Master Chief Vs. Warframe

[yeomanry]

You're not the only one presenting points here, please read other peoples posts

 

Edit: You forgot/ignored to read the "and the other Spartans"part?,MC is only there as he's the center of most of the series and the subject of the thread versus the warframes.

 

Please read the first Post. OP questioned if MC can stand against a Tenno, with its Warframe.

 

Warframes my dear, are Space Ninja Suits. Jeysus. 

 

OP:

In an Epic, High Stakes Death Battle, would Master Chief of the Halo series stand any chance against 1 or more Tenno, and if so, which of and/or how many of the warframes would he be able to defeat/kill/neutralize before he is another mark on someone's Soma?

Edited November 1, 2013 by yeomanry

[KuzkinaMat]

Warframe's are just suits and are just suits without using them just like Spartan's mholnir armor. And the Tenno are the only one who can use them. 

And by warframe in general i meant the tenno in thier warframe, you don't have to correct/attack me on that one really, you could just use common sense.

yet again points presented are ignored. 

 

oh dear -sigh-

Edited November 1, 2013 by KuzkinaMat

[Scowlface2]

Havent you noticed that your irrational claims ricochets? For the Love of God, learn to read Posts. I already altered my statements. I had a rough day that time!

 

Senath and I have been arguing since the creation of this Thread. If you have nothing to concise about this argument, sit around the corner and cry. This Argument is supposed to be civil, a valid, friendly debate over two games.

 

 

We did not invite high school kids out here! 

 

Your argument still principally revolves around "nope, Warframe powers won't work because I don't understand how they work."

 

This has been your defining trait ever since this thread began. You do not argue in good faith nor do you actually bother to listen to what other people have to say so much as you regurgitate the same tired old debunked nonsense in the hopes that it'll be accepted.

 

You arbitrarily decide the conditions of the scenario that are beyond the scope set down, demand people obey your dictates, and then get upset when they don't play by the rules you set down because you can't legitimately argue otherwise.

 

A high school kid would have a better argument than you.

 

You don't get any slack and you certainly don't get your a pass for the crap you've already pulled. You don't like it? Tough. You can either sit down and cry or you can buck up and learn to actually debate honestly.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Scowlface2

[SirNerdsAlot5]

They say under Master Chief's helmet, is only another helmet; because he is too awesome to show his real face. O.O

[pitakosxD]

They say under Master Chief's helmet, is only another helmet; because he is too awesome to show his real face. O.O

And what's under the other mask?

I can't even imagine!!!

[yeomanry]

Your argument still principally revolves around "nope, Warframe powers won't work because I don't understand how they work."

 

This has been your defining trait ever since this thread began. You do not argue in good faith nor do you actually bother to listen to what other people have to say so much as you regurgitate the same tired old debunked nonsense in the hopes that it'll be accepted.

 

You arbitrarily decide the conditions of the scenario that are beyond the scope set down, demand people obey your dictates, and then get upset when they don't play by the rules you set down because you can't legitimately argue otherwise.

 

A high school kid would have a better argument than you.

 

You don't get any slack and you certainly don't get your a pass for the crap you've already pulled. You don't like it? Tough. You can either sit down and cry or you can buck up and learn to actually debate honestly.

 

Again, if you have nothing to concise about this thread, shoot yourself.

This thread was kept civil at all costs until your kind hinders the thought.

And on the fact that I ignored all other comments is because Senath generalized everything about Warframe. His rebuts were highly theoretical and has absorbed all other assumptions and questions of Warframe logic. I was simply being elusive on Warframe's overpowering attributes, searching for loopholes inside its bizarre Universe.

 

If someone posts, 'Simple, mc sucks at ember cuz shes gonna burn him'. 

 

Why would I address this if it has been already answered? You dont dive directly into an Open Ocean without being inclined to possible scenarios, perhaps danger in all sorts.

Conceptualize your thoughts beyond the matter before you exaggerate with tantrums.

This is Internet 101, trying to be grandiloquent wont save your skin.

 

 

If its your first time in the Internet, try the dark side of the Internet -4chan (sums up the Dark Side) you Unicorn fart sprinkler.

 

 

Edit: FYI, there's no such thing as debating in an honest way. You will do everything, anything for your side to win. 

Edited November 1, 2013 by yeomanry

[KuzkinaMat]

Maybe hes faceless

Faceless=Slenderman

Slenderman=Awesome

Awesome=Master Chief o-o

 

therefore Master Chief is the Space Slenderman!

[KuzkinaMat]

 

Edit: FYI, there's no such thing as debating in an honest way. You will do everything, anything for your side to win. 

 

There is, by pointing out errors or omissions in your opponent’s facts and logic and there are dis-honest tactics in debating such as name calling, rejecting facts or logic as opinion, scapegoating,citing irrelevant facts or logic and many other things.

 

as you said, if you have nothing to concise about this thread please post something relevant rather than attacking/lecturing posters personally? post your proof that could invalidate effectiveness of the Warframes against the Spartans and dont stop presenting them.

Edited November 1, 2013 by KuzkinaMat

[fatpig84]

After shifting through all the turd and gems here.

I just say 1 thing, Tenno will always win as long they are within ability range.

Nothing can stop them period.

 

FYI even skills like Radial Blind also works on frigging machines and AI. 

So even the lowly Excalibur can blind Cortana and chief together.

 

 

The only thing MC can hope for is to out snipe a tenno with his rifle and hope they don't snipe back since Tenno have hilarious rifles that actually work better vs armor.

 

So it becomes who can 1 shot who. 

 

But unfortunately for Chief, it won't be easy as some classes can severely tilt this in their favor like Frost and Volt.

Not to mention invisible snipers like Loki and Ash, who have the added advantage of teleporting everywhere.

 

Close combat, just no. 

Even Trinity can just disable him with EV till the sun goes down.

[yeomanry]

Italic is Mine. Formatting hates me.

 

Ack, forum ate my post, now I'm having to type up the whole thing again! >_<

 

In cutscenes, Mag's crush works just fine on Lech Kril, who is immune to it in the game. Cutscenes>gameplay. (unless word of god states otherwise) Also, Crush works as a one-hit kill on just about any reasonably-leveled enemy. (lvl 30 or so) It's just in the higher levels that it fails to do the job in one try, and I think we can all agree that the infinitely and exponentially scaling health and armor of enemies is simply game mechanics and not something that applies to the Warframe universe outside of gameplay.

 

Grineer in armor weigh twice as much as Master Chief in armor, and are covered in literal slabs of Carbon Steel alloy plate. Many of them have had their limbs replaced entirely with mechanical ones, instead of just having metal bones like Chief does. While it's not mentioned, it's logical to assume that their skeleton has been augmented in some manner to allow them to support the nearly 1 ton of armor they wear without buckling under the weight. Mag's skills are more than enough to snap them like twigs.

 

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No worries, no more spoilers

 

The Grineers uses Alloy Plates (?) of/and Ferrites (Sexy way to say Iron) to Carbon Steel in manufacturing their Armor and possibly their prostheticsb explains why they are magnetic.

 

Titanium is mildly paramagnetic, much less magnetic than Steels and to non-magnetic steel alloys.

And since Spartan's Skeletal System are virtually unbreakable (falling from Space under the weight of a slab from a Ship doesnt crush them neither a grip from a Forerunner is impossible), Mag's SS will prolly just stun or momentarily hugs MC's nostrils for 2.7 secs.

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As I said before, it's a common cliche in games to have that sort of thing be blatantly obvious to the player's side to prevent confusion, and yet be perfectly effective against enemies. The holo decoy the UNSC uses is effective in the field against intelligent combatants, and Saryn's decoy can fool brilliant scientists and top-of-the-line combat robots that are actively analyzing their opponents and scanning for weaknesses. Again as I stated earlier, it could be using a psionic compulsion to make things attack it, (it literally forces all enemies to target it above anything else in the area, and would fit in well with the psychic nature of some of the other frame skills) or it could be much more realistic from the enemy point of view. (supported by the fact that it has both shields and health, just like the real Saryn)

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So draw? 

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Just because water puts out fire doesn't mean that a bucket is all it takes to put out a forest fire. Biofoam does not turn you into freaking Wolverine, all it does is seal wounds to prevent blood loss, keep damaged organs in place, keep out infection, and promote cell regeneration. It isn't the sort of thing that can protect you and your armor from being reduced to a rapidly-evaporating puddle of goo in a matter of moments by some sort of nanotech/magic poison. Grineer, who are twice as heavy and massive as Chief, are melted in moments, as are large full metal robots with energy shields. (this can't be stated enough)

 

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Ok you win. But I side with Stinker's theory. Saryn must stay in Range upon combating MC esp her Miasma's cute radii. MC wont be fool enough to engage in Melee unless needed to.

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The Grineer conquered virtually the entire solar system. They are genetically and cybernetically augmented humans literally bred for war. It's their entire goal and purpose in life, and by all accounts, they're quite good at it.

By home turf, I didn't mean that the ships were literally their home, but that virtually every fight takes place in their own territory, on their own ships. They aren't being sent out to die by the thousands in suicide missions as you implied. The Tenno are taking the fight to them and choosing the terms of engagement.

 

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Not Genetically, grineers are a race of clones, bred from previous generation of clones which are bred from its respective generation of clones etc...ect... (end of thinking capacity) thus disrupts their Gene Song upon birth (but they do still love their Mothers prior to Update 10) and they are programmed only for combat and combat alone.

As stated in Wiki, they are fairly weak individually but poses a threat in Groups, their Ambush Tactics are quite obvious and predictable (heads popping out of their covers) and blindly engage in an Open fire (rushing towards its target) if they lost options And if hope fails, they run around in circles or get their asses stuck under a flight of stairs.

 

The Covenant  displays an upper hand in terms of contact:

-Evading Fire/Dodging

-Withdrawing 

-Sense of Direction especially in throwing grenades

-Positioning instead of Swarming

-Shielding their comrades instead of their comrades running to every available Shield Lancers

-Driving

 

If the Grineers conquered the Entire Sol System in their Universe.

The Covenants achieved more in theirs, they got the entire Galaxy kneeling before them with the exception of the Humans

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I'll add Spoilers sandwiched between sentences. Those are my Answers.

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Pot, meet kettle. Let me demonstrate for you the 'superior' tactics demonstrated by Spartans and Elites:

The Arbiter uncloaks himself for no reason and just sits there for a few seconds with his back turned to the three spartans and Forge, staring at the guy in front of him like an idiot. Why didn't he just stab the guy while invisible?

(1) The Covenant Values Death and Honor (Medieval Japanese theme) and on the fact that it was being led by an Arbiter (which was kinda weak compared to MC's friend) 

(2) Similar to our Shade's Cloaking Ability, it is disrupted once we fire/charging a weapon or performing any other attacks.

The three Spartans then slowly and dramatically pose for a few seconds

Similar to Frost, Nyx and Ash when they shielded the fallen Excalibur. They did pose...in style. The Spartans stood their ground, confident since the incoming hostiles are all in melee. The Three Tennos on the other hand are facing a Company being led by a Captain.

while a bunch of Elites uncloak and charge at them from a distance down a long narrow chokepoint with zero cover.

Perfect place to fire from and pick them off, right? Two of the Spartans draw their guns, (slowly) and then rush right into melee without firing a shot.

 

Once they get within a couple inches of the Elites they fire briefly, then forgo their guns in favor of stealing the dead Elite's melee weapons and using those instead. (!) Meanwhile, the Spartan that hung back fires his shotgun once, then sits there doing nothing for a while.

Anticipating, bracing for action. They were trained to calm themselves in all possible scenerios. The Wings took down the first two Elites from Air, enclosing themselves further deep into Melee range since they need to brace these armored tanks into their respective open skins.

 

(although the camera cuts away, we hear no sound from his shotgun, which makes a very loud and distinctive booming noise compared to the sound effects used for the other two Spartan's guns)

(1) Shotguns are for close range. They two last incoming Elites were took down from the Wings. Then the next wave approaches.

(2) The background sounds were probably omitted or were cut. This doesnt mean they are not doing anything beyond that point

 

Doesn't seek cover, doesn't shoot the Elites, doesn't try to increase the distance between them, just sits there.

There are no covers, there objective was to activate the machine and they will not risk of it getting destroyed. They were tasked to halt through the neck of the bridge preventing Elites to behind their lines where the Machine lies.

 

Finally an Elite gets right up in his face, and only then does he fire a second shot. When Forge fights the Arbiter just a few feet away, all sounds of gunfire stop for a good long while. Are they just standing around doing more nothing? Using melee weapons alone?

Background sounds are omitted or was purposely cut, it does not mean they are going melee behind the camera

Yay tactics.

Are things any better on the Covenant side? Not really. All they do is CHARGE! at the Spartans with pointy sticks extended. Not a single one bothers to shoot the targets that are still a good distance away, not taking any cover, just standing there like idiots or rushing into melee. (at speeds far below the supposed speeds the novels give them I might add)

 

Their only purpose in the scene is to rush forward blindly and get impaled by their own stolen weapons, or get shot from five inches away.

Same as what Sawmans do. They wield Glaives/Spears (not our Glaive). The Spartans needs to enclose themselves to speculate weak spots over Elite's Thick Armor.

And while this isn't really tactics-related, Forge, an ordinary human, was able to take down the Arbiter on his own.

This scene depicts that Arbiter's Armor ricochets the Spartan Secondary shots

One of the highest-ranking Covenant military figures, and generally considered to be the equivalent of a Spartan-II in combat. A completely ordinary human with nothing but standard UNSC weaponry.

Exactly! He killed the Arbiter (the weak one) through brute force and cunning trick (Humans are cunning of all Sentients anyway without any monstrous weapons)

 

As for Vor and Kril dying in seconds, cutscenes>gameplay. Slash dash is enough to cut a 15 foot tall cyborg made almost entirely of armor and with heavy shields in half with a single use.

Cinematics! Even before Excalibur used Slash Dash, the other three Tennos on both Cinematics tried everything they can to sink both Bosses' HP into critical levels.

(1) At Kril, Rhino immobilizes Kril for Excalibur. Excalibur then aims for a Weakspot-Stomach which is not covered much as does his Chest.

(2) At Vor, Frosts freezes Vor into a subzero state (possibly) making him a sitting duck against Excalibur.

 

Both Bosses were not moving before they were mutilated. 

 

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The Tenno are not the player. They have enough concentration to block bullets from multiple vectors, perform complex acrobatics, and slaughter hordes of massive cyborgs and still have enough concentration left over to keep track of their teammates at all times. (the moment Loki got into a tiny bit of trouble, he glances at Rhino several dozen meters away and Rhino stops what he's doing for a moment and turns to acknowledge Loki and prepares for attacking the moment he gets switch teleported into the mob. Now that's teamwork and coordination)

 

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Crystal Clear. When Loki got knocked down by a Flameblade. That Flameblade was still alive yet it did nothing. Even before Loki got knocked down, he was surrounded by Grineer Lancers and there was one specifically standing behind him yet is not shooting! 

 

If the Tennos are the not Players, then the Spartans are too. They have full concentration within almost everything around them. With their twenty milisecond reaction Time. They can anticipate almost everything. 

 

To justify this, here is an example of Spartan Teamwork:

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All you need is a simple equation, E=mc^2. (energy equals mass times the speed of light squared, where energy is in joules, mass in kilograms, and the speed of light in meters per second)

The speed of light is 299,792,458 m/s, so squaring it equals 89,875,517,873,681,764. Now multiply that number by the mass of the object in question. Let's use 1 kilogram for simplicity's sake, leaving the number unchanged. This gives us roughly 89.8 petajoules.

The standardized definition for how much energy a ton of TNT releases is 4.184 gigajoules. Divide 89,875,517,873,681,764 by 4,184,000,000, and that gives you roughly 21,480,764.3 tons of TNT equivalent, or about 21.48 megatons. We need to double this figure since an equal amount of ordinary matter is also converted into energy alongside its antimatter counterpart, so that brings us to 42.96 megatons worth of explosive power for 1 kilogram of antimatter. (now, roughly half of the energy released by a M/AM reaction is going to be in the form of neutrinos, which pass harmlessly through matter, so in actuality the explosive yield would be lower despite the total amount of energy generated. Most sci-fi ignores this aspect entirely however)

You can also do this in reverse to see how much antimatter would be needed for a particular explosion. Let's take a 125mm smoothbore tank shell, which delivers 5.8 megajoules of energy to its target. Running it through the equation, 5,800,000 joules = 6.45337e-11 kilograms, or 645.337 nanograms. Halve that number since antimatter comprises only half of the reaction mass, which gives us 322.6685 nanograms of antimatter to equal the energy delivered by a tank round.

 

 

[edit:] Or if you don't feel like doing the numbers manually, there are calculators out there to easily convert from mass to energy, or vice versa.

 

Just remember that when finding the energy released by a certain amount of antimatter to double the mass you input, since an equal amount of matter will be converted to energy as well. Conversely, when trying to find out how much antimatter would be needed to produce an explosion of a certain size, halve the amount of mass indicated by the calculator.This table is a handy reference guide to the energy yield of various explosions and weapons.

 

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You can calculate Antimatter? What? Who are you?

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Grineer have extensive neural links with their gear and have sensory enhancements. (Neurodes, which are used to control Grineer augments, and Neural Sensors, which are harvested from infested but bear Grineer writing and are therefore derived from some piece of tech within the Grineer that the infested corrupted) They get dulled by silence just fine, as do brilliant scientists, combat robots, inhuman nanotech monsters that have lived for thousands of years, and more. Nothing you listed indicates that it would have any bearing on the effectiveness of Silence.

As for super reflexes, there comes a point where superior reaction time only means you get a fraction of a second more to realize how screwed you are if you don't have the raw physical speed to match it. Even with max book speed for Chief, (which again, has never been demonstrated in any cutscene I've ever seen) it isn't fast enough to get out of the way of a Slash Dash's path, particularly since the Tenno can alter the direction he's traveling in to course-correct himself mid-slash. And furthermore, since Chief has never fought an Excaliber before, he has no way of knowing what that pose means until it's too late. (even more so than if he started running the instant Excalibur begins the animation)

 

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Silence limits Auditory and perception but does not affect the other transducers. The receptive is still wide and a Spartan's Modality is still at height. A chink of Spark from a bullet that emits from your flank can still make your head turn sidewards. 

 

If Banshee and MC do engage, everything starts in anticipation and in Silence even before Banshee casts one.

 

The Books, Wiki and the Story depicts that Spartan II Units are so fast that they are able to think, react and see things in Slow and Fast Motion like of most Insects that lives in a World of Slow Mo...muwahahaha and they have sharp eyesight that they can see virtually in the Dark.

 

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Carbon Steel melts at roughly the same point, and the Grineer wear twice as much of it than MC does titanium. and most have shields on top of that. We don't know what kind of heat-resistant features they may have, so bringing up Chief's as other posters have done is irrelevant, particularly since heat protection is kinda a standard thing for most sci-fi supersoldiers.

Calculating Radii, duration, and temperature is also mostly irrelevant, since a single casting is all it will take to fry him.

 

(for all the talk about surviving reentry, most of the heat was absorbed by the piece of forerunner hull, and in Halo 3 ordinary flamethrowers can be incredibly effective weapons when used against Spartans, able to kill them with ease. Incendiary grenades are also effective against Spartans)

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Titanium losses strength when heated above 430 degrees Celsius. But it doesnt melt  until 1668. 

So Masterchief dies at some point if he is exposed too much on Ember's Heat. 

 

But this doesnt mean he now losses directly to Ember. But you win this scenario over Ember's World on Fire. Stupid Fire-bender.

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Try strong enough to instantly stop his heart and char him to death in his suit, judging by what it does to the average Grineer and Corpus. Even if you were right and his armor can magically no-sell Volt's electricity, it'll still bring down his shields, one of his primary forms of protection and leave him even more hideously vulnerable to the Volt's weapons than he already is. (strong electrical fields are used all the time in Halo to disable shields)

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Crap. But hey, this doesnt mean MC losses to Volt jsut because he is Thor.

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The damage types are a hidden part of code that define certain behaviors, not an in-universe explanation for how things work. Forcefield damage was originally created for ragdolling players coming into contact with Corpus laser doors, and was later re-used to provide a desired special effect on enemies. Programmers re-use stuff a lot when they can, no use defining an entirely new class of interactions when one already exists that does the exact thing you want. They do physics impact damage for regular attacks, (knocks things away forcefully) forcefield damage on charged attacks, (ragdolls enemies) and IIRC physics impact for their ground finisher, which is the one that causes enemies to explode.

If you want a different example, the Furax are purely physics impact weapons and can toss Grineer a little ways, or punch one cleanly in half. No sharp ends to help with that, just a couple stubby projections and raw brute strength. The Bo, which is a thin metal rod, does physics impact damage and can fling a Grineer over a dozen meters away. Same with the Fragor.

We've only seen Tenno use weapons for melee since there is no option to equip nothing at all in a weapon slot. The closest you can get is just a pair of knuckle guards.

Physical strength can also be defined by suit amplification, or by augmenting muscle tissue with artificial musculature. To quote Peter Watts (author of Crysis Legion and technical advisor for Crysis 2) about the Crysis Nanosuit:

We know the Tenno's bodies are modified with nanotech, though we don't know the extent. Even with real-world limits on strength, if even a tiny portion of their muscle mass was replaced with carbon nanotube equivalents, it would easily allow all of the crazy strength feats seen in-game and then some.

 

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There's no end on both sides about their respective Strengths, it all ends in Circles and hypothesis over hypothesis.

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Issue about Ember's World on Fire and Volt's Thor-like Powers over Masterchief has ended. Masterchief losses. I did everything what I can. If Masterchief is unable to calculate the radius of the opposing Power. He ends up being roasted.

Edited November 1, 2013 by yeomanry

[Scowlface2]

Edit: FYI, there's no such thing as debating in an honest way. You will do everything, anything for your side to win. 

 

Thank you for admitting your intent to lie, mislead, insinuate and generally make an &amp;#&#33; of yourself.

 

It tells us exactly how much effort should go into arguing with a zealot like you.

 

None at all. Because you care nothing for what the other side has to say.

 

In fact, I don't even care about who wins in such a scenario. I'm only here to call you out on your self-entitled bullcrap. You want to continue to demonstrate how much of a dishonest twit you are?

 

Go right ahead. I'll be right there to highlight it.

 

You want it to stop? Then learn some basic debating etiquette and stop being an &amp;#&#33;.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Scowlface2

[DesDaimonus]

Usual Warhammer 40k space marine can reape Chief on many-many little Chiefs in few seconds. He will even not feel a pain before he die, and he also can't do nothink to space marine who don't have any shields, have extremely heavy power armor and all his physical parameters are in 2-5 times higher then Chief. Actually space marine can kill him even naked and without weapon, and kill easy.

[yeomanry]

Thank you for admitting your intent to lie, mislead, insinuate and generally make an &amp;#&#33; of yourself.

 

It tells us exactly how much effort should go into arguing with a zealot like you.

 

None at all. Because you care nothing for what the other side has to say.

 

In fact, I don't even care about who wins in such a scenario. I'm only here to call you out on your self-entitled bullcrap. You want to continue to demonstrate how much of a dishonest twit you are?

 

Go right ahead. I'll be right there to highlight it.

 

You want it to stop? Then learn some basic debating etiquette and stop being an &amp;#&#33;.

 

Debate is a method of interactive and representational argument. Debate is a broader form of argument than deductive reasoning, which only examines whether a conclusion is a consequence of premises, and factual argument, which only examines what is or isn't the case, or rhetoric, which is a technique of persuasion. In debating, one side often prevails over the other side by presenting a superior "context" and/or framework of the issue, which is far more subtle and strategic. The outcome of a debate depends upon consensus or some formal way of reaching a resolution, rather than the objective facts as such. In a formal debating contest, there are rules for participants to discuss and decide on differences, within a framework defining how they will interact. -Wiki (Here a copy of international definition in case you burst into tears again)

 

In the World of Anonymous contributors, authors and silhouettes. The rules are being set by a third party, the share holders -Warframe Forums -Forum Rules where they keep everything civil, where the rules are set stationary and universal in most Forums-Civilized.

Your debating etiquette is invalid and beyond reasonable, illogical and irrelevant base on what I have presented on my rebuttals. I have provided Halo Facts over Warframe Facts, applied scientific analysis (got few mistakes), formulated hypothesis, countered opposing Facts yet you dare call me a zealot and dishonest?

 

Lies? Misleading? My sources are from Halo Wiki. Check it out yourself.

 

Are you hearing yourself or you're a total half-wit to define your words.

 

You're not even a part of this Debate. You're just another jobless clown trying to sneak into the stage. Trying to seek attention, admiration through skills that can be compared to a Trainee. Whines and sobs if others ignores you. You're akin to AWs on FB. Nothing else.

 

Tantrums cannot conceal your Identity both Virtually and probably in Reality. 

 

You're too drawn to Matrix. You need sunshine. The Real World is far worse than here. If you are to criticize someone in such hilarious way, dont do it in the Internet, it's far too easy, no one will beat you to death here. Try the Real World mate. You'll deserve and be served in such way you never imagined :)

[Anunymau5]

Usual Warhammer 40k space marine can reape Chief on many-many little Chiefs in few seconds. He will even not feel a pain before he die, and he also can't do nothink to space marine who don't have any shields, have extremely heavy power armor and all his physical parameters are in 2-5 times higher then Chief. Actually space marine can kill him even naked and without weapon, and kill easy.

Hell Space Marines can kill him with their drool! (Cuz of the acid saliva glands that are implanted)

[Scowlface2]

 

Lies? Misleading? My sources are from Halo Wiki. Check it out yourself.

 

 

 

Of course you lie. You lie when you make nonsensical claims about the other side, pretending that it's authoritative despite it going directly against what is established as canon.

 

Take your antimatter claim for example. Even if we discount the whole 'parallel universe' rubbish you tried to shovel, you still attempted to claim that it wasn't antimatter, despite it being specifically stated as such. The same applies for most of your dismissals of the warframe powers, dismissing their descriptions and performance ingame outright through understated fabrications or ignoring them when it proves inconvenient.

 

Or the Nekros's Soul punch. You claimed that it couldn't work because there are no souls, because if there were then it'd get whichever deity you believe in involved. Again directly contradicting established canon.

 

So yes, you're a liar. You don't lie about the side you support. You lie about the side you're against. And by your own admission, you'll lie, cheat and misdirect using any means to 'win'.

 

You can keep pretending to be some kind of rational debater, but every post you make demonstrates your complete lack of integrity, much less wit.

 

The biggest lie you have is the one where you believe you're being clever.

 

You're not.

 

But hey, if you want to continue to demolishing whatever credibility you have left, go right ahead.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Scowlface2

[yeomanry]

Italic is Mine. Formatting hates me.

 

Ack, forum ate my post, now I'm having to type up the whole thing again! >_<

 

In cutscenes, Mag's crush works just fine on Lech Kril, who is immune to it in the game. Cutscenes>gameplay. (unless word of god states otherwise) Also, Crush works as a one-hit kill on just about any reasonably-leveled enemy. (lvl 30 or so) It's just in the higher levels that it fails to do the job in one try, and I think we can all agree that the infinitely and exponentially scaling health and armor of enemies is simply game mechanics and not something that applies to the Warframe universe outside of gameplay.

 

Grineer in armor weigh twice as much as Master Chief in armor, and are covered in literal slabs of Carbon Steel alloy plate. Many of them have had their limbs replaced entirely with mechanical ones, instead of just having metal bones like Chief does. While it's not mentioned, it's logical to assume that their skeleton has been augmented in some manner to allow them to support the nearly 1 ton of armor they wear without buckling under the weight. Mag's skills are more than enough to snap them like twigs.

 

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No worries, no more spoilers

 

The Grineers uses Alloy Plates (?) of/and Ferrites (Sexy way to say Iron) to Carbon Steel in manufacturing their Armor and possibly their prostheticsb explains why they are magnetic.

 

Titanium is mildly paramagnetic, much less magnetic than Steels and to non-magnetic steel alloys.

And since Spartan's Skeletal System are virtually unbreakable (falling from Space under the weight of a slab from a Ship doesnt crush them neither a grip from a Forerunner is impossible), Mag's SS will prolly just stun or momentarily hugs MC's nostrils for 2.7 secs.

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As I said before, it's a common cliche in games to have that sort of thing be blatantly obvious to the player's side to prevent confusion, and yet be perfectly effective against enemies. The holo decoy the UNSC uses is effective in the field against intelligent combatants, and Saryn's decoy can fool brilliant scientists and top-of-the-line combat robots that are actively analyzing their opponents and scanning for weaknesses. Again as I stated earlier, it could be using a psionic compulsion to make things attack it, (it literally forces all enemies to target it above anything else in the area, and would fit in well with the psychic nature of some of the other frame skills) or it could be much more realistic from the enemy point of view. (supported by the fact that it has both shields and health, just like the real Saryn)

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So draw? 

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Just because water puts out fire doesn't mean that a bucket is all it takes to put out a forest fire. Biofoam does not turn you into freaking Wolverine, all it does is seal wounds to prevent blood loss, keep damaged organs in place, keep out infection, and promote cell regeneration. It isn't the sort of thing that can protect you and your armor from being reduced to a rapidly-evaporating puddle of goo in a matter of moments by some sort of nanotech/magic poison. Grineer, who are twice as heavy and massive as Chief, are melted in moments, as are large full metal robots with energy shields. (this can't be stated enough)

 

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Ok you win. But I side with Stinker's theory. Saryn must stay in Range upon combating MC esp her Miasma's cute radii. MC wont be fool enough to engage in Melee unless needed to.

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The Grineer conquered virtually the entire solar system. They are genetically and cybernetically augmented humans literally bred for war. It's their entire goal and purpose in life, and by all accounts, they're quite good at it.

By home turf, I didn't mean that the ships were literally their home, but that virtually every fight takes place in their own territory, on their own ships. They aren't being sent out to die by the thousands in suicide missions as you implied. The Tenno are taking the fight to them and choosing the terms of engagement.

 

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Not Genetically, grineers are a race of clones, bred from previous generation of clones which are bred from its respective generation of clones etc...ect... (end of thinking capacity) thus disrupts their Gene Song upon birth (but they do still love their Mothers prior to Update 10) and they are programmed only for combat and combat alone.

As stated in Wiki, they are fairly weak individually but poses a threat in Groups, their Ambush Tactics are quite obvious and predictable (heads popping out of their covers) and blindly engage in an Open fire (rushing towards its target) if they lost options And if hope fails, they run around in circles or get their asses stuck under a flight of stairs.

 

The Covenant  displays an upper hand in terms of contact:

-Evading Fire/Dodging

-Withdrawing 

-Sense of Direction especially in throwing grenades

-Positioning instead of Swarming

-Shielding their comrades instead of their comrades running to every available Shield Lancers

-Driving

 

If the Grineers conquered the Entire Sol System in their Universe.

The Covenants achieved more in theirs, they got the entire Galaxy kneeling before them with the exception of the Humans

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I'll add Spoilers sandwiched between sentences. Those are my Answers.

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Pot, meet kettle. Let me demonstrate for you the 'superior' tactics demonstrated by Spartans and Elites:

The Arbiter uncloaks himself for no reason and just sits there for a few seconds with his back turned to the three spartans and Forge, staring at the guy in front of him like an idiot. Why didn't he just stab the guy while invisible?

(1) The Covenant Values Death and Honor (Medieval Japanese theme) and on the fact that it was being led by an Arbiter (which was kinda weak compared to MC's friend) 

(2) Similar to our Shade's Cloaking Ability, it is disrupted once we fire/charging a weapon or performing any other attacks.

The three Spartans then slowly and dramatically pose for a few seconds

Similar to Frost, Nyx and Ash when they shielded the fallen Excalibur. They did pose...in style. The Spartans stood their ground, confident since the incoming hostiles are all in melee. The Three Tennos on the other hand are facing a Company being led by a Captain.

while a bunch of Elites uncloak and charge at them from a distance down a long narrow chokepoint with zero cover.

Perfect place to fire from and pick them off, right? Two of the Spartans draw their guns, (slowly) and then rush right into melee without firing a shot.

 

Once they get within a couple inches of the Elites they fire briefly, then forgo their guns in favor of stealing the dead Elite's melee weapons and using those instead. (!) Meanwhile, the Spartan that hung back fires his shotgun once, then sits there doing nothing for a while.

Anticipating, bracing for action. They were trained to calm themselves in all possible scenerios. The Wings took down the first two Elites from Air, enclosing themselves further deep into Melee range since they need to brace these armored tanks into their respective open skins.

 

(although the camera cuts away, we hear no sound from his shotgun, which makes a very loud and distinctive booming noise compared to the sound effects used for the other two Spartan's guns)

(1) Shotguns are for close range. They two last incoming Elites were took down from the Wings. Then the next wave approaches.

(2) The background sounds were probably omitted or were cut. This doesnt mean they are not doing anything beyond that point

 

Doesn't seek cover, doesn't shoot the Elites, doesn't try to increase the distance between them, just sits there.

There are no covers, there objective was to activate the machine and they will not risk of it getting destroyed. They were tasked to halt through the neck of the bridge preventing Elites to behind their lines where the Machine lies.

 

Finally an Elite gets right up in his face, and only then does he fire a second shot. When Forge fights the Arbiter just a few feet away, all sounds of gunfire stop for a good long while. Are they just standing around doing more nothing? Using melee weapons alone?

Background sounds are omitted or was purposely cut, it does not mean they are going melee behind the camera

Yay tactics.

Are things any better on the Covenant side? Not really. All they do is CHARGE! at the Spartans with pointy sticks extended. Not a single one bothers to shoot the targets that are still a good distance away, not taking any cover, just standing there like idiots or rushing into melee. (at speeds far below the supposed speeds the novels give them I might add)

 

Their only purpose in the scene is to rush forward blindly and get impaled by their own stolen weapons, or get shot from five inches away.

Same as what Sawmans do. They wield Glaives/Spears (not our Glaive). The Spartans needs to enclose themselves to speculate weak spots over Elite's Thick Armor.

And while this isn't really tactics-related, Forge, an ordinary human, was able to take down the Arbiter on his own.

This scene depicts that Arbiter's Armor ricochets the Spartan Secondary shots justifying my hypothesis on why the Wings took their positions in Melee Range

 

One of the highest-ranking Covenant military figures, and generally considered to be the equivalent of a Spartan-II in combat. A completely ordinary human with nothing but standard UNSC weaponry.

Exactly! He killed the Arbiter (the weak one) through brute force and cunning trick (Humans are cunning of all Sentients anyway without any monstrous weapons)

 

As for Vor and Kril dying in seconds, cutscenes>gameplay. Slash dash is enough to cut a 15 foot tall cyborg made almost entirely of armor and with heavy shields in half with a single use.

Cinematics! Even before Excalibur used Slash Dash, the other three Tennos on both Cinematics tried everything they can to sink both Bosses' HP into critical levels.

(1) At Kril, Rhino immobilizes Kril for Excalibur. Excalibur then aims for a Weakspot-Stomach which is not covered much as does his Chest.

(2) At Vor, Frosts freezes Vor into a subzero state (possibly) making him a sitting duck against Excalibur.

 

Both Bosses were not moving before they were mutilated. 

 

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The Tenno are not the player. They have enough concentration to block bullets from multiple vectors, perform complex acrobatics, and slaughter hordes of massive cyborgs and still have enough concentration left over to keep track of their teammates at all times. (the moment Loki got into a tiny bit of trouble, he glances at Rhino several dozen meters away and Rhino stops what he's doing for a moment and turns to acknowledge Loki and prepares for attacking the moment he gets switch teleported into the mob. Now that's teamwork and coordination)

 

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Crystal Clear. When Loki got knocked down by a Flameblade. That Flameblade was still alive yet it did nothing. Even before Loki got knocked down, he was surrounded by Grineer Lancers and there was one specifically standing behind him yet is not shooting! 

 

If the Tennos are the not Players, then the Spartans are too. They have full concentration within almost everything around them. With their twenty milisecond reaction Time. They can anticipate almost everything. 

 

To justify this, here is an example of Spartan Teamwork:

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All you need is a simple equation, E=mc^2. (energy equals mass times the speed of light squared, where energy is in joules, mass in kilograms, and the speed of light in meters per second)

The speed of light is 299,792,458 m/s, so squaring it equals 89,875,517,873,681,764. Now multiply that number by the mass of the object in question. Let's use 1 kilogram for simplicity's sake, leaving the number unchanged. This gives us roughly 89.8 petajoules.

The standardized definition for how much energy a ton of TNT releases is 4.184 gigajoules. Divide 89,875,517,873,681,764 by 4,184,000,000, and that gives you roughly 21,480,764.3 tons of TNT equivalent, or about 21.48 megatons. We need to double this figure since an equal amount of ordinary matter is also converted into energy alongside its antimatter counterpart, so that brings us to 42.96 megatons worth of explosive power for 1 kilogram of antimatter. (now, roughly half of the energy released by a M/AM reaction is going to be in the form of neutrinos, which pass harmlessly through matter, so in actuality the explosive yield would be lower despite the total amount of energy generated. Most sci-fi ignores this aspect entirely however)

You can also do this in reverse to see how much antimatter would be needed for a particular explosion. Let's take a 125mm smoothbore tank shell, which delivers 5.8 megajoules of energy to its target. Running it through the equation, 5,800,000 joules = 6.45337e-11 kilograms, or 645.337 nanograms. Halve that number since antimatter comprises only half of the reaction mass, which gives us 322.6685 nanograms of antimatter to equal the energy delivered by a tank round.

 

 

[edit:] Or if you don't feel like doing the numbers manually, there are calculators out there to easily convert from mass to energy, or vice versa.

 

Just remember that when finding the energy released by a certain amount of antimatter to double the mass you input, since an equal amount of matter will be converted to energy as well. Conversely, when trying to find out how much antimatter would be needed to produce an explosion of a certain size, halve the amount of mass indicated by the calculator.This table is a handy reference guide to the energy yield of various explosions and weapons.

 

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You can calculate Antimatter? What? Who are you?

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Grineer have extensive neural links with their gear and have sensory enhancements. (Neurodes, which are used to control Grineer augments, and Neural Sensors, which are harvested from infested but bear Grineer writing and are therefore derived from some piece of tech within the Grineer that the infested corrupted) They get dulled by silence just fine, as do brilliant scientists, combat robots, inhuman nanotech monsters that have lived for thousands of years, and more. Nothing you listed indicates that it would have any bearing on the effectiveness of Silence.

As for super reflexes, there comes a point where superior reaction time only means you get a fraction of a second more to realize how screwed you are if you don't have the raw physical speed to match it. Even with max book speed for Chief, (which again, has never been demonstrated in any cutscene I've ever seen) it isn't fast enough to get out of the way of a Slash Dash's path, particularly since the Tenno can alter the direction he's traveling in to course-correct himself mid-slash. And furthermore, since Chief has never fought an Excaliber before, he has no way of knowing what that pose means until it's too late. (even more so than if he started running the instant Excalibur begins the animation)

 

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Silence limits Auditory and perception but does not affect the other transducers. The receptive is still wide and a Spartan's Modality is still at height. A chink of Spark from a bullet that emits from your flank can still make your head turn sidewards. 

 

If Banshee and MC do engage, everything starts in anticipation and in Silence even before Banshee casts one.

 

The Books, Wiki and the Story depicts that Spartan II Units are so fast that they are able to think, react and see things in Slow and Fast Motion like of most Insects that lives in a World of Slow Mo...muwahahaha and they have sharp eyesight that they can see virtually in the Dark.

 

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Carbon Steel melts at roughly the same point, and the Grineer wear twice as much of it than MC does titanium. and most have shields on top of that. We don't know what kind of heat-resistant features they may have, so bringing up Chief's as other posters have done is irrelevant, particularly since heat protection is kinda a standard thing for most sci-fi supersoldiers.

Calculating Radii, duration, and temperature is also mostly irrelevant, since a single casting is all it will take to fry him.

 

(for all the talk about surviving reentry, most of the heat was absorbed by the piece of forerunner hull, and in Halo 3 ordinary flamethrowers can be incredibly effective weapons when used against Spartans, able to kill them with ease. Incendiary grenades are also effective against Spartans)

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Titanium losses strength when heated above 430 degrees Celsius. But it doesnt melt  until 1668. 

So Masterchief dies at some point if he is exposed too much on Ember's Heat. 

 

But this doesnt mean he now losses directly to Ember. But you win this scenario over Ember's World on Fire. Stupid Fire-bender.

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Try strong enough to instantly stop his heart and char him to death in his suit, judging by what it does to the average Grineer and Corpus. Even if you were right and his armor can magically no-sell Volt's electricity, it'll still bring down his shields, one of his primary forms of protection and leave him even more hideously vulnerable to the Volt's weapons than he already is. (strong electrical fields are used all the time in Halo to disable shields)

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Crap. But hey, this doesnt mean MC losses to Volt jsut because he is Thor.

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The damage types are a hidden part of code that define certain behaviors, not an in-universe explanation for how things work. Forcefield damage was originally created for ragdolling players coming into contact with Corpus laser doors, and was later re-used to provide a desired special effect on enemies. Programmers re-use stuff a lot when they can, no use defining an entirely new class of interactions when one already exists that does the exact thing you want. They do physics impact damage for regular attacks, (knocks things away forcefully) forcefield damage on charged attacks, (ragdolls enemies) and IIRC physics impact for their ground finisher, which is the one that causes enemies to explode.

If you want a different example, the Furax are purely physics impact weapons and can toss Grineer a little ways, or punch one cleanly in half. No sharp ends to help with that, just a couple stubby projections and raw brute strength. The Bo, which is a thin metal rod, does physics impact damage and can fling a Grineer over a dozen meters away. Same with the Fragor.

We've only seen Tenno use weapons for melee since there is no option to equip nothing at all in a weapon slot. The closest you can get is just a pair of knuckle guards.

Physical strength can also be defined by suit amplification, or by augmenting muscle tissue with artificial musculature. To quote Peter Watts (author of Crysis Legion and technical advisor for Crysis 2) about the Crysis Nanosuit:

We know the Tenno's bodies are modified with nanotech, though we don't know the extent. Even with real-world limits on strength, if even a tiny portion of their muscle mass was replaced with carbon nanotube equivalents, it would easily allow all of the crazy strength feats seen in-game and then some.

 

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There's no end on both sides about their respective Strengths, it all ends in Circles and hypothesis over hypothesis.

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Issue about Saryn's Miasma, Ember's World on Fire and Volt's Thor-like Powers over Masterchief has ended. Masterchief losses. I did everything what I can. If Masterchief is unable to calculate the radius of the opposing Power. He ends up being roasted.

 

 

Upvoting this to defend our Side. Stinker quite took the endgame.

 

In all honesty, it'd happen something like this : (on second thought, before I proceed, I'm going to debunk the entire weapon argument. It's a weapon. You can be disarmed by either party. for the sake of this mind numbingly stupid argument (hurr durr acrid = hurr durr nukes) both parties have full access to the weaponry from both universes.

 

Master Chief Vs Nova Chief wins more often than not.You've got a trickster with dangerous anti matter tech to deal with. Her abilities demand close quarters and/or line of sight, her personal endurance, shields, and health are minimal. The chief will seek to exploit this by staying at range and striking from the shadows. Nova doesn't stand a chance if she loses the chief and the chief is allowed to slink into stealth. Through clever use of Wormhole, nova can prolong the time she gets to live or even just ultimately run. Her wormhole could also be used as a last ditch effort to throw the chief into a trap. EDIT: As an afterthought, It dawned on me that Nova could simply wormhole into null star range of the chief. The chief might be able to take 2 or 3, or even a full "clip" of null stars at most. He'd be hard pressed to win if Nova were ever able to effectively corner him for long enough.

 

Master Chief Vs Saryn Chief wins long range, Saryn stands a chance in a battle of fisticuffs. Saryn is a master of poison sturdy enough to exchange blows with the master chief. She is sturdy enough that she could withstand to use sacrificial blows against the chief to mortally wound the chief while barely holding onto life herself. Through use of Molt as a meatshield, saryn has equal potential to win in a brawl. At long range, her comparatively snail like movement makes her a sitting duck. Use of her ult is not advised. The time it takes for her to cast it is all the time it would take for someone with the speed and agility of the chief to cover the short distance that constitutes it's maximum range and destroy saryn before the swan song of poison finishes it's serenade leading to a draw. Venom is inconsequential against a single target, she could attempt to pull a rocky balboa with her molts however her energy supply would run long dry before the fairly non lethal singular poison would kill the chief.

 

Master Chief Vs Volt Chief wins every time Volt brings nothing to the field the chief hasn't dispatched millions of times before. Sorry volt, but you are a good deal underpowered. Electricity is near completely ineffectual on MJOLNIR armor.

 

Master Chief Vs Vauban Chief wins most of the time on open terrain, vauban wins everytime in enclosed spaces. Vauban has clever tricks that amount to little more than mere tricks. Tesla is rendered useless, bounce isn't helping anything, vortex could be argued to be all it takes, but it actually catching the chief is far less possible than vauban catching MC with Bastille. Vaubans only win condition is bastille. If the chief is ever outplayed to be caught in a bastille, chief loses.

 

Master Chief Vs Loki Loki wins most of the time if it's a quick battle. MC wins if Loki fails to kill him quickly and exposes himself too much. Switch Teleport and Decoy is all loki has to win, and it's all he needs. With the ability to add focal point the chief simply will not be able to keep effective track of, loki has the ability to place himself in any position favorable to him. If it ever came to fisticuffs, Loki has the ability to immediately negate and slink back into stealth well beyond what the Master Chief can cope with. A punch that should have connected catches nothing but air as they switch places. Loki's demise could only come as a result of a clever trap, MC intending to be switch teleported (primes a grenade that blows up in lokis face. :P), catching loki offguard with a singular lethal attack, basically, the longer the fight goes on the more loki runs out of tricks and the more tricks Master chief can come up with. Loki's immediate large advantage makes this an unlikely scenario.

 

Master Chief Vs Trinity It's a draw. Despite you thinking link is the end all be all here, there are many ways to inflict great harm that would do little to nothing to yourself. Applying appropriate pressure to the slender exposed neck of trinity for instance. The amount of requisite force to break her dainty neck is quite insignificant to what it would take to break the reinforced and muscled one of the chiefs. Or Chief simply outranges it and kills her from afar. Trinity has limited vulnerability, chief would recognize this and skirt her attacks until it wears off. Trinity only needs to land a single vampiric embrace though. It stuns and lifts it's victim helplessly into the air making it a simple feat to finish him off.

 

Master Chief Vs Ash Chief wins every single time.  Ash brings nothing to the battle the chief hasn't dispatched many times before. Canonically, the chief fights tougher enemies regularly.

 

Master Chief Vs Ember Chief wins every single time. Fire does nothing to the Mjolnir armor, Ember is as flimsy as nova.

 

Master Chief Vs Banshee Banshee wins most of the time. Banshee has superior radar, the ability to deafen the chief, a method of keeping him at bay, however if she foolishly ults banshee dies. Chiefs only win condition is killing her from afar.

 

Master Chief Vs Nekros Chief wins most of the time. Nekros' only win condition is if chief doesn't succumb to Howl of Terror. Not likely given Chiefs' History. Soul Punch is debatable on effectiveness and difficult to land. Unreliable.

 

Master Chief Vs Excalibur Chief wins again. Excalibur doesn't bring anything the chief hasn't seen/defeated a hundred times before.

 

I'm sure I'm missing somebody, but that's my take on it given the facts presented throughout the discussion. Chief's superior mobility, speed, strength, and armor puts him at a considerable advantage despite his armor rarely playing a role in his win conditions. As someone said earlier, Master Chief is pretty much Batman in power armor.

 

Master Chief Vs Frost Chief wins most of the time. Even slowed by 30%, the chief is still significantly faster than frost. Frosts snowglobe is borderline a disadvantage. Frost would have to use his snowglobe to bait the chief into a trap. Frost's "Freeze" is not instantaneous like someone in this thread mentioned, it's actually a fairly slow moving projectile. Avalanche is fairly irrelevant here. Don't believe me? Go load up a heavily infested survival and tell me just how much breathing room avalanche is really giving you. Protip: none whatsoever. You gotta cast it for every bit it slow down your enemy.

 

Master Chief Vs Mag A draw with favor to mag Crush has the same argument as avalanche, although slightly superior. Chief is accustomed to being thrown around and is more or less a 2 ton cat so pull doesn't prove to be much of an advantage on mag's end. In fact, mag would die if she pulled chief to her. Bullet attractor is her main method of blowing the spartan out of the water. it allows her to shoot around corners and even shoot blindly rendering chiefs superior agility rather moot. She just has to kill him before he gets in range to snap her pretty little neck.

 

Chief vs Nyx Nyx wins every single time. Probably would be the saddest battle to watch. Chaos is more or less forced PTSD. The ultimate downfall of any great warrior. Chief doesn't stand a chance thanks to chaos alone.

 

Chief Vs Rhino  The universe implodes because these two battle hardened mountains of men would never do battle.

 

 

Edited November 1, 2013 by yeomanry

[yeomanry]

 

Of course you lie. You lie when you make nonsensical claims about the other side, pretending that it's authoritative despite it going directly against what is established as canon.

 

Take your antimatter claim for example. Even if we discount the whole 'parallel universe' rubbish you tried to shovel, you still attempted to claim that it wasn't antimatter, despite it being strictly stated as canon. The same applies for most of your dismissals of the warframe powers, dismissing their descriptions outright through understated fabrications or ignoring them.

 

So yes, you're a liar. You don't lie about the side you support. You lie about the side you're against. And by your own admission, you'll lie, cheat and misdirect using any means to 'win'.

 

You can keep pretending to be some kind of rational debater, but every post you make demonstrates your complete lack of integrity, much less wit.

 

 

 

Read all Posts you half-twat. The Anti-Matter and Soul Punch issue was resolved, so was my Mistakes. It ended calm and civil.

Again, my sources are from Halo Wiki, from the Game itself. Check it yourself. I did not invent anything for me to win over an argument about a Game. *rolls eyes*

 

Again, Tantrums cannot conceal your Identity both Virtually and probably in Reality. 

You're too drawn to Matrix. You need sunshine. The Real World is far worse than here. If you are to criticize someone in such hilarious way, dont do it in the Internet, it's far too easy, no one will beat you to death here. Try the Real World mate. You'll deserve and be served in such way you never imagined.

You'll probably be nothing but all talk *winks*

 

 

For the Love of God, someone threw this kid out of the bar, he is too young to taste cherries!

Edited November 1, 2013 by yeomanry

[Scowlface2]

 

Read all Posts you half-twat. The Anti-Matter and Soul Punch issue was resolved, so was my Mistakes. It ended calm and civil.

Read all previous statements!

 

Again, Tantrums cannot conceal your Identity both Virtually and probably in Reality. 

 

You're too drawn to Matrix. You need sunshine. The Real World is far worse than here. If you are to criticize someone in such hilarious way, dont do it in the Internet, it's far too easy, no one will beat you to death here. Try the Real World mate. You'll deserve and be served in such way you never imagined.

You'll probably be nothing but all talk *winks*

 

For the Love of God, someone threw this kid out of the bar, he is too young to taste cherries!

 

 

I rather find it amusing how you try to make unfounded claims about life experience as if it was a valid comparison to your exposure as a pretty bad liar on this forum.

 

Not that it's a particularly intelligent move on your part, but hey, beggars can't be choosers.

 

And you're still making a bunch of lies to try to eke out wins I note.

 

Nova for example. Two of her offensive powers do not require line of sight to work, but you keep insisting that LOS is a big factor. Add this to the fact that AM Drop isn't restricted by range.

 

Saryn's cast, you insist takes forever, but a demonstration of the video shows it's not.

 

Volt being useless is another nonsensical lie you make. And not just because you're ignoring the fact that high power electrical fields can take out shields, but the weapons that are likely to be used as well. What, did you expect your MC to have a full weapons loadout and the other team restricted to slapping?

 

Vauban, again, you make an unfounded claim of him being useless because... 'tricks'. No doubt you also think that grenades, land mines, and other assorted traps deployed in the real world are 'useless tricks'. Nevermind the fact that shields are, as shown much earlier, affected by electrical fields.

 

Ember, you again make the rubbish claim that is useless because... what, he managed to survive an orbital drop by hiding behind an improvised heat shield? You know who makes regular orbital drops behind heat shields too? Regular bog standard humans. If that's the quality of your argument, I'm not impressed. Come back when you have evidence of him swimming in the molten metal of a blast furnace.

 

I could pick out more inconsistencies with your argument, but these are quite glaring enough.

[Senteth]

 

No worries, no more spoilers

 

The Grineers uses Alloy Plates (?) of/and Ferrites (Sexy way to say Iron) to Carbon Steel in manufacturing their Armor and possibly their prostheticsb explains why they are magnetic.

 

Titanium is mildly paramagnetic, much less magnetic than Steels and to non-magnetic steel alloys.

And since Spartan's Skeletal System are virtually unbreakable (falling from Space under the weight of a slab from a Ship doesnt crush them neither a grip from a Forerunner is impossible), Mag's SS will prolly just stun or momentarily hugs MC's nostrils for 2.7 secs.

 

Corpus seem to like using advanced plastics, and most of their armor seems to be made of a heavy flexible synthetic. It seems unlikely that they give their crewmen metal bones, though I will admit that some sort of augmentation is probable, particularly in the case of the eight-foot tall Techs. All corpus crewmen get lifted and crushed just fine by her magnetism. (may have something to do with the fact that with a powerful enough magnetic field, even the water in your body will start to react to it. Scientists have levitated frogs using extremely powerful magnetic fields before)

 

As for MC's bones, "virtually unbreakable" is hyperbole, much like a ceramic or plastic bowl might claim to be unbreakable. He doesn't have an adamantium skeleton like Wolverine, just one that's very resistant to damage and made of materials on par with his suit's armor. From what I saw watching an LP of Halo 4, the weight of the ship debris on top of him wasn't substantial enough to bend and crumple metal like cardboard like Crush does to enemies.

 

So draw? 

 

For now, yes. Until more information comes out, we can assume that any holo decoys MC uses will be effective on Tenno, and that Tenno decoys will be effective on MC.

 

Ok you win. But I side with Stinker's theory. Saryn must stay in Range upon combating MC esp her Miasma's cute radii. MC wont be fool enough to engage in Melee unless needed to.

 

Her Miasma is ranged, but not so short that it falls outside the typical range MC is usually depicted as fighting at. And in most Halo cutscenes and short episodes, he has a marked tendency to close the gap whenever possible.

 

 

Not Genetically, grineers are a race of clones, bred from previous generation of clones which are bred from its respective generation of clones etc...ect... (end of thinking capacity) thus disrupts their Gene Song upon birth (but they do still love their Mothers prior to Update 10) and they are programmed only for combat and combat alone.

 

Their genetics may be deteriorating over their original template, but it's pretty clear that the base pattern is heavily modified. Unless you think 7-8 foot tall humans built like football players and with glowing orange eyes are normal? And yes, they are programmed exclusively for combat. (except in rare cases like their scientists, and even those seem to be fairly combat-oriented from what we've seen) This means things like tactics and teamwork.

 

As stated in Wiki, they are fairly weak individually but poses a threat in Groups, their Ambush Tactics are quite obvious and predictable (heads popping out of their covers) and blindly engage in an Open fire (rushing towards its target) if they lost options And if hope fails, they run around in circles or get their asses stuck under a flight of stairs.

 

The Covenant  displays an upper hand in terms of contact:

-Evading Fire/Dodging

Grineer take cover all the time, even moving out of your line of sight when it should be borderline impossible for them to know that you're looking at them.

-Withdrawing 

Grineer fight to the death! XD

-Sense of Direction especially in throwing grenades

I don't know, they seem pretty accurate to me, so long as I'm not rushing around the place like the energizer bunny from hell. They also use grenades intelligently to force you to leave cover.

-Positioning instead of Swarming

Obviously you have never faced a large horde of grineer for any length of time. They love positioning themselves behind your back or taking advantage of terrain. I've also seen Covies use swarm tactics numerous times in gameplay and cutscenes.

-Shielding their comrades instead of their comrades running to every available Shield Lancers

Shield Lancers tend to move in front of their comrades, and their comrades move behind them.

-Driving

No vehicles in-game yet, so irrelevant.

 

If the Grineers conquered the Entire Sol System in their Universe.

The Covenants achieved more in theirs, they got the entire Galaxy kneeling before them with the exception of the Humans

 

The Covenant also have the advantage of faster than light travel, something the Warframe universe lacks. The Covenant has hundreds of habitable worlds it was able to reach and colonize thanks to that, expanding their population and resource base immensely, while the Grineer are stuck with only a handful of barely-terraformed planets and moons in a single solar system, unable to physically reach anywhere else. For the resources available to them, it's impressive.

 

(1) The Covenant Values Death and Honor (Medieval Japanese theme) and on the fact that it was being led by an Arbiter (which was kinda weak compared to MC's friend) 

(2) Similar to our Shade's Cloaking Ability, it is disrupted once we fire/charging a weapon or performing any other attacks.

1: The Arbiter is generally considered the equal of a Spartan-II in combat. The 'Death and Honor' mentality is a liability in combat, both tactically and strategically, not a strength.

 

2: Still no reason to uncloak before attacking and sit there with your back turned to three Spartans and a regular soldier, or to target the very weakest one there first.

 

Similar to Frost, Nyx and Ash when they shielded the fallen Excalibur. They did pose...in style. The Spartans stood their ground, confident since the incoming hostiles are all in melee. The Three Tennos on the other hand are facing a Company being led by a Captain.

 

No, they acted 'cool' instead of acting professionally. It's a flaw endemic to most cutscenes and isn't really excusable for either side. However, it's hypocritical to point at one and say they have terrible tactics compared to yours when your own side displays equally bad tactics in cutscenes.

 

Anticipating, bracing for action. They were trained to calm themselves in all possible scenerios. The Wings took down the first two Elites from Air, enclosing themselves further deep into Melee range since they need to brace these armored tanks into their respective open skins.

 

No. That scene portrays terribad tactics no matter how you look at it. The only way it makes sense is if the Spartans were so overconfident in their abilities that they were just showing off and totally phoning in their performance, but that clashes with the whole 'professional soldier' deal they have going on and is stupid when fighting a real war.

 

(1) Shotguns are for close range. They two last incoming Elites were took down from the Wings. Then the next wave approaches.

Shotguns are only close range in video games. In a 'realistic' setting like you claim Halo is, you could have used that shotgun to practically snipe the elites from a good long distance. (short-ranged shotguns would be acceptable for the purposes of game mechanics, but not in a plot-relevant cutscene) RL shotguns don't become worthless at ranges of over 20 feet, and the pellets stick together and don't spread out all that much. Unless of course the UNSC's shotguns are truly abysmal compared to modern ones.

 

(2) The background sounds were probably omitted or were cut. This doesnt mean they are not doing anything beyond that point

You can hear the other Spartan's guns firing from offscreen while it focuses on only one of them, but there's no sign of the loud booming of the third Spartan's shotgun anywhere.

 

There are no covers, there objective was to activate the machine and they will not risk of it getting destroyed. They were tasked to halt through the neck of the bridge preventing Elites to behind their lines where the Machine lies.

Gee, it's really too bad the Elites didn't think to bring a single ranged weapon with them then. Sure could have used a couple of those armor-melting plasma guns.

 

Background sounds are omitted or was purposely cut, it does not mean they are going melee behind the camera

Uh-huh, sure...

 

Same as what Sawmans do. They wield Glaives/Spears (not our Glaive). The Spartans needs to enclose themselves to speculate weak spots over Elite's Thick Armor.

The difference is that sawmen are almost always used in a support role to ranged units, you don't see entire squads composed solely of them. They're also some of the very weakest and low-end enemies you fight, with a level cap of 15. Elites are... well, elites. XD

 

This scene depicts that Arbiter's Armor ricochets the Spartan Secondary shots

I don't see any ricochet from his pistol. It looks like he shoots up the Arbiter's hand. There's not even any armor on the part he's firing at.

 

Exactly! He killed the Arbiter (the weak one) through brute force and cunning trick (Humans are cunning of all Sentients anyway without any monstrous weapons)

Er... Arbiters are generally considered to be the equal of a Spartan-II in combat, they're hardly seen as 'weak' in-setting. All it took was an ordinary guy with ordinary weapons and a good dose of luck to take him down. We also see ordinary guys one-shotting Promethian Knights with pistols in other cutscenes, and they can give Chief trouble.

 

Cinematics! Even before Excalibur used Slash Dash, the other three Tennos on both Cinematics tried everything they can to sink both Bosses' HP into critical levels.

(1) At Kril, Rhino immobilizes Kril for Excalibur. Excalibur then aims for a Weakspot-Stomach which is not covered much as does his Chest.

(2) At Vor, Frosts freezes Vor into a subzero state (possibly) making him a sitting duck against Excalibur.

 

Both Bosses were not moving before they were mutilated. 

 

They soften them up sure, but I don't think you can say that they did enough damage to their structural integrity to make slicing clean through them any less impressive. (unless their weapons are even stronger than we thought, which bodes ill for the Spartan)

 

Crystal Clear. When Loki got knocked down by a Flameblade. That Flameblade was still alive yet it did nothing. Even before Loki got knocked down, he was surrounded by Grineer Lancers and there was one specifically standing behind him yet is not shooting! 

 

If the Tennos are the not Players, then the Spartans are too. They have full concentration within almost everything around them. With their twenty milisecond reaction Time. They can anticipate almost everything. 

 

To justify this, here is an example of Spartan Teamwork:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=Bglzosd3QPU

 

In that video: One of them goes off on his own ignoring the protests of the one who wants to wait for backup and gets suckered into a trap as a result. Lots of neat feats are seen, but we also see several parts that show they aren't infallible and can screw up big time in combat. Running speed shown is comparable to ordinary Tenno sprinting speeds and is nowehere close to novel-Spartan speeds. Chief, for all his vaunted strength, training, and reflexes, is almost immediately disarmed by the red Sanghelli in melee and would have died right then if not for circumstances completely outside his control. Teamwork shown is very basic, if requiring a high level of timing to pull off. Verbal coordination is necessary, unlike Tenno who seem to achieve similar levels of coordination while in total silence.

 

You can calculate Antimatter? What? Who are you?

 

*evil cackle* Just a sci-fi geek who likes debating different sci-fi franchises and trying to quantify various aspects of their tech.

 

Silence limits Auditory and perception but does not affect the other transducers. The receptive is still wide and a Spartan's Modality is still at height. A chink of Spark from a bullet that emits from your flank can still make your head turn sidewards. 

 

If Banshee and MC do engage, everything starts in anticipation and in Silence even before Banshee casts one.

 

The Books, Wiki and the Story depicts that Spartan II Units are so fast that they are able to think, react and see things in Slow and Fast Motion like of most Insects that lives in a World of Slow Mo...muwahahaha and they have sharp eyesight that they can see virtually in the Dark.

 

I'm having a little trouble parsing what you just said there.

 

There's no end on both sides about their respective Strengths, it all ends in Circles and hypothesis over hypothesis.

 

Hypothesis over the source and exact nature of their strength, and the exact limits, but also a good deal of observation and proven feats. From what I've seen, Tenno are on-par with or somewhat above Spartan strength.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Senteth

[Kefaljohn]

So...is it dead yet?

[Aimop95]

We know to little about Tenno Lore to accurately say if an individual Tenno could take on Master Chief. 

 

What I will say though is from the basic standpoint. Tenno have access to superior weapons and technology than MC has, and the Tenno utilizes specific elements that MC would not be accustomed to (example: Saryn's Miasma and Nyx's Chaos).

 

However, Master Chief arguably might be more skilled than an average Tenno if they both were "unsuited". We have little to no idea how much augmentation (if any) is required when putting on a Warframe, but we do know how strong MC is.

[RsxHayabusa]

Wow this thread has taken flight....

[Grailchaser]

Can an Admin please close this topic or move it elsewhere? Such actions seem long overdue, and I think this exercise in futility is the last thing new players should need to see when they introduce themselves.

 

Also the attention this topic is receiving is making actual introductions less likely to receive welcoming responses. 

 

Make it so.

[Toztman]

You guys are forgetting a very important part of Halo lore.  Master Chief is the Reclaimer.  he cant be stopped folks.  It is destined and foretold.  Sorry Tenno.  Not that it matters.

 

Halo at least tried to maintain a bible of lore and tech boundaries.  Warframe has no boundaries.  Which I love of course.

 

Rhino slows time when he stomps...because...its cool.

Frost makes an ice shield that stops bullets but...not your body.  Last I checked solid ice doesn't work that way.

Vauban creates black holes that somehow have intelligent Friend/Foe detection haha.

Are we understanding the random but awesome nature of this game.  There are NO rulebooks for the tenno to follow.  DE makes what is cool.  Therefore, the Tenno are OP against other heroes.

 

It is an unfair comparison to any game hero vs. tenno, because most other heroes are more grounded into a plausible reality.  I think Samus is the closest precursor to the Tenno, power wise.  BUt she would kick anyones &amp;#&#33; all over town, outside of gods from Marvel or something.

Edited November 3, 2013 by Toztman

[LordOda]

I once again feel the need to plug a very relevant internet show... http://www.youtube.com/show/deathbattle

"It's Time For a Death Battllllllle!"

 

(Side note, the Chief has already been featured in one of their match ups, so his abilities are already mathed out for you)

But mostly due to the following...

In any Death Battle scenario, the combatants will have no knowledge of one another unless such knowledge is canon to their universe. This really needs to be stressed... The last 14 pages are filled with "But the Chief/Tenno would just blablahblah whenever they did blahblahblah!" but it doesn't work like that.

 

Combatants also go into combat (typically) carrying their most iconic or traditional loadouts. That breaks down to...

 

Master Chief: MA5B Assault Rifle, M6H Personal Defense Pistol, 3 Frag Grenades, Mark VI MJOLNIR Armor

Tenno: Braton Assault Rifle, Lato Pistol, Skana Sword, Warframe (Excalibur)

In this instance the Chief won't know anything about the Warframes/Tenno and will engage them as he would any other foe in his universe until they prove otherwise. The same goes for the Tenno... they have no idea what kind of armor or systems the Chief is running, and even at first glance the Tenno will likely engage the Chief as if he was a new unit of the Grineer. In fact, Death Battles assume an equally beneficial battlefield scenario where both combatants are "surprised" by the other's appearance (both drop into the same room as one another on the way to a target, both seeking an object etc etc).

 

The idea in setting up a Death Battle as above is to eliminate many of the random variables in the battle. You use the most iconic equipment since that equipment typically has easy equivilents and is featured most prominently in the character's lore and thus definable.

 

Everyone is losing their minds over variables that I think to have a logical and calm discussion on this requires us to assume the above or at least some parameters in order to give this a setting, a context, and not just pointless arguing.