R3Leaz's (Possibly Final) Feedback.

[R3leaZ]

Introduction of Forma

There used to be these awesome people who were very good at making Warframe builds or weapon builds. They made the most balanced and useful builds with the limited mod space they were given. Weapons that were limited so that they wouldn't become ridiculously unbalanced. Though that is no more after forma got implemented.

 

Sure it would have been okay if formaing could only be done once or twice. But it has been implemented so that it can be done infinitely. This was a very bad decision imo. Default polarities on weapons had their use before forma got implemented. They were there to balance out the weapon's weakness or weren't there to prevent them from becoming overpowered. The game was more balanced before formas got released. Infinite formaing ended up making tons.... like srsly tons of weapons less effective and inferior. (Mainly the weapons that had default polarities to balance out their weaknesses)

 

This game already had balancing issues. Like armor scaling and instead of fixing up stuff they made things even more unbalanced... even added power creeps not only in weapons and warframes but also in mods...

 

"Warframe/Gun X is over(or under)-powered! (Why did you nerf? Why did you boost?)

We are rolling out balance changes very quickly. We love the feedback (good and bad) and take it very seriously. Our goal is to avoid having a single dominant weapon, build, mod configuration..." - Source: FAQ

 

Founder reasons

I became a founder because I wanted to support DE. I found that they made an awesome game that had so much potential. My main focus of becoming a founder was supporting DE (I didn't care about the platinum honestly). I dislike the route Warframe is going now though. DE is making mistake after mistake and it feels like they are only digging deeper and diverting from their original path where everything would be balanced...

 

They said armor scaling was working as intended (ayfkm? https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/91501-august-6th-communtiy-hot-topics/ Look at the comments), they're releasing power creep after power creep, they don't fix the re****ed AI. They only focus on pumping out new content after new content while they should focus on fixing issues that have been here for a very long time (Example: Graphics department). But not focusing on their broken mechanics or tons of bugs and glitches that have stuck around for almost a year...

 

I'm seriously wondering if my time finally is up in this game. I was trying to be a true beta player. Focusing on reporting bugs, glitches or exploits. Giving a lot of feedback about different things and making mechanic suggestions. Having fun at the forums discussing things about the game...

 

Motivation

But I'm starting to lose motivation. The imbalance in this game which was not the original path of DE, problems that have stuck for almost a year and overly simplicity of this game (This game is overly simple which is a problem, simple mechanics... almost nothing that actually seems complicated. Example: Elemental mods are just damage modifiers, no complicated debuffs or any well thought out mechanics, limitations are also mechanics) have eventually made me lose a lot of motivation in this game after time went on.

 

PvP

Also one thing. PvP keeps games alive for a hell of a lot longer. It's because competition in skill actually makes things challenging = fun, you learn tactics, you learn ways to play, you get a break from the stupid predictable AI. Look at Battlefield 3 for example. It would also have helped with the balance of weapons. Making everything balanced and nerfing power creeps. Current Warframes should never be implemented in PvP though. PvP exclusive Warframes ranging from light, medium, heavy should be made exclusive to PvP only so the PvE Warframes won't get touched. Since Warframes are way too different and balancing them for PvP wouldn't be good at all... it would be terrible since they have their uniqueness. Weapons though could fit into PvP since it would help with rebalancing them. But still DE confirmed that this game won't have PvP and are deleting any threads that talk about PvP.

 

I will try to stick around helping the game grow

DE might still have the possibility to get back up from this endless spiral that goes downwards. So I will try to stick around searching for bugs, glitches and exploits for them to fix. But I wonder how long it will take before I finally give up.

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[Trollin4ThePrimes]

K.

[R3leaZ]

K.

 

The irony in your profile description rofl...

[notlamprey]

Did you just find a way to package PvP that made me NOT instantly hate it?

D - don't go...

[ChaoticVice777]

Valid feedback and complaints, but perhaps it's time for you to take a long short break from Warfarmframe?

Edited August 13, 2013 by ChaoticVice777

[R3leaZ]

Did you just find a way to package PvP that made me NOT instantly hate it?

D - don't go...

 

I actually wonder how many times I have suggested it like this rofl xDDD I always see people reacting positively on it but it always ends up getting swallowed in a lot of comment pages xD

 

 

Valid feedback and complaints, but perhaps it's time for you to take a long short break from Warfarmframe?

 

 

Would you imagine... xD I reached Mastery Rank 7 not once but twice. xD Currently I'm at Mastery Rank 8 almost 9. So I've got quite a lot of experience with this game. Yes it was very repetitive but I tried for MR 7 once again after the reset.

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[CrazyCanadian24]

K.

 

The only redeeming quality of this post is the fact that the poster is an anti-brony. Otherwise this post needs to be killed with fire. It lends absolutely nothing to this thread - in fact, if you could express that with a numerical value, you'd probably get a negative number.

[R3leaZ]

The only redeeming quality of this post is the fact that the poster is an anti-brony. Otherwise this post needs to be killed with fire. It lends absolutely nothing to this thread - in fact, if you could express that with a numerical value, you'd probably get a negative number.

 

Oh wow, I couldn't stop giggling when I read this post xDD

 

EDIT: I'll get some sleep for now. It's getting late. Sleep well everyone ^^

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[Cyrosage]

Forma

There used to be these awesome people who were very good at making Warframe builds or weapon builds. They made the most balanced and useful builds with the limited mod space they were given. Weapons that were limited so they couldn't become ridiculously unbalanced. Though that is no more after forma got implemented.

 

Sure it would have been ok if formaing could only be done once or twice. But it has been implemented so it can be done indefinitely. This was a very bad decision imo. Default polarities on weapons had their use before Forma got implemented. They were there to balance out the weapon's weakness or weren't there to prevent them becoming overpowered. The game was more balanced before formas got released. Infinite formaing ended up making tons.... like srsly tons of weapons obsolete. (Mainly the weapons that had default polarities to balance out their weaknesses)

 

This game already had balancing issues. Like armor scaling and instead of fixing up stuff they made things even more unbalanced... even added power creeps not only in weapons and warframes but also in mods...

 

Founder reasons

I became a founder because I wanted to support DE. I found that they made an awesome game that had so much potential. My main focus of becoming a founder was supporting DE (I didn't care about the Platinum honestly). I dislike the route Warframe is going now though. DE is making mistakes after mistakes and it feels like they are only digging deeper...

 

They said armor scaling was working as intended (ayfkm?), they're releasing power creeps after power creeps, they don't fix the re****ed AI. They only focus on pumping out new content after new content. But not focusing on their broken mechanics or tons of bugs and glitches that have stuck around for almost a year...

 

I'm seriously wondering if my time finally is up in this game. I was trying to be a true beta player. Focusing on reporting bugs, glitches or exploits. Giving a lot of feedback about different things and making mechanic suggestions. Having fun at the forums discussing things about the game...

 

Motivation

But I'm starting to lose motivation. The unbalance in this game, problems that have stuck for almost a year and overly simplicity of this game (This game is overly simple which is the problem, simple mechanics... almost nothing that actually seems complicated. Example: Elemental mods are just damage modifiers, no debuffs or any well thought out mechanics) have eventually made me lose a lot of motivation in this game after time went on.

 

PvP

Also one thing. PvP keeps games alive for a hell of a lot longer. It's because competition in skill actually makes things challenging = fun, you learn tactics, you learn ways to play, you get a break from the stupid predictable AI. Look at Battlefield 3 for example. It would also have helped with the balance of weapons making everything balanced taking away power creeps. Current Warframes should never be implemented in PvP though. PvP exclusive Warframes ranging from light, medium, heavy should be made exclusive to PvP only so the PvE Warframes won't get touched. Since Warframes are way too different and balancing them for PvP wouldn't be good at all... it would be terrible since they have their uniqueness.

 

I will try to stick around helping the game grow

DE might still have the possibility to get back up from this endless spiral that goes downwards. So I will try to stick around searching for bugs, glitches and exploits for them to fix. But I wonder how long it will take before I finally give up.

 

Goodness.  Many of your points are based on opinions being asserted as facts.  Slow down and take a deep breath.

 

Just because you have played the game a lot, have lots of high level mods, and potatoes, doesn't mean everyone else does.  This is F2P remember? There are and will be far more casual players than people like you and I who have played the heck out of this game.  To many, the challenge is still there as they fight to get better warframes and level up their mods and get other weapons.  Most players won't be rolling in credits until running a T3 and will be selectively having to choose what to build and how to equip it based off what they have.

 

Obsolete weapons in F2P game with tons of variety is an unfair statement.  If there were a starter weapon, mid level weapon, and high level weapon with no other choices (I mean seriously, something has to be the best right?) then it would be repetitive.  Acrid is crazy good, but Lato is still fun and a good starter.  Acrid is for those who have seriously invested in the game.  Infinite forma making other weapons obsolete is an imbalanced statement because you could just forma all the weapons and you still have about the same thing.  There is nothing so terrible that when equipped with leveled mods won't be worth taking into battle.

 

Glad you're a founder.  You've seen change but you can't assert the company is making mistakes based off your own opinion on what they should do unless you run your own MMO F2P while making a profit and growing your player base.  They are changing the game a lot and some people won't like every change.  Get over it rather than attacking.  This isn't feedback, it's whining.

Power creeps?  You can't seriously complain about challenging enemies when talking about how OP weapons are with forma, can you?

 

AI is always exploitable.  In this game, they move and shoot.  If they can't move, they still shoot.  They're standard meat shields with no apparent idea they ARE going to die.  They have stated the design is for fast action.  Enemies getting crazy tactical will slow the action as you would have to go from each cover to cover and flush them out.  I haven't really witnessed anything terrible with the AI.  I get shot at a lot.

Suggesting things vs expected to get your way are very different.

Losing motivation happens when you play the same thing so long, but they keep adding new content which you complained about.  Ironic.

This isn't a PVP game.  They've discussed this multiple times.  Play another game if you want PVP.  There are plenty of people who will stay for the high quality TEAM based gameplay.  Not everyone likes competition.  I personally HATE PVP even in games I love.  Wasted resources, especially adding generic cookie cutter PVP.  It's just not "Warframe"ish.  Rather have everyone on the same page polishing and growing the same big project.

 

I hope you calm down and find some good people in the community to play with.  With almost 400 hours in according to Steam, I'm still having a blast and loving every minute (except when I get a laggy host of course, but that's rare and not developer's fault that the host has the settings too high when stuff hits the fan).

Edited August 13, 2013 by Cyrosage

[CrazyCanadian24]

-snip-

 

You people still don't get it, do you? PvP can be segregated from PvE - you wouldn't have to play it, you wouldn't get anything unique from playing it, balance would be handled separately and more importantly, advocates of PvP would shut up. It's a win-win for all parties involved.

[R3leaZ]

-snip-

 

Before I used the reset. I was 100% F2P and reached MR 7. I even played before they fixed the credit amount where every mission had the same payout making progress horrible.

 

About obsolete weapons. Currently armor piercing or armor ignoring weapons are the only really useful equipment against high level enemies at defense. The reason is because of a broken mechanic that has been here for a very long time. Armor scaling. It made a lot of weapons obsolete making only AP/AI weapons effective at high levels even at mid levels. They didn't even want to take a look at this if you check recent Hot Topics section. Until a massive amount of players started complaining about this decision.

 

You're right on weapons still being viable in battle. But don't forget. People have the mentality of focusing on the best thing available in the game and try working towards it and ignoring any other item. Sure tiering of weapons could have been good if they actually made them tier in requirements too. There are weapons that are insanely effective requiring mastery rank... 0.

 

You've seen change but you can't assert the company is making mistakes based off your own opinion on what they should do unless you run your own MMO F2P while making a profit and growing your player base.

 

I can still compare to other succesful F2P games and I do that. I take both pros and both cons and compare them.

 

Power creeps?  You can't seriously complain about challenging enemies when talking about how OP weapons are with forma, can you?

 

Prime weapons.

 

This isn't a PVP game.  They've discussed this multiple times.  Play another game if you want PVP.  There are plenty of people who will stay for the high quality TEAM based gameplay.  Not everyone likes competition.  I personally HATE PVP even in games I love.  Wasted resources, especially adding generic cookie cutter PVP.  It's just not "Warframe"ish.  Rather have everyone on the same page polishing and growing the same big project.

 

That is an opinion. Lots of people who played PvE for a long time get tired of predictable AI and actually want some challenge. Taking away that feature that is most important to keep the game alive for a long time is certainly not a good decision. I play BF3 and those kind of games competitively. In a clan. Doing clan wars that at times involve a price (money). These things can make the game a hell of a lot more fun. Having a lot more possibility with the game. Not liking PvP is an opinion.

 

Play another game if you want PVP.

 

you really want that? You really want people who helped a lot with the growth of the game to leave this game due to lacking of a simple feature and move on to other games? Why not add PvP to Warframe so people get more choice? That way we can still invest into this game instead of the game losing players. Better for the growth also.

 

EDIT: Yes I'm still awake. It's nearly 6AM here for me...

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[Cyrosage]

You people still don't get it, do you? PvP can be segregated from PvE - you wouldn't have to play it, you wouldn't get anything unique from playing it, balance would be handled separately and more importantly, advocates of PvP would shut up. It's a win-win for all parties involved.

Win-Win if you have plenty of money and resources.  There was a video posted of DE-Steve still working on an update hours before it's release.  Why?  Because they don't have Blizzard's money and people to throw at it.  The game isn't even released and needs to be as good as possible at what it was designed for to get a large player base and keep them.  Mostly complete main game and generic PVP to shut up whiners doesn't make win-win.  Handling balance separately doesn't change the fact you need PEOPLE who get PAID to crunch those numbers, take care of the NERFS (aka riot starters) and buffs (aka omg OP!).  If the games wasn't a crowd-funded F2P PVE game, sure.  But it doesn't seem realistic.

[R3leaZ]

Win-Win if you have plenty of money and resources.  There was a video posted of DE-Steve still working on an update hours before it's release.  Why?  Because they don't have Blizzard's money and people to throw at it.  The game isn't even released and needs to be as good as possible at what it was designed for to get a large player base and keep them.  Mostly complete main game and generic PVP to shut up whiners doesn't make win-win.  Handling balance separately doesn't change the fact you need PEOPLE who get PAID to crunch those numbers, take care of the NERFS (aka riot starters) and buffs (aka omg OP!).  If the games wasn't a crowd-funded F2P PVE game, sure.  But it doesn't seem realistic.

 

This is why developers focus on certain things. They invest in certain stuff to make the most of it. But currently they are investing only on more content that only give a short term boost instead of fixing terribly annoying bugs that have existed for a very long time, UI issues or maybe even PvP that would give this game a bigger player base thus more income thus more space to invest in additional features. These kind of investments are long term based and will help the game a lot more than short term features like a new weapon or a new Warframe.

 

EDIT: I NEED SLEEP KBYE It's 5:55AM freaking.... go to sleep R3leaZ.

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[Cyrosage]

Before I used the reset. I was 100% F2P and reached MR 7. I even played before they fixed the credit amount where every mission had the same payout making progress horrible.

 

About obsolete weapons. Currently armor piercing or armor ignoring weapons are the only really useful equipment against high level enemies at defense. The reason is because of a broken mechanic that has been here for a very long time. Armor scaling. It made a lot of weapons obsolete making only AP/AI weapons effective at high levels even at mid levels. They didn't even want to take a look at this if you check recent Hot Topics section. Until a massive amount of players started complaining about this decision.

 

You're right on weapons still being viable in battle. But don't forget. People have the mentality of focusing on the best thing available in the game and try working towards it and ignoring any other item. Sure tiering of weapons could have been good if they actually made them tier in requirements too. There are weapons that are insanely effective requiring mastery rank... 0.

 

 

I can still compare to other succesful F2P games and I do that. I take both pros and both cons and compare them.

 

 

Prime weapons.

 

 

That is an opinion. Lots of people who played PvE for a long time get tired of predictable AI and actually want some challenge. Taking away that feature that is most important to keep the game alive for a long time is certainly not a good decision. I play BF3 and those kind of games competitively. In a clan. Doing clan wars that at times involve a price (money). These things can make the game a hell of a lot more fun. Having a lot more possibility with the game. Not liking PvP is an opinion.

 

"Play another game if you want PvP" you really want that? You really want people to leave this game due to lacking of a simple feature and move on to other games? Why not add PvP to Warframe so people get more choice? That way we can still invest into this game instead of the game losing players. Better for the growth also.

Goodness again.

 

So I'm mastery 11, and I understand there was some grindy grindy.  Part of all MMO.  Credit payout sucked, but it changed.  Not sure where this is going.

 

Obsolete is NOT equal to not as effective in certain scenarios.  That scenario being really high level defense.  Got it, but for MOST of the game, everything is rather fair overall.

 

Mechanic isn't BROKEN just because you don't like it.  Some weapons have advantages and some have disadvantages.  Pretty normal to have trade offs.

 

You reference min/maxers.  There are some of those.  If you read a lot of the forums you'll find MANY people play with what's fun.  How many people use Paris when there are other weapons like Ogris for Flux that can kill more faster?  Plenty.

 

Prime weapons are rewards from an often more difficult set of missions and not as easy to farm as boss runs.  Isn't it fair they have their own advantages?  It doesn't make anything obsolete unless you are in fact a min/maxer.

 

You retort my opinion with an opinion??  "most important to keep the game alive for a long time" is clearly an opinion.  Battlefield is a war game.  Single player and multiplayer killing.  It wasn't designed to be a team-oriented goal based game.  Warframe combines multiplayer with the "single player" experience of goal based missions that end when the goal is achieved.  You could argue blah blah blah, but the games are very different in nature.

 

Making things a "hell of a lot more fun" is definitely an opinion of someone who enjoys PVP.  This isn't a PVP game though.  Liking PVP is an opinion.

 

You can't seriously expect Warframe players to ONLY play Warframe.  if you feel like sports, pop in some Madden.  If you want PVP, play WoW or Battlefield.  If you want to play a 4 player coop space ninja game, play Warframe.

 

Asserting investing in PVP is better for growth is an unfounded statement.  PVP could flop if the balance isn't fixed quickly.  Buff/nerfs &!$$ people off even if it's for the best.  Taking resources from making the main game better and putting them on PVP isn't necessarily the best business decision just because PVP supporters think it is.  You have expressed discontent with the content ALREADY present and want them to work on a WHOLE NEW game basically.

 

"Lacking something simple" is such ridiculous understatement.  You want PVP, but not with the current frames.  New frames, check.  You want balanced weapons.  You say current weapons are OP.  New weapons, check.  You want arenas, check.  You want balanced powers.  New power system, check. You asked for a whole lot there friend.  

 

The FACT is that it will cost money and resources.  Do you want the stuff you don't like changed and fixed, or do want them to be like "F that, lets make some PVP!"?  They obviously aren't doing enough according to your first post, so let's add a whole new project and just claim it's simple!

Edited August 13, 2013 by Cyrosage

[Cyrosage]

This is why developers focus on certain things. They invest in certain stuff to make the most of it. But currently they are investing only on more content that only give a short term boost instead of fixing terribly annoying bugs that have existed for a very long time, UI issues or maybe even PvP that would give this game a bigger player base thus more income thus more space to invest in additional features. These kind of investments are long term based and will help the game a lot more than short term features like a new weapon or a new Warframe.

 

EDIT: I NEED SLEEP KBYE It's 5:55AM freaking.... go to sleep R3leaZ.

You assert they are ONLY focused on adding content but apparently haven't seen how several hotfixes come with each update to things OTHER than what they added in the update.  Fixing bugs takes time.  Knowing the bug doesn't mean you know WHY it happens or it likely wouldn't have happened in the first place.  Some bugs are likely typos or oversight, but many are just unplanned side effects.

 

I'm not saying PVP is bad, just that PVP may not be a good business decision yet.  They game SURELY doesn't need half-&#! PVP at the time of PS4 release or the PVP crowd will scoff and leave.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Armor scaling was an issue that was largely limited to ED until the recent buff to enemy levels.  That's what made it apparent for the game at large.

 

Regarding your PVP suggestion, that's a ton of work, but I think that if they ever do pvp, that might be the way to do it.  Best suggestion I've seen so far for it.

 

Balance and power creep are things they are concerned about.  Personally, I think they aren't concerned about armor scaling because they plan to topple defense from its throne, though I don't know how.  In my "Three Simple Questions" thread, one of the questions related to that and it sounds like Rebecca plans to ask them about it when they do the livestream tomorrow, so perhaps their response to that will ease your mind.

[Cyrosage]

I understand OP is sleep, and its midnight here.  I miiight be a bit grumpy haha, but I just strongly feel the game is absolutely great for what it is, but it's just not quite where it needs to be.  I expect them to keep working and "polishing the turd" as they say in the Army.  Hopefully they can play the WoW card and become huge and then add PVP when they have the stable player base and figure out how to monetize it properly without being pay to win but continuing their income.  I do not mean to attack anyone or their right to opinions, I tend to present the other side when I feel someone is too strongly implying opinion=fact.

[CrazyCanadian24]

Win-Win if you have plenty of money and resources.  There was a video posted of DE-Steve still working on an update hours before it's release.  Why?  Because they don't have Blizzard's money and people to throw at it.  The game isn't even released and needs to be as good as possible at what it was designed for to get a large player base and keep them.  Mostly complete main game and generic PVP to shut up whiners doesn't make win-win.  Handling balance separately doesn't change the fact you need PEOPLE who get PAID to crunch those numbers, take care of the NERFS (aka riot starters) and buffs (aka omg OP!).  If the games wasn't a crowd-funded F2P PVE game, sure.  But it doesn't seem realistic.

 

Just as I suspected, you assumed I want it now. I don't. The last thing this game needs is an unpolished PvP when the core game isn't even finished yet. The point I was trying to make with my comment is that continuing to believe that this game should never have PvP is a backwards and outdated line of thought. That's it.

[Cyrosage]

Just as I suspected, you assumed I want it now. I don't. The last thing this game needs is an unpolished PvP when the core game isn't even finished yet. The point I was trying to make with my comment is that continuing to believe that this game should never have PvP is a backwards and outdated line of thought. That's it.

Cool beans.  But as you didn't imply when, and neither did I, umm..  My point was that insisting it is definitely a good idea does not mean that DE will make more money because of a PVP enjoying player base vs focusing on the actual game.  Frankly, I don't care when you want it.  PVP could be great, might suck, will definitely initially make many people happy but you can't assume it's going to be good (in this post anyway) when the request was to make new frames and rebalance literally everything.  I'm struggling to find a polite way to say this, but basically PVP without original warframes is not warframe?  New stuff sounds interesting, but if you level the new stuff, you are playing on an uneven battlefield until everyone is max level.  Then how does DE make money?  How do they keep people around.  If the coop has bugs, PVP will have bugs.  Which get priority?  PVP players will leave first as they have the largest impact.  One OP glitch is all it would take to break leaderboards or ruin the system.  The whole idea of warframe just doesn't support a PVP type environment.

 

I'll just take the backwards and outdated thing.  I personally just don't enjoy PVP in general.  I am not implying the game should never have PVP.  I was asserting that you can't just assume it will make the game better.  How many F2P games have PVP?  There are many but I can't think of the name of a single one.  That should tell you something (ok ok, I could have a bad memory).  The PVP could suck, it might not ever find a way to get balanced right in the Warframe world.  It might just not seem like Warframe.  Even with the money to fund that, Blizzard wouldn't release it if it sucked.  DE doesn't yet have the freedom to experiment with that.  If it gets implemented, and sucks, do they just remove it or leave it?  Either way, it will have a negative impact.  If it sucks.  It might.  You can't prove it won't.  I can't prove it will.

 

I'd rather the fate of the game not be at stake.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Cyrosage

[Cyrosage]

TL;DR  Some want PVP.  Some don't.  Some don't care.  PVP might suck and ruin game.  PVP might rock but will take resources from main game and people already complain constantly about the main game.  Stakes are too high for PVE F2P game.

[Torguish]

Right now i think the reason why there is no PvP is pure and simple:

The game would go from ''patience to play 4 free'' to ''pay to win'' simply because spending money would get you a rather hefty advantage. People would be more easily angry at the store as it is right now.

At least that's how i see it...

[R3leaZ]

Right now i think the reason why there is no PvP is pure and simple:

The game would go from ''patience to play 4 free'' to ''pay to win'' simply because spending money would get you a rather hefty advantage. People would be more easily angry at the store as it is right now.

At least that's how i see it...

 

That's not how it needs to be though. Like my suggestion. PvP exclusive Warframes with pre-mods integrated that you cannot change. Classes ranging from light, medium, heavy. Each class would have their own traits: Scout/Sniper/Recon, Assault/Engineer, Tank/Heavy Trooper. Maybe even weapon classes with pre-mods ranging from SMG, AR, LMG, Rocket Launcher, Pistol. Sure it might not have much variety at first but it's still PvP. PvP is fun because of the challenge and the difference in skill.

 

Pay system stays restricted to PvE for the time being or it should only involve accessories that give no stats changes (just for looks) but make you look a hell of a lot nicer.

Edited August 13, 2013 by R3leaZ

[Bakercompany86]

OP makes some extremely valid points.

 

 

His implementation of PvP would actually work, and serious help balance the weapons in this game.

 

However, as he mentioned, you would need to seriously tone down the power creep in this game.

 

 

This hyper-vertical progression that Warframe is currently afflicted with will be the death of this game.

 

 

Strictly vertical progression has no place in first or third person shooters.  Yes I'm speaking of Borderlands also.

 

What is Borderlands without all the humor, bells and whistles, and uniqueness that makes it Borderlands?

 

It's an FPS where that awesome weapon you've become attached to WILL become useless and must be discarded for something else whether you like it or not.

 

 

Please.....tone down power creep in Warframe.  I really like this game, and I don't want to see it die because good players like the OP are frustrated and leaving.

 

 

EDIT:  dadgoat....gtfo.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Bakercompany86

[direcyphre]

Dadgoat is best post.

 

Anyway, on PvP, the Dojo is a clear indication of why it would be a separate game entirely. We already know PvP wouldn't work in this game as it stands, and DE is not interested in dedicating resources to adding it. Steve has already clearly outlined why in the livestreams, probably more than once. Lots of people probably think it's possible, but a separate game entirely is a separate game, not this one. I for one would not look forward to the massive influx of 'balance' threads that would follow, even as a separate game.

 

With regards to the rest of the feedback, this is entirely why they wanted to steer clear of the "MMO" label. This game isn't intended to be played in the same fashion as an MMORPG because it's not some open-world RPG where you play for hours and hours at a time to continue progress. Everyone is welcome to play a game as much as they like, but this game isn't built to be played the same number of hours as WoW. Some people do grind, and have not even been on this game very long before they get burnt out on it. I've got nearly 300 hours in-game, but I take breaks and come back when new content comes around. There are other games to be played in the meanwhile!

 

Not that I'm saying "Don't play Warframe!" or anything ridiculous like that, but don't think you can just grind everything in a short period and expect to have some other end-game to worry about after. This has also lead to the armor scaling complaints, which are only applicable to Endless Defense as far as I can tell. Everyone wants armor scaling to change because all they play are high level defense, but we don't even have a planet with level 100 enemies yet.

[Tangerine]

Rather than PvP, longevity comes from dynamic content. That is, experience that constantly fills new or changes. PvP is dynamic because of your interaction with other players, having human people behind the actions and movements leads to a new experience every time you play. Other aspects of dynamic content are player created content for example.

 

You don't need PvP for such dynamic items, though it does help. It takes alot of creativity to make a PvE online game have such however.