Malaheart
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Posts posted by Malaheart
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They are not thinking it out lol, thank you!
The game is designed to try a weapon, enjoy...and move on to try a new weapon. That is why long term progression is tied to mods and not Weapons. Sure, you will have your picks of your favorite loadout, but the game was not designed to use a Braton for 200 hours. There are literally 4 different types of Bratons lol.
You missed the point of the post where I suggested pumping fusion cores in to weapons. It's a reddiculous idea. How I want the system to work is still the same as the op and I suggest you read it again. It would make trying new builds and weapons easier because you would not have to worry about how you are going to fit that 14 point serration and 15 point split chamber. Because if my math is right that leaves you with one point on an unpotatoed weapon.
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"Weapon Damage should be part of the weapon!"
Genius! :D
wait...
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So what would you suggest?
Ohhhhh, I know.
Forma'ing a weapon increases it's base damage by one rank of Serration. Has as many ranks as Serration currently has.
Imagine all the Forma DE would sell, imagine all the frustration from people because leveling guns TAKES AGES.
I can see it COULD work, but only if guns could rank up waaaay faster.
So for the time being...
NO. :/ too much hassle, the mod can be moved around into any primary/secondary weapon easily. Per-weapon stats wouldn't. And make ranking them up even more of a hassle and frustration.
No, once a weapon hits rank 30 it's base damage is as high as it will ever get. Once you do forma the damage will be reduced back to baseline. The only thing you would gain from forma would be an extra polarity slot. Personally I think forma was a horrible idea in the first place. I honestly have clue where you got that impression from.
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in all my posts i was explaining things straight to point as short as possible. on other forums usual suggestions consist of 500+ words and nobody have a problem with it.
if 100 words considered to be a text, i don't even know what to say. 150 words per minute is average reading speed of children in elementary school. i don't find it excuseable that person is unable to focus for atleast one minute. if he have ADHD, thats one thing, but i don't think that majority of people who bothered to post here have such disorder, therefor you can safely make a conclusion that their responses are ignorant and were made without even bothering to read the very short OP.
if person don't bother to read, but yet bother to post garbage, i feel like he deserve the apropriate response on pair to his behaviour. i will try to continue to avoid breaking forum rules, but if person behave ignorant, thats plain disrespect, i would not change the tone or ways i interact with them, since thats probably the only way to cut the crap.
best regards
~snk
So anyone you believe is not as intelligent as you are is treated like dirt. That is not a great way to breed the type of conversation you are after. Try and guide the community through your own posts not calling them idiots for not completely understanding. That just derails the conversation even more.
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What? Warframe has a high learning curve??
Your a funny one :)
I you are not being sarchastic, yeah. Nothing is intuitive.
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Ok let me fix it then.
Damage mods affecting DoT is good, Armor scaling nerfing other weapons into the ground is bad.
The DESPAIR does the same damage front loaded and the result is the same, enemies die fast. And the Despair has 2 V attack slots, which better supports your case against Base damage mods. The issue isnt the Acrid and not Hornet Strike... its the Armor scaling.
Armor scaleing is a differant problem. Even if it was to be fixed in U10 Many weapons would still not be as good as others. And melee and warframe powers would pale in comparison to guns.
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Good thoughts gell, what I'm arguing for is indeed a dramatic change. Your idea would be a nice middle ground. Although I do still argue that aquireing something that is mandetory through rng is a bad idea. If you are on the forum chances are you are around the 300 hour mark. When warframe is released for the ps4 we will have a large influx of new players. Part of my idea was to reduce some of the substantial learning curve that warframe has.
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Yes I get it. But that is still a flawed Idea of progression. DE has yet to introduce an endgame to Warframe. So what are we progressing towards? Are we trying to get enough gear so we can kill the boss to explore the rest of the dungeon or are we trying to just get more loot. The current way the system works it is all about the loot. It should be about playing the game. seeing all of the interesting things the game has to offer. Right now, without an endgame, we are stuck in perpetual Diablo territory. We play for loot and that so that we can find more loot. So what happens when you have every gun in the game, Every warframe, every mod every skin? You no longer have ANY reason to play and all the time you spent getting all those items is wasted. Because you truly have nothing to use them for. Eventually that should be fixed. DE will find a solution, create an endgame, making playing the game more interesting than JUST finding loot.
Also if a game is all about the loot you are going to have perpetual power creep. Fine I accept a small amount of power creep in games. But we are still in beta. Look just how far the damage in the game has crept in this short time.
Edit: Also to my knowledge and there admittance, DE have never made an MMO. This is new territory for them, so in many areas they may not know what they are doing.
So if we are both in agreement that Warframe lacks any real progression. Why not remove false progression. Doing so would make the game much more sound mechanically wise for when we actually do get an endgame. That way we are not hammpered by legacy ideas.
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Fair enough mogamu, It's been a good discussion with you on this and I can see where you are coming from with that explanation, even if I sit on the other side of the fence.
Then perhaps the issue is that they need to make it really clear in game that mods are THE progression THE ALMIGHTY LEVEL UP SYSTEM and not a customization system. They could do this by giving one time guaranteed rewards (like how the cronus drop works on Vor) for the core mods for levelling your warframe from bosses or as specific level/planet completion awards. Because as it stands right now the system doesn't scream LEVEL UP it screams CUSTOMIZATION to me, but that could be a personal problem.
So if you are going to give it away why make it a mod? Why not just let you apply fusion cores to your weapon to increase its damage? Clearly it is not a choice to equip it if it is the endgame. so why make it a choice? why make it a mod?
The argument maybe "Think about progression!" but I'll say it again, playing a game just to making your gun more powerful is a false sense of progression.
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I keep telling you, the key word is PROGRESSION. You have YET to address that word...PROGRESSION
Warframe is a game about PROGRESSION, IMPROVEMENT, REWARD, INCREASE...PROGRESSION
Do you understand?
It takes me 20 seconds to fuse a 5 level mod to max with a few fusion cores. There is no PROGRESSION in this.
it takes me less than a day to fully level ANY weapon in the game. There is no PROGRESSION in this.
However, I have been here since closed beta, and i have not fully maxed ever base stat mod. ie Ser, Honstrike, redirection, Vitality, Armor.
So, therefore...this is a discernabile difference between where i was as a new player and where I am now.
As it stands, BASE STAT MODS are the ONLY long term progression in Warframe..a game...based on...PROGRESSION.
I understand your argument about base stats, im not stupid. I have SUPPORTED your argument about base stats better than you ever could with my case against Point Blank and Pressure Point. Did you not read it? Surely you diddnt.
But yet, the idea of base stats adding PROGRESSION to a game built on PROGRESSION getting players to play and come back to the game for its PROGRESSION seems to totally escape you. Let me break it down into a single sentence because i clearly have not typed the word PROGRESSION in large caps enough.
BASE STAT MODS ARE THE ONLY FORM OF LONG TERM PROGRESSION IN A GAME BUILT ON THE IDEA OF PROGRESSION.
Did you catch it that time?
Yes I get it. But that is still a flawed Idea of progression. DE has yet to introduce an endgame to Warframe. So what are we progressing towards? Are we trying to get enough gear so we can kill the boss to explore the rest of the dungeon or are we trying to just get more loot. The current way the system works it is all about the loot. It should be about playing the game. seeing all of the interesting things the game has to offer. Right now, without an endgame, we are stuck in perpetual Diablo territory. We play for loot and that so that we can find more loot. So what happens when you have every gun in the game, Every warframe, every mod every skin? You no longer have ANY reason to play and all the time you spent getting all those items is wasted. Because you truly have nothing to use them for. Eventually that should be fixed. DE will find a solution, create an endgame, making playing the game more interesting than JUST finding loot.
Also if a game is all about the loot you are going to have perpetual power creep. Fine I accept a small amount of power creep in games. But we are still in beta. Look just how far the damage in the game has crept in this short time.
Edit: Also to my knowledge and there admittance, DE have never made an MMO. This is new territory for them, so in many areas they may not know what they are doing.
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I'm not trying to be a jerk or elitist, Im trying to point you towards the fallacy of removing base stat mods.
You say numbers dont matter, yet you think Serration is somehow different from Element damage or crit damage. That is where your argument fails. Calling 5 damage "fire" and calling 4 damage "ice" is a mental dissonance. The only real relevance is the downtime between games making the number bigger or smaller depending on what you are shooting. You have trouble discerning this, it makes your argument invalid.
You dont realize, but you are making the point for and against progression and customization simultaneously. A number is a number, this is the argument, no?
Let me help you improve your argument because you are faling at it. Shotguns should not have a base damage mod, ie Point Blank because it levels SO FAST with only 5 additional levels that it doesnt support customization nor progression. This should have been your case that either Point Blank and Pressure point should be more progressive like Serration or Hornetstrike, or Serration and Hornetstrike should be made less progressive which further supports your argument that the base stat mods would NOT be progressive at all in that instance and would make more sense tied to the weapon level. But as it stands, I and the larger majority of players tend to think that long term progression in mods is better over the longterm of the game.
True a number is a number... BUT there is something called context. Fire damage and frost damage function differently because enemies have different resistances to those elements. Serration is a just a flat boost to the base damage of a mod. Elemental mods scale off Serration, Serration does not scale off elemental mods. There is nothing else to it. The mod, Serration, was meant to be how weapons will scale over time and levels. DE wants us to always use this mod because it is how the game works. I just want to take the next logical step and make that process automatic. Freeing up a mod slot and 14 mod points while in the process giving DE another number to tune and balance the game with.
Repeatedly saying my argument is invalid without providing any actual argument against it is on the other hand is a logical fallacy. Contrary to your belief, I don't need your help.
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Anything can be an ornament and they are functional to a certain extent. Do not expect them to be viable endgame weapons.
But that is my point, they should be viable in the end game.
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You could very well survive the endgame by not using a redirect mod and going for some other type of build. It would be a bit harder but not impossible like it would be without a Serration or Split Chamber.
I think we are all sick of RNG here.
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Basically they are gunning to kill the damage creep that has infected Warframe since at least update 8. Endgame would feel the same to those currently experiencing it. But to newbies it would not be nearly as punishing to.
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wait is this nerf nova thread?
I see how you can be confused, I'm very anti-Molecular Prime. But the OP was purposing an idea that would apply to all warframes.
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- Serration adds a layer of long term progression beyond the first few hours of owning a weapon
- Serration adds Re-playability to a weapon. I went back and played alot of older weapons after I got my serration much higher
- Serration adds Deeper customization. Some players max it for damage, some players leave a bit of space for more mod energy for other mods
- high energy mods like Serration and Multishot are a natural barrier for players to overcome with Forma.
No one would EVER use forma if if Serration's high cost was not an issue.
So does finding a cool unique mod, leveling that cool unique mod, trying out different combinations with your cool unique mod till you find one that fits your play style. And honestly once you max out one serration you are unlikely to ever bother to try and max it out again. You just did not have to. All it was was a time sink to keep you preoccupied until DE can come up with an endgame.
If your weapon hits rank 30, it's rank 30. With proper balancing all weapons, even older ones, should be viable to play.
Serration is the death of customization, you bump it as high as you can afford to. Then wait till you can forma an extra slot so you can maximize it.
Forma should not have exist. It was a massive mistake. Now with enough time and luck you can maximize every mod you have equipped. So I ask you, who do you balance the endgame around? The guy who has his gear fully formaed? The guy who just Reactored/catalyst his gear? Or should it scale off the guy who was not lucky enough to get a reactor or catalyst from an alert and can't afford to buy one? I'll leave the answer up forum. I know my opinion.
If you're against this idea, think about why. Acrid is super OP because of the damage scaling (along with multishot etc). It's not that it shouldn't scale, but if DE controlled the values, that would lead to better balance. Unless of course you love the Acrid, then why is it that you like all other weapons to be inferior? This idea would fix those issues.
Still my favorite gell.
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Nope you were alright, I apologize myself for semi-hijacking your thread. Honestly I don't think DE even knows how to make the endgame right now. They are just pushing out weapons and warframes till they figure out what it should be.
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I think they're fine, I see them as novelty weapons to add to my collection. They're also great for bringing along to defense missions for leveling.
A weapons should not just be and ornament. They should all be of equal use or at the very least functional.
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Let me save you from yourself. The point of of things like Serration and Forma is they give you the ability to improve your weapons well beyond what they are capable of fresh out of the Foundry. This is the very nature of video games, accomplishment and reward. removing reward from a video game makes no sense. This is the fundamental issue with the "sidegrade" and "skins" argument. If every weapon, warframe and item functioned exactly the same and had the exact same dps...why would anyone EVER play warframe beyond the first 10 or so hours?
Why play Warframe past 10 hours if the only reason to play is to get bigger numbers? You will still be doing the exact same damage percentage wise, because the endgame has to scale with you. The only difference is we would not be leaving quite as many players. Oh. And, with a bit of hope, we would get bullets that bounce off walls! I play games for fun, not numbers.
Side-grades just mean more choice. That does not make them flawed.
Also, if being saved required also being an elitist I would rather pass.
gell... You're my favorite...
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Acrid buff?
If it needed one yes. They could also remove it.
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Weapon in the game deserves better stats than anything other weapon. The alert weapons are just a victim of power creep.
Also longswords are just broken as a weapons class.
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Unless i'm mistaken, we are both in agree the energy system is flawed... So i'll drink to that!
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Thats too drastic of a change to make to the current throwing knives, but i wouldn't mind seeing a new one thats like Lex, but a throwing knife. Would either need to retain the really low reload speed, or have higher projectile speed in order to be viable though.
And for god sakes, no more charged weapons. The bows were never designed in mind to be shot non-charged or else they would have more than 1 ammo capacity.
This is a beta. Nothing is too drastic.
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Like other have said it would increase the requirement on the hosts part making it problematic for them.
Serration Must Be Apart Of The Weapons Not Mods In My Opinion.
in Weapons
Posted
It's not about winning. It's about voiceing my opinion on a problem I see in warframe and offering a solution. I'm doing just as the forum title says, I'm offering feedback to the developer. But i will repeat myself, you fit your build around serration, not serration around your build.