Hayden11121 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I just want to get this across. Every time I get into a "Nova isn't OP" argument it turns into "WAH STFU SCRUB WHO CARES IF IT STEALS KILLS" That is not what people dislike nova for. People dislike nova for the ability to nuke every and anything with no problem. The massive debuff, the massive explosions, the bloom from the explosions. This is not fun, I mean yes, when I got nova I had fun until she was rank 10. Then playing god got boring, as it should. And, to top it all off, this is the new "Standard" which is what a lot of people also dislike. Some people are fine with their classes, like I rarely see someone complain about Saryn, Loki, or Rhino. What are you going to do to them? Buff them to Nova standards? Venom now contains Radiation, meaning after 10 seconds everything dies? Is Invisibility going to affect all Teammates like Volt's Speed? I realize there are good things about playing with a Nova. Sure, you can leech, which is great. But I don't play this game to spam mastery rank. I play to enjoy myself, which might be hard to believe. I like taking my time, incorporating backflips, dragon kicks, wallrunning headshots, and other goodies into my combat. I haven't had the time to since Nova was around, everything dies too quick. Every other ult has something to CC enemies, or it's range is too limited to really affect anything. Like Rhino's Stomp or Saryn's Miasma. This is why I dislike Nova. She instagibs everything, forces the bloom to go haywire, is forcing your other frames to be affected when they are perfectly balanced, and removes any and all effort for 95% of the game. So next time we have a Nova is OP or not argument (It will happen) on the forums. Remember they don't really care about killstealing. It may be a factor when wanting to level a certain weapon, but it's not the main point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAWGUNITALPHA Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 "I play in a highly specific way in an online game and cry everytime someone doesn't play the same way" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayden11121 Posted August 21, 2013 Author Share Posted August 21, 2013 "I play in a highly specific way in an online game and cry everytime someone doesn't play the same way" "I enjoy a challenge and pressing 4 was fun the first time, but every time after then and so forth just gets god awful boring" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Althix Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) yeah yeah i like this "new standart" trend as well. Edited August 21, 2013 by Althix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAWGUNITALPHA Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 "I enjoy a challenge and pressing 4 was fun the first time, but every time after then and so forth just gets god awful boring" If you're looking for a challenge you are playing the wrong game, and the wrong genre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Althix Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 now that's just too blatant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabadath5 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 If you're looking for a challenge you are playing the wrong game, and the wrong genre. OH TEH NOES someone is looking for a challenge in a video game!How could that happen! If this game is not about challenge and overcoming it, then lets just have some AI control our warframes and all we have to do as players is watch the screen as our characters kill everything automatically. Not that its much of a difference since Nova, the queen of press 4 to win, was launched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annnoth Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) "I enjoy a challenge and pressing 4 was fun the first time, but every time after then and so forth just gets god awful boring"Some people actually find that fun... I used to play maplestory when O was younger and after a massive update it became the easiest game ever, every skill was a massive AoE an pretty much 1shot everything. I guess after playing so many years of that I was trained to enjoy seeing lots of numbers when I kill things. I'm sure others are the same way.Though I do understand what you mean, people like challenge and they won't find that with a nova. Edited August 21, 2013 by theharddrinkingapplejack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayden11121 Posted August 21, 2013 Author Share Posted August 21, 2013 Some people actually find that fun... I used to play maplestory when O was younger and after a massive update it became the easiest game ever, every skill was a massive AoE an pretty much 1shot everything. I guess after playing so many years of that I was trained to enjoy seeing lots of numbers when I kill things. I'm sure others are the same way. Nova is my favorite frame and is the most fun to me. Go play an indie fighting game on easy mode. God mode shouldn't be forced onto every frame, reguardless of whether or not you want it on one frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neKroMancer Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 To be frank, Nova is a big mistake from the council and a failure in term of design. Caster frame is fine until it can kill everything before anyone else has a chance to do anything. It's outright impossible to buff other frames to Nova's level since the game will be laughably easy at that point. Warframe won't be coop shooter at that point, it will be space murder simulator. Nova also make another problem clearer. Ultimate spamming and energy system. Releasing a new shiny content that able to outshine everything exists in the game is never a good thing. BW did the same mistake with Krysae sniper rifle in ME3MP. The gun managed to make entire arsenal irrelevant until BW dicided to go berserk and nerfed it to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Althix Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 ^ i like you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAWGUNITALPHA Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 OH TEH NOES someone is looking for a challenge in a video game!How could that happen! If this game is not about challenge and overcoming it, then lets just have some AI control our warframes and all we have to do as players is watch the screen as our characters kill everything automatically. Not that its much of a difference since Nova, the queen of press 4 to win, was launched. Hyperbole gets you nowhere. Free to play online games are rarely about hardcore challenge, that's generally left up to niche single player-focused titles (your bayonettas, dark souls and etrian odysseys for example) If this game were to focus on challenge, difficulty and skill it's almost a guarantee that it wouldn't survive. Go play an indie fighting game on easy mode. God mode shouldn't be forced onto every frame, reguardless of whether or not you want it on one frame. Alternatively you could play something else to get your fill of challenge. Your desire to be challenged does not override his delight of ease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annnoth Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Go play an indie fighting game on easy mode. God mode shouldn't be forced onto every frame, reguardless of whether or not you want it on one frame. I never said I wanted it. I was simply saying some people find it fun, should they keep it? No. It's just plain boring for other people whether or not a select few enjoy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabadath5 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) Hyperbole gets you nowhere. Free to play online games are rarely about hardcore challenge, that's generally left up to niche single player-focused titles (your bayonettas, dark souls and etrian odysseys for example) If this game were to focus on challenge, difficulty and skill it's almost a guarantee that it wouldn't survive. Alternatively you could play something else to get your fill of challenge. Your desire to be challenged does not override his delight of ease. I'm not asking for dark souls kind of difficulty....even tho I wouldn't mind. All I want is a game where you can actually lose instead of being capable of spraying with your eyes closed or pressing 4 to instantly kill everything in a room.And no, turning enemies into bullet sponges doesn't count... Edited August 21, 2013 by Cabadath5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamte Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 OH TEH NOES someone is looking for a challenge in a video game!How could that happen! If this game is not about challenge and overcoming it, then lets just have some AI control our warframes and all we have to do as players is watch the screen as our characters kill everything automatically. Not that its much of a difference since Nova, the queen of press 4 to win, was launched. There's a difference between not challenging and not playing. Chess is more challenging than checkers because it involves more complicated maneuvers, more tactical and strategic elements, and therefore must be superior to checkers, right? Not everything is meant to be a challenge. Not every game can scale infinitely from "so simple a four year old can do it" to the point that you're still getting better at it after playing for twenty years. That said, I do dislike Nova's 4. I'm not against powers, or even strong powers, but it doubles the damage taken by everything it hits, explodes them when they die for extra damage, and seems to hit half the damn map. I enjoy my little volt and loki frames. They're fun in their own ways, but yes, you do have to start to wonder how much more you could accomplish if your skills were on the same scale as the newer frames. Nova hits 4 and all of the things die, and anything that didn't is a walking timebomb waiting to make more things die. My volt hits 4 and some enemies in the immediate vicinity lose shields, and it might steal a kill from a team mate who already had that enemy 90% dead. I don't care what scale we stick to, so long as we stick to one. Make really strong powers, but give them drawbacks. Super explosive damage, really small range. Huge range, limited damage. Things like damage taken debuffs or chain reactions should factor into "cost" too. Nova's 4 though, with it's damage, debuff, chain reaction, and insane range is "equal" in our current system to other frame abilities that only do damage (and less of it than her), or only debuff (and not as significantly), with smaller ranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neKroMancer Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Hyperbole gets you nowhere. Free to play online games are rarely about hardcore challenge, that's generally left up to niche single player-focused titles (your bayonettas, dark souls and etrian odysseys for example) If this game were to focus on challenge, difficulty and skill it's almost a guarantee that it wouldn't survive. Alternatively you could play something else to get your fill of challenge. Your desire to be challenged does not override his delight of ease. To be honest, I don't think Warframe could live long without difficulty and challenge. It depends on DE's target audience. If DE want to target player with age no more than 15 then they did the right thing. However, if they are aiming for older audience then they will fail, spectacularly. Based from the price tag of Founder's package, I think it aims at older target more than younger ones. Playing the game is about challenge as much as it's about fun. There is no fun without challenge. Imagine playing Tetris without any chance of failure, without the block dropping faster, without certain strategy to get higher score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayden11121 Posted August 21, 2013 Author Share Posted August 21, 2013 To be honest, I don't think Warframe could live long without difficulty and challenge. It depends on DE's target audience. If DE want to target player with age no more than 15 then they did the right thing. However, if they are aiming for older audience then they will fail, spectacularly. Based from the price tag of Founder's package, I think it aims at older target more than younger ones. Playing the game is about challenge as much as it's about fun. There is no fun without challenge. Imagine playing Tetris without any chance of failure, without the block dropping faster, without certain strategy to get higher score. I think the hardest challenge currently in Warframe is at the beginning with your unranked Loki, or getting the courage to kill Hyena 30x times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crow-k Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 The only thing I could see changing for nova is lowering the total range on her ult. Otherwise it offers great CC. It may seem overpowered in Xini level 5 but at higher levels you bless every piece of ammo you have. You have that ammo because of using less to kill your target. It clears out the crap lower mods and leaves the team to kill all the higher level mobs, the bullet sponges. it has its place. It wasn't so long ago that Banshee was considered OP. what really changed? The new frame came out. Then Vaub was OP. Then the new frame came out. Could nova get a few small adjustments sure. So could Rhino. Or Volt.If anything were to change I would vote for mods not making the radius larger. Or you could try increasing the level YOU play at. I assure you, at lvl 150 mobs, you no longer rage at the nova. And for Lotus sake, any player that is only hitting one skill is a skilless player. I do not care which frame you are on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oranjeboom Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) Frost, saryn, vauban are way WAY stronger people only see an offensive frame as op but not a defensive Really you cant do any kind of high lvl defence without a frost or vauban... Nova is fine for what she does... Edited August 21, 2013 by Oranjeboom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaasjeweetzelluf Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) I like Nova the way she is, but I agree her ult ruins the fun for the rest of the team If she decides to spam it.. I'd say leave the skill as it is, cut the range by roughly 30% and give it a 30 second cooldown. Edited August 21, 2013 by Negerjeweetzelluf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waftycrank Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Problem isn’t Nova’s kill count. Problem is Nova making other team mates feel redundant. For a co-op game that alone should sound warning alarms in DE offices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oranjeboom Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 The only reasonable change (not nerf, change) to Novas ult i can see is if they make it do HP percentange dmg on the explosion 1,2,3,% or more of the targets max HP as explosion dmg She prolly wont be able to kill everything at wave 5 defence, but she ll also scale better at higher lvls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crow-k Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 To be honest, I don't think Warframe could live long without difficulty and challenge. It depends on DE's target audience. If DE want to target player with age no more than 15 then they did the right thing. However, if they are aiming for older audience then they will fail, spectacularly. Based from the price tag of Founder's package, I think it aims at older target more than younger ones. Playing the game is about challenge as much as it's about fun. There is no fun without challenge. Imagine playing Tetris without any chance of failure, without the block dropping faster, without certain strategy to get higher score. How does age factor into it. Do you need to be 15 to enjoy a random fun title? Is 30 a good median to aim for? Theres no potty humor here. They aren't aimed at 5 and above. There are no legos here. At 15 I could play this game. At ten too. Lets go forward and say 25 I could still play this game. I am currently 30 and guess what. Game is still enjoyable. I could play diablo 2. Games like this are open enough to be enjoyed by a large range of ages. Age does not infer a desire for "challenge". I do not need everything to be a cake walk or everything to make me want to punch a small kitten everytime I lose. Or a big cat. Or take a sabertooth tiger to the cinema and eat popcorn while watching frank sinatra sing story weather the flies and spider get along together. Or something like that. I am not telling you the rest of your argument has no value. it does. Just don't assume age forces any kind of perspective as a collection . Not all of anyone wants anything the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordAsmolicious Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 ALOT of Frames can Nuke rooms man! Dont be delusional. you just want your fav frame to be superior. Ember can nuke while moving. she can burn trough hordes of enemies. Rhino can put an entire room into stasis leaving only the heavy units alive. Volt can kill all corpus in a room. Saryn can nuke All enemies in a room. So WHAT is your problem? You are just hating on Nova cause you dont have her? If her Nuke should be nerfed then NERF all other nukes aswell. otherwise youll complain again. cause blabla this frame nukes whole rooms just like nova used to do nerf iiit! i dont like it killing everythiiiing Just stop the whining. More frames than Nova can nuke. and some do it even better. Just dont use her if you dont like her bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archiadus Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I dislike Nova with the only reason for that being that she takes all my kills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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