'd have no problems with it.

 

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not dominating nightmare mode, in fact most of the time it makes me realize how much I suck at the game and how much I need to learn in order to make a versatile loadout. But I really can't make a distinction about punishing or challenging, because in my mind, when you reach the big leagues, you either learn to roll with the unfair punches or go home.

 

And yes, I go home a lot.

[BadAimbot]

What I don't like is the incentive for NMM. Doing a Raid on Venus with a timer and no Shields gives the same reward as a Defense on Pluto featuring draining energy and vampire. There is no reward scaling at all. High level and/or painful combination NMM missions are only there for a challenge, which just isn't enough.