Jump to content


PC Member
  • Posts

  • Joined

  • Last visited



Recent Profile Visitors

The recent visitors block is disabled and is not being shown to other users.

  1. Status Immunity seemed to only exist to reign in Corrosive before the status rework. Feels silly now that both armor scaling and Corrosive got capped. The power of 11x Crit multipliers was literally insignificant to the power of 100% armor strip when armor scaled exponentially. At Sortie level, armor gave an enemy upwards of 20x ehp and just got higher and higher during an endurance run. Against such armor, Crit-weapons fell off hard compared to Status-weapons, which was why Hunter Munitions was introduced as a band-aid. Let that sink in: Hunter Muntions was a Band-aid introduced to help "garbage" crit weapons against armor. The gentler S-curve armor scaling was a buff to Crit weapons as raw damage was allowed to scale higher. Corrosive getting capped killed a lot of non-Slash Status weapons like the Strun Wraith. The loss of 4x IPS nerfed a lot of Slash based Status weapons, while Crit-weapons that relied on Hunter Munitions got stronger due to Viral's buff.
  2. I wrote pure damage, not status. As statuses cap, there is little reason to actively build for status except for status primers or slash. My point was that it's misleading to compare a crit and non-crit hit on a weapon built for crit because it's the same as comparing a fully modded weapon to an unfinished build. Crit is just another multiplier and has similar relative gains to other multipliers for the same amount of mod slots invested. The only difference is that crit is an extra multiplier some weapons can take advantage and others don't creating a gap between the crit-ables and the cri-t-pples. Tuning the Crit multiplier numbers won't change this gap unless Crit mods and multipliers were made uselessly weak. The real solution is to make the Crit Multiplier additive with something else like Base Damage.
  3. When a weapon built for Crit fails to land a Crit, for that one shot, 2-3 mod slots on that weapon are essentially doing nothing. Comparing a crit hit and non-crit hit on a crit modded weapon is comparing a fully modded weapon to an unfinished build. A better comparison would between the damage of a crit hit when crit modded and a non-crit hit on the same weapon with a pure damage build instead. Crit operates under the same rules of opportunity costs just like Base Damage. Getting over 100% Critical Chance and a good Crit Multiplier doesn't come cheap in terms of mod slot investment. Crit Multiplier = (Crit Tier * (Modded Crit Multiplier -1)) With a standard modded Crit Multiplier of 4.4x. Yellow Crit = 4.4x or +340% Damage, +340% Relative to White Damage Orange Crit = 7.8x or +680% Damage, +77% Relative to Yellow Crit Red Crit = 11.2x or + 1020% Damage, +43.5% Relative to Orange Crit Each Crit tier yields lower relative returns, just like how stacking more Base Damage yields lower relative returns. If you can use an extra mod slot to push your Orange Crits into Red territory, you would get more value out of that mod slot by slotting in a +55% Primed Faction mod. Of course, this is just opportunity costs. Stacking additional Crit continues to increase damage linearly. Status effects like Viral have actual diminishing returns with lower increases after the 1st proc and an actual cap.
  4. Though I agree Warframe has too many multipliers, Crit is just one small piece of the multiplication problem. Take an above average crit weapon with Base crit chance of 30% and multiplier of 2.0x. 1*0.7+2*0.3=1.3 Add Vital Sense and Point Strike to raise Crit chance to 75% and Crit multiplier to 4.4x. 1*0.25+4.4*0.75=3.55 Damage increase factor: 3.55/1.3=2.73 or +173% damage which is in line with other mods for the cost of 2 slots. The only issue is that this +173% for 2 slots is multiplicative with +165% Serration for 1 slot, +180% of 2 Elements for 2 slots, +90% of Multi-shot for 1 slot, +55% of Faction Damage for 1 slot, +325% of Viral at max stacks, etc..... Status is stronger than Crit, which is why we have enemies with Status Immunity instead of Crit Immunity. Status only seems underwhelming because weapons don't need much Status % to reach the 10 cap for the maximum benefit. A Crit weapon only needs passable Status % to be labeled a hybrid. Layers of armor, damage caps, status immunity, invincibility phases, damage attenuation are just damage dividers on the enemy end to blunt our damage multipliers. Before the Base Damage arcanes were added, I suggested that a lot of multiplicative interactions should be changed to additive just like how Condition Overload was made additive with Pressure Point.
  5. Everyone confuses diminishing returns with opportunity costs. Stacking more base damage, elements and crit results in opportunity costs. Status procs have actual diminishing returns. First Viral proc adds +100%, each subsequent one adds +25% capping at +325%. DE should probably add an Overload Status effect. When reaching the 10 cap on a status effect, subsequent procs are converted into Overload. Overload is a dot that scales off status%.
  6. Crit is over hyped. It's strong, but it isn't magic. Take an above average crit weapon with Base crit chance of 30% and multiplier of 2.0x. 1*0.7+2*0.3=1.3 Add Vital Sense and Point Strike. Crit chance of 75% and Crit multiplier of 4.4x. 1*0.25+4.4*0.75=3.55 Damage increase factor: 3.55/1.3=2.73 2 mod slots for a 2.73x damage increase or +173% damage which is in line with other multipliers. +180% is two 90% 2 elements taking up 2 slots discounting resistances. Viral grants +100% damage on first proc and +325% on 10th. Crit isn't magic, it's just another multiplier that's multiplicative with other multipliers which is why hybrids are king. At sortie levels, armor gives over 20x ehp and back when Corrosive could fully strip armor, it effectively let you deal 20x damage, Pure Crit weapons were just cute in comparison.
  7. Well that's the thing. Games are built on interaction. Power is good when it expands our options for interactivity, but it also runs the risk of depriving the enemy of interactivity. But the enemy not being able to interact is also the fastest way to farm.
  8. One of the big things Warframe suffers from is the lack of traditional levels for players. There is no correlation between player power and levels. Players don't scale the same way enemies do, which leads to unbalanced encounters and squad compositions.
  9. Warframe has more exceptions and technicalities than Yu-Gi-Oh. Playing the game has been reduced to playing solitaire with yourself. Warframe as it's now is just a busted interactive card game.
  10. DE changed Blast because people complained about it making it harder to land headshots. DE could have made it so that the entire body of a downed enemy counted as "head" in damage calculations, allowing melee weapons to land "headshots", giving on headshot buffs an alternative way to be stacked. Instead, we got inaccuracy...
  11. The latest one made it so that pure damage builds didn't immediately fall off at higher levels so you could go a much higher without 100% armor strip or True Damage. A change that's mostly invalidated with Steel Path modifiers. The issue is that changing armor scaling did not change the fact that armor is the only thing we care to mod against. Also, the gentler scaling isn't in a vacuum. 4 x Corrosive Projection is no longer 100%. Corrosive got capped at 80%, so it breaks even with a full strip at 4500 initial ferrite armor which level 74 Heavy Gunners sport and progressively gets worse as armor levels rise. Of course, this is not far from where the gentler scaling kicks in. Corrosive is basically dead against Alloy compared to Viral. Slash lost 4xIPS priority, but Viral got buffed. Viral + Hunter Munitions/Stance Slash Proc builds got stronger.
  12. The enemies will never feel quite right as long as DE chooses to juggle multipliers around. We have so many ways to multiply damage for free and enemies have just as many ways to divide or ignore our damage. Status immunity, armor scaling, damage attenuation, i-frames are ways to blunt our needlessly unchecked cocktail of multishot, combo counter, crit, status and Warframe buffs. DE needs to cut the fluff on both sides because the game right now is just pure cheese.
  13. I'm surprised DE didn't implement this for Corpus Shields to make them more competitive ehp wise with Grineer. As long as an enemy has a sliver of shields, Crit Multiplier is changed to 1.0x during damage calculations.
  14. The player damage curve and enemy ehp curve is all over the place. DE is stuck juggling multipliers. There are too many ways to multiply damage for free and slapping random DR, status immunity and damage attenuation seems to be DE's band-aid solution. DE can't please everyone. DE doesn't just nerf weapons, but enemies too. There are people that complained about the gentler armor scaling, or how sentients are too weak now because they were made status vulnerable in the recent update.
  • Create New...