Shotgun Comparisons

[GottFaust]

Lets put some misconceptions to rest here.

The Hek is not the best at anything. It was never very good to begin with. It just did enough damage to kill the old-scale enemies in 1-2 hits so people thought it was good. With the new enemy scaling and advent of the Sobek, it doesn't actually have any advantage at all anymore.

The following is the "optimum" damage build:

• Hell's Chamber
• Point Blank
• Shotgun Spazz
• Accelerated Blast
• Blaze
• Flechette
• Incendiary Coat
• Chilling Grasp

DPS Comparisons:

Strun

DPS :: 6373.505

Burst DPS :: 22842.641

Full Details:

Name :: Strun

Magazine Size :: 6

Total Ammo :: 126

Crit Chance :: 7.5%

Crit Damage Multiplier :: 150%

Fire Rate :: 5.168

Reload Time :: 3

Damage :: 4260.256

Damage Shields :: 5042.752

Damage Corpus :: 4260.256

Damage Grineer :: 4260.256

Damage Infested :: 5564.416

Crit Damage :: 6390.384

Crit Damage to Shields :: 7564.128

Crit Damage to Corpus :: 6390.384

Crit Damage to Grineer :: 6390.384

Crit Damage to Infested :: 8346.624

Average Damage :: 5325.32

Average Damage to Shields :: 6303.44

Average Damage to Corpus :: 5325.32

Average Damage to Grineer :: 5325.32

Average Damage to Infested :: 6955.52

Damage per Mag :: 26520.094

Damage per Mag to Sheilds :: 31391.131

Damage per Mag to Corpus :: 26520.094

Damage per Mag to Grineer :: 26520.094

Damage per Mag to Infested :: 34638.49

DPS :: 6373.505

DPS to Sheilds :: 7544.148

DPS to Corpus :: 6373.505

DPS to Grineer :: 6373.505

DPS to Infested :: 8324.577

Burst DPS :: 22842.641

Burst DPS to Shields :: 27038.228

Burst DPS to Corpus :: 22842.641

Burst DPS to Grineer :: 22842.641

Burst DPS to Infested :: 29835.286

Boar

DPS :: 8176.473

Burst DPS :: 36761.421

Full Details:

Name :: Boar

Magazine Size :: 10

Total Ammo :: 130

Crit Chance :: 5%

Crit Damage Multiplier :: 150%

Fire Rate :: 15.2

Reload Time :: 2.3

Damage :: 2359.526

Damage Shields :: 2792.909

Damage Corpus :: 2359.526

Damage Grineer :: 2359.526

Damage Infested :: 3081.83

Crit Damage :: 3539.29

Crit Damage to Shields :: 4189.363

Crit Damage to Corpus :: 3539.29

Crit Damage to Grineer :: 3539.29

Crit Damage to Infested :: 4622.746

Average Damage :: 2949.408

Average Damage to Shields :: 3491.136

Average Damage to Corpus :: 2949.408

Average Damage to Grineer :: 2949.408

Average Damage to Infested :: 3852.288

Damage per Mag :: 24185.146

Damage per Mag to Sheilds :: 28627.315

Damage per Mag to Corpus :: 24185.146

Damage per Mag to Grineer :: 24185.146

Damage per Mag to Infested :: 31588.762

DPS :: 8176.473

DPS to Sheilds :: 9678.274

DPS to Corpus :: 8176.473

DPS to Grineer :: 8176.473

DPS to Infested :: 10679.475

Burst DPS :: 36761.421

Burst DPS to Shields :: 43513.519

Burst DPS to Corpus :: 36761.421

Burst DPS to Grineer :: 36761.421

Burst DPS to Infested :: 48014.918

Hek

DPS :: 6761.531

Burst DPS :: 31067.884

Full Details:

Name :: Hek

Magazine Size :: 4

Total Ammo :: 124

Crit Chance :: 2.5%

Crit Damage Multiplier :: 150%

Fire Rate :: 6.688

Reload Time :: 2.15

Damage :: 4587.968

Damage Shields :: 5430.656

Damage Corpus :: 4587.968

Damage Grineer :: 4587.968

Damage Infested :: 5992.448

Crit Damage :: 6881.952

Crit Damage to Shields :: 8145.984

Crit Damage to Corpus :: 6881.952

Crit Damage to Grineer :: 6881.952

Crit Damage to Infested :: 8988.672

Average Damage :: 5734.96

Average Damage to Shields :: 6788.32

Average Damage to Corpus :: 5734.96

Average Damage to Grineer :: 5734.96

Average Damage to Infested :: 7490.56

Damage per Mag :: 18581.27

Damage per Mag to Sheilds :: 21994.157

Damage per Mag to Corpus :: 18581.27

Damage per Mag to Grineer :: 18581.27

Damage per Mag to Infested :: 24269.414

DPS :: 6761.531

DPS to Sheilds :: 8003.445

DPS to Corpus :: 6761.531

DPS to Grineer :: 6761.531

DPS to Infested :: 8831.388

Burst DPS :: 31067.884

Burst DPS to Shields :: 36774.23

Burst DPS to Corpus :: 31067.884

Burst DPS to Grineer :: 31067.884

Burst DPS to Infested :: 40578.461

Sobek

DPS :: 10006.92

Burst DPS :: 25217.438

Full Details:

Name :: Sobek

Magazine Size :: 20

Total Ammo :: 140

Crit Chance :: 2.5%

Crit Damage Multiplier :: 150%

Fire Rate :: 7.6

Reload Time :: 4

Damage :: 3277.12

Damage Shields :: 3879.04

Damage Corpus :: 3277.12

Damage Grineer :: 3277.12

Damage Infested :: 4280.32

Crit Damage :: 4915.68

Crit Damage to Shields :: 5818.58

Crit Damage to Corpus :: 4915.68

Crit Damage to Grineer :: 4915.68

Crit Damage to Infested :: 6420.48

Average Damage :: 4096.4

Average Damage to Shields :: 4848.8

Average Damage to Corpus :: 4096.4

Average Damage to Grineer :: 4096.4

Average Damage to Infested :: 5350.4

Damage per Mag :: 66361.68

Damage per Mag to Sheilds :: 78550.56

Damage per Mag to Corpus :: 66361.68

Damage per Mag to Grineer :: 66361.68

Damage per Mag to Infested :: 86676.48

DPS :: 10006.92

DPS to Sheilds :: 11844.926

DPS to Corpus :: 10006.92

DPS to Grineer :: 10006.92

DPS to Infested :: 13070.263

Burst DPS :: 25217.438

Burst DPS to Shields :: 29849.213

Burst DPS to Corpus :: 25217.438

Burst DPS to Grineer :: 25217.438

Burst DPS to Infested :: 32937.062

None of these guns ignore armor, and they all have the exact same scaling.

If you want Burst DPS, you get the Boar. If you want sustained DPS, you get the Sobek.

Furthermore: the Sobek is just as accurate and has the exact same rage as the Hek.

The Hek had her day, but it's time to put the old girl to rest.

Edit - Formatting (The forums ate my new-line characters).

Edit 2 - According to this spreadsheet https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au6mBXle3cFtdHBYUzVJaDJfdkIzSEN1cUh5UlRvckE#gid=4 the Hek has a 2.15 second reload, so I've updated the DPS numbers to reflect this. The conclusions still stand in their entirety though.

Edited August 6, 2013 by GottFaust

[--Sokol]

As far as I know the reload speed on Hek is not 4 but 2.1 .

[Llokii]

I've used both the Hek and the Sobek to level 30, no way they have the same reload time

[GottFaust]

The Hek reload was based on the last info I had, and the wiki doesn't list it. If someone can get me the exact reload I'll update my post.

For the record even with a 2.0 reload it's still only 6800 dps with the same burst. (Reload does not affect burst DPS)

[DeathByDribbling]

Loose shotgun spaz and put on ammo stock (which benefits some guns more then others).  Added in hells chamber because that also benefits some guns more then others, most of the other mods are the same for all of them so no need to make numbers bigger:

Sobek: 225 * 32 = 7200

Hek: 300 * 6 = 1800

Strun 286 * 10 = 2860

Boar 156 * 16 = 2496

 

Being as the killer is reload sobek is in a different league to the others.  Strun not as good as it looks as spread and damage drop off vs hek lower actual damage quite a bit.  Sobek however gets hek spread so it's not got that disadvantage.

 

That said a despair is better then any of them, with new pistol ammo mutation never runs out of ammo so you never need a second gun and is available at rank 2, so makes them all obsolete really.

Edited August 6, 2013 by DeathByDribbling

[Llokii]

Also, using shotgun spazz over charged shell?

[GottFaust]

Also, using shotgun spazz over charged shell?

Yes, fire rate affects ALL damage output, Charged Shell would only add 90% additional base damage. Download the calculator and try it out yourself.

[Naf912]

The reload on the Sobek puts it out of the running.  Hek until Dojo.

[Definitegj]

Can elaborate or define what exactly is burst and sustained DPS?

[DeathByDribbling]

The reload on the Sobek puts it out of the running.  Hek until Dojo.

 

When you can do 4 * the damage before reloading?

[Naf912]

When you can do 4 * the damage before reloading?

Yeah - you would think that the extra clip size would balance it out, but, my experience with it just left me frustrated having to take cover and reload.  Often I would swap out a sidearm if needed but that would just start the painful reloading process all over again.  I find that with the Hek the pattern of 'Kill 6 - reload, repeat' fits the pace of how mobs spawn in most of the content. 

 

Sometimes I wish I didnt have to click so often, however.

[GottFaust]

Can elaborate or define what exactly is burst and sustained DPS?

Burst DPS is the raw DPS. It's unaffected by such petty things as mag size, time to empty the mag, reload time, ect...

Sustained DPS is much closer to what you will actually see. It factors in reloads, mag size, ect...

[Llokii]

Yes, fire rate affects ALL damage output, Charged Shell would only add 90% additional base damage. Download the calculator and try it out yourself.

 

I'll be damned, it sure does according to the calc.  I might reconsider this weapon.

[GottFaust]

I found a data-mined reload speed for the Hek, and have updated the initial post to reflect it. All of the conclusions still stand as initially drawn though.

[Naf912]

Hek vs Sobek - I found that to make the Sobek viable in harder content where ammo availability is an issue I had to sacrifice a raw dps mod for ammo mutation, or bring along ammo packs.

 

Hek seems much more viable in situations such as late wave defense missions or T3 exterminates with how much more damage it does per unit of ammunition.

 

[Definitegj]

Hek vs Sobek - I found that to make the Sobek viable in harder content where ammo availability is an issue I had to sacrifice a raw dps mod for ammo mutation, or bring along ammo packs.

 

Hek seems much more viable in situations such as late wave defense missions or T3 exterminates with how much more damage it does per unit of ammunition.

Just 40% more damage per shot, meaning 40% more ammo ammunition. Easily solved with ammo boxes.

[Dran]

Hek vs Sobek - I found that to make the Sobek viable in harder content where ammo availability is an issue I had to sacrifice a raw dps mod for ammo mutation, or bring along ammo packs.

 

Hek seems much more viable in situations such as late wave defense missions or T3 exterminates with how much more damage it does per unit of ammunition.

 

I respectfully disagree.

 

I have personally use both Hek and Sobek in various situations: regular run-and-gun mission, low level defense, high level defense, mobile defense, void T3 missions of all kind. Simply put I have good experience with both guns.

 

The Sobek outperform the Hek in almost all situation.

 

The only noticeable downside of the Sobek, as we all know, is the reload time. But even when that is taken into account, Hek can atmost kill 4 regular enemies before reloading, while Sobek can kill 15-20 regular enemies just as easily (not counting Ammo Stock)

 

VS Heavy units: let's assume a heavy units would require a full clip of 4 shots of Hek to take down. that would equal roughly 6 rounds of Sobek shots, meaning Sobek could take down 3 same heavy units before having to reload.

 

I know we all have our attachment with the Hek - it's almost one of my most used guns, but the Sobek is just THAT good after the buff to 100 base damage.

[AfroGamerNinja]

I respectfully disagree.

 

I have personally use both Hek and Sobek in various situations: regular run-and-gun mission, low level defense, high level defense, mobile defense, void T3 missions of all kind. Simply put I have good experience with both guns.

 

The Sobek outperform the Hek in almost all situation.

 

The only noticeable downside of the Sobek, as we all know, is the reload time. But even when that is taken into account, Hek can atmost kill 4 regular enemies before reloading, while Sobek can kill 15-20 regular enemies just as easily (not counting Ammo Stock)

 

VS Heavy units: let's assume a heavy units would require a full clip of 4 shots of Hek to take down. that would equal roughly 6 rounds of Sobek shots, meaning Sobek could take down 3 same heavy units before having to reload.

 

I know we all have our attachment with the Hek - it's almost one of my most used guns, but the Sobek is just THAT good after the buff to 100 base damage.

 

Then again, there's Tactical Pump for the reload time.

[Dran]

Then again, there's Tactical Pump for the reload time.

 

Nah, if I wanna save on reload time, an Ammo Stock mod would be much more sufficient. Tactical Pump is just too weak for its mod cost.

[AfroGamerNinja]

Nah, if I wanna save on reload time, an Ammo Stock mod would be much more sufficient. Tactical Pump is just too weak for its mod cost.

 

Mind explaining why a max ammo mod is more effective than a reload speed one? Because right now, I don't see the damn link.

[Haif]

Reload speed mod is only 30% at max rank. Clip capacity goes up to 60%.

You don't have to reload a 32 round clip very often, which leads to greater uptime.

[Briar_Wolf]

Reload speed mod is only 30% at max rank. Clip capacity goes up to 60%.

You don't have to reload a 32 round clip very often, which leads to greater uptime.

Unless you are a compulsive reloader, like myself. There could be one spent shot in the magazine, and I'll reload. It's just the way I work. I'll dump the entire magazine when fighting a boss or a massive wave during defense, but otherwise I am reloading after every few kills.

 

I'm not disagreeing with you. On the contrary, I do agree that increasing the magazine size means you don't have to reload as often. But that wouldn't work for everybody.

[Definitegj]

Unless you are a compulsive reloader, like myself. There could be one spent shot in the magazine, and I'll reload. It's just the way I work. I'll dump the entire magazine when fighting a boss or a massive wave during defense, but otherwise I am reloading after every few kills.

 

I'm not disagreeing with you. On the contrary, I do agree that increasing the magazine size means you don't have to reload as often. But that wouldn't work for everybody.

 

Those are the times when you are reloading outside combat which the extra 1 sec reload time won't make any difference since you are not vulnerable. If the enemies appear suddenly while reloading, some tips to break reload and resume shooting - Jump or roll tap.

Edited August 8, 2013 by Definitegj